topic Re: Why doesn't he get it? Venting. in Relationships and Money

Why doesn't he get it? Venting.

thankfulheart — Sun, 03 Jun 2012 10:37:29 GMT

The question of the ages, it would seem. My estranged spouse handed me the finances when we married as he worked and I stayed at home, so had "time". That was fine except he DIDN'T work 3-4 months out of the year. When he was young and single, that worked for him, but when he had a family to support, not so much. It never did quite sink in that feeding a family was quite a bit more pricey than feeding himself, not to mention all of the other falderal that goes along with kids. Fast forward to a time when I finally came to grips with the fact that he was not going to change his work situation, so something had to give. I went back to school and got a job that moved me (and the kids) away. It was supposed to be a short-term gig, but turned into a career. I've been slowly cutting the ties in the finances and last December, asked for a separation agreement and a promissory note to buy me out of my half of the marital home. He signed, but wasn't very happy about it. I helped him set up his own personal checking account and gave him a budget so he would know what was coming out of auto-pay. He does have a personality disorder and we do have kids, so I'm trying to slowly pull the threads to split the seam, so to speak, rather than yank it apart.

Every month, he wants to know what I am spending the child support/promissory note money on. He seems to think that I should be pumping that money back into paying HIS bills, forgetting that I am the one maintaining a household here with the children (whom he never calls, writes, etc), providing them with everything, including insurance, orthodontia, etc.

Right now, the only thing still between us is the mortgage on the marital home (he can't refi due to his bad credit) and our cell phone plan which I include in HIS budget as a reminder that the kids have them and he can call or text every once in awhile. Part of me says I should just pick up the phone bill, too, to get him off my back, but part of me says, doggone it, he can shut up and worry about money for once.

Short of outright divorcing him or being harsh, any suggestions how to handle the situation? For reference, phone bill = 1/3 of child support amount.

Re: Why doesn't he get it? Venting.

marty56 — Sun, 03 Jun 2012 11:39:25 GMT

Please stop being his mom. Do what is in your and your kid's best interest. If won't change for his kids, he won't change for you. Do what is in your and your kid's best interest.

Re: Why doesn't he get it? Venting.

Repo-ed — Sun, 03 Jun 2012 14:58:41 GMT

marty56 wrote:
Please stop being his mom. Do what is in your and your kid's best interest. If won't change for his kids, he won't change for you. Do what is in your and your kid's best interest.

+1000

Re: Why doesn't he get it? Venting.

FrugalRican — Mon, 04 Jun 2012 13:41:51 GMT

marty56 wrote:
Please stop being his mom. Do what is in your and your kid's best interest. If won't change for his kids, he won't change for you. Do what is in your and your kid's best interest.

Bingo.

Re: Why doesn't he get it? Venting.

thankfulheart — Tue, 05 Jun 2012 06:32:06 GMT

I do know I need to back off, but at least with kids, you have 18 years to prepare them for reality, y'know? I just don't feel like I can cut him loose suddnely since he's obviously never had anyone teach him about finances and money management and I still have to count on child support for another 5 years and the promissory note for another 15 (unless he ever gets to the point where he can cash out some equity). It's just a very slow, frustrating process, teaching someone who is clueless.

Re: Why doesn't he get it? Venting.

FrugalRican — Tue, 05 Jun 2012 13:39:51 GMT

thankfulheart wrote:
I just don't feel like I can cut him loose suddnely since he's obviously never had anyone teach him about finances and money management

Things my best friend's mother would say about his son for about 30 years.

It's not that you're teaching someone who is clueless, it's that you are teaching someone who doesn't care to learn. Two different types of students.

Re: Why doesn't he get it? Venting.

Booner72 — Tue, 12 Jun 2012 23:37:11 GMT

There is a difference between enabling and "teaching."

From personal experience my recommendations are 1. Read "Codependent No More" by Melodie Beattie.

2. Go to therapy.

3. If the personality disorder includes drinking or drugs,which they do in most cases, then go to an Alanon Meeting ASAP.

There's no shame in learning the skills you need to set boundaries and learn to live without guilt. Your kids are watching how this goes down.

GOOD LUCK!! Sounds very hard.

