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Established Contributor
CreditCrusader
Posts: 799
Registered: ‎09-27-2011
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Re: capital one. the most annoying credit card company.

As one who just jumped through seemingly endless fiery hoops closing a USDA GUARANTEED, secured home loan (as they all are) by providing tax returns, paystubs, W2's and every other shred of information as far as the eye can see, I am incredulous that people complain about having to provide proof of income to open, extend, or maintain UNSECURED credit.

 

People, 100% of the risk is with the lenders when unsecured credit cards are involved. If you want to complain that a CCC is inconsistent...ok, well, show me one that ISN'T at some point or another. As all borrowers are different, so too will the requirements for credit. Just because Peggy doesn't know policies from a hole in the wall doesn't mean you shouldn't have to comply with any and all requests they make of you to best ensure minimal risk on their end and to confirm your creditworthiness.

 

Capital One is well-known as a stingy lender when it comes to CLs and CLIs. Perhaps they are adjusting their model to mitigate risk. I don't call these sorts of practices "annoying". I call them the tools of a successful business model that has made Cap1 one of the premier lenders in the world. They have basically gobbled up nearly every other sub-prime lender and are a verifiable credit empire because they do business in a smart, not convenient, manner.

I'm Spartacus!

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legacys7
Posts: 150
Registered: ‎04-20-2013
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Re: capital one. the most annoying credit card company.


navigatethis12 wrote:

legacys7 wrote:


Gotta love the White Knight posters that come to the rescue with major assumptions. Where in my post did I state that my credit was bad? Cap. 1 didn't pull my report. I'd made that point in my post. LEt's not add things to my or other's post unless we make that clear that it;s exactly the case. And let's not also make the assumption that Cap. 1 or like c.c. are doing us a favor when many of them have a "negative" history themselves. And as you've pointed out, you don't have a credit card from them. That equates to, you don't have a clue of the dynamics of the company, due to lack of experience with them on your part. Now that we got that part out of the way, let's try to stay focused and get back on track here. It was cleary pointed out after my initial question on here that Cap. 1 didn't ask for a w2 or 1040 from other owners of the card. I'd took the advice from a few who actually do own the card. Turns out that the women lied on the phone. That point was made on here that she said all aplicants had to do what I'm obligated to do. When I'd told her that this was not the case because I know some owners of the card that didn't, she got tongue tied and back paddled.  


Perhaps I should have made it clear that I wasn't saying that you had bad credit. However, most of the people who have a low limit Capital One card here do not have perfect credit. Not having their card does not mean no experience with them. My aunt and dad both have Capital One cards with high limits and great customer service; I just do not have any experience with them managing something in my name. It doesn't matter if the lender has a negative history or not, it's their money they are lending to you, so yes they are doing you a favor.

 

I am not sure why you are so hung up on the fact of not everyone needing to provide proof of income. Maybe the woman thought everyone did go through this process or maybe she was lying, what does it matter? Any lender at any time has the right to request proof of income from someone that is asking for money. That's the same as getting upset that you were declined with ten inquiries and someone else with ten was approved. Everyone is different and will go through different procedures to get approved. Credit unions will usually ask for proof of income, but there are some people who get approved without having to provide it. Search here and on other credit forums and you will find a plethora of threads with people saying they were asked for some type of income document. If you want the card you can send them what they ask, or you won't get it.


actually you made it very clear. the problem and point that you had missed is, none of your points applied to anything that i had stated in none of my post. they were irrelevant. regarding doing me a favor point. we can go in circular conversations on that. but i won't. they are not. the bottom line and question here were answered regarding their inconsistwnt policy from both owners of the card and the person rhat i had spoken to. so no, she did not meant one thing when she made it very clear to me after i had asked more than once to make sure rhat we were on the same page. after that fact, that is when i pointed out about the income part.and changed her conversation. you do know that many companiws di train staff to do this rught? food for thought.

Regular Contributor
legacys7
Posts: 150
Registered: ‎04-20-2013
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Re: capital one. the most annoying credit card company.


