topic Re: Shouldn't TU98 be a FAKO? in Understanding FICO® Scoring

Shouldn't TU98 be a FAKO?

CS800 — Wed, 25 May 2011 15:03:34 GMT

I know this topic has been discussed before and the reviews are mixed from extreme difference between TU98 and TU04 to minor. So minor or not, why would TU sell two versions. Which brings me to a point I made before; it's all about the money and the leeway that the law has givem the CRA's.

If we on this board didn't know any better we would all trust FAKO's but we KNOW better and we want to improve our lives and we pay money to make sure we are getting the right info. Now that's not Myfico's fault but why would myfico sell an older verion; the version NOT used by lenders?

Now one might say, well they are not that different; but they aren't the same. It's like being given the wrong info prior to engaging the enemy. We trust a FICO score but then go to a LO just to find out that we are not really worthy of the best rate or even an approval. So that's a wasted inquiry. I'm sure many have been disappointed when comparing their TU98 that they buy on here to the TU04 that their LO pulled. One could easily say that this whole credit repair thing is a scam.

If we the people cannot change that, so why should we be 'judged' by these score? I wonder if there are regulating bodies so that the consumer is protected. The BBB is useless but governmental body? I wonder if anyone has ever challenged TU on a big scale as to why they sell two versions of their FICO knowing well they are not the same?

Maybe the owner of MyFico could take this up to TU's management or maybe that has been done. If I was myfico, I would be appalled that my customers are getting ripped.

So in my books anything that is not what the lenders/Banks see is a FAKO.

Re: Shouldn't TU98 be a FAKO?

JagerBombs89 — Wed, 25 May 2011 16:31:18 GMT

I personally treat the TU98 FICO score as a FAKO. I figured that is why MyFICO sells them so cheap (TU Quarterly Monitoring) is because they are just about worthless. They are for "educational purposes only"... Sounds like a PLUS Score to me.

Re: Shouldn't TU98 be a FAKO?

MBOhio2 — Wed, 25 May 2011 16:47:31 GMT

Is it true that the TU98 has no real correlation to the TU04? For example, is there any way to predict what one's TU04 will be based on the TU98 pulled here?

My current TU98 from here is 588

My husband's current TU98 from here is 657

Any thoughts??

Re: Shouldn't TU98 be a FAKO?

llecs — Wed, 25 May 2011 17:16:12 GMT

MBOhio2 wrote:
Is it true that the TU98 has no real correlation to the TU04?

True unfortunately. There's no way to guess. In our case, DW's was higher (much higher!) than her TU98 and mine was lower.

I used to read others' results leading up to my mortgage and noticed that TU04 typically fell on the higher side, but that isn't true for everyone.

Re: Shouldn't TU98 be a FAKO?

CS800 — Wed, 25 May 2011 17:28:39 GMT

Other factors remaiing the same, I know of another person on here that subscribes to the Quarterly SW for TU98 score and the EQ SW. So his TU98 is 741 as he pulled last tuesday. The same day went to get a refi thinking he is going to get the best rate. Low and behold, he pretty much nearly passed out when LO told him that his TU was 675 and that's the same day and nothing else has changed. His EQ was 781 as per SW ans the lender pulled the exact number, his EX FICO was 739 and his EX plusscore was 728 (yes about 10 points lower than his EX FICO)

He did however get an excellent refi rate but still, he has had the TU Quarterly SW for 1.5 years. That was a big difference. The time that he pulled his TU98 to the LO pulling his TU04 was about 1 hour.

So now for me, it makes me wonder why my true TU FICO is. I get so pumped up everytime my score goes up but now i'm thinking my joy might be for no good reason.

Others might say the difference with their TU98 and TU04 wasn't that big but fact is, even if there is 1 point difference for me it matters since I'm paying for it and getting fed the wrong info all becasue TU decided to make some extra $$ and sell an older scoring system that they know is pretty much useless to your regular consumer.

Re: Shouldn't TU98 be a FAKO?

SocalMark — Wed, 25 May 2011 17:38:04 GMT

Why doesn't Myfico sell TU04?

Re: Shouldn't TU98 be a FAKO?

llecs — Wed, 25 May 2011 17:40:55 GMT

CS800 wrote:
So now for me, it makes me wonder why my true TU FICO is.

This topic comes up frequently. If you applied for a mortgage tomorrow, and you actually find a lender that pulls a TU98 (there are some still out there) and your TU matches, would you still consider it a FAKO? Conversely, if you applied tomorrow and your lender pulled a TU08 model (part of the FICO08) or maybe a mortgage-enhanced TU FICO, would you still consider TU98 a FAKO? How about TU04, would that be a FAKO too?

