cancel
Showing results for 
Search instead for 
Did you mean: 

Derogatory items

tag
Anonymous
Not applicable

Re: Derogatory items

A credit pull that goes beyond the 7 year window is called a "Full Factual" report.   It's basically your entire file going as far back as the databases allow.  For some people this can go back 20+ some-odd years.   CRAs don't ever actually delete anything unless the data furnisher requested a deletion of something, or they replaced the data with a new version.

 

AFAIK, there's no way you can get a Full Factual report for yourself unless you ask someone who has the ability to pull that kind of report to give you a copy.    A Full Factual is way more expensive to pull than a normal 7-year variety.

 

 

If it's any consolation, most creditors don't bother with a full factual and nobody who does in-store/online approvals uses a FF report.    The ones that do use them often have competitors who do not use them.   Private employers generally don't bother with a FF either with the online background check services they use.

 

Even for basic security clearances, your prior 7 years (10-15 if you have any unpaid liens) is all that really matters.   Your FF may matter if you're going for something more sensitive than a military/basic civic-service position.

 

The people who routinely do FF's are generally looking for *any* possible reason to give a denial or AA, so if you weren't exactly stellar during your early history with credit (like during your college years), you're not going to get past the screening anyway.   FF pullers generally don't get that much business because people will immediately go over to someone else who does 7-yr pulls.

 

 

 

Having something bad on your FF but not your current file won't lock you out of the credit markets, and only locks you out of a very small number of employers, even if the job pays > $75K.   You can definitely get cards, get a job, get a rental or a mortgage even with something nasty on the FF that otherwise can't be seen in a 7yr pull.

 

I wouldn't sweat it, unless you're trying to become a CIA director or something.  Smiley Very Happy

Message 11 of 34
Anonymous
Not applicable

Re: Derogatory items


@Anonymous wrote:

A credit pull that goes beyond the 7 year window is called a "Full Factual" report.   It's basically your entire file going as far back as the databases allow.  For some people this can go back 20+ some-odd years.   CRAs don't ever actually delete anything unless the data furnisher requested a deletion of something, or they replaced the data with a new version.

 

AFAIK, there's no way you can get a Full Factual report for yourself unless you ask someone who has the ability to pull that kind of report to give you a copy.    A Full Factual is way more expensive to pull than a normal 7-year variety.

 

 

If it's any consolation, most creditors don't bother with a full factual and nobody who does in-store/online approvals uses a FF report.    The ones that do use them often have competitors who do not use them.   Private employers generally don't bother with a FF either with the online background check services they use.

 

Even for basic security clearances, your prior 7 years (10-15 if you have any unpaid liens) is all that really matters.   Your FF may matter if you're going for something more sensitive than a military/basic civic-service position.

 

The people who routinely do FF's are generally looking for *any* possible reason to give a denial or AA, so if you weren't exactly stellar during your early history with credit (like during your college years), you're not going to get past the screening anyway.   FF pullers generally don't get that much business because people will immediately go over to someone else who does 7-yr pulls.

 

 

 

Having something bad on your FF but not your current file won't lock you out of the credit markets, and only locks you out of a very small number of employers, even if the job pays > $75K.   You can definitely get cards, get a job, get a rental or a mortgage even with something nasty on the FF that otherwise can't be seen in a 7yr pull.

 

I wouldn't sweat it, unless you're trying to become a CIA director or something.  Smiley Very Happy


 

Great valuable information!  Thank you very, very much!!

 

You would think that CRAs must give you access to that data, but then I suppose if someone actually meets the requirements to pull a FF and does, then you could get access.  Any ideas about that?

 

 

Message 12 of 34
guiness56
Epic Contributor

Re: Derogatory items

The FCRA is very clear on when someone can get your entire credit file and  unless they meet one of the requirements to do so, creditors cannot obtain it.  That is why most creditors don't bother with it, they can't get it.

 

The consumer has access to their entire credit file per the FCRA.  They may have to pay for it but they can get it.

Message 13 of 34
Anonymous
Not applicable

Re: Derogatory items


@bcdudley wrote:

I just pulled my credit reports a few days ago and they had at the most 7 derogatory Items listed all 6 years old or more. When I just had a lender pull my credit for a potential mortgage, it came up with 40 derogatory items with some as new as 3 months. How come these are not showing up when I pull my own credit reports?

 

I am 100% positive that I have nothing derogatory in the last 5 years so what gives?



bc,

 

Did you see a copy of the report pulled by your lender?  Hopefully they gave you a copy to keep.

 

It's interesting because it has new baddies that you're not seeing on your pull.  That indicates that the issue may not be the FF that goes back to the beginning of time.

BTW, we've done several mortgages and/or refi's well over the $150,000 mark and have never had a FF - if you check the mortgage boards I think you will find that they are very rarely pulled for folks.  It might be that you're looking at some other issue here.

