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Bank's ATM Says I Got Money Even Though I Did Not

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AmethystWM
Established Member

Re: Bank's ATM Says I Got Money Even Though I Did Not

You said it, Callandra! I AM going to switch banks. But I've decided it would make sense to keep this account open until the OCC has done whatever they are going to do with my complaint. Also, I have several payments set up as auto-debits, and it takes a few weeks to get all those things switched over to a new account. I am researching banks now. I am pretty sure I don't want to use another fully online bank. I do want a bank that has mobile deposits and low fees, though (actually one selling point of My Bank is that they always refund ATM service charges for any ATM). I am seriously weighing the advantages of a big national bank versus a smaller local bank, too.

Message 11 of 21
longtime_lurker
Valued Contributor

Re: Bank's ATM Says I Got Money Even Though I Did Not


@AmethystWM wrote:

You said it, Callandra! I AM going to switch banks. But I've decided it would make sense to keep this account open until the OCC has done whatever they are going to do with my complaint. Also, I have several payments set up as auto-debits, and it takes a few weeks to get all those things switched over to a new account. I am researching banks now. I am pretty sure I don't want to use another fully online bank. I do want a bank that has mobile deposits and low fees, though (actually one selling point of My Bank is that they always refund ATM service charges for any ATM). I am seriously weighing the advantages of a big national bank versus a smaller local bank, too.


It wasn't Charles Schwab was it? I'd appreciate it you PM'ed me a yes/no

Current cards: MSUFCU Platinum, Amex PRG, Amex Surpass, Amex BCE, Citi Prestige, Citi Double Cash, Citi Premier, US Bank Cash +, Huntington Voice, AAviator, Sallie Mae, Discover IT, Chase Freedom TU:753 EQ Enhanced: 758
Message 12 of 21
Callandra
Valued Contributor

Re: Bank's ATM Says I Got Money Even Though I Did Not


@AmethystWM wrote:

You said it, Callandra! I AM going to switch banks. But I've decided it would make sense to keep this account open until the OCC has done whatever they are going to do with my complaint. Also, I have several payments set up as auto-debits, and it takes a few weeks to get all those things switched over to a new account. I am researching banks now. I am pretty sure I don't want to use another fully online bank. I do want a bank that has mobile deposits and low fees, though (actually one selling point of My Bank is that they always refund ATM service charges for any ATM). I am seriously weighing the advantages of a big national bank versus a smaller local bank, too.


Good luck! I have Chase now (big national bank) after banking with small banks my whole life (my parents have been into that and they always opened my accounts for me when I was under 18 so I had no choice, lol). Small banks have some good features but I couldn't take the inconvenience (no, sorry we are not sending you a new debit card even though yours has expired, you must come into the branch and sign for it -- this is when I lived in Japan, I couldn't exactly hop on over there!!; and then I got locked out of internet banking because they made me change my password like once every month and I couldn't keep up with it) -- this might depend on the bank. The one I had just wasn't very good or worked for me. 

 

No issues with Chase and no fees since I have the minimum balance to have them waived (plus I got $200 for opening the Checking with the coupon my Dad got in the mail). I think they also waive fees for having direct deposit. I've always gotten great service in branch too. The bank depends what you are looking for!

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Message 13 of 21
AmethystWM
Established Member

Re: Bank's ATM Says I Got Money Even Though I Did Not

Dear Forum:

 

I got an email from the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau today. The OCC forwarded both complaints to them for review. So, now I am waiting to hear if the CFPB thinks any federal consumer laws were broken. I was a little surprised because I thought that the OCC was the regulatory body in charge of MyBank.

 

As soon as I know anything, I will post it here. Thanks again.

 

Amethyst

Message 14 of 21
Anonymous
Not applicable

Re: Bank's ATM Says I Got Money Even Though I Did Not

Great persistence!

 

One of my new job duties is handling credit card chargebacks for a medium-sized firm. Debit card transactions are a different story, but CC disputes are relatively easy for consumers to win, and thus difficult and sometimes impossible for merchants to fight in many cases.

 

Not a process to abuse as a consumer though, because aside from ethics, the Payment Card Industry supposedly maintains a private internal "Negative" list of accounts that have seen a suspicious amount of disputed transactions.

 

Debit cards / Checking Accounts / ACH transactions are more difficult for a consumer to have reversed, especially if you don't dispute quickly, I think it is just a week to initiate dispute or so tops, as opposed to ~120 days for credit transactions. So I'm glad you won in this atm case! Too bad it took such a headache.

 

A lot of us live on a thin margin, so a $200 discrepancy could result in late payments or overdrafts.

 

I've found most CS Reps in the consumer and merchant banking industry, at reputable companies at least, are pretty reasonable, although they have some rigid guidelines and protocols they have to follow in most cases, and obviously you will come across bad apples.

Message 15 of 21
barbaralee
Established Contributor

Re: Bank's ATM Says I Got Money Even Though I Did Not


@Anonymous wrote:

 

Debit cards / Checking Accounts / ACH transactions are more difficult for a consumer to have reversed, especially if you don't dispute quickly, I think it is just a week to initiate dispute or so tops, as opposed to ~120 days for credit transactions. So I'm glad you won in this atm case! Too bad it took such a headache.

