Why do basic DVs differ from the OC letters I've seen here?

[Anonymous]

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@Anonymous wrote:

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@Anonymous wrote:

TO MY READING THOUGH, AND TAKING POINT 1 INTO ACCOUNT, ALL THIS MEANS IS THAT IF YOU DON'T DISPUTE IN 30 DAYS THE CA CAN PROCEED WITH COLLECTION EFFORTS AND REPORTING.

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SO I THINK IT IS TIME TO ESTABLISH IN A COURT OF LAW 'TIMELY MANNER' AND 'VERIFICATION'.

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I CANNOT BELIEVE THERE IS NO CASELAW ON EXACTLY WHAT 'VALIDATION' AND EVEN 'VERIFICATION' MEANS.

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You might find caselaw in your district which is more consumer friendly, but a whole lotta credit freaks in several other places have been following this for a whole lot longer than I have.. Guerrero was the case a lot of us were watching, but the court didn't spell out what constitutes "adequate validation" under 809. So, at the risk of repeating myself, that matter remains undecided.

You are very much mistaken in believing that 809 prohibits a CA from collection efforts UNTIL you DV them. They can call, write, report to the CAs, and otherwise pursue collection efforts unless and until you timely validate. If you don't, well, then under the law Congress appears to have told consumers, "Tough manure."

CAs aren't required to wait out the 30 days before they start collections.

"If the consumer notifies the debt collector in writing within the thirty-day period ... the debt collector shall cease collection of the debt ... Collection activities and communications that do not otherwise violate this title may continue during the 30-day period ..."

You can believe what you want, but unless and until you put forth some caselaw to back up your assertions, they just ain't so.

Message Edited by Noah_Bodie on 02-18-2008 09:01 AM

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Hi Noah, I'm not asserting law or caselaw, I'm only expressing amazement that the situation is the way it is.

It's like saying if you are accused of a crime and you don't ask for all the evidence against you within 30 days, then your accuser doesn't have to supply it again. All they have to do is consult their suit which says 'Grand Larceny/NYC/3-08' and say 'yep, that's what we said'. In other words, in the credit world, you are only innocent until proven guilty for 30 days. After that is is almost quite literally a kangaroo court.

[Anonymous]

Interesting thread-

The Ca has to prove that they sent notification and you DID NOT DV within 30 days- 

So unless they sent the dunning CM- they would have a hard time proving this-

[Anonymous]

I think there will be a break-through case in the next 5 years, now that consumers have so much access to information and each other. I predict;

1) Stringent requirements for proving a debt, including statements and signed contracts. Seems pretty basic to me.

2) Clarification and/or repeal of the 30-day dispute, i.e. consumers will have at all times, just like in every other area of law and especially contract law, evidence of the debt/charges against them.

These are the very most basic tenets of the rule of law.

Can anyone say 'Class Action Lawsuit'?

[Anonymous]

nyccc2 wrote:

in the credit world, you are only innocent until proven guilty for 30 days. After that is is almost quite literally a kangaroo court.

I disagree. Can't say that you're even presumed innocent during those first 30 days.

[Anonymous]

nyccc2 wrote:

I think there will be a break-through case in the next 5 years

I'd like to believe it, but FDCPA has it's 30th birthday this year. Has the Internet helped in the last few years? Yeah, sure. But big breakthrough? Been a myriad of $100K plus lawsuit wins by consumers. No change in behavior. I believe there've been a few million and multi-million $ wins. No change in behavior. Almost 20 percent of complaints to the FTC by consumers are FDCPA violations, and the FTC filed 1 whole case in 2006 compared to 69K complaints.

[REMOVED]

Please keep your analogies non-controversal

Message Edited by Timothy on 02-18-2008 04:04 PM

[Anonymous]

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@Anonymous wrote:

@Anonymous wrote:

I think there will be a break-through case in the next 5 years

I'd like to believe it, but FDCPA has it's 30th birthday this year. Has the Internet helped in the last few years? Yeah, sure. But big breakthrough? Been a myriad of $100K plus lawsuit wins by consumers. No change in behavior. I believe there've been a few million and multi-million $ wins. No change in behavior. Almost 20 percent of complaints to the FTC by consumers are FDCPA violations, and the FTC filed 1 whole case in 2006 compared to 69K complaints.

[Removed].

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I just don't understand how an entire industry can operate outside of the confines of the cornerstones of Western Law.

I was not going to waste my time with any suits, but now if i get the slightest indication I can bring suit for any of these items incorrectly reported AFTER disputing, I am going to do so full force.

Message Edited by Timothy on 02-18-2008 04:05 PM

[Anonymous]

nyccc2 wrote:

I just don't understand how an entire industry can operate outside of the confines of the cornerstones of Western Law.

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Follow the money, all $4.7 million of MBNA's for starters.

[Anonymous]

My bad. Make that $10.1 million.