 

When you pulled your report, where was it pulled from?  Was it EQ, TU, EX?  And what CRA's were the baddies showing up on for the lender pulled report?

 

 

Message 14 of 34
bcdudley
Regular Contributor

Re: Derogatory items

This is the information that is on the report. The lender would not give it to me. She said their office policy does not allow it. She is the one who told me that some of the items are recent. She does seem very knowledgeble in credit so I believe she is giving me correct information. She named a few things to me that I have had in my past, but should have been removed by now. The ones she named are the recent ones.

 

Something else kinda funny, I just pulled my Transunion on here recently and I got a 648. She is showing a 633. Nothing should have changed for the negative that I know of.

 

After looking at this, this does look more like my credit file going all the way back to 1995. I had lots of bad stuff all the way up until around 2006. I also had lots of inquiries last year when I tried to purchase a house. I had a broker that threw my credit file every which way he could and by the time I found out about it, they had run my credit report at around 20 different agencies. That was less than a year ago.

 

Your Credit Score Score Source Brand Type Date Range
659 Experian Fair Isaac V2 FICO 5/17/2011 320-844
656 Equifax BEACON 5 FICO 5/17/2011 334-818
633 Transunion Classic 04 FICO 5/17/2011 309-839

 

Experian
40 DEROGATORY PUBLIC RECORD OR COLLECTION FILED
10 RATIO OF BALANCE TO LIMIT ON BANK REVOLVING OR OTHER REV ACCTS
TOO HIGH
14 LENGTH OF TIME ACCOUNTS HAVE BEEN ESTABLISHED
08 TOO MANY INQUIRIES LAST 12 MONTHS
Equifax
38 SERIOUS DELINQUENCY, AND DEROGATORY PUBLIC RECORD OR
COLLECTION FILED
10 PROPORTION OF BALANCES TO CREDIT LIMITS IS TOO HIGH ON BANK
REVOLVING OR OTHER REVOLVING ACCOUNTS
14 LENGTH OF TIME ACCOUNTS HAVE BEEN ESTABLISHED
18 NUMBER OF ACCOUNTS WITH DELINQUENCY
Transunion
040 Derogatory public record or collection filed
010 Proportion of balances to credit limits is too high on bank revolving or other
revolving accounts
020 Length of time since derogatory public record or collection is too short
013 Time since delinquency is too recent or unknown


Starting Score: 580
Current Score: EQ740, EX695
Goal Score: 850


Take the FICO Fitness Challenge
Message 15 of 34
Anonymous
Not applicable

Re: Derogatory items


@bcdudley wrote:

This is the information that is on the report. The lender would not give it to me. She said their office policy does not allow it. She is the one who told me that some of the items are recent. She does seem very knowledgeble in credit so I believe she is giving me correct information. She named a few things to me that I have had in my past, but should have been removed by now. The ones she named are the recent ones.

 

Something else kinda funny, I just pulled my Transunion on here recently and I got a 648. She is showing a 633. Nothing should have changed for the negative that I know of.** 

 

**It looks like she pulled a TU04 and the TU from this site is a TU98.  A 15 point variance between the two TU FICO's is not unheard of.

 

After looking at this, this does look more like my credit file going all the way back to 1995. I had lots of bad stuff all the way up until around 2006. As I know you know Smiley Wink, these will report for about ten years or so after last activity - so depending on when they closed, they can still be reporting on your current credit report.  I currently have items from as far back as the mid 90's showing up on my current credit report as well - I wouldn't have to go to a FF to see them I also had lots of inquiries last year when I tried to purchase a house. I had a broker that threw my credit file every which way he could and by the time I found out about it, they had run my credit report at around 20 different agencies. That was less than a year ago.  That makes sense then - they should be showing up on the credit reports you pull as well as the credit reports the bank pulled. 

 

Your Credit Score Score Source Brand Type Date Range
659 Experian Fair Isaac V2 FICO 5/17/2011 320-844
656 Equifax BEACON 5 FICO 5/17/2011 334-818
633 Transunion Classic 04** FICO 5/17/2011 309-839

 

Experian
40 DEROGATORY PUBLIC RECORD OR COLLECTION FILED
10 RATIO OF BALANCE TO LIMIT ON BANK REVOLVING OR OTHER REV ACCTS
TOO HIGH
14 LENGTH OF TIME ACCOUNTS HAVE BEEN ESTABLISHED
08 TOO MANY INQUIRIES LAST 12 MONTHS
Equifax
38 SERIOUS DELINQUENCY, AND DEROGATORY PUBLIC RECORD OR
COLLECTION FILED
10 PROPORTION OF BALANCES TO CREDIT LIMITS IS TOO HIGH ON BANK
REVOLVING OR OTHER REVOLVING ACCOUNTS
14 LENGTH OF TIME ACCOUNTS HAVE BEEN ESTABLISHED
18 NUMBER OF ACCOUNTS WITH DELINQUENCY
Transunion
040 Derogatory public record or collection filed
010 Proportion of balances to credit limits is too high on bank revolving or other
revolving accounts
020 Length of time since derogatory public record or collection is too short
013 Time since delinquency is too recent or unknown


I'm going to guess that the 40 derogatory items you mentioned in your OP were spread out over all three reports.