There's no doubt that as a consumer, we'd love to have access to all models. Many of use have expressed that. And I don't know what the hold up is. I don't know if FICO is doing that or if TU is doing that (I suspect the latter). But if FICO sold all of the industry specific scores and all of the classic scores that lenders are known to use, I'd buy them all from time to time (esp. TU04 pre-mortgage because most lenders are using it). And know that lenders still use the same TU98 version as found on here. I do business with one (Lending Club) that pulls a TU98. Seems like loans serviced by Fannie and Freddie still use TU98, or as of last year they still did. Some lenders are slow and upgrading and some don't want to upgrade due to changes in the economy.

Re: Shouldn't TU98 be a FAKO?

JagerBombs89 — Wed, 25 May 2011 17:49:30 GMT

llecs wrote:

This topic comes up frequently. If you applied for a mortgage tomorrow, and you actually find a lender that pulls a TU98 (there are some still out there) and your TU matches, would you still consider it a FAKO? Conversely, if you applied tomorrow and your lender pulled a TU08 model (part of the FICO08) or maybe a mortgage-enhanced TU FICO, would you still consider TU98 a FAKO? How about TU04, would that be a FAKO too?

That would be like saying, what if the lended pulled a Vantage score... would all the FICO scores be considered FAKO? Either way, TU04 is what most lends use anyways. TU98 is just a money pit into a false sense of security.

Re: Shouldn't TU98 be a FAKO?

wednesdayaddamsd — Wed, 25 May 2011 18:00:02 GMT

Agreed. You get jumped on for even hinting that you may have bought a score somewhere else that is "useless", yet TU 98 IS useless for those of us trying to get a mortgage.

I don't understand why mods on this site won't just admit that. The 30-65 point spread that TU 98 offers over TU 04 is just the same as any other FAKO score that is endlessly ridiculed here.

Re: Shouldn't TU98 be a FAKO?

kelli1970 — Wed, 25 May 2011 18:17:46 GMT

So the Suze Orman package has which one?

Re: Shouldn't TU98 be a FAKO?

CS800 — Wed, 25 May 2011 20:03:03 GMT

Wednesday:

I don't think the mods have any say. They only moderate for conduct and materials on here. I'm a 'Super Moderator' for a major forum and we do not have much say in the site itself. Our job is solely to moderate discussions.

However, I would think the owner of Myfico as I mentioned before would be more aggravated by that since it's their reputation at stake. The importance of knowing one's true score has become more and more relevant since the tightening of the credit industry. If we want to do things right, we need the right information to see if we're progressing or not. At least that's my take.

Personally I would love to be able to get all my reports and true scores so I can tap myself on the shoulders for a job well done in rebuilding.Right now it's like walking on thin ice apart from EQ since the EQ score on here is spot on the one that lenders pull.

As for Experian's situation, it's like going to court and not knowing what you're being charged for. In a perfect world where the consumer is truly protected, we would have told EX to take a hike and not use them at all until they make their FICO available to the public at a cost of course. Would it kill them? Of course not, it's just the leeway the law gives them to withheld any information they see fit even though it concerns your future. A familiar expression comes to mind --- They have us by the b***s

I have said it before, these kind of activites need to be monitored by a governing body for our sake at the federal level so we the people don't get abused.

Re: Shouldn't TU98 be a FAKO?

fot1 — Thu, 26 May 2011 02:06:15 GMT

Once I get my PSECU rolling I'm gonna dump the TU quarterly for that reason. EX and EQ will be enough for me.

Re: Shouldn't TU98 be a FAKO?

Cotton_Britches — Thu, 26 May 2011 04:07:55 GMT

Not to mention that myFICO upped the price of their scores to $19.95 each. I feel the whole credit system is a ripoff to consumers.

Re: Shouldn't TU98 be a FAKO?

TangMeister — Fri, 27 May 2011 02:16:02 GMT

I'll be more blunt that most and simply say it's a JOKE that myfico is selling TU Classic 98 FICO to consumers, and at the very least without disclosing in HUGE PRINT that this scoring system is antiquated and worthless. It's nothing better than the free FAKO you get from some of the daily pullers.

We've been talking about this for YEARS, and the criteria they said needed to be in place to upgrade has long since happened (04 FICO passing 50% usage by businesses)! C'mon myfco/Fair Isaac/TU, get on the ball and upgrade the TU score to AT LEAST 04. Heck, skip it and jump to 08.