CreditCrusader wrote:

As one who just jumped through seemingly endless fiery hoops closing a USDA GUARANTEED, secured home loan (as they all are) by providing tax returns, paystubs, W2's and every other shred of information as far as the eye can see, I am incredulous that people complain about having to provide proof of income to open, extend, or maintain UNSECURED credit.

 

People, 100% of the risk is with the lenders when unsecured credit cards are involved. If you want to complain that a CCC is inconsistent...ok, well, show me one that ISN'T at some point or another. As all borrowers are different, so too will the requirements for credit. Just because Peggy doesn't know policies from a hole in the wall doesn't mean you shouldn't have to comply with any and all requests they make of you to best ensure minimal risk on their end and to confirm your creditworthiness.

 

Capital One is well-known as a stingy lender when it comes to CLs and CLIs. Perhaps they are adjusting their model to mitigate risk. I don't call these sorts of practices "annoying". I call them the tools of a successful business model that has made Cap1 one of the premier lenders in the world. They have basically gobbled up nearly every other sub-prime lender and are a verifiable credit empire because they do business in a smart, not convenient, manner.


all that i got out of your post, they are a monoply due to shrewd business. 

Senior Contributor
Open123
Posts: 4,155
Registered: ‎02-23-2011
0

Re: capital one. the most annoying credit card company.

Per the Credit Card Act, it is the issuers' responsibility to "verify" income before extending credit.  

 

During the aftermath, Congress (the Warren Commission) placed part of the blame to the then meteoric rise of credit card defaults to the issuers "failure" to ensure a borrower had suffient income to to justify a certain CL.

 

If an issuer has other means (which, there are many) to verify your income either directly or indirecly, they can issue a CL and use the those sources to satisfy the Fed regulation that they must "verify" income.  For some, such as newly employed or recent immigrants, don't have a long enough work history for verification through "other" channels, which leads to more direct income verification, e.g. tax forms, W2s, Employer letter of offer, etc.

 

 

Established Contributor
CreditCrusader
Posts: 799
Registered: ‎09-27-2011
0

Re: capital one. the most annoying credit card company.


legacys7 wrote:

navigatethis12 wrote:

legacys7 wrote:


Gotta love the White Knight posters that come to the rescue with major assumptions. Where in my post did I state that my credit was bad? Cap. 1 didn't pull my report. I'd made that point in my post. LEt's not add things to my or other's post unless we make that clear that it;s exactly the case. And let's not also make the assumption that Cap. 1 or like c.c. are doing us a favor when many of them have a "negative" history themselves. And as you've pointed out, you don't have a credit card from them. That equates to, you don't have a clue of the dynamics of the company, due to lack of experience with them on your part. Now that we got that part out of the way, let's try to stay focused and get back on track here. It was cleary pointed out after my initial question on here that Cap. 1 didn't ask for a w2 or 1040 from other owners of the card. I'd took the advice from a few who actually do own the card. Turns out that the women lied on the phone. That point was made on here that she said all aplicants had to do what I'm obligated to do. When I'd told her that this was not the case because I know some owners of the card that didn't, she got tongue tied and back paddled.  


Perhaps I should have made it clear that I wasn't saying that you had bad credit. However, most of the people who have a low limit Capital One card here do not have perfect credit. Not having their card does not mean no experience with them. My aunt and dad both have Capital One cards with high limits and great customer service; I just do not have any experience with them managing something in my name. It doesn't matter if the lender has a negative history or not, it's their money they are lending to you, so yes they are doing you a favor.

 

I am not sure why you are so hung up on the fact of not everyone needing to provide proof of income. Maybe the woman thought everyone did go through this process or maybe she was lying, what does it matter? Any lender at any time has the right to request proof of income from someone that is asking for money. That's the same as getting upset that you were declined with ten inquiries and someone else with ten was approved. Everyone is different and will go through different procedures to get approved. Credit unions will usually ask for proof of income, but there are some people who get approved without having to provide it. Search here and on other credit forums and you will find a plethora of threads with people saying they were asked for some type of income document. If you want the card you can send them what they ask, or you won't get it.


actually you made it very clear. the problem and point that you had missed is, none of your points applied to anything that i had stated in none of my post. they were irrelevant. regarding doing me a favor point. we can go in circular conversations on that. but i won't. they are not. the bottom line and question here were answered regarding their inconsistwnt policy from both owners of the card and the person rhat i had spoken to. so no, she did not meant one thing when she made it very clear to me after i had asked more than once to make sure rhat we were on the same page. after that fact, that is when i pointed out about the income part.and changed her conversation. you do know that many companiws di train staff to do this rught? food for thought.


