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Regular Contributor
nma851
Posts: 145
Registered: ‎04-23-2013

Re: DOFD/CO/SOL, 4 year discrepancy, & resurrection of cancelled debt

You still keep amazing me Guiness...  Working on this when your post came in trying to "condense" my novel to these wonderful people :smileyhappy:.  Once again, THANK YOU for all this!

 

At least this one will be short :smileyhappy::smileyhappy::smileyhappy:

 

Quick clarification - as the last response is pretty cut & dry:  When you mention the DOFD date, it just dawned on me that theoretically and in actuality, there isn't a DOFD date given the Conditional Discharge granted automatic deferment.  Up until the approval of said P&TD, which started my 3-year conditional clock, there was not a late pay at all - PAA all the way.  Knowing the SL's can cause a larger problem (if any SL went into default, then I would have to rehabilitate before I could apply for the P&TD; luckily I was advised of this or I'd really be in a worse predicament if that is even possible!) than the CC's, I chose to let those "go" derog while keeping up on the SL's.  Once P&TD came into play and subsequent conditional deferment, I ceased paying for obvious reasons - they were deferred. 

 

The DV aspect also makes perfect sense.  DUH - on my part I suppose LOLOL.  I only see the OC reporting (March Pull) - and it appears, despite this CA "running the show", that the CA is doing the reporting on behalf of the OC under the OC's trade.  Otherwise, I *should* see the OC's trade as "CO'd/Transferred to CA" or the equivalent and the new CA trade appearing showing the current activity.  At this point, since I do NOT see such on any of the 3 CR's, this makes me think that CA is feeding OC the info and the OC is handling the reporting.  With all the other SL's, they're all showing a 2028 date with no derog at all (Status is Paid/Closed/Discharged as of August 2012).  They do not show up in a "potentially negative" area either; they're all in the "good standing" or the equivalent on all 3 CR's.  Makes perfect sense why I need to do the direct dispute with the OC & is in the works as I am replying to you my dear.  Depending on what the outcome of the DD letter is, and if the OC comes back with ANY derog date, I will have no choice but to somehow get a Civil Claim going since the OC is essentially "Voiding" that deferment timeframe and subsequently replacing it with CO's.  Not true as we know but proving, on the other hand, is going to be quite cumbersome.  

 

This will be interesting to say the least!  My DD letter is just going to have to run its course and go from there.  Pulling DOFD dates out of thin air won't fly, no pun intended, nor will "voiding" 3 years of deferment just to replace it with CO's back then to the present.  It is just so perplexing that this OC is the SAME CREDITOR as the other 13 SL's that received the P&TD Discharge!  

 

I have a feeling, however, that the only recourse I am going to have is hauling them into court which I simply do not have the funds to do.  I am confident there is a penalty to the OC here for violating the P&TD conditional period - look at it as a creditor attempting to collect during an automatic stay.  That Conditional Discharge is basically the equivalent of an automatic stay, irrespective of the previous CA's on that particular SL.  I ignored it then - given I knew I was in Conditional Discharge.  One would think I would have put two and two together on that one; but since the disputes resulted in removal, I never thought about it again - why would I realistically?  Even though they were deleted, to me that is just more leverage proving my case that the OC violated the provisions of the Conditional Discharge from day #1 amongst however many other FDCPA laws out there??  Wow this is uncovering more & more discrepancies by the hour..... SMH big time!

 

Looking forward, if it is found to be determined this SL truly was NOT eligible from the get-go unlike the FED ones, it is going to open up a whole different can of worms. Obviously I cannot afford litigation like this so at this point, I am going to TRY and not stress out by looking into the future like that.  Let's just hope my DD doesn't result in opening pandora's box....... 

 

Ohhh boy oh boy oh boy what have I gotten into???? :smileysad:  

 

Thank you again Guiness - if there is anything I can do for YOU, please let me know.  You've been far more informative & helpful than either of the 2 attorneys I went to!!  I certainly owe you some favors in return :smileyhappy::smileyhappy:

NMA


C1 QS-REW: $4,000; C1 V-REW: $4,000; RING: $8,200; AZ REW: $3,000; FREEDOM: $3,400. SCORES: EX: 799; TU: 785, EQ: 790 - 09 JUL 14. STARTING: EX 635 TU 629 EQ 630 - 19 Oct 2012. GOAL: 800 ACROSS & IN THE GARDEN!
Moderator
guiness56
Posts: 22,408
Registered: ‎01-17-2008

Re: DOFD/CO/SOL, 4 year discrepancy, & resurrection of cancelled debt

If you could cut and paste or somehow show the TL as it is on your CR would be beneficial.  Omit personal information.