 

 


For debit cards (at least where I work) they can dispute through one of our front office agents as long as it is within 90 days. After 90 days we have to get the bank/ credit union's permission. We cannot submit any chargebacks after 120 days. 

Message 16 of 21
AmethystWM
Established Member

Re: Bank's ATM Says I Got Money Even Though I Did Not

Hi Forum:

 

Well, my understanding is that debit transactions just have a different process--it is not that they are necessarily harder to dispute. My dispute got complicated because My Bank and Bankcard Services screwed up, so I had to run around like a maniac getting it all figured out.

 

I have another update about the complaint I filed. I got an email from the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau asking for more information. I just got off the phone with a CFPB rep. She said that they needed to know which company I was actually complaining about. I wonder if anyone actually read the document I submitted. My complaint narrative clearly states that I am complaining about My Bank. Specifically, I said in the narrative that My Bank violated Regulation E by taking longer than 45 days to resolve the dispute, and then wrongly taking away the provisional credit. So, I ended up having to tell her the whole story again about what happened. I asked her if she thought the complaint sounded legitimate and she just said cheerily, "I can't comment on that. I know how frustrating all this can be!" Yeah, you said it lady!

 

So, I don't know what is going to happen now. Does anyone have any experience with the federal complaint process?

 

Amethyst

Message 17 of 21
barbaralee
Established Contributor

Re: Bank's ATM Says I Got Money Even Though I Did Not

We give merchants 48 days to respond to a chargeback. If they respond we give the cardholder 30 days to respond back. That is 78 days right there, not including the time it took to open the case and do the research. If we were only allowed 45 days to resolve a dispute we would be crazy behind. That is for a chargeback, though, can't really comment on the ATM thing.

 For the very few banks that we help dispute ATM fraud it is a super simple process. Sorry you have gone through so much hassle. Smiley Sad

 

Message 18 of 21
AmethystWM
Established Member

Re: Bank's ATM Says I Got Money Even Though I Did Not

Hi Folks:

 

This transaction was neither a chargeback nor an instance of fraud. It was an error. The ATM malfunctioned, and said it gave me money when it did not.

 

I have learned a lot about this type of problem since this dispute happened. Banks are supposed to deal with these errors according to Regulation E. Here is a link to a PDF of Regulation E:

 

http://www.federalreserve.gov/boarddocs/supmanual/cch/efta.pdf

 

The relevant portion of Regulation E says this:

 

"After receiving a notice of error, the financial institution must do all of the following:

  • Promptly investigate the oral or written allegation of error;
  • Complete its investigation within 10 business days (12 CFR 1005.11(c)(1));
  • Report the results of its investigation within three business days after completing its investigation;
  • Correct the error within one business day after determining that an error has occurred.

"The financial institution may take up to 45 calendar days (12 CFR 1005.11(c)(2)) to complete its investigation provided it:

  • Provisionally credits the funds (including interest, where applicable) to the consumer’s account within the 10 business-day period
  • Advises the consumer within two business days of the provisional crediting
  • Gives the consumer full use of the funds during the investigation"

To me, this is unambiguous. They get 10 days or 45 days, depending on whether or not they give the customer provisional funds. I got provisional funds, so My Bank got 45 days to fix the dispute. They took way more than 45 days, so they violated the Regulation E timeline. Moreover, they screwed up the investigation by coming to the wrong conclusion for some unbeknownst reason. My Bank messed up completely and caused me a lot of grief (yes, I admit that my account was overdrawn briefly because of this $200 mistake by My Bank).

 

Different types of problems probably have different timelines. Anyway, the CFPB told me they have forwarded my complaint to My Bank. I really hope something positive comes of this whole thing. I'm just really, really mad about this screw up. I feel like My Bank abdicated their fiduciary duty to me by the wayt hey handled this dispute.

 

Thanks again for everyone's responses and interest.

 

Amethyst

Message 19 of 21
AmethystWM
Established Member

Re: Bank's ATM Says I Got Money Even Though I Did Not

Hi Folks:

 

I received another update from the CFPB today. They said that MyBank contacted them to say they have received my complaint, and that they are "still researching" the problems. According to the CFPB case worker, My Bank says they will contact me again within 60 days.  60 DAYS???? Are they serious?

 

I do not understand how it can possibly take them so much time to figure out what went wrong. It is clear that they violated Regulation E. They are just dragging their feet and maybe hoping I will just forget about all this. I have been debating the merits of starting a "Twitter Shame Campaign." I have a friend who did that when her insurance company refused to cover a very expensive medication that she needs for a chronic health issue. Of course, this is banking, not healthcare--so I don't know if My Bank would experience the same level of anxiety as an insurance company over being publically called out on Twitter.

 

Even though I was able to get my $200 back, I still feel that I was screwed over by My Bank. I had to do the investigation that they were supposed to do. I had to deal with several incredibly time-consuming tasks to put everything right again, including dealing with a returned autodebit from a utility company because of the way My Bank screwed up. I did not incur any extra charges, but I did lose a lot of time, and suffer some embarrassment. They owe me a faster response than what I am getting.

 

Should I just wait it out? Does anyone have any experience using Twitter to get faster responses from companies? Any other thoughts whatsoever on this issue?

 

Thanks again for all the support and input.

 

Amethyst

Message 20 of 21
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