@odin308 wrote:RUN BRO, RUN!
She's sponging off you and you're letting her. There's no reason she should have ever lived with you for free(this isn't the 1950's. Women can take care of themselves). The unfortunate truth is that if you allow it, MOST people will take advantage of your kindness. You've set up a precedent where she knows you will bail her out. At her income, she should have plenty of money to pay down debt while paying <400 rent.
She needs to pay rent or find a new place to live. She probably won't accept this change because she's used to walking all over you. She doesn't respect you, sorry to say.
Best of luck
I hear what you're saying...it''s just hard to toss 2+ year relationship out the window...every relationship has its travails. That being said, you're right I don't want to be a sucker, and I am starting to resent the whole situation (which is why I addressed it with her, and came on here for advice).
I've basically given her until the weekend to come clean and let me help her figure this out. After that, all bets are off.
This brings up another question...I hope it doesn't go this way, but probably should start planning in case it happens. Assuming she decides to keep on keeping on and not change/pay rent, how do I (legally) compel her to leave? We never signed any kind of lease/rent agreement. I would obviously give her sufficent time to find another place (I'm not the type of guy to just put someone out on the street). But what is an appropriate amount of time? 30 days? 2 months? 3 months? Can she claim "squatter's rights" after being there for 8 months? Ugh...my head hurts just thinking about it.
@IOBA wrote:I'd have a hard time sticking with this gal with everything you have said. You can still date her but get her OUT of your house!! ASAP!!
ASAP!!!
If I ask her to move out, I'm pretty sure that would also be the end of our relationship...
The resentment you feel, will eventually be the end of your relationship, you will see her for who she is and not through your love colored glasses. That sounds harsh, but it's true, one day you will wake up and think "she's gotta go". She knows she has you, that she controls the relationship.
@barbaralee wrote:It has also crossed my mind the idea of man work/woman stay at home (or work little), but I don't think it applies in this situation. Those types of scenarios they are usually married and children involved. Being that there are no kids, they have not even mixed finances, and the girlfriend actually makes a very nice salary, there is no reason for her NOT to be contributing. I don't know if I want to go as far to say that she is a gold digger, but for sure there is an imbalance in regards to the finances and it is in her favor. Curious, does she pay for groceries, her gas, eating out?
I would say we split the food/Costco bill about 60/40 (with me paying the 60). She does pay for her own gas.
I pay about 90%+ of our outings (dinner, movies, etc.)...to be fair, I am kind of old-fashioned about this and think the guy should pay most of the time. So that's on me.
Her bills (as far as she told me) are:
1. Student loans ($900),
2. Car payment and insurance ($350)
3. Cell phone ($80)
4. Food ($200)
5. Gas ($120)
6. Misc. ($200)
@7. Credit Card ($250)---I am just guessing this is what she pays based on minimum payments on $10K worth of debt @Anonymous% APR average...she obviously is not paying much more than the minimums since she is maxed out.
These are the numbers she gave me (with the exception of credit card payments which she continues to be very vague about). But assuming these numbers are close to accurate, it all adds up to ~$2100/month in total expenses. Her take home (net salary) is about $2800-3000/month ($50,000/year less 30% for Fed, State, FICA, etc.).
So that leaves about $700-900/month, which is what I was thinking she was (could have) been putting toward paying down her debt. Even if she were paying $350/month in rent, that still should leave a few hundred dollars buffer.
Not only has she not paid debt down, her debt has substantially grown (all without paying rent). This is what is so troubling to me....
@p- wrote:odin308 wrote: That's rough. She can technically sponge off you and make you go through the eviction process(which costs $$$).Dw4250 wrote:I hope it doesn't go this way, but probably should start planning in case it happens. Assuming she decides to keep on keeping on and not change/pay rent, how do I (legally) compel her to leave? We never signed any kind of lease/rent agreement. I would obviously give her sufficent time to find another place (I'm not the type of guy to just put someone out on the street). But what is an appropriate amount of time? 30 days? 2 months? 3 months? Can she claim "squatter's rights" after being there for 8 months? Ugh...my head hurts just thinking about it.Oh, I missed the post earlier in which you said that you own your townhouse. Yeah, you're in a tough spot for sure. Does she have family she can move in with if you kick her out? I doubt she would refuse to leave if your relationship ended, unless she is truly evil, in which case you need her gone at any cost.
