A couple of questions for you all.

pkenn · ‎11-14-2009

1. Im going to send out a few dv letters for some fairly old debts with ca's. what are the odds they dont have the original paperwork? is it common?

2. if i pay off a co,will it show on the oc as well as the ca?

3. if i do a pfd, do both the ca and the oc get removed?

4. if i negoitiate a payoff, how much worse is it for me credit score wise than doing the full amount?

5. last but not least, do you alway have to pay the amount the ca says? (it seems way over my limit even,and i hear they add al sorts of inflated amounts to it the co amount)

Thanks all, i could really use your input!

benben7 · ‎11-14-2009

Wow, you are right on the money. These are the same questions I have as well. Please, please, please will the other members help out here. Another question if the OC send you to the collection agency and they agree to accept a lower amount how is that reflected on the OC. Do they (OC) show the account as closed with no balance?

Another question: If a collection is assigned to collect a zombie debt should they be sent a DV letter. In this instance I am speaking of a old verizon land line from 2005. The question I have - is Verzion considered a open ended account or a written contract? If it is an open account and virginia law is 3 and it has been 4 years then this is a zombie debt, correct?

If so the collection must remove it right? I want to thank everyone for their advice.

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llecs · ‎11-14-2009

pkenn wrote:
            1. Im going to send out a few dv letters for some fairly old debts with ca's. what are the odds they dont have the original paperwork? is it common?

            2. if i pay off a co,will it show on the oc as well as the ca?

            3. if i do a pfd, do both the ca and the oc get removed?

             4. if i negoitiate a payoff, how much worse is it for me credit score wise than doing the full amount?

             5. last but not least, do you alway have to pay the amount the ca says? (it seems way over my limit even,and i hear they add al sorts of inflated amounts to it the co amount)
                                                                                                                                        Thanks all, i could really use your input!

1) In general, CA's don't have to provide the org. paperwork. Under the FDCPA, original paperwork isn't required. In my experience, most of them went away with a simple DV letter. Most of those that went away sold the debt to another CA and the process continued. I DV'd those and they went away too. Out of 13-15 DV letters sent over the past two years+ for org. debts, only one is still chasing me and all others went away. None are reporting and most didn't report because I sent a DV to their dunning immediately.

2) Both the OC and the CA can report at the same time. Only one can report a balance, though. If you paid a CO, the OC account should already be reporting paid at $0. The CA can be reporting a balance. If you pay a CO, the OC account wouldn't change because it was reporting paid already and the CA would change their reporting to paid collection. Be forewarned, paying a CO will not help your score. Paying a CA will not help your score. You need to do a PFD if you want your score to improve.

3) If you PFD, you PFD the creditor reporting. If just a CO is reporting, and not a CA, then PFD the OC and see what happens. Be careful, though. Removing old OC accounts can actually drop your score. Sometimes the history helps more than the baddie hurts. Compare the age of the CO in relation to your AAoA on that report. If it is super old, then modify your PFD, not to delete, but change it to remove only the baddie references like lates and CO status. If younger than your AAoA, then send a PFD.

If both the OC and CA is reporting, then the OC should be at $0. All you can do with them is to GW. For the CA, then DV first. If they verify and if you agree, then send a PFD. If they accept, then the CA will go away. A PFD to the CA won't automatically delete the OC account. Again, all you can do is to GW the OC.

4) It'll never hurt your score to offer a settlement with a PFD to a CA. Because the TL gets deleted. If you negotiate a settlement with a CA without a PFD, your score won't improve. If you negotiate a PFD w/ a settlement to an OC for a CO, your score won't drop because of the PFD (unless for reason prev. mentioned w/ the AAoA). If you negotiate with a OC on a CO without a PFD, then your score could take a hit. A "settled" comment is just as bad as a CO statement per your score.

5) Legally, they can add fees. If you look in your agreements, for example, it'll say some like "Bank X and its assignees" meaning that anyone who picks up the debt after the OC passes it along can continue to add interest. Some states limit the amount of interest that can be charged. YMMV. There's nothing wrong with settling, per se. I've was burned in the past, so I tend to offer 100%. Also offering more increases your chances to getting a PFD accepted.

Anonymous · ‎11-14-2009

1. Fairly common, although that doesn't mean they won't respond/will remove the entry from your reports.

2. If you pay the CA, they'll mark it as paid. A charge-off will still show with the OC unless you PIF to them. PFD!

3. Only if you PFD the OC AND only if they agree to pull it back from the CA. Get it in writing!

4. Some say worse, although I haven't noticed that to be true. Either way, it's a negative. The goal is PFD.

5. Nope. Negotiate by starting low. Some people have success offering as low as 30%. I've found that it takes at least 50% or more. Many times I could only get a PFD at 100%.