Regular Contributor
nma851
Posts: 145
Registered: ‎04-23-2013

Re: DOFD/CO/SOL, 4 year discrepancy, & resurrection of cancelled debt

Hopefully this is going to appear correctly - I've had to play with the formatting several times so different areas "stand out" as they do in the report. A simple copy/paste was ALL over the place and you would need a day to decipher it LOLOL :smileyhappy::smileyhappy:.   Thank you Guiness - I really do mean that and I will do or declare or affirm whatever this forum would like me to do just to prove I'm not taking this lightly one bit.  Not only do I feel completely humiliated & disgusted with myself, I feel guilty as sin that you are having to utilize a significant portion of your time for me and an issue that is NOT an "everyday walk in the park".  I really pray that you personally believe me whenever I am saying, right now, I never expected this type of response, including the extensive parts such as citing Case Law for example, far less anyone willing to take on the challenge period and am beyond grateful that I am not laying here, in physical agony (due to the disabilities) and emotional, googling my heart out for WEEKS on end!!  Like I said before, I'm used to doing all the "help" in my life; so let this be a shout-out for anyone reading that you have made a HUGE difference in a complete stranger's life.  Unbelievable and a thank you is FAR from sufficient.  

 

Anyway darlin (sorry - don't mean to offend either; it's just the way I talk :smileyhappy:,  here is that TL as it's appearing as of February - and yep I ended up having to pay for it because I was out of "dispute pulls" giving me the report again more/less keeping me "up to date" on how this kept changing, when, etc.  I have others and I also have a good one (properly like THIS one should be) for comparison purposes if you would find that helpful and/or easier.  Just let me know.  

 

 

SALLIE MAE   Address:

11100 USA PKWY

FISHERS, IN 46037

(888) 272-5543

Account Number: ********************....   Address Identification Number: 0***********

Status: Account charged off. $14,348 written off. $13,109 past due as of Jan 2013.

Status Details: This account is scheduled to continue on record until Aug 2018.

Date Opened: 03/2003  Reported Since: 11/2005  Date of Status01/2013

Last Reported01/2013  TypeEducation  Terms: 180 Months  Monthly Payment: $0

ResponsibilityIndividual  Credit Limit/Original Amount$10,000  High Balance:NA

Recent Balance: $24,920 as of 01/2013  Recent Payment: $0  Payment History:

Account History: Charge Off as of Jan 2013 to Aug 2012

180 days past due as of Jun 2012, Jul 2012

150 days past due as of May 2012

120 days past due as of Apr 2012

90 days past due as of Mar 2012

60 days past due as of Feb 2012

30 days past due as of Jan 2012

Balance History - The following data will appear in the following format:

account balance / date payment received / scheduled payment amount / actual amount paid

Oct 2012: $24,887 / October 5, 2012 / no data / $103

Sep 2012: $24,956 / no data / no data / no data

Aug 2012: $24,923 / no data / no data / no data

Jul 2012: $24,888 / no data / no data / no data

Jun 2012: $24,854 / no data / no data / no data

May 2012: $24,821 / no data / no data / no data

Apr 2012: $24,786 / no data / no data / no data

Mar 2012: $24,753 / no data / no data / no data

Feb 2012: $24,719 / no data / no data / no data

Jan 2012: $24,687 / no data / no data / no data

Dec 2011: $24,652 / no data / no data / no data

Nov 2011: $24,618 / no data / no data / no data

Oct 2011: $24,585 / no data / no data / no data


C1 QS-REW: $4,000; C1 V-REW: $4,000; RING: $8,200; AZ REW: $3,000; FREEDOM: $3,400. SCORES: EX: 799; TU: 785, EQ: 790 - 09 JUL 14. STARTING: EX 635 TU 629 EQ 630 - 19 Oct 2012. GOAL: 800 ACROSS & IN THE GARDEN!
Moderator
guiness56
Posts: 22,408
Registered: ‎01-17-2008

Re: DOFD/CO/SOL, 4 year discrepancy, & resurrection of cancelled debt

There is a DoFD with this account.  It gives a fall off date of Aug 2018 which means DoFD would have been 7 - 7.5 years before that date.  7 years would make the DoFD Aug 2011 and 7.5 years would make it Feb 2011.  Do any of those dates mean anything to you?  Were you past due before that?

