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Established Contributor
electra
Posts: 573
Registered: ‎10-21-2012
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Re: State Tax Lien


guiness56 wrote:

electra wrote:

The way that the CRAs get their public records information is a mystery.  One thing I can say for certain is that the Courts and/or County Recorders DO NOT report information to the CRAs.  (I have spoken to the County Recorder personally regarding this very subject and he himself didn't know how the CRAs got the information...he verified that they NEVER send anything to the CRAs or communicate with them in any way.)   I have heard, and this seems likely, that they hire a 3rd party company (LexisNexis has been speculated) who then hires people to go to the Recorders office or look online for updates.  Who knows...I can tell you I have pulled my LexisNexis report and it DOES NOT contain most of my liens so...I dunno.  I specifically asked for MOV from CRAs and they gave me a vague line of canned BS. 

 

In terms of updates...it's kinda random.  Two of my IRS liens were recently paid...TU and EX updated to paid fairly quickly (at least the one) and EQ I had to dispute.  Interestingly...EX has only 1 of my 6 liens.  Don't know why but I can tell you that paying the second one did not cause it to appear on EX...at least so far and in my case it's NOT past the exclusion date.  (It's been 2-3 months now since it was paid.)

 

If you want to buy a house, I think you are going to have to pay the lien.  I would be VERY surprised if it appeared on your CR and, even if it did, 1) you should be able to get it removed based on the age and 2) it's so old that it's doubtful it would have much impact on your score.  (What happened with your score when it was removed?)  My advice would be to pay it and get some sleep!  :smileyhappy:


If she did pay it and it was rereported, it goes by the date it was reported not the age of the lien.  So, it would definitely impact her score as a new lien.

 

I honestly do not believe it can be rereported once it comes off due to age.  It has already run its course on the CR.


Where are you getting this information from?  It would definitely not be reported as a new lien.   It might show up as an old lien with a recent "Date Paid" but that should not impact her score.  If there were impacts to score from paying a lien then I would have seen it.  I've been watching my score like a hawk (I pull daily) and it didn't budge when my liens updated as paid.  There is no such entry as  "Date Reported" for liens on ANY of the three CRs.  



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electra
Posts: 573
Registered: ‎10-21-2012
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Re: State Tax Lien


Kathy4NU wrote:

Ok, went in and talked with my LO and came clean with him about the lien.  Showed him the paperwork and the certified check to pay it off.  He said it was no big deal.  It would have to be paid before we can close and it would come up when the title company searched for liens and judgements.  

 

We talked about it showing up on my credit report.  He felt it was highly unlkely given the age.  He didn't mention pulling my credit report a second time.  He did say if I wanted to wait and see what the title company said and than pay it after that.  Sounds reasonable to me.

 

This has had me stressed out for 4 days now.  No sleep, no eating, no nothing.  The plan is to teach my night class and than get a good nights sleep.


So glad to hear that. :smileyhappy:  Really don't think it will appear and if it does by some freak chance I doubt it would impact your score and you should be able to get it removed.



Starting Score: TU:584 | EQ 584
Current Score: TU FICO: 711 | EQ FICO 713 | EX (USAA FAKO) 779
Goal Score: 780 across the board


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guiness56
Posts: 22,408
Registered: ‎01-17-2008
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Re: State Tax Lien

[ Edited ]

electra wrote:

guiness56 wrote:

electra wrote:

The way that the CRAs get their public records information is a mystery.  One thing I can say for certain is that the Courts and/or County Recorders DO NOT report information to the CRAs.  (I have spoken to the County Recorder personally regarding this very subject and he himself didn't know how the CRAs got the information...he verified that they NEVER send anything to the CRAs or communicate with them in any way.)   I have heard, and this seems likely, that they hire a 3rd party company (LexisNexis has been speculated) who then hires people to go to the Recorders office or look online for updates.  Who knows...I can tell you I have pulled my LexisNexis report and it DOES NOT contain most of my liens so...I dunno.  I specifically asked for MOV from CRAs and they gave me a vague line of canned BS. 

