Wells-Fargo Visa Pre-Qualification Letter

[irrational]

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@Credit-hoarder wrote:

@Creditaddict: Don't need to pay the annual fee if I probably won't use all of the perks that come with it (BCP)

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The only perks of the BCP (over the BCE) are MORE cashback. 6% for groceries vs 3%, and 3% for gas vs 2%. Everything else is the same, sans the AF.

It just comes down to what other cards you have, and how much you spend at stand alone grocery stores (e.g., NOT wal-mart, sam's club, costco, etc).

For me... with a family of 5, we EASILY max out our annual $6K limit of 6% cash back at stand alone grocery stores. I estimate that the BCP will yield us about $450 annually, well worth the 75 AF.

[09Lexie]

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@irrational wrote:

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@Credit-hoarder wrote:

@Creditaddict: Don't need to pay the annual fee if I probably won't use all of the perks that come with it (BCP)

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The only perks of the BCP (over the BCE) are MORE cashback. 6% for groceries vs 3%, and 3% for gas vs 2%. Everything else is the same, sans the AF.

It just comes down to what other cards you have, and how much you spend at stand alone grocery stores (e.g., NOT wal-mart, sam's club, costco, etc).

For me... with a family of 5, we EASILY max out our annual $6K limit of 6% cash back at stand alone grocery stores. I estimate that the BCP will yield us about $450 annually, well worth the 75 AF.

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I am a family of 3 and we will max out my DHs in a few months.  So, I just got one. 

[irrational]

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@09Lexie wrote:

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@irrational wrote:

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@Credit-hoarder wrote:

@Creditaddict: Don't need to pay the annual fee if I probably won't use all of the perks that come with it (BCP)

---

The only perks of the BCP (over the BCE) are MORE cashback. 6% for groceries vs 3%, and 3% for gas vs 2%. Everything else is the same, sans the AF.

It just comes down to what other cards you have, and how much you spend at stand alone grocery stores (e.g., NOT wal-mart, sam's club, costco, etc).

For me... with a family of 5, we EASILY max out our annual $6K limit of 6% cash back at stand alone grocery stores. I estimate that the BCP will yield us about $450 annually, well worth the 75 AF.

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I am a family of 3 and we will max out my DHs in a few months.  So, I just got one. 

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Very good point!

We're EXTREMELY frugile with our grocery spending (only $500/mo for 5 people). According to US averages, the average house of 4 people (2 adults, 2 children) spends about $700-$1,200 a month in grocery stores (http://www.cnpp.usda.gov/Publications/FoodPlans/2013/CostofFoodNov2013.pdf). So, in reality, most families should be able to max out the BCP.

Assuming the lower end number, $700/mo, you end up with:

$700/mo * 12/mo = $8,400/year

@$6,000 @ 6% = $360

@$6,000 @ 3% = $180

@remaining $2,400 @ 1% = $24

So, BCP would yield this average family $309 ($360+$24-$75) where the BCE would only yield $204 ($180+$24). That's an additional $104/year AFTER the AF. And, this assumes this family doesn't spend any money on gasoline on their BCP. The numbers come out even better if they do.

[Credit-hoarder]

Family of one here. And half the time I eat take out food so not a lot of grocery buying. So I think the BCE would still be a good fit for me. Same reason I didn't app for the AMEX PRG-I didn't want to pay the annual fee and let the extra benefits go to waste.

[09Lexie]

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@Credit-hoarder wrote:

Family of one here. And half the time I eat take out food so not a lot of grocery buying. So I think the BCE would still be a good fit for me. Same reason I didn't app for the AMEX PRG-I didn't want to pay the annual fee and let the extra benefits go to waste.

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Obviously, you have to app for what makes you feel comfortable. I'm sure longtimelurker will chime in with ways to maximize your BCP through gift cards.  

Good luck with your app!

[longtimelurker]

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@09Lexie wrote:

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@Credit-hoarder wrote:

Family of one here. And half the time I eat take out food so not a lot of grocery buying. So I think the BCE would still be a good fit for me. Same reason I didn't app for the AMEX PRG-I didn't want to pay the annual fee and let the extra benefits go to waste.

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Obviously, you have to app for what makes you feel comfortable. I'm sure longtimelurker will chime in with ways to maximize your BCP through gift cards.  

Good luck with your app!

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Who knows what longtermlurker will do!   But in this case, I would have a very different answer to the OP question.

For a certain type of use, the Wells Fargo card is one of the two best ones out there, for those first six months.   It is UNCAPPED 5% on three major categories, gas, groceries and drugstores.   The last two may allow you to profit greatly through the purchase of cash equivalents.  And after six months, SD it, but use it for those six months!

That said: Wells Fargo there have been a few reports of WF closing cards when people used them too much, but, most unusually, their Fraud department also gave guidence: Don't use more  than the CL in any cycle, and multiple payments will alert them to this potential misuse.  This limits the fun for the most aggressive (one of the people shutdown used 13x the CL in one month, which might attract attention from any issuer!), but also tells us the rules.

But to obey 09Lexie's prediction:   one of things sometimes overlooked is that the BCP doesn't need to be spent just on groceries, just things sold at grocery stores, and these often include gift cards to many other retail places.  Usually, there is no mark up, so a $100 Starbucks gift card will cost $100.   If you buy it with BCP, you end up paying $94, so this is like getting 6% off at starbucks.   If you use all $6K on real groceries, this isn't an advantage, but for those debating BCE vs BCP, check your spending on these places as well, when doing the mathematics.    The math can be a little complex though!   A rule of thumb is that if you spend over $2500 a year on groceries + places you can get gift cards for, go with the BCP.

One caveat:   To be accurate  in the comparison, you need to compare other ways of buying giftcards.  So in some cases, such as Petco, you can easily find sites selling Petco gift cards at over 25% off, so getting them 6% off isn't exactly a win (though of course better than just buying at Petco with a 1% card).  In most other cases, the discount is less than 6% so getting with a BCP is still better.  You should also take into account that if you used a 1% at a store, you get that 1% off, but if you use a gift card, there are no additional discounts (so the 6% off is really 5% off etc).   These don't change the relative value of BCP vs BCE on each transaction, but does impact the crossover point to make up for the annual fee.  Also, for bigger purchases, you will want the protection of a credit card rather than buying with a gift card.

And lastly!  Depends where you shop, and this has recently changed my thinking.   The vast majority of our "real" grocery shopping is at Whole Foods.  And Whole Foods gift cards are available at Amazon.   As both Citi Forward and Sallie Mae give 5% off at Amazon, I've started buying gift cards, and this reduces the value of the BCP greatly.  It's now worth 1% (6% vs 5%) on $6K a year, = $60, for an annual fee of $75.  Oh oh!    For those with Ink cards, the same applies, with WholeFoods cards available at Staples etc.    For those that shop elsewhere, this might not apply, but check these possibilities....