As a word of advice, my personal policy has been to only PFD with the OC unless absolutely impossible. Then, and only then, will I talk to a CA. All CA discussions are in writing and begin and end with PFD as a condition. No delete, no $.

llecs · ‎11-14-2009

benben7 wrote:
Another question if the OC send you to the collection agency and they agree to accept a lower amount how is that reflected on the OC. Do they (OC) show the account as closed with no balance?

If the OC owns the account and assigned it to a CA, who isn't reporting and won't report, then sending a payment settlement to the CA will result in that CA forwarding the payment to the OC. The OC will then report the account as "settled" with a $0 balance. That may ding your score, but the debt would be done with.

benben7 wrote:
Another question: If a collection is assigned to collect a zombie debt should they be sent a DV letter. In this instance I am speaking of a old verizon land line from 2005. The question I have - is Verzion considered a open ended account or a written contract? If it is an open account and virginia law is 3 and it has been 4 years then this is a zombie debt, correct?

If so the collection must remove it right? I want to thank everyone for their advice.

Verizon, IMO, is considered a written account because a contract was signed verbally and delivered by mail at the time the service was established. I've opened a few lines in the past year and found that to be the case with Verizon.

If a debt is past SOL, IMO, it isn't a zombie debt. A zombie debt as I understand it is a debt that is past SOL and CRTP. Two different things. SOL may be up but they can continue to report for the 7 years (CRTP as set by the FCRA). If Verizon owns the debt and report a balance, then it wouldn't hurt to send a DV to the CA. The CA won't report so as long as Verizon owns the debt (applicable to Verizon's SOPs).

benben7 · ‎11-14-2009

Thank you all for your imput. This is valuable advise. I am working on 2 differents collections with Verizon. Verizon Maryland is reporting a past due of 159.99. My plan based on the advise is to call them first. I'm they will no doubt send me to cbcs. If that's where I end of then I will pay them and I will start at 30%.

So from what I read, would it be correct to say that the CA will report to Verizon that the debt has been settled. If so, the balance on my collection from Verizon Maryland would be ZERO. Correct? Next I would start GW letters with them.

Verizon Washington - this amount is $ 90.00 - Verizon Washington is not reporting on my cr - but AFNI came up with the last couple of day. Based on what I have read I will DV first and if it comes back verified I will send a PFD. Does this seem like a reasonable course of action? My hope is to get both of these either cleared, deleted or at the very least improved.

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Current Score: TU 702 EX 677
Goal Score: TU 730 EX 730

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llecs · ‎11-14-2009

benben7 wrote:
Thank you all for your imput. This is valuable advise. I am working on 2 differents collections with Verizon. Verizon Maryland is reporting a past due of 159.99. My plan based on the advise is to call them first. I'm they will no doubt send me to cbcs. If that's where I end of then I will pay them and I will start at 30%.

So from what I read, would it be correct to say that the CA will report to Verizon that the debt has been settled. If so, the balance on my collection from Verizon Maryland would be ZERO. Correct? Next I would start GW letters with them.

In this example, Verizon owns the debt as evidenced by the balance reported by VErizon and evidenced by a lack of a reporting CA (CBCS in your case). If so, then ignore the CA. You can DV them but drag your feet. Focus your attention on Verizon. Send Verizon a PFD. IMO, it'll likely take 100% if you want them to accept it. They are a tough nut. I say to ignore the CA because they won't report. They can't accept any PFD agreements. They can't do anything except for bugging you. In fact, I bet if you sent a DV they'd go away and never call again (but a new CA will pick up where they left off).

If you decide to give up on any PFD arrangement with VErizon and opt to settle (IMO, never give up), then if you settle with Verizon, they will mark your CR with a $0 balance and a "settled" reference. That won't help your FICO score any but would put a stop to the debt.

benben7 wrote:
Verizon Washington - this amount is $ 90.00 - Verizon Washington is not reporting on my cr - but AFNI came up with the last couple of day. Based on what I have read I will DV first and if it comes back verified I will send a PFD. Does this seem like a reasonable course of action? My hope is to get both of these either cleared, deleted or at the very least improved.

You got it.

You can't improve a CA's reporting. Whether you owe $0 or $10,000, the damage to your score is the same.

pkenn · ‎11-14-2009

Thanks for all your help everyone!...llecs , did you owe any $ to the ca's you sent dv lettrs to?

llecs · ‎11-14-2009

pkenn wrote:
Thanks for all your help everyone!...llecs , did you owe any $ to the ca's you sent dv lettrs to?

Yes. In fact I had the cash in hand but I wouldn't pay without any PFD agreement (via the OC or CA). In every case, my DV letter was simple and only asked for OC info as permitted by the FDCPA. In nearly every case, they wrote back saying they couldn't validate and they are closing the account. I owed money but the dates were off, balance was off, etc.