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Moderator
Posts: 10,601
Registered: ‎03-06-2010

Re: Not Including a Credit Card in Bankruptcy filing


holmesnmanny wrote:

Actually the advice given isn't entirely accurate. You can safely pay down any card that has a balance of $599 and under within the 6 months before the bk filing without closing the card and hope the creditor doesn't close the card. 

 

And you don't include cards, you include debt. If you don't have debt on a card at the time of the filing then you don't list it in your bankruptcy, which basically has the effect of not being included in your bankruptcy, yes, but you still have to pray the creditor simply doesn't close your card if they see the bankruptcy. However, if you have no debt, it's not likely they will be pulling your report via an account review

 

It is extremely important to your credit score to try to have cards survive your bankruptcy. 


^^^they don't have to have an account review. Certainly that is an option, but one of the ways they can determine Bk is through the subscription to recent Bk filings list furnished through the CRA's.  This is independant of the court notification and account review methods. 

Valued Contributor
Posts: 1,604
Registered: ‎09-28-2014
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Re: Not Including a Credit Card in Bankruptcy filing


StartingOver10 wrote:

holmesnmanny wrote:

Actually the advice given isn't entirely accurate. You can safely pay down any card that has a balance of $599 and under within the 6 months before the bk filing without closing the card and hope the creditor doesn't close the card. 

 

And you don't include cards, you include debt. If you don't have debt on a card at the time of the filing then you don't list it in your bankruptcy, which basically has the effect of not being included in your bankruptcy, yes, but you still have to pray the creditor simply doesn't close your card if they see the bankruptcy. However, if you have no debt, it's not likely they will be pulling your report via an account review

 

It is extremely important to your credit score to try to have cards survive your bankruptcy. 


^^^they don't have to have an account review. Certainly that is an option, but one of the ways they can determine Bk is through the subscription to recent Bk filings list furnished through the CRA's.  This is independant of the court notification and account review methods. 


Off topic, but I'm wondering since Comenity's Paypal Credit doesn't report to the CRAs Comenity doesn't subscribe to that BK filing list? By "accident" my Comenity Bill Me Later, which became PP Credit, survived my 2010 BK7. I hadn't used it in awhile so no balance, and forgot about it when I furnished my list of creditors to my attorney, so they were never notified by the court. A year or two after discharge I was cleaning out files & found the BML account info, so I logged in and was surprised to find it still active with a CL. I used it until earlier this year when I closed it - I hadn't used it in a long time, I use a rewards CC for Paypal payments.

 

And up in the CC forum I've been having a conversation with a MyFico'er who says his attorney screwed up and listed PayPal as the creditor for a $900 balance when it was actually PayPal Credit. 1 1/2 years post discharge his PayPal account says he still has a balance due of $900 on PP Credit. And a few months ago he used the SCT to get a $1k CL for Overstock by Comenity. So I'm telling him Comenity is obviously not aware of his BK, so he should send them a copy of his discharge to Comenity and tell them his PP Credit was included in his discharge and to remove the amount due on PP Credit as that is an attempt to collect a debt discharged in BK. But I warned him if he does that they will likely close his Overstock account, better than paying $900 to PP Credit.


Fico 08: TU 724, EX 689 EQ 687
Moderator
Posts: 10,601
Registered: ‎03-06-2010

Re: Not Including a Credit Card in Bankruptcy filing

[ Edited ]

From what I have seen here, an experienced myself, a zero balance credit card not listed on the bk petition is hit or miss as far a closing it by the credit grantor and labeling it iib. I had a Neiman Marcus card for years and it was zero balance at least two years before filing bk (in 2008). That card survived. I too forgot to close it before filing. None of the other zero balance cards survived, they were all marked iib and closed by the grantor. 

 

Others have written here about some cards surviving and others not. I did notice however that the iib TL's drop off at 7 years and other closed accounts not iib stay on for 10 years (occassionally longer). 

 

I have seen the bk list advertised on Exp's IIRC credit site for risk management - more of a B2B use and not for consumers.

 

Look at this link for all kinds of lists provided by Experian...and I haven't checked the others 

https://www.experian.com/business-services/risk-assessment-tools.html

 

Here is a list that creditors can get for triggers to show we are recovering (interesting) https://www.experian.com/consumer-information/debt-collection.html

Valued Contributor
Posts: 1,604
Registered: ‎09-28-2014
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Re: Not Including a Credit Card in Bankruptcy filing

[ Edited ]

StartingOver10 wrote:

From what I have seen here, an experienced myself, a zero balance credit card not listed on the bk petition is hit or miss as far a closing it by the credit grantor and labeling it iib. I had a Neiman Marcus card for years and it was zero balance at least two years before filing bk (in 2008). That card survived. I too forgot to close it before filing. None of the other zero balance cards survived, they were all marked iib and closed by the grantor. 

