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Established Contributor
lithium78
Posts: 929
Registered: ‎07-30-2011
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Re: Is Discover too aggressive lately?

I think we live in a culture where everybody thinks they have to behave like wealthy celebrities and everyone should possess luxury items and status symbols.  The reality is that most of us are never going to be high-rollers, nor should we try to be, because that way of thinking is incredibly wasteful.  People trying to "keep up with the Joneses" by taking on more debt than they could handle for stuff they don't need played a big role in the financial meltdown we suffered through in 2008.

 

I guess what I'm trying to say is that the average person can get a lot more use out of a Discover card than an American Express card.  No annual fee, 5% categories with a reasonable cap that most people probably wouldn't even max out, and 1% for everything else is a pretty good deal.  AMEX cards only really make sense if you spend thousands and thousands of dollars each month.  I suppose that works really well for people who own businesses or people with 1% occupations, but that's just not reality for most people.

 

I like Discover a lot and I think they are a terrific company to do business with.


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sccredit
Posts: 950
Registered: ‎09-14-2012
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Re: Is Discover too aggressive lately?


Gunnar419 wrote:

RSCo wrote:

Chrysostom wrote:

Damn, I guess they do. Do you realize how rare a $10k Discover limit is? Discover only goes to $15k, even if you have an 850 FICO, 990 VS, and make capital gains faster than you can write $1000 checks to spend them.

I've never even heard of a $10k Discover limit in real life. $5k is considered excellent for Discover in any case - there being dozens of individuals that have $25k here, $23k here, $24.9k here, and $3.6k on Discover. Congratulations!


Wow, really.. I had no idea they were that conservative.. I was a bit surprised.. My Fico is only 713 and my partners is 823.. Maybe that's why he received 10k... The card is gorgeous and everyone always comments on it being unique..

 


I have a Discover limit over $10k. But it took me the better part of two decades to get there! A $10k approval from Discover right out of the bag is astonishing.

 


I was approved with a $10k limit with a 708 score, I don't know that I would call it astonishing.

 

I have been extremely happy with my Discover card, especially the CS.  I had the worst experiences with AMEX's outsourced CS, tot he point where I cancelled my PRG card. 

 

I don't have time to track all of my points, making sure I maximize rewards.  I make sure I use the correct card for 5% categories (Freedom, it card), use my Spark card for my 2% on business and everything else goes on Discover.  I don't buy into the AMEX "prestige" they try to sell (when I cancelled my card the CSR tried to sell me on the prestige of the AMEX card) and use what I feel best about.  I have never had somewhere that did not take Discover so no acceptance complaints there.

Unsecured Credit: Amex BCP $24,900; Chase Sapphire Preferred $24,200; Discover It $12,500; Chase Ink Cash $15,000; Chase Slate $13,500; Citi TYP $12,900; Amex SPG Biz $3,000; US Bank Platinum $8,600; DCU Visa $10,000; Logix FCU $15,000; Citi Home Depot $8,800; Lowes $5,000; Care Credit $6,000; Penfed Platinum Sig $16,000; Barclay Arrival Plus WEMC $5,000; Bank of America World Points Business Visa $8,000; US Bank PLOC Overdraft $1,500; US Bank Edge Rewards Business $10,000; PenFed PLOC $5,000

Senior Contributor
Open123
Posts: 4,155
Registered: ‎02-23-2011
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Re: Is Discover too aggressive lately?

[ Edited ]

lithium78 wrote:

I think we live in a culture where everybody thinks they have to behave like wealthy celebrities and everyone should possess luxury items and status symbols.  The reality is that most of us are never going to be high-rollers, nor should we try to be, because that way of thinking is incredibly wasteful.  People trying to "keep up with the Joneses" by taking on more debt than they could handle for stuff they don't need played a big role in the financial meltdown we suffered through in 2008.

 

I guess what I'm trying to say is that the average person can get a lot more use out of a Discover card than an American Express card.  No annual fee, 5% categories with a reasonable cap that most people probably wouldn't even max out, and 1% for everything else is a pretty good deal.  AMEX cards only really make sense if you spend thousands and thousands of dollars each month.  I suppose that works really well for people who own businesses or people with 1% occupations, but that's just not reality for most people.

 

I like Discover a lot and I think they are a terrific company to do business with.


Excellent points all around.  Can't say I disagree with any of your assessments.

