Gaining points/miles for free using Paypal?

[Darius1976]

This is a little immoral story, but I wanted to know if its sounds true.  I didn't think it was.  Anyhow.  I talked with a friend of mine and he stated that he and another friend want to test a theory and it worked.  He had a Delta miles card and his friend had a paypal account.  He transferred money buy "purchasing" an item from his friend and paid it to the paypal account.  Once the paypal account cleared the money, the other guy withdrew the money and just gave it back to the orignal guy.

Isn't that really shady thing to do?  What are your thoughts?

[ksantangelo23]

This would fall under the "Manufactured Spending" conversation

If done in moderation, or at least very carefully, you can get away with it. But if your lender finds out you're clearly, and obviously gaming their reward system, they will come down on you hard.

[jamesdwi]

Its called manuafactored spending, and is forbidden in most credit card agreements, it does happen, its dangerous for the credit card holder, if the person with the paypal account doesn't give you the money back it can get ugly, if you are caught the creditor will shut down all of your accounts, and possibly black list you for life, don't forget that paypal has fee's as well which are greater than the rewards you get, could be helpful for meeting spend requirements to get sign up bonuses. 

[Darius1976]

i totally agee. I told him that credit card companies have ways to protect themselves from those types of actions.  it didn't sound good at all.

[indiolatino61]

---

@Darius1976 wrote:

This is a little immoral story, but I wanted to know if its sounds true.  I didn't think it was.  Anyhow.  I talked with a friend of mine and he stated that he and another friend want to test a theory and it worked.  He had a Delta miles card and his friend had a paypal account.  He transferred money buy "purchasing" an item from his friend and paid it to the paypal account.  Once the paypal account cleared the money, the other guy withdrew the money and just gave it back to the orignal guy.

Isn't that really shady thing to do?  What are your thoughts?

---

Most things that seem shady usually are...lol.

[longtimelurker]

---

@jamesdwi wrote:

Its called manuafactored spending, and is forbidden in most credit card agreements, it does happen, its dangerous for the credit card holder, if the person with the paypal account doesn't give you the money back it can get ugly, if you are caught the creditor will shut down all of your accounts, and possibly black list you for life, don't forget that paypal has fee's as well which are greater than the rewards you get, could be helpful for meeting spend requirements to get sign up bonuses. 

---

I don't think this is particularly forbidden in the T&Cs, which focus more on buying of cash equivalents, whereas this is more of a fake transaction.  What stops this more, as you say, is the PP fees, did the friend return the total purchase price (in which case there was a loss) or purchase-fees, in which case the transaction probably wasn't profitable for the card holder.

Using phrases like "shady" doesn't mean much.  There is a sliding scale that each person has a comfort level with.  For example, where are you on this scale!

1) I apply for a card I don't really "need", just for the bonus.

   1a) Shortly after meeting the bonus, I close the card

    1b) or, since it doesn't have an AF, I just SD it.

2) As above in 1a), then after whatever time is needed, I apply again and churn for the bonus

3) I use Amazon payments to send $1K to my partner, and he/she withdraws it and gives it back as a check (a smarter way of what was described in the OP)

4) I MS $2K a month

5) I MS $20K a month

6) I MS $200K a month

7) I work at a bar, and whenever possible I clone people's cards and sell them to a friend for $100 each

8) I kill people, hide their bodies and steal their cards, this gives me a long time to use them before they are reported.

[Fico2Go]

---

@longtimelurker wrote:

---

@jamesdwi wrote:

Its called manuafactored spending, and is forbidden in most credit card agreements, it does happen, its dangerous for the credit card holder, if the person with the paypal account doesn't give you the money back it can get ugly, if you are caught the creditor will shut down all of your accounts, and possibly black list you for life, don't forget that paypal has fee's as well which are greater than the rewards you get, could be helpful for meeting spend requirements to get sign up bonuses. 

---

I don't think this is particularly forbidden in the T&Cs, which focus more on buying of cash equivalents, whereas this is more of a fake transaction.  What stops this more, as you say, is the PP fees, did the friend return the total purchase price (in which case there was a loss) or purchase-fees, in which case the transaction probably wasn't profitable for the card holder.

Using phrases like "shady" doesn't mean much.  There is a sliding scale that each person has a comfort level with.  For example, where are you on this scale!

1) I apply for a card I don't really "need", just for the bonus.