 

In terms of updates...it's kinda random.  Two of my IRS liens were recently paid...TU and EX updated to paid fairly quickly (at least the one) and EQ I had to dispute.  Interestingly...EX has only 1 of my 6 liens.  Don't know why but I can tell you that paying the second one did not cause it to appear on EX...at least so far and in my case it's NOT past the exclusion date.  (It's been 2-3 months now since it was paid.)

 

If you want to buy a house, I think you are going to have to pay the lien.  I would be VERY surprised if it appeared on your CR and, even if it did, 1) you should be able to get it removed based on the age and 2) it's so old that it's doubtful it would have much impact on your score.  (What happened with your score when it was removed?)  My advice would be to pay it and get some sleep!  :smileyhappy:


If she did pay it and it was rereported, it goes by the date it was reported not the age of the lien.  So, it would definitely impact her score as a new lien.

 

I honestly do not believe it can be rereported once it comes off due to age.  It has already run its course on the CR.


Where are you getting this information from?  It would definitely not be reported as a new lien.   It might show up as an old lien with a recent "Date Paid" but that should not impact her score.  If there were impacts to score from paying a lien then I would have seen it.  I've been watching my score like a hawk (I pull daily) and it didn't budge when my liens updated as paid.  There is no such entry as  "Date Reported" for liens on ANY of the three CRs.  


Because when items are entered on your CR it goes by that date, not the date of the lien itself.  I never said there was a date reported on the lien itself.  It would be considered a "new" lien for reporting purposes.  It has nothing to due with when it was paid, just the fact it was reported in the first place.

 

It is no different than a collections that has not been reported to the CRAs for 4 years and you pay it and it shows up and tanks your scores.

 

Were your liens ever removed then rereported after you paid.  Or did they just update to paid still on the report?  Big difference.

Established Contributor
electra
Posts: 573
Registered: ‎10-21-2012
0

Re: State Tax Lien


guiness56 wrote:

electra wrote:

guiness56 wrote:

electra wrote:

The way that the CRAs get their public records information is a mystery.  One thing I can say for certain is that the Courts and/or County Recorders DO NOT report information to the CRAs.  (I have spoken to the County Recorder personally regarding this very subject and he himself didn't know how the CRAs got the information...he verified that they NEVER send anything to the CRAs or communicate with them in any way.)   I have heard, and this seems likely, that they hire a 3rd party company (LexisNexis has been speculated) who then hires people to go to the Recorders office or look online for updates.  Who knows...I can tell you I have pulled my LexisNexis report and it DOES NOT contain most of my liens so...I dunno.  I specifically asked for MOV from CRAs and they gave me a vague line of canned BS. 

 

In terms of updates...it's kinda random.  Two of my IRS liens were recently paid...TU and EX updated to paid fairly quickly (at least the one) and EQ I had to dispute.  Interestingly...EX has only 1 of my 6 liens.  Don't know why but I can tell you that paying the second one did not cause it to appear on EX...at least so far and in my case it's NOT past the exclusion date.  (It's been 2-3 months now since it was paid.)

 

If you want to buy a house, I think you are going to have to pay the lien.  I would be VERY surprised if it appeared on your CR and, even if it did, 1) you should be able to get it removed based on the age and 2) it's so old that it's doubtful it would have much impact on your score.  (What happened with your score when it was removed?)  My advice would be to pay it and get some sleep!  :smileyhappy:


If she did pay it and it was rereported, it goes by the date it was reported not the age of the lien.  So, it would definitely impact her score as a new lien.

 

I honestly do not believe it can be rereported once it comes off due to age.  It has already run its course on the CR.


Where are you getting this information from?  It would definitely not be reported as a new lien.   It might show up as an old lien with a recent "Date Paid" but that should not impact her score.  If there were impacts to score from paying a lien then I would have seen it.  I've been watching my score like a hawk (I pull daily) and it didn't budge when my liens updated as paid.  There is no such entry as  "Date Reported" for liens on ANY of the three CRs.  