 

At any rate, since you filed PT&D and a discharge was approved,  it should not be reporting as a CO at all.  Any default references should have been removed. And it should be reporting a 0 balance.

 

Are the rest of the SLs also from Sallie Mae? 

 

No offense taken at all:smileyvery-happy:

 

I've been doing some reading on your situation and trying to see what can be done.  I would definitely send out that direct dispute and state why you are disputing.  Include copies of the discharge papers, before and after credit reports etc.

 

 

 

Regular Contributor
nma851
Posts: 145
Registered: ‎04-23-2013

Re: DOFD/CO/SOL, 4 year discrepancy, & resurrection of cancelled debt

Yes, there is a DOFD as it shows on the TL as copied/pasted.  However, that is the problem - it HAS a DOFD whenever it should not.  NONE of those dates mean a thing other than in Aug 2011 (7 years) and Feb 2011 (7.5 years) were year #2 of the Conditional Discharge.  At NO time was a payment missed unless it was in deferment, just as the account reported the entire duration of the Conditional Discharge.  Just as you said, since it had a P&TD, it shouldn't be reporting this at all and that is exactly what was being reported for the duration and ever since the account opened. 

 

Did you see how the CO amount and the amount owing were not correct either? 

 

Yes, ALL of the others are from Sallie Mae as well.  In fact, here is what that account looked like RIGHT before the discharge and how EVERY other Sallie Mae SL loan is reporting:

 

SALLIE MAE   Address:

11100 USA PKWY

FISHERS, IN 46037

(888) 272-5543

Account Number********************....   Address Identification Number0***********

Status: Deferred/Discharged/Never Late

Status DetailsThis account is scheduled to continue on record until Jul 2021.

Date Opened03/2003  Reported Since11/2005  Date of Status:  12/2012

Last Reported:  12/2012  Type:  Education  Terms180 Months  Monthly Payment: $0

Responsibility:  Individual  Credit Limit/Original Amount:  $10,000  High Balance:NA

Recent Balance$13,348 as of 12/2012  Recent Payment$0 Creditor's Statement: Account in Conditional Disharge until Jan 2013

Payment History: Account History: In deferment as of Jul 2009 to Jan 2013

he following data will appear in the following format:

account balance / date payment received / scheduled payment amount / actual amount paid

 

Apr 2012: $13,348 / no data / no data / no data

Mar 2012: $13,348 / no data / no data / no data

Feb 2012: $13,348 / no data / no data / no data

Jan 2012: $13,348 / no data / no data / no data

Dec 2011: $13,348 / no data / no data / no data

Nov 2011: $13,348 / no data / no data / no data

Oct 2011: $13,348 / no data / no data / no data

 

 

AND HERE IS THE "REALLY DISCHARGED" ONES:

 

 

SALLIE MAE   Address:

11100 USA PKWY

FISHERS, IN 46037

(888) 272-5543

Account Number********************....   Address Identification Number0***********

StatusPaid/Closed/Never Late. Discharged. Payment date not reported

Status DetailsThis account is scheduled to continue on record until Feb 2021.

Date Opened01/2003  Reported Since09/2003  Date of Status:  12/2012

Last Reported:  12/2012  Type:  Education  TermsNA  Monthly Payment: NA

Responsibility:  Individual  Credit Limit/Original Amount:  $1,328  High Balance:NA

Recent BalanceNA  Recent Payment$0 Creditor's Statement: Account/Balance discharged through claim filed with Government as of Jan 2013. The orignal amount of this account was $1,328

Payment History: Account History: Discharged as of Jul 2009 to Jan 2013

he following data will appear in the following format:

account balance / date payment received / scheduled payment amount / actual amount paid

 

Jan 2013: $1,328 / January 31, 2013 / no data / $1,328

 

 

Now that you have a "side-by-side" comparison, does this make better sense of the major discrepancies?  I should have posted them all at the same time and I apologize for not doing that - then you would have seen/known that the account, just like the LAST one I copied/pasted, never ever ever had a LP and/or CO.