   1a) Shortly after meeting the bonus, I close the card

    1b) or, since it doesn't have an AF, I just SD it.

2) As above in 1a), then after whatever time is needed, I apply again and churn for the bonus

3) I use Amazon payments to send $1K to my partner, and he/she withdraws it and gives it back as a check (a smarter way of what was described in the OP)

4) I MS $2K a month

5) I MS $20K a month

6) I MS $200K a month

7) I work at a bar, and whenever possible I clone people's cards and sell them to a friend for $100 each

8) I kill people, hide their bodies and steal their cards, this gives me a long time to use them before they are reported.

---

LTlurker,

Before #1 is also this one:

a)  I freeze all my CRs except the one I want creditors to see;

b) I RECON and ask the creditor to HP only the CRA that favors me;

There is also #19:

Which goes something like this..

a) I know and am aware that reload cards require cash to buy but I will come up with many ways to trick the cashier to selling me one;

b)  I will buy reload cards from CVS but only at late evenings when no one is really paying attention;

c)  I will offer to pay a cashier at CVS so he will sell me a reload card using CC;

For me tho I probably fit in #20 which goes like this:

I find the closest card to 5% rewards and I MS and load to paypal.  Then pay for things using Paypal and get an extra 1.5% cashback for using PP debit card.

[myjourney]

---

@Fico2Go wrote:

---

@longtimelurker wrote:

---

@jamesdwi wrote:

Its called manuafactored spending, and is forbidden in most credit card agreements, it does happen, its dangerous for the credit card holder, if the person with the paypal account doesn't give you the money back it can get ugly, if you are caught the creditor will shut down all of your accounts, and possibly black list you for life, don't forget that paypal has fee's as well which are greater than the rewards you get, could be helpful for meeting spend requirements to get sign up bonuses. 

---

I don't think this is particularly forbidden in the T&Cs, which focus more on buying of cash equivalents, whereas this is more of a fake transaction.  What stops this more, as you say, is the PP fees, did the friend return the total purchase price (in which case there was a loss) or purchase-fees, in which case the transaction probably wasn't profitable for the card holder.

Using phrases like "shady" doesn't mean much.  There is a sliding scale that each person has a comfort level with.  For example, where are you on this scale!

1) I apply for a card I don't really "need", just for the bonus.

   1a) Shortly after meeting the bonus, I close the card

    1b) or, since it doesn't have an AF, I just SD it.

2) As above in 1a), then after whatever time is needed, I apply again and churn for the bonus

3) I use Amazon payments to send $1K to my partner, and he/she withdraws it and gives it back as a check (a smarter way of what was described in the OP)

4) I MS $2K a month

5) I MS $20K a month

6) I MS $200K a month

7) I work at a bar, and whenever possible I clone people's cards and sell them to a friend for $100 each

8) I kill people, hide their bodies and steal their cards, this gives me a long time to use them before they are reported.

---

LTlurker,

Before #1 is also this one:

a)  I freeze all my CRs except the one I want creditors to see;

b) I RECON and ask the creditor to HP only the CRA that favors me;

There is also #19:

Which goes something like this..

a) I know and am aware that reload cards require cash to buy but I will come up with many ways to trick the cashier to selling me one;

b)  I will buy reload cards from CVS but only at late evenings when no one is really paying attention;

c)  I will offer to pay a cashier at CVS so he will sell me a reload card using CC;

For me tho I probably fit in #20 which goes like this:

I find the closest card to 5% rewards and I MS and load to paypal.  Then pay for things using Paypal and get an extra 1.5% cashback for using PP debit card.

---

This is not encouraged and is in a violation of the TOS please refrain 

Thanks MJ

[longtimelurker]

---

@myjourney wrote:

---

@Fico2Go wrote:

---

@longtimelurker wrote:

---

@jamesdwi wrote:

Its called manuafactored spending, and is forbidden in most credit card agreements, it does happen, its dangerous for the credit card holder, if the person with the paypal account doesn't give you the money back it can get ugly, if you are caught the creditor will shut down all of your accounts, and possibly black list you for life, don't forget that paypal has fee's as well which are greater than the rewards you get, could be helpful for meeting spend requirements to get sign up bonuses. 

---

I don't think this is particularly forbidden in the T&Cs, which focus more on buying of cash equivalents, whereas this is more of a fake transaction.  What stops this more, as you say, is the PP fees, did the friend return the total purchase price (in which case there was a loss) or purchase-fees, in which case the transaction probably wasn't profitable for the card holder.