 

Others have written here about some cards surviving and others not. I did notice however that the iib TL's drop off at 7 years and other closed accounts not iib stay on for 10 years (occassionally longer). 

 

I have seen the bk list advertised on Exp's IIRC credit site for risk management - more of a B2B use and not for consumers.

 

Look at this link for all kinds of lists provided by Experian...and I haven't checked the others 

https://www.experian.com/business-services/risk-assessment-tools.html

 

Here is a list that creditors can get for triggers to show we are recovering (interesting) https://www.experian.com/consumer-information/debt-collection.html


Those list of reports available from EX are interesting.

 

Yes, I also had a Lowe's Synchrony account that I hadn't used for awhile with $0 balance that I forgot to provide to my attorny. But other Synch accounts had balances & were IIB, so when they received notice of those they closed Lowes. But I was lucky, they just marked Lowes as "Closed by credit grantor", but no derogatory mark and it is included in my satisfactory close accounts. Coming up on 7 years post discharge I got TU to early exclude all IIB acounts, and my TU Fico jumped from 674 to 720. EQ & EX removed all but my non-reffirmed mortgage, on which I'm still current, it comes off in Sept. So EQ & EX Ficos are only high 680s. And I'm back in with Lowes, $10k CL.


Fico 08: TU 724, EX 689 EQ 687
Contributor
Posts: 135
Registered: ‎11-15-2014
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Re: Not Including a Credit Card in Bankruptcy filing

I did speak with 2 lawyers and the first lawyer told me that I can leave a credit card out of the filing and the second told me I must include everything. Now the lawyer who told me I can leave out a card is not as experienced and well versed as the second lawyer so of course I'm going with the second lawyer I met with because I don't want to run into any problems.
Contributor
Posts: 83
Registered: ‎08-13-2013
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Re: Not Including a Credit Card in Bankruptcy filing

I had a good credit card that was not included in my bankruptcy (Meaning I never brought it up, and it wasnt set as beiong removed).  Today I got an update on my fico that this card was closed and set to 0 balance.  It was noted as Chapter 7 included.  So FYI thats what happened to me.  

Starting FICO June 2017: EQ: 514 - EX: 491 - TU: 521

Filed C7 Bankruptcy 7 File: June 17 2017

Meeting of Creditors: July 20 2017 - COMPLETE

Discharge: ?
Contributor
Posts: 135
Registered: ‎11-15-2014
0

Re: Not Including a Credit Card in Bankruptcy filing

That's what I'm worried will happen. I want to keep my Kohls card which is furnished by Capital One and I'll be burning two of their cards in the bankruptcy so they just may close it.
Established Contributor
Posts: 1,087
Registered: ‎02-07-2017
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Re: Not Including a Credit Card in Bankruptcy filing


DaveInAZ wrote:

StartingOver10 wrote:

holmesnmanny wrote:

Actually the advice given isn't entirely accurate. You can safely pay down any card that has a balance of $599 and under within the 6 months before the bk filing without closing the card and hope the creditor doesn't close the card. 

 

And you don't include cards, you include debt. If you don't have debt on a card at the time of the filing then you don't list it in your bankruptcy, which basically has the effect of not being included in your bankruptcy, yes, but you still have to pray the creditor simply doesn't close your card if they see the bankruptcy. However, if you have no debt, it's not likely they will be pulling your report via an account review

 

It is extremely important to your credit score to try to have cards survive your bankruptcy. 


^^^they don't have to have an account review. Certainly that is an option, but one of the ways they can determine Bk is through the subscription to recent Bk filings list furnished through the CRA's.  This is independant of the court notification and account review methods. 


Off topic, but I'm wondering since Comenity's Paypal Credit doesn't report to the CRAs Comenity doesn't subscribe to that BK filing list? By "accident" my Comenity Bill Me Later, which became PP Credit, survived my 2010 BK7. I hadn't used it in awhile so no balance, and forgot about it when I furnished my list of creditors to my attorney, so they were never notified by the court. A year or two after discharge I was cleaning out files & found the BML account info, so I logged in and was surprised to find it still active with a CL. I used it until earlier this year when I closed it - I hadn't used it in a long time, I use a rewards CC for Paypal payments.

 

And up in the CC forum I've been having a conversation with a MyFico'er who says his attorney screwed up and listed PayPal as the creditor for a $900 balance when it was actually PayPal Credit. 1 1/2 years post discharge his PayPal account says he still has a balance due of $900 on PP Credit. And a few months ago he used the SCT to get a $1k CL for Overstock by Comenity. So I'm telling him Comenity is obviously not aware of his BK, so he should send them a copy of his discharge to Comenity and tell them his PP Credit was included in his discharge and to remove the amount due on PP Credit as that is an attempt to collect a debt discharged in BK. But I warned him if he does that they will likely close his Overstock account, better than paying $900 to PP Credit.