 

This DD is going to be even MORE interesting now!!! :smileyhappy:  UGHHHHH MY LIFE!!


C1 QS-REW: $4,000; C1 V-REW: $4,000; RING: $8,200; AZ REW: $3,000; FREEDOM: $3,400. SCORES: EX: 799; TU: 785, EQ: 790 - 09 JUL 14. STARTING: EX 635 TU 629 EQ 630 - 19 Oct 2012. GOAL: 800 ACROSS & IN THE GARDEN!
Moderator
guiness56
Posts: 22,408
Registered: ‎01-17-2008

Re: DOFD/CO/SOL, 4 year discrepancy, & resurrection of cancelled debt

Yes, the second one looks as it should.

 

I know there is not supposed to be a DoFD, I was just saying there was one and that they are reporting incorrectly.

 

I just noticed on the first one it states account in conditional discharge until Jan 2013.  That was almost 4 months ago.  Have you heard from them again?

 

I wonder if you could contact the Department of Education directly about this.

 

The difference in amounts is because they are charging late fees and interest. 

Regular Contributor
nma851
Posts: 145
Registered: ‎04-23-2013

Re: DOFD/CO/SOL, 4 year discrepancy, & resurrection of cancelled debt

[ Edited ]

Understood my dear..  My apologies for misinterpreting your statement(s) about the DoFD aspect :smileyhappy:.  Smack me around a bit LOL!

 

For the "conditional discharge" question, whenever I posted that first TL, the one that has all the CO's/DEROG's & is a mess overall.  I should have labeled it somehow like image 1,2, and 3.  So we'll call this image 1 on the 1st copy/paste & based off a March CR pull.

 

Image #2 copy/paste is what it was as of Dec 2012 pull along with Image #3 copy/paste.  In February, the letter stating the conditional is now final arrived, along with a "cancellation of debt" from Sallie Mae - apparently for tax filing purposes as it looks like a W-2.  I guess I now get to deal with the IRS - goodie goodie!!

 

Dept. of Ed:  Ohhh that's a story for another day as you'll fall out of your chair.  DOE won't even TOUCH the unsecured since, per the DOE, that loan was never guaranteed by them, they had NOTHING to do with it, and all they can help me out on are the FED ones - which is the image #3, and all 12 are reporting the same/correct.  DOE further states that since this was an unsecured loan, it does not follow any of the rules that a "regular" SL would as there is no "security interest by any guarantee agency made, by the Federal Government, for this type of loan.  This discharge is per the lender's own set of guidelines/rules regarding the specific loan product this unsecured was".  I'm almost quoting verbatim as many times as I've called the DOE on it and the reply I get.  

 

Nutshell:  It's between me and Sallie, all by myself, no help from the DOE/FED on JUST that loan.  

 

I figured the balance rising is due to fees and all, but DOUBLING?  That's not logical in and of itself since, under the conditional period, as as you can see in the History of Images 2 and 3, the balance is "Stayed" similar to that of a BK.  The DOE states that during that time, even though payments are deferred during the conditional period, the actual Balance must be "stayed" as the Discharge date, once it is reached that is, will Discharge the ORIGINAL balance only at the time of the P&TD filing.  In other words, no one can charge a thing during that period because, even though there is a 3-year wait period, the discharge is based off the "Protected Filing Date of your P&TD app approval date".  For 3 years the balances on ALL the SL's, even the Unsecured, remained the same (Images #2 & #3).  Image #1 shows that DRASTIC change in the entire account - it's almost easier to say they deleted and reported a TOTALLY different account.  For all I know they have LOL;  however given they are not honoring that discharge, on the grounds that it was never "eligible" from the start, Sallie does not care obviously, and the only response(s) any of us get out of Sallie is "Too bad, so sad, we messed up, now we're making you pay literally & figuratively". 