Using phrases like "shady" doesn't mean much.  There is a sliding scale that each person has a comfort level with.  For example, where are you on this scale!

1) I apply for a card I don't really "need", just for the bonus.

   1a) Shortly after meeting the bonus, I close the card

    1b) or, since it doesn't have an AF, I just SD it.

2) As above in 1a), then after whatever time is needed, I apply again and churn for the bonus

3) I use Amazon payments to send $1K to my partner, and he/she withdraws it and gives it back as a check (a smarter way of what was described in the OP)

4) I MS $2K a month

5) I MS $20K a month

6) I MS $200K a month

7) I work at a bar, and whenever possible I clone people's cards and sell them to a friend for $100 each

8) I kill people, hide their bodies and steal their cards, this gives me a long time to use them before they are reported.

---

LTlurker,

Before #1 is also this one:

a)  I freeze all my CRs except the one I want creditors to see;

b) I RECON and ask the creditor to HP only the CRA that favors me;

There is also #19:

Which goes something like this..

a) I know and am aware that reload cards require cash to buy but I will come up with many ways to trick the cashier to selling me one;

b)  I will buy reload cards from CVS but only at late evenings when no one is really paying attention;

c)  I will offer to pay a cashier at CVS so he will sell me a reload card using CC;

For me tho I probably fit in #20 which goes like this:

I find the closest card to 5% rewards and I MS and load to paypal.  Then pay for things using Paypal and get an extra 1.5% cashback for using PP debit card.

---

This is not encouraged and is in a violation of the TOS please refrain 

Thanks MJ

---

That's quite funny, giving the impression that freezing your reports is more frowned upon than my 7 and 8!

[myjourney]

---

@longtimelurker wrote:

---

@myjourney wrote:

---

@Fico2Go wrote:

---

@longtimelurker wrote:

---

@jamesdwi wrote:

Its called manuafactored spending, and is forbidden in most credit card agreements, it does happen, its dangerous for the credit card holder, if the person with the paypal account doesn't give you the money back it can get ugly, if you are caught the creditor will shut down all of your accounts, and possibly black list you for life, don't forget that paypal has fee's as well which are greater than the rewards you get, could be helpful for meeting spend requirements to get sign up bonuses. 

---

I don't think this is particularly forbidden in the T&Cs, which focus more on buying of cash equivalents, whereas this is more of a fake transaction.  What stops this more, as you say, is the PP fees, did the friend return the total purchase price (in which case there was a loss) or purchase-fees, in which case the transaction probably wasn't profitable for the card holder.

Using phrases like "shady" doesn't mean much.  There is a sliding scale that each person has a comfort level with.  For example, where are you on this scale!

1) I apply for a card I don't really "need", just for the bonus.

   1a) Shortly after meeting the bonus, I close the card

    1b) or, since it doesn't have an AF, I just SD it.

2) As above in 1a), then after whatever time is needed, I apply again and churn for the bonus

3) I use Amazon payments to send $1K to my partner, and he/she withdraws it and gives it back as a check (a smarter way of what was described in the OP)

4) I MS $2K a month

5) I MS $20K a month

6) I MS $200K a month

7) I work at a bar, and whenever possible I clone people's cards and sell them to a friend for $100 each

8) I kill people, hide their bodies and steal their cards, this gives me a long time to use them before they are reported.

---

LTlurker,

Before #1 is also this one:

a)  I freeze all my CRs except the one I want creditors to see;

b) I RECON and ask the creditor to HP only the CRA that favors me;

There is also #19:

Which goes something like this..

a) I know and am aware that reload cards require cash to buy but I will come up with many ways to trick the cashier to selling me one;

b)  I will buy reload cards from CVS but only at late evenings when no one is really paying attention;

c)  I will offer to pay a cashier at CVS so he will sell me a reload card using CC;

For me tho I probably fit in #20 which goes like this:

I find the closest card to 5% rewards and I MS and load to paypal.  Then pay for things using Paypal and get an extra 1.5% cashback for using PP debit card.

---

This is not encouraged and is in a violation of the TOS please refrain 

Thanks MJ

---

That's quite funny, giving the impression that freezing your reports is more frowned upon than my 7 and 8!

---

Actually I'll be watching the whole thread because It's full of unrelated credit subject matter going on here