IMO, you are WAY too hung up on Peggy here. So a rep got it wrong and was flustered. That's not exactly news.

 

Believe me, the "gotchya!" game is not a way to get anywhere in the credit world. In the end, they have the right to ask for anything and everything prior to handing out credit. If you don't like it (and you clearly don't), lose them and move on. But don't expect to get anywhere by calling and ripping on a rep who got it wrong. These people get it wrong from time to time...doesn't change the fundamentals of anything credit-related when all is said and done.

I'm Spartacus!

hr>Starting Score: EQ 546, EX 547, TU 580
Current Scores (lender): EQ 725 , EX FICO 720, TU 737 FICO scores>
Goal Score: 750
Take the FICO Fitness Challenge
Established Contributor
CreditCrusader
Posts: 799
Registered: ‎09-27-2011
0

Re: capital one. the most annoying credit card company.

[ Edited ]

legacys7 wrote:

CreditCrusader wrote:

As one who just jumped through seemingly endless fiery hoops closing a USDA GUARANTEED, secured home loan (as they all are) by providing tax returns, paystubs, W2's and every other shred of information as far as the eye can see, I am incredulous that people complain about having to provide proof of income to open, extend, or maintain UNSECURED credit.

 

People, 100% of the risk is with the lenders when unsecured credit cards are involved. If you want to complain that a CCC is inconsistent...ok, well, show me one that ISN'T at some point or another. As all borrowers are different, so too will the requirements for credit. Just because Peggy doesn't know policies from a hole in the wall doesn't mean you shouldn't have to comply with any and all requests they make of you to best ensure minimal risk on their end and to confirm your creditworthiness.

 

Capital One is well-known as a stingy lender when it comes to CLs and CLIs. Perhaps they are adjusting their model to mitigate risk. I don't call these sorts of practices "annoying". I call them the tools of a successful business model that has made Cap1 one of the premier lenders in the world. They have basically gobbled up nearly every other sub-prime lender and are a verifiable credit empire because they do business in a smart, not convenient, manner.


all that i got out of your post, they are a monoply due to shrewd business. 


...as is BOA, Citi, AMEX, Barclay...the list is nearly endless. These people profit by implementing a successful business model. If people didn't, as a general rule, like the way Cap1 did business, they wouldn't be a "monopoly", as you put it (Actually, a monopoly suggests that there are no other sub-prime lenders in the game...which is far from true in reality).

 

They are in business to make money. The business that ISN'T doesn't stay in business very long.

 

Edited to add:

 

EVERY CCC has its "foible". Many Prime lenders are well-known to exclude people who have a BK on their record. Is that annoying? Yes, to some. Is it prudent business to exclude people who have filed for bankruptcy? Yes, to others.

 

Cap1 has a way of doing business that is successful. Believe me, they won't change just because of a couple complaints. Again, if you don't wish to conduct business with them, you might want to choose a different lender.

I'm Spartacus!

hr>Starting Score: EQ 546, EX 547, TU 580
Current Scores (lender): EQ 725 , EX FICO 720, TU 737 FICO scores>
Goal Score: 750
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Regular Contributor
legacys7
Posts: 150
Registered: ‎04-20-2013
0

Re: capital one. the most annoying credit card company.


CreditCrusader wrote:

legacys7 wrote:

CreditCrusader wrote:

As one who just jumped through seemingly endless fiery hoops closing a USDA GUARANTEED, secured home loan (as they all are) by providing tax returns, paystubs, W2's and every other shred of information as far as the eye can see, I am incredulous that people complain about having to provide proof of income to open, extend, or maintain UNSECURED credit.