 

You know what - given Sallie is here in Indy, just as I am, maybe me wheeling myself into their HQ over all this would result in some resolution.  Then we're looking each other in the eyes and hashing this out.  With my temper though, I may need bail money ready!  It's certainly an option - and at this point may be just the way to go about DD'ing and everything else.  Can't hurt any more than it has!!

 

There has got to be SOME type of law that exists that prohibits retroactively "penalizing" any consumer, not just me, especially for waiting 3 years and "coincidentally" declaring said alleged "error" about "never being eligible to begin with".  Then not giving ANY opportunity nor DFP, just STRAIGHT to CA and let's double the amount while we are at it.  BTW: I have modified and modified and modified this DD letter so many times I am seeing double-digits LOLOL.  It's time I forget about trying to write out all this detail & chronology for the rest of today; there is always tomorrow. 

 

As for now, thank you again darlin & to say the least, I wonder if I am in the "Top 10 of OC/CA/ catastrophes of 2013".  I want to be entered in THAT competition - and let's make the "Grand Prize" the amount I can settle this for :smileyhappy: :smileyhappy: :smileyhappy: :smileyhappy:.   Hey - gotta TRY and get a smile on my face here..  I'm VERY much tired of the crying!!!

 

Talk to you when you can Guiness - and again, my deepest appreciations! 


C1 QS-REW: $4,000; C1 V-REW: $4,000; RING: $8,200; AZ REW: $3,000; FREEDOM: $3,400. SCORES: EX: 799; TU: 785, EQ: 790 - 09 JUL 14. STARTING: EX 635 TU 629 EQ 630 - 19 Oct 2012. GOAL: 800 ACROSS & IN THE GARDEN!
Moderator
guiness56
Posts: 22,408
Registered: ‎01-17-2008

Re: DOFD/CO/SOL, 4 year discrepancy, & resurrection of cancelled debt

Well, I would most definitely send out that direct dispute to Sallie Mae and have them explain why it is reporting correctly when in fact it was discharged.

 

If need be, I am betting you could find an attorney that would take your case pro bono.

Regular Contributor
nma851
Posts: 145
Registered: ‎04-23-2013

Re: DOFD/CO/SOL, 4 year discrepancy, & resurrection of cancelled debt

Well Guiness -

 

First I hope you had a good week and all is as well as it can be.  

 

Unfortunately, SM has absolutely NO clue what they've done nor is it "fixable".  I received a letter, VERY promptly after sending the DD we discussed, asking me to have MY attorney contact them.  When I called the number affiliated with this, given I have NOT retained nor do I plan (for now) on having one, they said the "Verbiage used sounded like an attorney so therefore we can only speak to your counsel as this would be a violation on our part".  

 

KUDOS GUINESS!!  You wrote that DD and gave me the cites that made em think I have representation!  :smileysurprised:

 

Back to reality, I DID find out that this SL is "governed" by SM/CA who are "one in the same".  The CA is piggybacking off of the OC, the OC cannot "comply with my request" until I prove I'm not an attorney, and now I have the phone ringing at all hours about this loan.  They have this SO messed up that my OLD PAID & LONG GONE LOANS have been "re-statused" as showing "Claim Filed with Government" - I received an alert about derog info being posted, and now I have 12 loans that have now been resurrected all to status them, as of March 2013, as "Claim filed with Government", the "OK" payment histories are now all "G", and they have all gone into the "Potentially NEGATIVE Items" column and BOY OH BOY did it knock that score right down... 

 

This is what I meant by EVERY time I try with these fools, they only end up making my life WORSE.  The harder I try, the worse it gets.  I contact them, I end up being harassed.  I write them, I get BS answers.  I send in info, it ends up never getting addressed.  Now here I sit with PAID LOANS SHOWING SALLIE HAS DECIDED TO FILE CLAIMS WITH THE GOVERNMENT (Guaranty Agencies) to get PAID FOR LOANS THAT ARE ALREADY PAID?  NOW THEY WANT TO DOUBLE-DIP?

 

My god how LONG can this go on for?  Yes, in case you're wondering I never really mentioned these because I know, and they've been reported/reporting, as "Paid through P&TD".  Now I rock the boat and their answer to it is to SINK my boat, not just rock it back....  