Because when items are entered on your CR it goes by that date, not the date of the lien itself.  I never said there was a date reported on the lien itself.  It would be considered a "new" lien for reporting purposes.  It has nothing to due with when it was paid, just the fact it was reported in the first place.

 

It is no different than a collections that has not been reported to the CRAs for 4 years and you pay it and it shows up and tanks your scores.

 

Were your liens ever removed then rereported after you paid.  Or did they just update to paid still on the report?  Big difference.


My point is that...even if it WERE to somehow end up on her report...which I SERIOUSLY doubt...1) the effect would be negligible if anything because it is a 20 year old lien and the score impact goes down as it ages (the date they use is the date it was FILED...not the date it ended up on your CR) and 2) 20 years is WELL outside the reporting time for all three CRAs as far as I can tell so she would be able to get it off PDQ.  All three of my credit reports very clearly state that 10 years is the date at which unpaid liens fall off.   Is that because I'm in CA?  I'm not sure.  I have yet to see anyone point to anything in the FCRA that specifies the time for reporting unpaid liens.  The CRAs themselves seem to have conflicting information but I can tell you that they are all three VERY clear on my reports.  

 

Paying the lien does not "reset the clock".  If it did, I would see different exclusion dates for the 2 liens I posted previously.

 

Does anyone outside of CA have an unpaid lien on their reports?  What does it say under the notes section for Public Records?

 

My guess is that what is meant by "indefinitely" reported is that the IRS or the state can get a new lien (a renewal if you will) before the 10 years is up if it remains unpaid and they so choose.  If they don't, either because the loan is paid, they've determined it's uncollectible, it's off their radar, they are understaffed...whatever the reason, it will come off at 10 years.  This lien was probably on the OPs other CRs but aged off.  (I believe she mentioned she didn't look at them for years.)



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Kathy4NU
Posts: 279
Registered: ‎07-09-2012
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Re: State Tax Lien


electra wrote:

guiness56 wrote:

electra wrote:

guiness56 wrote:

electra wrote:

The way that the CRAs get their public records information is a mystery.  One thing I can say for certain is that the Courts and/or County Recorders DO NOT report information to the CRAs.  (I have spoken to the County Recorder personally regarding this very subject and he himself didn't know how the CRAs got the information...he verified that they NEVER send anything to the CRAs or communicate with them in any way.)   I have heard, and this seems likely, that they hire a 3rd party company (LexisNexis has been speculated) who then hires people to go to the Recorders office or look online for updates.  Who knows...I can tell you I have pulled my LexisNexis report and it DOES NOT contain most of my liens so...I dunno.  I specifically asked for MOV from CRAs and they gave me a vague line of canned BS. 

 

In terms of updates...it's kinda random.  Two of my IRS liens were recently paid...TU and EX updated to paid fairly quickly (at least the one) and EQ I had to dispute.  Interestingly...EX has only 1 of my 6 liens.  Don't know why but I can tell you that paying the second one did not cause it to appear on EX...at least so far and in my case it's NOT past the exclusion date.  (It's been 2-3 months now since it was paid.)

 

If you want to buy a house, I think you are going to have to pay the lien.  I would be VERY surprised if it appeared on your CR and, even if it did, 1) you should be able to get it removed based on the age and 2) it's so old that it's doubtful it would have much impact on your score.  (What happened with your score when it was removed?)  My advice would be to pay it and get some sleep!  :smileyhappy:


If she did pay it and it was rereported, it goes by the date it was reported not the age of the lien.  So, it would definitely impact her score as a new lien.

 

I honestly do not believe it can be rereported once it comes off due to age.  It has already run its course on the CR.


Where are you getting this information from?  It would definitely not be reported as a new lien.   It might show up as an old lien with a recent "Date Paid" but that should not impact her score.  If there were impacts to score from paying a lien then I would have seen it.  I've been watching my score like a hawk (I pull daily) and it didn't budge when my liens updated as paid.  There is no such entry as  "Date Reported" for liens on ANY of the three CRs.  


Because when items are entered on your CR it goes by that date, not the date of the lien itself.  I never said there was a date reported on the lien itself.  It would be considered a "new" lien for reporting purposes.  It has nothing to due with when it was paid, just the fact it was reported in the first place.

