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Revelate
Posts: 9,762
Registered: ‎12-30-2011
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Re: Well shoot, denied AMEX 61 Day CLI


09Lexie wrote:
Sorry, didn't see the part where you paid your bal. Charge cards do not count towards your util only rev CL's

Under FICO '04 / '08 this is correct; Walt is also right that the earlier '98 version it is counted.  The newer models exclude anything that is listed with a 1 month term is my understanding of it.

 

A balance on a charge card though does get counted in the "number of revolving tradelines with balances" metric so it's worth still keeping track of if trying to maximize one's FICO for a given period.

 

Starting Score: EQ 561, TU 567, EX 599* (12/30/11, EX lender pull 12/29/11)
Current Score: EQ 04 673, EQ 8 707, TU 720, EX 702* (09/02/14, EX older)
Goal Score: 700 on EQ '04 (01/01/15)


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FinStar
Posts: 6,980
Registered: ‎10-21-2012
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Re: Well shoot, denied AMEX 61 Day CLI


Walt_K wrote:

Jutz wrote:

My Gold card doesn't count towards UTIL on what model?  The AMEX internal scoring?  It counts as UTIL in several models in different ways, does it not?

 

Also, you would have made your payment do you mean?  Because I had definitely made my payment, both cards were paid to zero and cleared prior to CLI request.


Open lines like Amex charge cards don't count for utilization purposes except on TU98.


+1

 

And what Lexie mentioned as well.

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Jutz
Posts: 1,216
Registered: ‎05-10-2012
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Re: Well shoot, denied AMEX 61 Day CLI

Thanks Revelate, that makes sense.  I would have had 3 cards post with balances in that case.  Gold, Freedom, Lowe's.  Out of 9.

  • Current: EQ FICO 694, TU FICO 695, EX FICO 698 | Starting Score: 525 (05/2012)
  • Starting total revolving credit: $1100 | Current total revolving credit: $29,500
  • Inquiries (12 Months): EQ 6 TU 3 EX 6 | Most Recent: 1/21/2014
Chase Freedom $5000
DCU Visa $10000
Capital One QS $2000
AMEX BCE $1000
Lowe's CC $8500
WalMart CC $2400
BOA Platinum $600
AMEX Gold NPSL
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Revelate
Posts: 9,762
Registered: ‎12-30-2011
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Re: Well shoot, denied AMEX 61 Day CLI


Jutz wrote:

Well that's reassuring.  I'm sure it was just my average at best scores, mixed with a TON of activity in the past year.  I'll accept it.  Kinda hard to use it as an everyday card for rewards with only $1k though.  With Freedom hitting the 4th quarter and no more gas 5%, this was going to replace it.


I was going to ask how much you'd run through the the card; I run the majority of my spending (other than things I'd rather not have Amex know about in their internal models) through my BCP, though my usual everyday expenses only total up to around $800ish each month anyway I did push the boundaries a little bit to max out high balance one month.

 

Taking my shot tomoorrow, have to see how they like my spending pattern I guess as my FICO scores are pretty similar to yours, nominally higher but not by much.

 

Starting Score: EQ 561, TU 567, EX 599* (12/30/11, EX lender pull 12/29/11)
Current Score: EQ 04 673, EQ 8 707, TU 720, EX 702* (09/02/14, EX older)
Goal Score: 700 on EQ '04 (01/01/15)


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mongstradamus
Posts: 7,499
Registered: ‎06-19-2013
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Re: Well shoot, denied AMEX 61 Day CLI


Revelate wrote:

Jutz wrote:

Well that's reassuring.  I'm sure it was just my average at best scores, mixed with a TON of activity in the past year.  I'll accept it.  Kinda hard to use it as an everyday card for rewards with only $1k though.  With Freedom hitting the 4th quarter and no more gas 5%, this was going to replace it.


I was going to ask how much you'd run through the the card; I run the majority of my spending (other than things I'd rather not have Amex know about in their internal models) through my BCP, though my usual everyday expenses only total up to around $800ish each month anyway I did push the boundaries a little bit to max out high balance one month.

 

Taking my shot tomoorrow, have to see how they like my spending pattern I guess as my FICO scores are pretty similar to yours, nominally higher but not by much.

 


Does amex not like you getting close to CL per month even if you pay multiple times an month to keep utilization under 30 %?


EX Fico 782 9/25/14 Fako 801 CS/Credit.com 11/24/14
EQ SW 823 quizzle fako 796 7/19/14
TU Fico 808 Fako 796 Creditkarma 12/24/2014
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Revelate
Posts: 9,762
Registered: ‎12-30-2011
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Re: Well shoot, denied AMEX 61 Day CLI


mongstradamus wrote:

Revelate wrote:

Jutz wrote:

Well that's reassuring.  I'm sure it was just my average at best scores, mixed with a TON of activity in the past year.  I'll accept it.  Kinda hard to use it as an everyday card for rewards with only $1k though.  With Freedom hitting the 4th quarter and no more gas 5%, this was going to replace it.


I was going to ask how much you'd run through the the card; I run the majority of my spending (other than things I'd rather not have Amex know about in their internal models) through my BCP, though my usual everyday expenses only total up to around $800ish each month anyway I did push the boundaries a little bit to max out high balance one month.

 

Taking my shot tomoorrow, have to see how they like my spending pattern I guess as my FICO scores are pretty similar to yours, nominally higher but not by much.

 


Does amex not like you getting close to CL per month even if you pay multiple times an month to keep utilization under 30 %?


I don't think Amex cares honestly; anecdotally they do seem to like big lump sum payments: when trying to curry favor with Amex (like I'm doing) I'd never make multiple payments.  If nothing else, it goes completely against their historical charge card paradigm.