Re: Why doesn't he get it? Venting.

haulingthescoreup — Wed, 13 Jun 2012 08:08:53 GMT

thankfulheart wrote:
I do know I need to back off, but at least with kids, you have 18 years to prepare them for reality, y'know? I just don't feel like I can cut him loose suddnely since he's obviously never had anyone teach him about finances and money management and I still have to count on child support for another 5 years and the promissory note for another 15 (unless he ever gets to the point where he can cash out some equity). It's just a very slow, frustrating process, teaching someone who is clueless.

But my dear, this is the reality that your kids need to know: their dad might very well love them, but he's completely clueless as to the nuts and bolts of being a dad, and he isn't going to meet the financial obligations that you think he should meet. And as for him learning reality, that isn't your job; that was his parent's job, and for whatever reason, it didn't stick.

Let go of the cell phone bill. It's not worth the fight, and wouldn't you pay for a cell phone plan anyway, if he weren't around? This sounds like one of those pointless battles that people engage in out of bitterness and some sort of determination to at least win one thing, and twenty years later, they have no idea why they bothered. Rise above, move on, and you'll be a happier human being in the end.

Do get the mortgage untangled, though. That's a biggie, both financially and legally, and if for no other reason, you need to have good credit for your new life as a single mom. Best of luck to you, and major thumbs up for being determined to make if different for your kids.

Re: Why doesn't he get it? Venting.

thankfulheart — Wed, 13 Jun 2012 08:46:04 GMT

I hate it when other people are right. :smileyvery-happy: (OK, I really like it and appreciate the kick in the pants!)

You are absolutely right about the phone bill. Verizon just announced a new plan anyway that will save me some moolah, so that will be that. I'm trying to figure out the mortgage thing. It's at $7K left owing, but I've got money tied up in my own mortgage plan right now, so can't pay it off at this point. If I can get it excluded from my DTI, that will be a HUGE blessing and load off my shoulders.

I just need to stop listening to him whine about where the money is going. It's going and it would be going one way or the other, so suck it up, buster. Tired of the eggshells.

Oh, and to the person who mentioned drugs/alcohol, none of that is involved. His "drug" is reading crazy stuff on the computer for hours on end.

Re: Why doesn't he get it? Venting.

haulingthescoreup — Wed, 13 Jun 2012 08:50:11 GMT

thankfulheart wrote:
I hate it when other people are right. :smileyvery-happy: (OK, I really like it and appreciate the kick in the pants!)

You are absolutely right about the phone bill. Verizon just announced a new plan anyway that will save me some moolah, so that will be that. I'm trying to figure out the mortgage thing. It's at $7K left owing, but I've got money tied up in my own mortgage plan right now, so can't pay it off at this point. If I can get it excluded from my DTI, that will be a HUGE blessing and load off my shoulders.

I just need to stop listening to him whine about where the money is going. It's going and it would be going one way or the other, so suck it up, buster. Tired of the eggshells.

Oh, and to the person who mentioned drugs/alcohol, none of that is involved. His "drug" is reading crazy stuff on the computer for hours on end.

Oh, heavens. Good thing none of us do that! ;)

Re: Why doesn't he get it? Venting.

thankfulheart — Wed, 13 Jun 2012 09:28:09 GMT

haulingthescoreup wrote:
His "drug" is reading crazy stuff on the computer for hours on end.
Oh, heavens. Good thing none of us do that! ;)

LOL! Only his "crazy" involves conspiracy theories and aliens on the dark side of the moon and that he "knows stuff" and if he told anyone what he knows, they'd think he was crazy. Ummmm, because it IS crazy!

The MyFICO brand of crazy is a whole other cupcake. ;)

Re: Why doesn't he get it? Venting.

pizzadude — Wed, 13 Jun 2012 13:50:04 GMT

haulingthescoreup wrote:
Oh, and to the person who mentioned drugs/alcohol, none of that is involved. His "drug" is reading crazy stuff on the computer for hours on end.
Oh, heavens. Good thing none of us do that! ;)

Yeah, I know !!! Who would do THAT ??? ;)

Re: Why doesn't he get it? Venting.

Booner72 — Wed, 13 Jun 2012 21:38:25 GMT

AAAAH, the conspiracy theory type. Fun.

Re: Why doesn't he get it? Venting.