 

It is no different than a collections that has not been reported to the CRAs for 4 years and you pay it and it shows up and tanks your scores.

 

Were your liens ever removed then rereported after you paid.  Or did they just update to paid still on the report?  Big difference.


My point is that...even if it WERE to somehow end up on her report...which I SERIOUSLY doubt...1) the effect would be negligible if anything because it is a 20 year old lien and the score impact goes down as it ages (the date they use is the date it was FILED...not the date it ended up on your CR) and 2) 20 years is WELL outside the reporting time for all three CRAs as far as I can tell so she would be able to get it off PDQ.  All three of my credit reports very clearly state that 10 years is the date at which unpaid liens fall off.   Is that because I'm in CA?  I'm not sure.  I have yet to see anyone point to anything in the FCRA that specifies the time for reporting unpaid liens.  The CRAs themselves seem to have conflicting information but I can tell you that they are all three VERY clear on my reports.  

 

Paying the lien does not "reset the clock".  If it did, I would see different exclusion dates for the 2 liens I posted previously.

 

Does anyone outside of CA have an unpaid lien on their reports?  What does it say under the notes section for Public Records?

 

My guess is that what is meant by "indefinitely" reported is that the IRS or the state can get a new lien (a renewal if you will) before the 10 years is up if it remains unpaid and they so choose.  If they don't, either because the loan is paid, they've determined it's uncollectible, it's off their radar, they are understaffed...whatever the reason, it will come off at 10 years.  This lien was probably on the OPs other CRs but aged off.  (I believe she mentioned she didn't look at them for years.)


 

 

Yes, you are correct.  I never looked at my reports before June 2012.  It very well could have been on the other two reports and aged off.

 

Both EQ and TU asked me yesterday what state I lived in to see when it would fall off.  I gave them the scenerio of a tax lien that was filed 5 years ago and being paid now.  I asked if it woud age off in 5 years - making it 10 years from being filed or in 7 years - time from being paid.  EQ said whichever comes first.  TU said from time paid.  TU did say if I lived in CA it would be whichever is sooner.

 

Does anyone know how I can get a hold of someone at EX without entering in a repor number?

 

I am going to go with the assumption that it will not appear back on my report.  Mostly because this is what I want to believe.  However, I am not going to push my luck.  I am set to close on my house on May 24.  LO said the title company will find the lien.  Going to wait for them to find it and than pay it and supply the receipt.  I should be a few days or maybe 1 week from closing at that time.  This way, hopefully, if they are going to repull my report than it won't show up on the credit report if they do choose to put it on.



June '12: EQ 553 TU 0 EX 545
April '13 Lender Pull EQ 731, EX 692, TU 722 - all FICO

Closed on home May 22, 2013 at 2:00pm!!!
CU Visa $1000, VS $350, Chase Freedom $1000, Discover IT $2500, Home Depot: $2700, Menards $3000, NFM $3500
What's been deleted: 32 collections, 5 PR, 2 tax liens, defaulted student loans
Established Contributor
electra
Posts: 573
Registered: ‎10-21-2012
0

Re: State Tax Lien

Sounds like a smart plan.  Good luck!!  :smileyhappy:

 

Maybe the explanation for the difference really boils down to the state.   I would still love to know if anyone outside of CA has an unpaid lien on their CR what the public records notation above the lien says or what it says about the date it will drop off.  



Starting Score: TU:584 | EQ 584
Current Score: TU FICO: 711 | EQ FICO 713 | EX (USAA FAKO) 779
Goal Score: 780 across the board


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Cheryla18
Posts: 449
Registered: ‎10-13-2009
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Re: State Tax Lien

[ Edited ]

electra wrote:

Sounds like a smart plan.  Good luck!!  :smileyhappy:

 

Maybe the explanation for the difference really boils down to the state.   I would still love to know if anyone outside of CA has an unpaid lien on their CR what the public records notation above the lien says or what it says about the date it will drop off.  