 

Another FYI:  I did make and go to an appt with legal aid, who referred me to an FDCPA atty, who says I have NO case at the moment because they need time to comply with my request encompassing the DD.  Well - when I offered up the changes they have made on the PAID loans, some of which were not even part of the P&TD as I already PAID THEM BEFORE I BECAME DISABLED, Sallie's only response to any/all of this is to throw ANY type of derog info onto the TL's just out of spite.  Yeah that is my honest-to-god opinion.  Nevertheless, FDCPA attorney stated that he will not take it as NO FDCPA violation has occurred and my "Lack of Ability to prove otherwise" does not make a good case that (he) could argue. 

 

Who says one can go back to square one?  I end up going back in a time-machine in worst shape than when I started.  I KNEW this was going to come down to an attorney, ergo going to legal aid, I qualify for legal aid, but "until I can prove this", I have not ONE person on my side... If only this forum could be used, that would be nice.  Guiness, if you're willing to work for a VERY small fee, just tell me where to send the check as I'd hire you in a second!!

 

All in all, sending the DD has done NOTHING other than open a huge can of worms.... I have also subsequently disputed ALL of the SL's with ALL the bureaus, stating it's paid and being reported/re-reported incorrectly, so hopefully this will get resolved easily but as for the MAIN SL that is the subject of this thread, it has gone no where.  Until I get a hold of the DOE on Monday, to obtain a letter stating the loans are paid, when, etc., I don't have that exact "proof" however I do have the "ZERO BALANCE PAID OFF" letters regarding all these SL's.  It's a short-term problem with an easy fix since I DO have the info proving Paid/Closed/Discharged through P&TD, however what's to stop them from (once again) RE-REPORTING THE TL'S AS DEROG'S??  NOPE - if this takes me filing a suit on my own, just to STOP the madness at least temporarily until I can somehow find an attorney, so be it.  

 

I'm OVER this game-playing and intentional "Retaliation" - as that is exactly what this is - RETALIATION - for them NEVER being able to get that $$ out of me since I'll never work a day again in my life and my life should be made WORSE than it is so I suffer more for "skating out" of having to pay Sallie under P&TD.  Heck I'm half-tempted to cry civil rights at this point - discrimination against the disabled - as that seems to be the ONLY consistent "subject" in agreement.  Well that isn't totally true since they say they have the "Right to determine if I am disabled"!!!  Really?   So the Federal Government, who sends, via direct deposit, $$ to me via my paid-into-SSDI funds, each month, is NOT proof enough?  You have GOT to be joking right??  I made a critical error by never filing that AND going to THEIR physician?  Was I supposed to pick a doctor off the internet and go or was I to wait until 4 years later and go?  I just cannot - CANNOT - believe that they're ALSO challenging if I was/am really disabled now?  Who in the heck, at Sallie that is, could even determine such whenever this is a DONE DEAL?  

 

We really have no rights do we??...............

 

SIGHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!

 

All my love, appreciation, and electronic hugs my dear!  I'm really trying here - and let me know if you need anything else from me and/or PM me should it be too personal to post on here.  No matter what, I cannot thank you/everyone enough for this whole ordeal & the amount of support you've given me throughout! :smileyhappy::smileyhappy::smileyhappy:

 

NMA


C1 QS-REW: $4,000; C1 V-REW: $4,000; RING: $8,200; AZ REW: $3,000; FREEDOM: $3,400. SCORES: EX: 799; TU: 785, EQ: 790 - 09 JUL 14. STARTING: EX 635 TU 629 EQ 630 - 19 Oct 2012. GOAL: 800 ACROSS & IN THE GARDEN!
Moderator
guiness56
Posts: 22,408
Registered: ‎01-17-2008

Re: DOFD/CO/SOL, 4 year discrepancy, & resurrection of cancelled debt

Did you tell them you do not have an attorney, you wrote that letter yourself following the guidelines of the FCRA?

 

If they refuse to fix anything after you sent them the DD your next course would be to file a suit against them in court.  I am sure you could find an attorney who would be willing to work pro bono on the case.

 

I would give them 30 days to fix it then on to a civil suit.


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