You may want to pull up a current report, mark the baddies you see, and ask your loan officer if she has any additional baddies for the same CRA - and if so, what they are.  They should be willing to help you out on that even if they won't give you a copy of your report.  And, if possible, do this for all 3 CRA's.

 

edited (SOP for me)  for highlighting for ease of reading and a smiley
 

Message 16 of 34
bcdudley
Regular Contributor

Re: Derogatory items

Am I reading the definitions wrong where it says "040 Derogatory public record or collection filed"? Is 040 the number of derogs or is that some type of category?

 

I was just looking over it again and noticed the 040, 010, 018 etc and realized those may not be quantities, but definition numbers or something.


Starting Score: 580
Current Score: EQ740, EX695
Goal Score: 850


Take the FICO Fitness Challenge
Message 17 of 34
GregB
Valued Contributor

Re: Derogatory items


@bcdudley wrote:

This is the information that is on the report. The lender would not give it to me. She said their office policy does not allow it. She is the one who told me that some of the items are recent. She does seem very knowledgeble in credit so I believe she is giving me correct information. She named a few things to me that I have had in my past, but should have been removed by now. The ones she named are the recent ones.

 

Something else kinda funny, I just pulled my Transunion on here recently and I got a 648. She is showing a 633. Nothing should have changed for the negative that I know of.

 

After looking at this, this does look more like my credit file going all the way back to 1995. I had lots of bad stuff all the way up until around 2006. I also had lots of inquiries last year when I tried to purchase a house. I had a broker that threw my credit file every which way he could and by the time I found out about it, they had run my credit report at around 20 different agencies. That was less than a year ago.

 

Your Credit Score Score Source Brand Type Date Range
659 Experian Fair Isaac V2 FICO 5/17/2011 320-844
656 Equifax BEACON 5 FICO 5/17/2011 334-818
633 Transunion Classic 04 FICO 5/17/2011 309-839

 

Experian
40 DEROGATORY PUBLIC RECORD OR COLLECTION FILED
10 RATIO OF BALANCE TO LIMIT ON BANK REVOLVING OR OTHER REV ACCTS
TOO HIGH
14 LENGTH OF TIME ACCOUNTS HAVE BEEN ESTABLISHED
08 TOO MANY INQUIRIES LAST 12 MONTHS
Equifax
38 SERIOUS DELINQUENCY, AND DEROGATORY PUBLIC RECORD OR
COLLECTION FILED
10 PROPORTION OF BALANCES TO CREDIT LIMITS IS TOO HIGH ON BANK
REVOLVING OR OTHER REVOLVING ACCOUNTS
14 LENGTH OF TIME ACCOUNTS HAVE BEEN ESTABLISHED
18 NUMBER OF ACCOUNTS WITH DELINQUENCY
Transunion
040 Derogatory public record or collection filed
010 Proportion of balances to credit limits is too high on bank revolving or other
revolving accounts
020 Length of time since derogatory public record or collection is too short
013 Time since delinquency is too recent or unknown


There aren't 40 derogatories. This says Experian code 40, which means "DEROGATORY PUBLIC RECORD OR COLLECTION FILED". Could be just ONE "derogatory".

 

TU seems to be using code 40 for the same issue. EQ seems to be using code 38, not that they are reporting 38 deragatories.

 

 

ETA: Looks like you were figuring it out while I was typing

 

Message 18 of 34
guiness56
Epic Contributor

Re: Derogatory items

40 is just the code.  I was wondering if you saw that and thought it meant 40 negatives.

 

Message 19 of 34
guiness56
Epic Contributor

Re: Derogatory items

After looking at this, this does look more like my credit file going all the way back to 1995. I had lots of bad stuff all the way up until around 2006. As I know you know :smileywink:, these will report for about ten years or so after last activity - so depending on when they closed, they can still be reporting on your current credit report.  I currently have items from as far back as the mid 90's showing up on my current credit report as well - I wouldn't have to go to a FF to see them I also had lots of inquiries last year when I tried to purchase a house. I had a broker that threw my credit file every which way he could and by the time I found out about it, they had run my credit report at around 20 different agencies. That was less than a year ago.  That makes sense then - they should be showing up on the credit reports you pull as well as the credit reports the bank pulled. 

 

Negatives only stay for up to 7.5 years.  Only accounts in good standing stay for up to 10 years from date closed.

Message 20 of 34
Advertiser Disclosure: The offers that appear on this site are from third party advertisers from whom FICO receives compensation.