@Anonymous wrote:I'll be the dissenting voice here and say Citi Double Cash hands-down.
Reason? 2% beats 1.5URP. To me, 1.5URP = 1.5%.
Excuse me while I rant.
I have been at this game for eight years, and I have never, ever, seen a URP redemption that would work for me, other than $.01 per URP.
Yes, I've studied, I've read the how-to-manuals, looked at flyertalk and the points guy, read the bragging threads on how someone got a first-class flight to Paris on July 1 that otherwise would have cost $5,000 for only 700k URP, making a redemption value of over 7 cents per point.
But guess what? I have no desire to fly first class to Paris on July 1 for $5000, $700 or even $500.
Every time I've looked for a flight that I actually *want* to take, any flight I could actually take by converting my points to something else, resolves to far less than 1 cent per point, compared to what I could book otherwise.
The way I see it, URP may be more valuable than 1 cent per point if all of the following are true:
1. You like to fly a *lot* for no particular reason.
2. You don't care where your destination is, except that it has to be an expensive flight that you get for next to nothing.
3. You really really have to have first class for everything.
Otherwise, take the cash.
There are two types of people. Person A will buy a $300 pair of shoes for $50 and say "Man, what a great deal I got! I got a $300 pair of shoes, with built-in GPS and step-tracking, for only $50." And there's the other type of person who said, "hey, I just got a pair of sneakers at Costco for $19.99 and got 5% cashback, so they only cost me $18.99." Person A will sniff and say, "but I saved $250, and you only saved $1, and my shoes are so much cooler." Person B will say "but I paid $18.99 for a pair of shoes that will serve me fine, and you paid $50, so I saved $30 more than you."
If you're person B, take the DC. If you're person A, FU.
Chris.
Then just get the DC. I only fly to destinations I want to travel to. I do not fly a lot. I don't "need" to be in first class, but on a 14+ hour flight it is a hell of a lot better than economy, especially for taller people who need more leg room. I use points and while they can be a hassle sometimes, I have saved thousands (maybe tens of thousands) over the years. Also, points are good for business class seats as well so it isn't just first class. I often get more than 2% back on redemptions. If you are only going to travel domestic then maybe points aren't for you (there is no real need for buisness or first class on a domestic ticket), but your list of the only people who can use points is inaccurate. Also, with URs I find better redemptions via Hyatt vs using them on flights (part of this has to do with I use other points programs for flights and like to avoid fuel surcharges though).
;
I don't "need" to be in first class, but on a 14+ hour flight it is a hell of a lot better than economy, especially for taller people who need more leg room.
I heard THAT. Only 5'11", but 34" inseam.
And I'd gladly fly first class to Paris for points, even at 3 a.m. on a weekday.
That said, I'm only chasing cash, at this point.
@Anonymous wrote:I'll be the dissenting voice here and say Citi Double Cash hands-down.
Reason? 2% beats 1.5URP. To me, 1.5URP = 1.5%.
Excuse me while I rant.
I have been at this game for eight years, and I have never, ever, seen a URP redemption that would work for me, other than $.01 per URP.
Yes, I've studied, I've read the how-to-manuals, looked at flyertalk and the points guy, read the bragging threads on how someone got a first-class flight to Paris on July 1 that otherwise would have cost $5,000 for only 700k URP, making a redemption value of over 7 cents per point.
But guess what? I have no desire to fly first class to Paris on July 1 for $5000, $700 or even $500.
Every time I've looked for a flight that I actually *want* to take, any flight I could actually take by converting my points to something else, resolves to far less than 1 cent per point, compared to what I could book otherwise.
The way I see it, URP may be more valuable than 1 cent per point if all of the following are true:
1. You like to fly a *lot* for no particular reason.
2. You don't care where your destination is, except that it has to be an expensive flight that you get for next to nothing.
3. You really really have to have first class for everything.
Otherwise, take the cash.
There are two types of people. Person A will buy a $300 pair of shoes for $50 and say "Man, what a great deal I got! I got a $300 pair of shoes, with built-in GPS and step-tracking, for only $50." And there's the other type of person who said, "hey, I just got a pair of sneakers at Costco for $19.99 and got 5% cashback, so they only cost me $18.99." Person A will sniff and say, "but I saved $250, and you only saved $1, and my shoes are so much cooler." Person B will say "but I paid $18.99 for a pair of shoes that will serve me fine, and you paid $50, so I saved $30 more than you."
If you're person B, take the DC. If you're person A, FU.
Chris.
