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Established Contributor
cashnocredit
Posts: 1,028
Registered: ‎07-18-2009
0

Re: Do YOU exaggerate your income when applying?

[ Edited ]

LionLaw wrote:
That reminds me of a story my Securities Regulation prof told.

We were talking about insider trading, and some of the little, seemingly undetectable ways people commit insider trading. One of my classmates asked the prof "How do they get caught?" My prof sighed and said "Every year someone in this class asks that question. And when I look in the Wall Street Journal and read about one of my former students going to jail for insider trading, it's always the ones who sat where you are now and asked that same question. You will get caught, and you will go to jail Don't worry about how. Just don't do it."

Funny story and it brings up the question of what, exactly, is insider trading.

Person A, a company exec, files a Form 144 to sell shares. Form 144 specifically states they have no material inside information, a requirement of the Form.

Person B, a non affiliate, learns that Person A has filled a Form 144.

 

Does the mere knowledge that an exec, who has officially stated they have no insider info, intends to sell shares constitute insider trading?

 

The answer depends on the era.

 (hint: Martha, Martha, Martha)

 

While this is getting off topic, it illustrates that sometimes things aren't clearcut and when you operate close to the line sometimes one can't be sure which side one is really on.

I have reestablished credit over the last couple years
so my moniker is, well, rather out of date.

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tinuviel
Posts: 4,875
Registered: ‎11-02-2010
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Re: Do YOU exaggerate your income when applying?


cashnocredit wrote:

LionLaw wrote:
That reminds me of a story my Securities Regulation prof told.

We were talking about insider trading, and some of the little, seemingly undetectable ways people commit insider trading. One of my classmates asked the prof "How do they get caught?" My prof sighed and said "Every year someone in this class asks that question. And when I look in the Wall Street Journal and read about one of my former students going to jail for insider trading, it's always the ones who sat where you are now and asked that same question. You will get caught, and you will go to jail Don't worry about how. Just don't do it."

Funny story and it brings up the question of what, exactly, is insider trading.

Person A, a company exec, files a Form 144 to sell shares. Form 144 specifically states they have no material inside information, a requirement of the Form.

Person B, a non affiliate, learns that Person A has filled a Form 144.

 

Does the mere knowledge that an exec, who has officially stated they have no insider info, intends to sell shares constitute insider trading?

 

The answer depends on the era.

 (hint: Martha, Martha, Martha)

 

While this is getting off topic, it illustrates that sometimes things aren't clearcut and when you operate close to the line sometimes one can't be sure which side one is really on.


 

Yes, and while I truly do enjoy reading a spirited and thoughtful debate, let's please remember to stay on topic. :smileyhappy:

 


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CreditCrusader
Posts: 799
Registered: ‎09-27-2011
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Re: Do YOU exaggerate your income when applying?


Tommy5746 wrote:

SwampSystems wrote:

Tommy5746 wrote:

we ALL know you shouldnt lie on your app.. but, if somebody said they make 32k but they really make 30k... im going to bet the farm that the WORST thing that happens is the CCC closes the card.. and possibly even blacklists them... I dont see that as a top tier case for the feds lol... And i hiiighly doubt the CCC would even report it...


Fraud is fraud. According to Title 18 of the U.S. Code, Section 1014, the maximium penalty is $1,000,000 or 30 years in prison.


I dont deny that lying on an application is against the law, and wrong.. but you give me just one.. one single case where somebody fudged there income by 1k or 2k and they got jail time...Fudging your income by 10, 20 or even 30k or more is warrant for legal investigation..BUT  You wont find one for somebody exaggerating by 1 or 2k.. Its like speeding in a car.. should you speed? No.. is it stupid? yes.. Do people ever get jail time for going 5 miles over the speed limit? absolutely not.. Thats ridiculous...


Tommy, in this thread you seem to be trying to ease your own mind regarding what you deem to be minimal fudging of income. I would be very cautious about rationalizing illegal behavior per using an economic degree of separation.