 

There's also a lot of sophisticated data which they can easily get from from the transaction records and also the Experian SP's they do.  Sad is it somewhat is, I'm fairly confident Amex knows me better than all but my closest associates, and all of that potentially goes into their analytics and risk assessments.

 

Starting Score: EQ 561, TU 567, EX 599* (12/30/11, EX lender pull 12/29/11)
Current Score: EQ 04 673, EQ 8 707, TU 720, EX 702* (09/02/14, EX older)
Goal Score: 700 on EQ '04 (01/01/15)


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mongstradamus
Posts: 7,499
Registered: ‎06-19-2013
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Re: Well shoot, denied AMEX 61 Day CLI


Revelate wrote:

mongstradamus wrote:

Revelate wrote:

Jutz wrote:

Well that's reassuring.  I'm sure it was just my average at best scores, mixed with a TON of activity in the past year.  I'll accept it.  Kinda hard to use it as an everyday card for rewards with only $1k though.  With Freedom hitting the 4th quarter and no more gas 5%, this was going to replace it.


I was going to ask how much you'd run through the the card; I run the majority of my spending (other than things I'd rather not have Amex know about in their internal models) through my BCP, though my usual everyday expenses only total up to around $800ish each month anyway I did push the boundaries a little bit to max out high balance one month.

 

Taking my shot tomoorrow, have to see how they like my spending pattern I guess as my FICO scores are pretty similar to yours, nominally higher but not by much.

 


Does amex not like you getting close to CL per month even if you pay multiple times an month to keep utilization under 30 %?


I don't think Amex cares honestly; anecdotally they do seem to like big lump sum payments: when trying to curry favor with Amex (like I'm doing) I'd never make multiple payments.  If nothing else, it goes completely against their historical charge card paradigm.

 

There's also a lot of sophisticated data which they can easily get from from the transaction records and also the Experian SP's they do.  Sad is it somewhat is, I'm fairly confident Amex knows me better than all but my closest associates, and all of that potentially goes into their analytics and risk assessments.

 


To understand this more clearly if you pay three times for 200 each time in an month, its basically the same as paying once for 600? I am trying to understand what i should what I should do in two to three months when my cli comes up. 


EX Fico 782 9/25/14 Fako 801 CS/Credit.com 11/24/14
EQ SW 823 quizzle fako 796 7/19/14
TU Fico 808 Fako 796 Creditkarma 12/24/2014
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Revelate
Posts: 9,762
Registered: ‎12-30-2011
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Re: Well shoot, denied AMEX 61 Day CLI


mongstradamus wrote:

Revelate wrote:

mongstradamus wrote:

Does amex not like you getting close to CL per month even if you pay multiple times an month to keep utilization under 30 %?


I don't think Amex cares honestly; anecdotally they do seem to like big lump sum payments: when trying to curry favor with Amex (like I'm doing) I'd never make multiple payments.  If nothing else, it goes completely against their historical charge card paradigm.

There's also a lot of sophisticated data which they can easily get from from the transaction records and also the Experian SP's they do.  Sad is it somewhat is, I'm fairly confident Amex knows me better than all but my closest associates, and all of that potentially goes into their analytics and risk assessments.


To understand this more clearly if you pay three times for 200 each time in an month, its basically the same as paying once for 600? I am trying to understand what i should what I should do in two to three months when my cli comes up. 


Anecdotally it's been found better to make 1 lump sum payment for 600 than 3 for 200 in your scenario.

 

I don't know where the idea of paying multiple times during a given month came about unless you've overruning your limits: that is not normal consumer behavior.  Show a bureaucrat what they expect to see, I would suggest underwriting is similar: anything out of the ordinary can trigger a closer review.  I'd rather underwriting or servicing be completely bored with my application and simply stamp it for approval :smileyhappy:.  

 

Myself, I've never found running up to a limit to be a problem personally and I've done that with every single one of my cards; however, I'm pretty consistent in my spending behavior, and with Amex historically being a charge card company, they expect large month balances and then large month payments in full.  That's one thing which may take decades to change, and not sure it will as Amex has been doing very well with their risk management.

 

 

Starting Score: EQ 561, TU 567, EX 599* (12/30/11, EX lender pull 12/29/11)
Current Score: EQ 04 673, EQ 8 707, TU 720, EX 702* (09/02/14, EX older)
Goal Score: 700 on EQ '04 (01/01/15)


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swpopham
Posts: 554
Registered: ‎06-02-2012
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Re: Well shoot, denied AMEX 61 Day CLI

 


To understand this more clearly if you pay three times for 200 each time in an month, its basically the same as paying once for 600? I am trying to understand what i should what I should do in two to three months when my cli comes up. 


 

Amex calculates off of your average payment amount. In my case my average payment is around 7k but if i paid it 3 times a month that would put my average payment at 2300. I dont know how it factors but we have been led to believe they would be rather paid once a month

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Jutz
Posts: 1,216
Registered: ‎05-10-2012
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Re: Well shoot, denied AMEX 61 Day CLI

Yeah I don't really mess around with AMEX when it comes to payment tricks.  My charge is on auto pay and has been since I picked it up around January.  Most I've done on the BCE was PIF before statement cut to report $0 for my CLI request.

  • Current: EQ FICO 694, TU FICO 695, EX FICO 698 | Starting Score: 525 (05/2012)
  • Starting total revolving credit: $1100 | Current total revolving credit: $29,500
  • Inquiries (12 Months): EQ 6 TU 3 EX 6 | Most Recent: 1/21/2014
Chase Freedom $5000
DCU Visa $10000
Capital One QS $2000
AMEX BCE $1000
Lowe's CC $8500
WalMart CC $2400
BOA Platinum $600
AMEX Gold NPSL

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