I agree, flights, particularly first class, need to be something you would otherwise pay for to be a fair comparison. Low value flights can be "only" 1.5c per point, but even at that, the FU maps out to 1.5 points x 1.5c to $0.0225. The other important consideration for any points program is, it works best as an adjunct to points you are already earning for other travel, whether business or personal. When you've got 20,000 miles from business travel, being able to find 5,000 miles from your points card of choice to get a $400 or $500 airline ticket adds a lot of value to both earnings sources.
My goal redemption for UR points is Hyatt Escala at Park City. 15,000 points for a night, ski season rates of $500 - $600 per night, plus the Hyatt Annual Free Night can make for a nice couple of nights for double occupancy. With the FU, that's $10,000 of spend for about a $600 return, or 6%. Would I spend $600 per night? No. But being able to use the points has value that a 2% card can't provide.
@NRB525 wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:I'll be the dissenting voice here and say Citi Double Cash hands-down.
Reason? 2% beats 1.5URP. To me, 1.5URP = 1.5%.
Excuse me while I rant.
I have been at this game for eight years, and I have never, ever, seen a URP redemption that would work for me, other than $.01 per URP.
Yes, I've studied, I've read the how-to-manuals, looked at flyertalk and the points guy, read the bragging threads on how someone got a first-class flight to Paris on July 1 that otherwise would have cost $5,000 for only 700k URP, making a redemption value of over 7 cents per point.
But guess what? I have no desire to fly first class to Paris on July 1 for $5000, $700 or even $500.
Every time I've looked for a flight that I actually *want* to take, any flight I could actually take by converting my points to something else, resolves to far less than 1 cent per point, compared to what I could book otherwise.
The way I see it, URP may be more valuable than 1 cent per point if all of the following are true:
1. You like to fly a *lot* for no particular reason.
2. You don't care where your destination is, except that it has to be an expensive flight that you get for next to nothing.
3. You really really have to have first class for everything.
Otherwise, take the cash.
There are two types of people. Person A will buy a $300 pair of shoes for $50 and say "Man, what a great deal I got! I got a $300 pair of shoes, with built-in GPS and step-tracking, for only $50." And there's the other type of person who said, "hey, I just got a pair of sneakers at Costco for $19.99 and got 5% cashback, so they only cost me $18.99." Person A will sniff and say, "but I saved $250, and you only saved $1, and my shoes are so much cooler." Person B will say "but I paid $18.99 for a pair of shoes that will serve me fine, and you paid $50, so I saved $30 more than you."
If you're person B, take the DC. If you're person A, FU.
Chris.
I agree, flights, particularly first class, need to be something you would otherwise pay for to be a fair comparison. Low value flights can be "only" 1.5c per point, but even at that, the FU maps out to 1.5 points x 1.5c to $0.0225. The other important consideration for any points program is, it works best as an adjunct to points you are already earning for other travel, whether business or personal. When you've got 20,000 miles from business travel, being able to find 5,000 miles from your points card of choice to get a $400 or $500 airline ticket adds a lot of value to both earnings sources.
My goal redemption for UR points is Hyatt Escala at Park City. 15,000 points for a night, ski season rates of $500 - $600 per night, plus the Hyatt Annual Free Night can make for a nice couple of nights for double occupancy. With the FU, that's $10,000 of spend for about a $600 return, or 6%. Would I spend $600 per night? No. But being able to use the points has value that a 2% card can't provide.
The flights don't need to be something you would otherwise pay for to be a fair comparison. The reality is you are getting a service that has a certain ticket value. If you look at first class as a product then in order to do a fair comparison you need to look at what you would pay for a first class ticket using cash back. If you want economy then you need to look at what you would pay for an economy ticket (on the same airline because service varies between airlines) vs how much a point redemption would cost you. They are all different products, but the argument that you would have to have been willing to pay for a first class ticket otherwise the value somehow doesn't count makes no sense. There are some times even with points you will do better in economy than you will with cashback, especially when it comes to longhaul international flights.It is true that if you only want to fly economy then you may be better off with cashback (this is certainly true with domestic US flights).With cashback cards you normally will not see the same value in terms of signup bonuses that you will with travel rewards cards, so that should be factored in as well. Signups are relavant here because with the ability to pool points across multiple cards into one travel partner can allow you to obtain larger redemptions. So if you have a bunch of points from a signup on another card and that card shares an airline transfer partner with chase you could combine both sets of points into one travel partner account. Something you can't do across multiple cash back cards.