This is what my current unpaid state tax lien shows in the state of Kansas

 CNTY COURT HSE                - Docket#:             
             
(
Date Filed:02/08/2013
Date Updated:02/20/2013
Type:STATE TAX LIEN
Responsibility:Individual Debt
Amount:$3,383
Court Type:Recorder of Deeds
Estimated month and year that this item will be removed: 01/2023

This information was collected from public records sources by TransUnion or a company we hired. You may be required to explain these items to potential creditors.        An unpaid tax lien remains on your file for up to 10 years.        Public record items generally remain on your credit file for up to 7 years.        For any public record that contains medical information, the information following 'Medical-' is not displayed to anyone but you except where permitted by law

 

This came off my current report from TransUnion after a dispute i filed.

 

Not sure if this helps or not but thought I would let you see what a currently unpaid tax lien says.

 

myFico EQ 612 (8/14) 596 (2/14) 574 (12/13) 497(1-7-13
myFico Exp 626 (2-10-14) 602 (11-17-13)
MyFico TU 618 (2-10-14) 589 (11-17-13)
Current Goal 640
Final Goal. 700
Established Contributor
electra
Posts: 573
Registered: ‎10-21-2012
0

Re: State Tax Lien

Interesting...that IS helpful, thanks!  What do your EQ and EX reports say?



Starting Score: TU:584 | EQ 584
Current Score: TU FICO: 711 | EQ FICO 713 | EX (USAA FAKO) 779
Goal Score: 780 across the board


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Cheryla18
Posts: 449
Registered: ‎10-13-2009
0

Re: State Tax Lien


Cheryla18 wrote:

electra wrote:

Sounds like a smart plan.  Good luck!!  :smileyhappy:

 

Maybe the explanation for the difference really boils down to the state.   I would still love to know if anyone outside of CA has an unpaid lien on their CR what the public records notation above the lien says or what it says about the date it will drop off.  


This is what my current unpaid state tax lien shows in the state of Kansas

 CNTY COURT HSE                - Docket#:             
             
(
Date Filed:02/08/2013
Date Updated:02/20/2013
Type:STATE TAX LIEN
Responsibility:Individual Debt
Amount:$3,383
Court Type:Recorder of Deeds
Estimated month and year that this item will be removed: 01/2023

This information was collected from public records sources by TransUnion or a company we hired. You may be required to explain these items to potential creditors.        An unpaid tax lien remains on your file for up to 10 years.        Public record items generally remain on your credit file for up to 7 years.        For any public record that contains medical information, the information following 'Medical-' is not displayed to anyone but you except where permitted by law

 

This came off my current report from TransUnion after a dispute i filed.

 

Not sure if this helps or not but thought I would let you see what a currently unpaid tax lien says.

 


********************CLARIFICATION*********** When i said this came off of my report....I simply meant this information was used from a current report that i recieved after i filed a dispute. It was not removed. I just wanted to make sure no one misundertood what i was trying to say :smileyhappy:

 

Cheryl

myFico EQ 612 (8/14) 596 (2/14) 574 (12/13) 497(1-7-13
myFico Exp 626 (2-10-14) 602 (11-17-13)
MyFico TU 618 (2-10-14) 589 (11-17-13)
Current Goal 640
Final Goal. 700
Frequent Contributor
Cheryla18
Posts: 449
Registered: ‎10-13-2009
0

Re: State Tax Lien


electra wrote:

Interesting...that IS helpful, thanks!  What do your EQ and EX reports say?


Suprisingly enough Experian says that it will remain until Feb 2020........3 years earlier than what TU says it will fall off.

So the Notes at the Top of my Experian reports says this: A paid tax lien may remain for up to seven years.  Unpaid tax liens may remain for 10 years..... Looks like Experian just went with the 7 years even though it is  has not been paid.

 

Cheryl

myFico EQ 612 (8/14) 596 (2/14) 574 (12/13) 497(1-7-13
myFico Exp 626 (2-10-14) 602 (11-17-13)
MyFico TU 618 (2-10-14) 589 (11-17-13)
Current Goal 640
Final Goal. 700

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