 

For me, I like to try and maximize every dollar I invest and spend.  In my view, whether one spends $1,000s per month, $1000s per day, or $100 per month, he should still try to maximize the return for his spending.  I never see things in $$ amounts, but % of return.

 

So, if Chase is 1.10% on all spending, why not use them?  Or, Fid Amex at 2%, why not use them for an extra 1%?  Perfectly valid reason is a person rather not suffer a dislocation of change caused by app'ing for a new card, taking a new inquiry and/or account, or if the person just "likes" Discover.  From my perspective, the only thing that matters is the cost vs. benefit analysis.

 

All things being equal, it isn't about how much one spends.  It is about "maximizing" the benefit/rewards for whatever amount one spends.  Finally, I can't see any reason not to even earn an extra 25 bps on a transaction.  

 

My loyalty to any financial institution stems on what I get--nothing else really matters.  It is just "money" after all--the most impersonal of all things in life.

 

PS - In this modern information age, it requires so little effort to maximize.  We all parcitipate and offer little bits of information and combined we have access to almost perfect information.  This is why perfect global information has virtually destroyed the "middle" person and price discrimination.  In most cases, customer service is irrelevant since it's much more efficient to do ourselves through the internet.  This makes it easy to squeeze out 25 bps or 50 pbs, whereas in the past, it would require far too much effort--app'ing with paper, sending different checks, reading periodical and journal articles about new offers.  

 

PS 2 - As a merchant, if you charge more for the same product, a person can instantly check on his mobile phone.  This allows the person to decide if paying a higher price is worth having the product immediately upon leaving the store; or, if the amount saved is worth buying from the net or the store a mile away.  Credit cards and banks are the same.  Why would I buy a CD for 75 bps, when I can get it for 1%?  

Senior Contributor
youngandcreditwrthy
Posts: 6,242
Registered: ‎08-16-2012
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Re: Is Discover too aggressive lately?

I don't think Amex is exclusively for "high rollers"

And the average person does spend tens of thousands of dollars lol

Avg mid class income is around $50k a year. Duh lol

Amex does cater to "prime" borrowers, however. A retired lady living on $12k a year could have a FICO of 800+ and get an Amex. Lol
I'd say Discover/Amex are prob about the same in terms of difficulty to obtain.
Marriott PR$25k | BCE $24.5K |BankAmericard Visa $25k| Wmt Discover $12.5k | BR Visa $12.5k | Amex Delta Gold $10k | Discover IT $10k | Paypal Extras MC $15k | Amazon Store $10k|Arrival $12.7k | Smile Gen $7.25k | Dillard's $10k | West Elm $4k| Express $3.05K | Mypoints.com Visa $4.5k | Freedom Visa $1k| Amex Surpass $1k
New Contributor
Chrysostom
Posts: 58
Registered: ‎04-15-2012
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Re: Is Discover too aggressive lately?

[ Edited ]

Open123 wrote:

FrugalRican wrote:

Funny, because to me, they haven't been aggressive enough.

 

Home Improvement for the 2Q and nothing else?

SD for three months, I say.


Next quarter it could the "groupon" card, I suppose.

 

If they wanted to compete more, I think they should at least offer a base 1.10% cashback on the IT card.  This will at least place them on equal footing with the Freedom.



It's already on par with it - the extra 1%/10pts per swipe are to get people to get a Chase checking account which is loaded down with fees, a crappy web interface, long holds on deposits, and few services until you have the "silver" checking for $25k - just letting $25k sit in linked checking and 0.01% APY return savings accounts or a 0.25% APY money market fund - instead of investing it.

It may be worth it for Discover to offer a bonus to people who use Discover savings accounts or CDs - they already have the highest rates of any bank I've seen, about tied with Centurion Bank (Amex). I don't know if Discover offers a checking account.

Secondly, around here, home improvement stores sell giftcards, green dots, and prepaid cards. Not a bad category - $10 for two green dots loaded with $750 (at Walmart alone.. so it's probably $15 for 3 $500 ones at Home Depot), and $75 cash back, for a $60-65 net. Deposit the money into Paypal, and transfer it for free to your linked bank account. Or just buy Amex GCs, or Amazon GCs if you want to spend a lot on Amazon.


Goal: 760 by End of Year
Current Score: 714 TU (2-3/12); 681 EQ (2-3/12); 714 EX (AmEx Pull: 2-7/12); 777 VantageScore (2-3/12)
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Chrysostom
Posts: 58
Registered: ‎04-15-2012
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Re: Is Discover too aggressive lately?