 

People, 100% of the risk is with the lenders when unsecured credit cards are involved. If you want to complain that a CCC is inconsistent...ok, well, show me one that ISN'T at some point or another. As all borrowers are different, so too will the requirements for credit. Just because Peggy doesn't know policies from a hole in the wall doesn't mean you shouldn't have to comply with any and all requests they make of you to best ensure minimal risk on their end and to confirm your creditworthiness.

 

Capital One is well-known as a stingy lender when it comes to CLs and CLIs. Perhaps they are adjusting their model to mitigate risk. I don't call these sorts of practices "annoying". I call them the tools of a successful business model that has made Cap1 one of the premier lenders in the world. They have basically gobbled up nearly every other sub-prime lender and are a verifiable credit empire because they do business in a smart, not convenient, manner.


all that i got out of your post, they are a monoply due to shrewd business. 


...as is BOA, Citi, AMEX, Barclay...the list is nearly endless.

 

They are in business to make money. The business that ISN'T doesn't stay in business very long.


Exactly my point. But let's not paint a flowery picture was main point. That is what you were doing. 

Established Contributor
CreditCrusader
Posts: 799
Registered: ‎09-27-2011
0

Re: capital one. the most annoying credit card company.


legacys7 wrote:

CreditCrusader wrote:

legacys7 wrote:

CreditCrusader wrote:

As one who just jumped through seemingly endless fiery hoops closing a USDA GUARANTEED, secured home loan (as they all are) by providing tax returns, paystubs, W2's and every other shred of information as far as the eye can see, I am incredulous that people complain about having to provide proof of income to open, extend, or maintain UNSECURED credit.

 

People, 100% of the risk is with the lenders when unsecured credit cards are involved. If you want to complain that a CCC is inconsistent...ok, well, show me one that ISN'T at some point or another. As all borrowers are different, so too will the requirements for credit. Just because Peggy doesn't know policies from a hole in the wall doesn't mean you shouldn't have to comply with any and all requests they make of you to best ensure minimal risk on their end and to confirm your creditworthiness.

 

Capital One is well-known as a stingy lender when it comes to CLs and CLIs. Perhaps they are adjusting their model to mitigate risk. I don't call these sorts of practices "annoying". I call them the tools of a successful business model that has made Cap1 one of the premier lenders in the world. They have basically gobbled up nearly every other sub-prime lender and are a verifiable credit empire because they do business in a smart, not convenient, manner.


all that i got out of your post, they are a monoply due to shrewd business. 


...as is BOA, Citi, AMEX, Barclay...the list is nearly endless.

 

They are in business to make money. The business that ISN'T doesn't stay in business very long.


Exactly my point. But let's not paint a flowery picture was main point. That is what you were doing. 


It IS a flowery picture...for them. They are a BUSINESS...and by definition, in this industry to make money. In the credit world, this is best accomplished by exercising intelligence and putting in place smart business practices. You are basically banging on Cap1 because they are ultra-successful. How is that something to not celebrate from a business perspective?

 

So that this doesn't degenerate into an argument, I will end with this post. You and I simply disagree on this issue. You don't like their business model...or the fact that it is successful. I think they are a prime example of how to do business successfully in the United States. They serve a diverse group of credit customers in a manner that allows them to be extremely profitable. They have no intention of (nor should they) of changing their business model just because some fine them "annoying"...and why should they? Does AMEX throw away FRs just because some people find them annoying and intrusive?

 

If you don't like their products and services, LOSE THEM. That's how capitalism best works. It's called letting the free market reward successful business models...something I champion whole-heartedly.

 

Have a great day :smileyhappy:

I'm Spartacus!

hr>Starting Score: EQ 546, EX 547, TU 580
Current Scores (lender): EQ 725 , EX FICO 720, TU 737 FICO scores>
Goal Score: 750
Take the FICO Fitness Challenge
Regular Contributor
legacys7
Posts: 150
Registered: ‎04-20-2013
0

Re: capital one. the most annoying credit card company.