Re: Shouldn't TU98 be a FAKO?

MarineVietVet — Fri, 27 May 2011 04:19:56 GMT

Everyone (including me) wonders when TU04 will be sold here and I wish I had the answer but I don't.

One statistic I learned today is that "in 2010, U.S. lenders and other businesses bought roughly four billion FICO scores calculated from the same models tapped by myFICO.com." .

Now I don't know how many of those were EQ and how many were TU but I would think that many millions of those scores were TU98. So TU98 is still being used but I wish the TU04 and/orTU08 versions were offered here just like all of you.

From a BK years ago to:
EX - 3/11 pulled by lender- 835, EQ - 2/11-816, TU - 2/11-782

"Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they've made a difference. The Marines don't have that problem".

ationRe: Shouldn't TU98 be a FAKO?

Corvidae — Fri, 27 May 2011 13:30:01 GMT

We need legislation proposed to standardize credit scoring.

You have FICO, which has numerous variants of the score, yet we are only allowed to see a couple. Want to prepare to buy a car? Your standard FICO score from this site is useless if the dealer uses the auto formula. Want to prepare to buy a house? Your TU98 score is worthless if the lender decides to use TU04. Want to know your Experian FICO score? Join PSECU or bend over.

Then you have the FAKO system, which is completely misleading altogether, since 90% of lenders use FICO scores. Even those websites say the score is worthless when obtaining credit.

Re: ationRe: Shouldn't TU98 be a FAKO?

CS800 — Fri, 27 May 2011 13:58:54 GMT

This is the ultimate topic for consumer protection. I'm very surprised that the Consumer Protection Agencies are not jumping on this. Imagine consumers all over paying money sometimes for years to get their scores so they can improve or increae their bargaining power only ot find out that they were wrong all along?.

The worst part you might ask? The CRA's themselves selling FAKOS on their own website. Not to mention banks all over the nation selling their own style of credit monitoring. As a consumer I think I deserve to have full power over whats going to affect my life creditwise.

I really encourage myFICO to take a good look at that and since the Fair Isaac formula rules the lives of millions, give us the consumer a chance in having control over our credit future. Making payments on time and having the right kind of accounts doesnt cut it anymore, we need more. We need 100% guarantee that we are doing the right thing and FAKO only gives us a fake sense of reality.

If EX says they don't want to provide their FICO, I say why should we use them then? Does EX not trust us enough as adults? Or do they love the power they have granted by the Govt? It's pretty ballzy for a CRA to tell people, 'We own you and we don't owe you any explanation whatsoever so live with it'

A FAKO should be plain illegal and charging people for wrongful information should be illegal.

Going back to TU04, I really do hope that myFICO will dump TU98 and offer TU04. Don't make it about the money guys, make it about integrity serving your customers who have put a lot of trust in you.

Re: Shouldn't TU98 be a FAKO?

tombking — Fri, 27 May 2011 16:08:32 GMT

This whole system is idiotic.

Re: Shouldn't TU98 be a FAKO?

starry1 — Sat, 29 Dec 2012 19:53:20 GMT

I know I'm furious. I was denied for Care Credit today (applied to take care of some emergency dental bills) and my TU score was 498 when myfico has been telling me its 533. Waste of money is all it is.

Re: Shouldn't TU98 be a FAKO?

GregB — Sat, 29 Dec 2012 21:40:19 GMT

starry1 wrote:
I know I'm furious. I was denied for Care Credit today (applied to take care of some emergency dental bills) and my TU score was 498 when myfico has been telling me its 533. Waste of money is all it is.

Furious at what? What score did Care Credit use? Was it a FICO? TU provides 21 FICO scores to lender although only half that many are common. Of the common FICO scores used, the one used by myFICO is one major revision before the most useful TU FICO of all, the one used for a mortgage. That still makes it FAR more useful than any TU score provided by anyone else.

It isn't as useful as TU FICO 04 Classic but it is still worth far more than the FAKO scores out there that may not even move the correct direction with most changes.

I would guess that Care Credit uses TU New Account Model 3.0, which isn't a FICO and has a range of 150-950. Second guess would be a PF Industry version of FICO, which have generic ranges of 250-900. Does it say FICO on the letter? Does it give a score range? 498 and 533 aren't that far apart, only 35 points.

I think the real problem is that a 533 TU FICO 98 will get a denial for almost all credit applications without security.

To call TU FICO 98 a FAKO is extreme. It is worth far less than the EQ FICO sold here but it is still far better than any FAKO sold elsewhere.