 

When you sign that application, you are attesting, under penalty of credit card application fraud, that the information is correct. I don't believe that trying to get a leg up on a credit application is worth having credit card application fraud stapled to every future credit application I submit. Fudging income by any degree is a really, really stupid thing to do and potentially disastrous to your credit and legal standings.

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CruzImperial
Posts: 869
Registered: ‎07-04-2012
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Re: Do YOU exaggerate your income when applying?

How do they get caught? XD
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Tommy5746
Posts: 440
Registered: ‎02-08-2012
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Re: Do YOU exaggerate your income when applying?


CruzImperial wrote:
How do they get caught? XD

no no! lol ...Im not trying to ease my own mind.. I don’t lie on apps.. im not rich.. but im not poor.. I make enough money to live a nice life.. BUT I also realize that some people DO in fact exaggerate income by a small amount.. The sole purpose of this thread wasn’t to praise lying on applications.. because it’s wrong to do so..It was just meant to see the reason WHY people do it.. and how much they exaggerated by... and to get peoples opinions on the matter....YES, we should ALL follow the applicable laws.. but somebody who puts down that they make 31k when they really make 30k in my mind.. Isn’t going to get jail time.. Isn’t going to be investigated for fraud.. Isn’t going to be labeled a criminal.. and in my opinion, CCC's aren’t going to drop the hammer down upon them...

 

This is all my opinion of course but some people seem to think that stating that you make 1k more a year on credit card application are leading a life of shame and crime which just isn’t true at all.. If a person was sick and needed surgery and the best doctor in the world stated that he made 500k a year on his CC app but he really only made 499K.. would you say "I will absolutely not let that doctor operate on me! He fudged his CC app by 1k!" That sounds silly right? Sounds ridiculous too? That’s because it is ridiculous... You wouldn’t even know that the doctor exaggerated by 1k on his app because it wouldn’t be on the news.. he wouldn’t be labeled or branded a criminal and his maturity wouldn’t be taken into account.. Its not about rationalizing this "behavior" because we are talking about something so small (small being 1 or 2k)...

 

I can’t even believe this thread became this big... imagine seeing a headline somewhere that read "Man Jailed For Parking In Spot Reserved For Expecting Mothers Only".. Your reaction would be "seriousy!!?" because it’s so small.. It’s not even a thought.. and im almost certain that a credit card company feels the same way about somebody who puts down 51k when they really only make 50k..

 

Last time ill say it.. Yes, it’s wrong to exaggerate or lie on ANY application for credit..Just as it’s illegal to go 5mph over the speed limit.. just as it is illegal to park in a handicapped spot if you aren’t disabled.. we are all mature adults on this site and I believe that all of us share a common interest in our financial well being and learning..

 

SO, this thread should show everybody that the general consensus is to NOT lie on your app.. The overwhelming majority of us feel that its wrong and we all know its illegal..  and I would like it if the Mods locked this thread because I believe its gone in the WRONG direction!

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TheConductor
Posts: 492
Registered: ‎07-24-2012
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Re: Do YOU exaggerate your income when applying?

[ Edited ]

As I've hinted in another thread, I suspect the number of people who are willing to brazenly exaggerate their income by 1k or 2k on a credit card app far outnumbers the number who will brazenly just ask their boss for a 1k or 2k raise.  A raise which they may well deserve if they would just step up and make their case for it.

 

It's laughable irony considering asking for a raise is entirely legal and the only possible outcomes range from neutral (nothing happens) to positive (get a raise).

 

If you feel the need to exaggerate your income, whether on CC applications or in casual conversation, consider the possibility that you're not really earning what you are worth. Grow a spine, ask for more!  Even in an extended recession, there's always extra money lying around for those who know how to objectively evaluate their own performance.

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jsickz32
Posts: 1,987
Registered: ‎06-25-2012
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Re: Do YOU exaggerate your income when applying?

I think what Tommy4756 is talking about are people who put 50k income when they make 48,917.12 lol if is that id understand putting 50,000 for income but its not called exaggerating but rounding.
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tinuviel
Posts: 4,875
Registered: ‎11-02-2010
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Re: Do YOU exaggerate your income when applying?

As per the OP's request, I am closing this thread to new replies. I do believe that this thread has pretty much run its course.


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