CreditCrusader wrote:

legacys7 wrote:

navigatethis12 wrote:

legacys7 wrote:


Gotta love the White Knight posters that come to the rescue with major assumptions. Where in my post did I state that my credit was bad? Cap. 1 didn't pull my report. I'd made that point in my post. LEt's not add things to my or other's post unless we make that clear that it;s exactly the case. And let's not also make the assumption that Cap. 1 or like c.c. are doing us a favor when many of them have a "negative" history themselves. And as you've pointed out, you don't have a credit card from them. That equates to, you don't have a clue of the dynamics of the company, due to lack of experience with them on your part. Now that we got that part out of the way, let's try to stay focused and get back on track here. It was cleary pointed out after my initial question on here that Cap. 1 didn't ask for a w2 or 1040 from other owners of the card. I'd took the advice from a few who actually do own the card. Turns out that the women lied on the phone. That point was made on here that she said all aplicants had to do what I'm obligated to do. When I'd told her that this was not the case because I know some owners of the card that didn't, she got tongue tied and back paddled.  


Perhaps I should have made it clear that I wasn't saying that you had bad credit. However, most of the people who have a low limit Capital One card here do not have perfect credit. Not having their card does not mean no experience with them. My aunt and dad both have Capital One cards with high limits and great customer service; I just do not have any experience with them managing something in my name. It doesn't matter if the lender has a negative history or not, it's their money they are lending to you, so yes they are doing you a favor.

 

I am not sure why you are so hung up on the fact of not everyone needing to provide proof of income. Maybe the woman thought everyone did go through this process or maybe she was lying, what does it matter? Any lender at any time has the right to request proof of income from someone that is asking for money. That's the same as getting upset that you were declined with ten inquiries and someone else with ten was approved. Everyone is different and will go through different procedures to get approved. Credit unions will usually ask for proof of income, but there are some people who get approved without having to provide it. Search here and on other credit forums and you will find a plethora of threads with people saying they were asked for some type of income document. If you want the card you can send them what they ask, or you won't get it.


actually you made it very clear. the problem and point that you had missed is, none of your points applied to anything that i had stated in none of my post. they were irrelevant. regarding doing me a favor point. we can go in circular conversations on that. but i won't. they are not. the bottom line and question here were answered regarding their inconsistwnt policy from both owners of the card and the person rhat i had spoken to. so no, she did not meant one thing when she made it very clear to me after i had asked more than once to make sure rhat we were on the same page. after that fact, that is when i pointed out about the income part.and changed her conversation. you do know that many companiws di train staff to do this rught? food for thought.


IMO, you are WAY too hung up on Peggy here. So a rep got it wrong and was flustered. That's not exactly news.

 

Believe me, the "gotchya!" game is not a way to get anywhere in the credit world. In the end, they have the right to ask for anything and everything prior to handing out credit. If you don't like it (and you clearly don't), lose them and move on. But don't expect to get anywhere by calling and ripping on a rep who got it wrong. These people get it wrong from time to time...doesn't change the fundamentals of anything credit-related when all is said and done.


Yes and no. In general they don't have the right to ask for anything and everything. Being stuck on Peggy Sue. Not really, nor is this a gotcha game were I'm setting up a trap. My initial reply was a questioned asked here more of curiosity and that was it. Others suggested that I speak to someone in a higher position to get some clarification. She initially stated it isn't possible. In the end of the conversation, she made that happen where I'll hear from someone in three business days. If anything, sometimes challenging an issue gets you more results than accepting some things that are questionable. And from what I have just read on Google from the consumers, capital 1 has a very crappy reputation in several departments and with their credit card policies. Food for thought.

Senior Contributor
Open123
Posts: 4,155
Registered: ‎02-23-2011
0

Re: capital one. the most annoying credit card company.

[ Edited ]

@legacys7

 

They absolutely have the right to ask you for whatever they want, so long as it wasn't motivated by anything discriminatory. Likewise, you absolutely have the right to tell them to "pound sand," and do business with any issuer of your choosing.


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