[ Edited ]

sccredit wrote:

Gunnar419 wrote:

RSCo wrote:

Chrysostom wrote:

Damn, I guess they do. Do you realize how rare a $10k Discover limit is? Discover only goes to $15k, even if you have an 850 FICO, 990 VS, and make capital gains faster than you can write $1000 checks to spend them.

I've never even heard of a $10k Discover limit in real life. $5k is considered excellent for Discover in any case - there being dozens of individuals that have $25k here, $23k here, $24.9k here, and $3.6k on Discover. Congratulations!


Wow, really.. I had no idea they were that conservative.. I was a bit surprised.. My Fico is only 713 and my partners is 823.. Maybe that's why he received 10k... The card is gorgeous and everyone always comments on it being unique..

 


I have a Discover limit over $10k. But it took me the better part of two decades to get there! A $10k approval from Discover right out of the bag is astonishing.

 


I was approved with a $10k limit with a 708 score, I don't know that I would call it astonishing.

 

I have been extremely happy with my Discover card, especially the CS.  I had the worst experiences with AMEX's outsourced CS, tot he point where I cancelled my PRG card. 

 

I don't have time to track all of my points, making sure I maximize rewards.  I make sure I use the correct card for 5% categories (Freedom, it card), use my Spark card for my 2% on business and everything else goes on Discover.  I don't buy into the AMEX "prestige" they try to sell (when I cancelled my card the CSR tried to sell me on the prestige of the AMEX card) and use what I feel best about.  I have never had somewhere that did not take Discover so no acceptance complaints there.

...
Someone else wrote this very good rant:

So, if Chase is 1.10% on all spending, why not use them?  Or, Fid Amex at 2%, why not use them for an extra 1%?  Perfectly valid reason is a person rather not suffer a dislocation of change caused by app'ing for a new card, taking a new inquiry and/or account, or if the person just "likes" Discover.  From my perspective, the only thing that matters is the cost vs. benefit analysis.

 

All things being equal, it isn't about how much one spends.  It is about "maximizing" the benefit/rewards for whatever amount one spends.  Finally, I can't see any reason not to even earn an extra 25 bps on a transaction.  

 

My loyalty to any financial institution stems on what I get--nothing else really matters.  It is just "money" after all--the most impersonal of all things in life.

 

PS - In this modern information age, it requires so little effort to maximize.  We all parcitipate and offer little bits of information and combined we have access to almost perfect information.  This is why perfect global information has virtually destroyed the "middle" person and price discrimination.  In most cases, customer service is irrelevant since it's much more efficient to do ourselves through the internet.  This makes it easy to squeeze out 25 bps or 50 pbs, whereas in the past, it would require far too much effort--app'ing with paper, sending different checks, reading periodical and journal articles about new offers.  

 



It actually is astonishing, that kind of a limit. Discover, as a rule, does not give limits even half that much to people with 760s right out the gate. If you have high income and good credit, they'll get you up to that point incrementally over five or ten years, usually.

I track all my points and maximize them because it's the game for me - the points game. I plan around my points, within reason, not the other way around. The SPG card got me to use almost solely SPG hotels - I used to use Hiltons, which are everywhere, and Radissons, which are common in the US, too. If you're just looking to get a little discount on life and a feeling of beating the system a bit, there's no need to count points, except for 1) persons on a fixed income and 2) obsessive-compulsive points hounds like me.

But even if there's no technical need, would you spend $3.659 on gasoline at Shell, if there was $3.489 gasoline at British Petroleum on the other corner? That's what not maximizing is, today, especially that maximizing requires so little time, with tools like Wallaby - an app for Android and iPhone, which you tell which cards you own, it uses GPS to see where you're shopping, and it tells you which card gives you the most return. It even takes in to account the different values of points, ranking 5 TYP below 5 UR or 5% cash back, and ranking 1 SPG point above 2% but below 3%. For pure maximizing of return - not necessarily maximizing relative returns/points-to-redemption or "aspirational" redemptions - just do whatever Wallaby says. I use it, and it's never given me wrong advice so far - it impressed me severely when it ranked 1 SPG point as more valuable than anything else, and 1 GECRB or ThankYou Point as more worthless than anything else.