I've been wondering about that too. I had a Bill Me Later account that I reported as part of my bankruptcy filing since there was a balance owed, and as far as I know it's long since been closed. However, it may have been linked to my Paypal account but not removed from that account even though it doesn't appear on my list of payment sources nor can I use Paypal Credit for eBay purchases; the Paypal Credit button, which heretofore had been greyed out, came up active the other day when I was making a purchase, so I clicked on it only to get a message saying that I couldn't use Paypal Credit for the purchase - I don't know for sure if that's because of the old Bill Me Later account or because the seller in question doesn't in fact accept Paypal Credit. I guess the best thing to do is to just get off my duff and call Comenity, find out what's what and if that old BML account is still there, have it closed out. That could be a bit time-consuming as I don't even remember what the account number was and I'm not sure whether or not I still have any old pre-BK statements from BML...

Rebuilding credit since 12/14 Ch7 BK discharge. FICO 6/28/17:TU 646/EX 680/EQ 677 FICO 8 or 693 NG 2, VS 3.0 7/20/17: TU 705/EX 666/EQ 691. $800 Amazon Prime Store Card, $951 Cap One secured Platinum MC, $1200 Walmart Store Card, $2000 Apple FCU Platinum Visa, $3000 Penfed Power Cash Rewards Visa, $3000 Cap One Quicksilver MC, $3300 Discover It, $4000 Overstock Store Card, $10k PenFed used car loan, $5k Navient student loan. In the garden as of 7/2/17 AND THIS TIME I REALLY MEAN IT!!! (unless I get a preapproval I can't refuse...)
Valued Contributor
Posts: 1,604
Registered: ‎09-28-2014

Re: Not Including a Credit Card in Bankruptcy filing

[ Edited ]
joe8185 wrote:

 

I've been wondering about that too. I had a Bill Me Later account that I reported as part of my bankruptcy filing since there was a balance owed, and as far as I know it's long since been closed. However, it may have been linked to my Paypal account but not removed from that account even though it doesn't appear on my list of payment sources nor can I use Paypal Credit for eBay purchases; the Paypal Credit button, which heretofore had been greyed out, came up active the other day when I was making a purchase, so I clicked on it only to get a message saying that I couldn't use Paypal Credit for the purchase - I don't know for sure if that's because of the old Bill Me Later account or because the seller in question doesn't in fact accept Paypal Credit. I guess the best thing to do is to just get off my duff and call Comenity, find out what's what and if that old BML account is still there, have it closed out. That could be a bit time-consuming as I don't even remember what the account number was and I'm not sure whether or not I still have any old pre-BK statements from BML...


It's worth a call to make sure the PayPal Credit is removed from your Paypal account: 866-528-3733 - I got through to a live person pretty fast, and didn't need my Paypal Credit account#, I think I gave him my Social Security # to find me. If you want PP Credit back you could ask if they would re-open it. But the main reason I closed my PP Credit account is that I wanted to be offered the new Synchrony 2% Paypal Cashback credit card, you can't have both PP Credit and a Synchrony Paypal credit card. I was offered the Cashback card when I logged into PayPal Monday, app'd & instant approval. If Paypal thinks you still have PP Credit you won't get the offer, and the 2% Cashback CC is currently by invitation from PayPal only.

 

Back on topic, rather than hoping for luck in a $0 balance CC surviving a BK, the safest thing to do is close it before you file. That way it will "survive" your BK as a satisfactory paid, positive closed account, which will remain on your credit report for at least 10 years, helping your AAoA (average age of accounts) as you rebuild your credit with new accounts. Obviously the older the $0 balance account the better. While you might get away with paying off a CC with a small balance & closing it, be aware that "playing favorites" with creditors - paying off some while not paying others - is not allowed, and the Trustee will require you provide bank account statements for them to examine.


Fico 08: TU 724, EX 689 EQ 687
Regular Contributor
Posts: 258
Registered: ‎01-30-2014
0

Re: Not Including a Credit Card in Bankruptcy filing

Just a quick FYI, I called and closed two Barclays cards (my Arrival and NFL card) which both had zero balances a week before filing. Checked my reports and they show up as Included In Bankruptcy....ughhhh!! I did burn them on my Aviator card for about $3200, so that one is reported correctly. It says "Closed by credit grantor - Chapter 7 petition". The zero balance ones day "Closed by Consumer - Chapter 7 petition".

All three say Included in Bankruptcy as the status though, when only the one with a balance should be doing this. I plan to dispute after discharge since I closed the two myself with 0 balances before filing. Amex and Chase reported "Closed by consumer" and made no mention of the BK7 on my zero balance accounts I closed out with them prior to filing. And I'm also burning both Amex and Chase on other accounts as well. Barclays is spiteful, I suppose. LOL.
Filed Ch7: 6/21/17
341 Meeting: 7/28/17
Pre BK Scores: EX 760, EQ 750, TU 755
Current Scores: I am scared to even look... Smiley Sad

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