All credit scores are useless

[Anonymous]

OP I can definitely understand your aggravation and frustration - especially since USBank holds your mortgage.  They hold mine as well (not my original lender) and I am currently undergoing the process for a HELOC ... which brings me to your situation.

I think I am confused. Based on what I have seen on this board, what you have described is limited credit history since you stated you only have a mortgage and CC with no balance. So, regardless of how long you have held the mortgage, would it matter since they do not have any thing else to base your credit worthiness?

Don't get me wrong, I am not agreeing with the decision, I am just asking you and others. I just spoke to a young lady today who needed to get a cosigner for a car. Her FICO is 760 and she has one credit card. The dealership stated if she at least had another loan, something else to base her payment history, they could have possibly given her the loan individually. 

USBank in general seems to do business backwards. I applied for my HELOC and was initially denied. I was contacted by an underwriter BEFORE I even received the written documentation for the denial. I was told that this is actually their normal process ... most are denied and then sent to underwriting to get approval.  Makes no sense to me.

Message Edited by PurpleHaze on 05-18-2009 10:28 PM

[Anonymous]

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@Imhotrodcrazy wrote:

Hi Carter,

My mortgage is 17 yrs old with a perfect payment record.  My one and only cc is zero balance and the highest utl was 14%.  The credit card is new however, since I didn't have any cc's, my score jumped 21 pts when I got it. I have never been a person to charge a lot, I usually pay cash.  Its just the way I was raised and it is hard to teach an "old" dog new tricks as they say.  I hope you have better luck in your search. 

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I'm so sorry you were denied this card. I don't, however, believe for a moment that they denied you for high DTI. CCCs seem to just giving random reasons for denials, CLDs, and closures lately.

From what you're saying above I tend to think they may have denied you because you have no credit card history to speak of.  Most  CCCs  want to see how you've handled credit cards in the past before they take a chance on you.

Ridiculous, since they've held your mortgage for so many years. but we're living in strange times.

Message Edited by VEEnVEGAS on 05-18-2009 08:03 PM

[Watchmann]

Many poster's experiences illustrate why FICO scores alone don't tell the whole story on credit worthiness.  Fair Isaac sold the industy a bill of goods over the last ten years or so.  FICO scores can be gamed and large credit lines can be obtained with flimsy income.  With all the defaults going on, and the Obama adminstration rolling out new laws, look for income hurdles to come into play.  Those that are complaining about being rate jacked or denied credit will be howling as the new laws will not favor them.  Those that have good income and stellar credit will be fine, everyone else will slide down the scale.  Be careful what you wish for ..... 

[Itsmeagain]

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@Watchmann wrote:
Many poster's experiences illustrate why FICO scores alone don't tell the whole story on credit worthiness.  Fair Isaac sold the industy a bill of goods over the last ten years or so.  FICO scores can be gamed and large credit lines can be obtained with flimsy income. 

And we are teaching that very thing every day in many, many posts.

With all the defaults going on, and the Obama adminstration rolling out new laws, look for income hurdles to come into play.

And where did this pearl come from?  I've seen absolutely NO indication that "income hurdles" have much (if any), bearing on revolving credit unless it's with a credit union.

  Those that are complaining about being rate jacked or denied credit will be howling as the new laws will not favor them. 

Please explain your logic.  The new rules seem to favor consumers, not penalize them.

Those that have good income and stellar credit will be fine, everyone else will slide down the scale.

Au Contraire . . . the new rules will stop the CC abuses to folks with mediocre credit files and force the CCC's to adjust their rates/penalties and therefore the consumer will be able to pay his debts easier and on time.

  Be careful what you wish for ..... 

 Just a fair shake, sir . . . just a fair shake.

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[natasjlp]

I have a TU of 701 and was denied a CLI from BOFA. They claimed my income was low and I did have 2 unsettled collections - so taking care of the collections and going back with a higher income soon

I don't know what your house is valued at to what you owe. I know you won't be able to refinance without a good ratio there.

Also trying for a new line of credit did you try any backdoor numbers?

check them out below.

[natasjlp]

Also you said you only have 1 CC? you might want to get a few more. Right, that is what you are doing. You could definitely get a secured card.

Let us know how going through another CCC works. Do you get pre-approved CC junk mail?

[cobaltnv]

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@Itsmeagain wrote:

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@Watchmann wrote:

Those that have good income and stellar credit will be fine, everyone else will slide down the scale.

Au Contraire . . . the new rules will stop the CC abuses to folks with mediocre credit files and force the CCC's to adjust their rates/penalties and therefore the consumer will be able to pay his debts easier and on time.

  Be careful what you wish for ..... 

 Just a fair shake, sir . . . just a fair shake.

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The new rules may help curb the "abuse" on those with mediocre credit, but a potential drawback is that ccc may just stop lending to those customers.

I think what the poster is referring to here is that with the new rules (and the current crisis) banks are going to be much more careful about handing out credit cards. Therefore watchman is correct (potentially) that those with mediocre credit may have a hard time getting credit cards.

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[natasjlp]

I think that is correct, seems like basic economics [great book by the way! Basic Economics - Thomas Sowell]

If you force the CCCs to artificially lower rates and lower fees, you then take away incentive for the CCCs to take the risk of loaning money to people with lesser credit ratings.

[haulingthescoreup]

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natasjlp wrote:

I think that is correct, seems like basic economics [great book by the way! Basic Economics - Thomas Sowell]

If you force the CCCs to artificially lower rates and lower fees, you then take away incentive for the CCCs to take the risk of loaning money to people with lesser credit ratings.

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Oh, gosh, I can't believe I'm getting into this one...

The above assumes that the current rates and fees are somehow "natural"; set by the classic forces of supply and demand in a free market. The big problem with CC's is that consumers don't have the info that we need to make this a free marketplace. We apply for a card advertised as "up to" 0% for twelve months, no fee, then 7.99%, and we wind up with a card with a $49 fee, 6 months APR @ 3.99%, then 14.99%.

If the playing field were leveled to where consumers actually knew what we were "buying" (i.e., acquiring via an app for credit), we could make more rational decisions. Those with good credit would be rewarded with good terms; those with shakier credit would have less favorable terms. As it is, though, the banks have all the decision-making power, and they can change terms without prior notice and without cause on the part of the consumer (in order to make their books look better), and it winds up being a giant crap-shoot for the consumer. Imagine if auto loans were handled this way??

I have a hard time with the concept of "artificial" lowering of rates and fee imposition, when we currently are experiencing what I consider to be artificial raising of rates and fees.

I do understand the argument of those suspicious of the pending CC legislation. I just don't believe that things are as black and white as either side presents.

[Anonymous]

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@Imhotrodcrazy wrote:

74King,

You are right, I will be looking for someone else to take my mortgage.  IMO opinion, common sense is missing in this world.  If a person has a 790 fico score, nothing bad at all on their report, you have to be an idiot not to approve them.  Its not like it use to be. I feel sorry for the young people out their trying to get started.  Well, thanks for the post.  Good luck to you. 

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Thank you.....I'm sure it will all work out.