FrugalRican — Mon, 18 Jun 2012 14:59:23 GMT

thankfulheart wrote:
His "drug" is reading crazy stuff on the computer for hours on end.

If his main worry is Nibiru/Planet X/HAARP or anything like that, rather than his own financial situation, you're much better off without.

Re: Why doesn't he get it? Venting.

webhopper — Sun, 01 Jul 2012 14:59:04 GMT

Wow.... Anyways, you could always force sale of the marital home. You don't want your name on it when he stops paying the bill. Just a suggestion. He probably doesn't need something that big to live in anyways since you and the kids are gone now

Re: Why doesn't he get it? Venting.

thankfulheart — Tue, 03 Jul 2012 07:20:34 GMT

webhopper wrote:
Wow.... Anyways, you could always force sale of the marital home. You don't want your name on it when he stops paying the bill. Just a suggestion. He probably doesn't need something that big to live in anyways since you and the kids are gone now

Yeah, that's not going to happen. It's an old family home and is symbiotic with his parents' house next door (they share utilities, long story). I did just take out a personal loan to pay off the mortgage to help my DTI for my own mortgage app and he signed another agreement with me to pay that off. Over the eggshell-walking financial discussions of the past month, I have laid out what is his to pay for and he doesn't need to worry about the rest of it. Just shut up and pay your bills, I'll shut up and pay mine. That seems to be working right now. We'll see what happens when he's off again this winter...

Re: Why doesn't he get it? Venting.

drkaje — Tue, 03 Jul 2012 11:49:14 GMT

Not being harsh, TH, but you're the one who needs to get it. He's not going to 'grow up' and time away from you and the kids isn't going to magically make him have an epiphany. FWIW, he's is probably the same person you married. :)

Deal with it forever or get a divorce but thinking you're going to make him change is crazier than alien conspiracies. :)

Re: Why doesn't he get it? Venting.

thankfulheart — Tue, 03 Jul 2012 13:19:09 GMT

drkaje wrote:
Not being harsh, TH, but you're the one who needs to get it. He's not going to 'grow up' and time away from you and the kids isn't going to magically make him have an epiphany. FWIW, he's is probably the same person you married. :)

Deal with it forever or get a divorce but thinking you're going to make him change is crazier than alien conspiracies. :)

I appreciate your candor. I do get it, more than I did before. I don't want an epiphany, per se, but a recognition of financial reality over time, learning from experience and life lessons. He is NOT the "same person" I married. At all. Complete personality change brought on by Y2K and 9/11. Many people have even suggested there might be a brain tumor (he won't go to find out, it gives "them" too much information), it's been so dramatic.

Divorce just isn't the right choice right now for a variety of reasons, but I do see it as a possibility in a few years. Until then, lots of deep breathing and hoping that the current you pay yours, I'll pay mine sticks.

One thing I'm learning from all of this, however, is to teach my 4 daughters to NEVER, EVER tangle up their finances with another person. I used to be all "married life, joint accounts, OUR money" and I have learned the very hard way that "to each his own" is not at all selfish, but necessary in today's world.

Re: Why doesn't he get it? Venting.

drkaje — Tue, 03 Jul 2012 14:39:47 GMT

Personality doesn't change on its own. Could be drugs, tumor, PTSD, schizophrenia, inherited, infection during mother's pregnancy, growing up with cats, etc...

Ugly reality? If it's mental disease, he's incapable of getting it. I'm not being harsh, just pressed for time and can't search for a better way to put it. Things might improve some with medication, though. :)

Re: Why doesn't he get it? Venting.

hunnybunnz — Wed, 11 Jul 2012 23:29:28 GMT

You need to pick your battles! Is it really worth the frustration and aggravation? Make a list of what is important to you. If the two of you aren't together, then why not just file for the divorce. Make it legal. Your not doing any favors for your kids or yourself. He is a grown boy. He has made it this far. His problem is he has always had you there to do it for him. Once he realizes your gone, he will learn to sink or swim. You need to learn how to release and let go.

My ex husband was the same way. As long as I was there bringing in a income. He was OK with working a mediocre job that hardly paid. Once I left and divorced him. He grew big boy pants and got a big boy job. Now he pays me alimony!