Discover has good acceptance most places in America. Visa is accepted almost everywhere, as is MC, and, averaged out, I think Discover has about the same acceptance rates as Amex - but on the East Coast big cities, it has poor-to-non-existent acceptance - it may have something to do with the largely non-chain nature of most stores and restaurants in said cities. Most are old and privately-owned, lots of mom and pop shops. In Boston, it's a crapshoot as to whether or not a given merchant will accept Discover. In NYC, I've never seen any merchants who did, although everyone in NYC accepts American Express.

Now, overseas, you always want a Visa card. Discover and Amex both have bad acceptance rates, although Discover is actually a good deal better due to the Diner's Club network and the agreement with China UnionPay. American Express is an Express in America alone; it's a plodding clydesdale overseas. Discover doesn't help in much discovery, either, but Visa gets you in as many places as the stamp by the same name in your passport.

I only have one MasterCard (the Paypal Extras), and have seen only one business, a utility, in my entire time of credit that took only MasterCard, so I hang on to it. I have the Discover, two Amexes, and about 15 additional Visas - maybe that's why they're so widely accepted, is that everyone has one, and everyone issues several - even overseas, the "Visa/Electron" (I think Electrons are what are called "Visa Debit" cards in America) network is massive.


Goal: 760 by End of Year
Current Score: 714 TU (2-3/12); 681 EQ (2-3/12); 714 EX (AmEx Pull: 2-7/12); 777 VantageScore (2-3/12)
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HiLine
Posts: 2,949
Registered: ‎10-19-2012
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Re: Is Discover too aggressive lately?


Chrysostom wrote:


Discover has good acceptance most places in America. Visa is accepted almost everywhere, as is MC, and, averaged out, I think Discover has about the same acceptance rates as Amex - but on the East Coast big cities, it has poor-to-non-existent acceptance - it may have something to do with the largely non-chain nature of most stores and restaurants in said cities. Most are old and privately-owned, lots of mom and pop shops. In Boston, it's a crapshoot as to whether or not a given merchant will accept Discover. In NYC, I've never seen any merchants who did, although everyone in NYC accepts American Express.


I only have one MasterCard (the Paypal Extras), and have seen only one business, a utility, in my entire time of credit that took only MasterCard, so I hang on to it. I have the Discover, two Amexes, and about 15 additional Visas - maybe that's why they're so widely accepted, is that everyone has one, and everyone issues several - even overseas, the "Visa/Electron" (I think Electrons are what are called "Visa Debit" cards in America) network is massive.


What a great post!

 

I'd like to add that in certain regions in the world, Mastercard is dominant over Visa in terms of acceptance, and vice versa. Also, Sam's Club still does not accept Visas I believe ...

 

Moderator Emeritus
webhopper
Posts: 7,230
Registered: ‎09-16-2011
0

Re: Is Discover too aggressive lately?

Sams club does not accept Visa Credit Card, only Visa Debit, and up until a few months ago, Dollar General did not take Visa, it was only Visa Debit, Discover, or Mastercard.  They still do not accept Amex, wonder why?  ha


Starting Score: 08/29/2011 TU 671 EQ 674
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Established Contributor
zyzzus
Posts: 539
Registered: ‎10-22-2012
0

Re: Is Discover too aggressive lately?


webhopper wrote:

Sams club does not accept Visa Credit Card, only Visa Debit, and up until a few months ago, Dollar General did not take Visa, it was only Visa Debit, Discover, or Mastercard.  They still do not accept Amex, wonder why?  ha


in my experience Sam's only accepts mastercard CC

Capital One Quicksilver- $5,000 (Thanks Cap1 Executive Office <3) | Chase Freedom - $7,100 | Chase Amazon -$1,000 | Priceline Visa -$10,000 | US Bank Cash+ - $18,200 (I know what an odd limit) | Fidelity Amex -$10,000 | Sallie Mae- $10,000 | Walmart $15,000 | DCU Platinum $12,000 | Discover IT - $7,500 | Amex EveryDay - $10,000  | Citi DoubleCash - $15,000

Moderator Emeritus
webhopper
Posts: 7,230
Registered: ‎09-16-2011
0

Re: Is Discover too aggressive lately?

My Sam's club must be unique, cause it takes Discover...  by the Way, Sam's issues Discover card backed by GE, so why wouldn't they take Discover?


Starting Score: 08/29/2011 TU 671 EQ 674
Current Score: TU 754 EQ 694 EX 697
Wallet: NFCU Visa Sig 25k, Amex Lowes 22k, NavCheck 15k, Amex PRG, Amex Zync, Discover It 13.5k, Amazon Visa 5k
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