I don't think she has any "squatter's rights" but it would be wise to check up on your state's eviction laws. A smart way to put it is tell her that the relationship is moving too fast, and you need space (a classic). You love her, and care about her, but think it would be better if you slowed down and she moved out. It's not you, it's me, right?
After a couple of weeks if she is still sleeping there, draw up a 30 day notice in writing. Let her know that "this is just a formality" and "I know you're not going to go all weird on me, but you need to find somewhere else to live" and hand it to her. Tell her, "I need you out by X date. This is just moving too fast, it's not you, it's me, etc." Then, on your own, file an affidavit stating the day, time, and a copy of what you gave to her with your county clerk.
If she is still not out by day 30, change the locks while she is at work, and box up her belongings Leave them on the driveway under a tarp. Have a copy of the affidavit on hand in case she calls the police, and turn on the video recorder on your phone. If things get crazy, call the cops, and get a restraining order. Consider adding a game camera or some other passive surveillance device to get a picture of any potential vandalism that occurs.
My guess is she'll get pissed off and leave as soon as you tell her she has to move out. She'll probably go to her sister's, or something. If she does leave, change the locks while she is gone for sure.
Unfortunately, her family all live out of town. It would be a mess to be sure.
If she took it poorly, I'd probably just go crash with my parents or a close friend for a month or two and let her find a new place to live. I would put something in writing for sure to cover myself legally, and file it at the courthouse in case things get sticky. I don't know about installing cameras or anything...that's a little too 007 for me...lol. I would go around a take pictures of everything, and do an inventory on what belongs to whom (luckily we haven't made any joint expensive purchases like a couch or bed).
Well...she woke me up around 5:45 this morning and decided she wanted to talk right then and there. We had initially agreed to discuss this weekend. But alright...I sat up and in bed and thought "OK, maybe we're getting somewhere". Turns out no....
Basically, it was a re-do of our last conversation. She said I didn't understand her situation...I was "lucky" to have the job I have and make the money I do....she works just as hard as I do....etc., etc. She also said if the situations were reversed, she would be much more supportive, and give me all the room I needed. She said she thought we were a "partnership". I replied yes, we are a partnership. But a partnership requires both parties to inform, consent and follow through on their agreements. We made an agreement last fall that she would use the money saved from rent the past 6 months to pay down bills, and she did not live up to her end.
She said she had a "plan" already, and if I would just get off her back and give her a break, she would make it happen (apparently 7 months of free rent/utilities does not qualify as giving her a break). When I asked her what was the "plan" she had in mind, I got a lot of vague promises and wishes, none of which included chipping in for rent anytime soon.
I told her hope is not a plan...the way I got through my debt issues was by sitting down in front of a spreadsheet and figuring out exactly what needed to be done, and then having the discipline/patience to follow through.
She said if I wanted her to pay rent, she would just go work minimum wage at McDonald's; we would never see each other and it would even make that much of a difference anyway (the emotional blackmail card). I pointed out that seemed like a straw man argument...it seems to me she has multiple options. One option would be to get another stream of income. Another would be to exercise strong spending discipline. When I had significant debt issues, I got a second job (and really cut back spending). I did not particularly enjoy having to work 20 extra hours/week nights and weekends, but did what I had to do. Anyway there are other options out there besides McJobs…
So that's where we left it. She has basically put her foot down and has decided I am being totally unreasonable, and she will execute her debt reduction “plan" on her own timetable. Oh yeah, and I can probably forget about collecting rent any time in the foreseeable future.
As I mentioned in earlier posts, this is not an acceptable outcome for me. As someone else wrote, this is not the 1950's anymore. It’s not that I “need” the rent money from her; it’s that I feel by allowing her to continue to live rent free while also not dealing with her debt/obligations, I am acting as an enabler. I had hoped to help through this, but instead it seems all my help is now being thrown back in my face.
Time for plan B….thanks again everyone for all your support and feedback!