Discrepancy between Discover Fico score and Fico Equifax monitoring

[Revelate]

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@iv wrote:

@Revelate wrote:

What's the score range on the DIscover provided one?  You are correct regarding FBNO, but the Discover version as we understand it is the same product from TU that Walmart and Barclays use.  I'm pretty certain the top score on the Discover one is 850, and you'll see it's different on the FBNO one.

Discover's TU FICO does appear to top out at 850 (last four months at 850/849/850/844, matching the EQ08/EX08 here), so it's not FICO 8 Bankcard Enhanced, just standard TU FICO 8.

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Thank you for the confirmation!

[bigjim1]

Mr MODERATOR you ARE WRONG!  My information IS CORRECT!  YOU obviously do not know much about the industry because everyone on this discussion has said that there myfico scores are MUCH higher than their mortgage pulls!  Therefore giving them better credit scores when applying for credit cards.   I TOO CAN list dozens of credit cards you can get, when you can not qualify for a mortgage loan....THEY some may not be the best credit cards in the industry but YOU CAN get one!  Period!  I am not talking about pre-paid cards either....And from what i have seen on this site, usually your non mortgage pulls for credit cards your scores are MUCH higher than 620!  In my case overf 50 points higher....so it is EASIER to qualify for for a credit card.  I am a perfect example!  I have credit cards offers right now a mile long!  Because myfico says my middle scores are above 660!  But on the mortgage side its only 593....PERFECT example of my original statement....AGain this ALL GOES back to the orginial discussion the scores on this site have to BIG OF A VARIANCE with mortgage pulls.  I will tell you its a FACT!  It takes better credit to get a mortgage than it does a credit card PERIOD! 

[bigjim1]

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@Revelate wrote:

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@bigjim1 wrote:

I can assure you after many years in the credit/banking business, if your credit is GOOD enough for a mortgage loan, you WILL qualify for a credit card!  But the reverse is not true at all!  Many people get approved for credit cards who CAN NOT qualify for a mortgage loan based off their credit!

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I don't normally do this but that's not accurate at all.  You can currently qualify for a conventional mortgage from any lender at a 640, and there are many at 620 minimum, at least 1 at 600, and I heard rumors that may have even dropped to 580.

I can list dozens of credit cards which the application would be laughed at even at a FICO of 640 let alone lower than that.  Yes there are some credit cards which can be qualified for below any mortgage underwriting standard when we're talking just FICO scores, but the vast majority which are commonly talked about and suggested on this forum simply aren't.

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Mr MODERATOR you ARE WRONG!  My information IS CORRECT!  YOU obviously do not know much about the industry because everyone on this discussion has said that there myfico scores are MUCH higher than their mortgage pulls!  Therefore giving them better credit scores when applying for credit cards.   I TOO CAN list dozens of credit cards you can get, when you can not qualify for a mortgage loan....THEY some may not be the best credit cards in the industry but YOU CAN get one!  Period!  I am not talking about pre-paid cards either....And from what i have seen on this site, usually your non mortgage pulls for credit cards your scores are MUCH higher than 620!  In my case overf 50 points higher....so it is EASIER to qualify for for a credit card.  I am a perfect example!  I have credit cards offers right now a mile long!  Because myfico says my middle scores are above 660!  But on the mortgage side its only 593....PERFECT example of my original statement....AGain this ALL GOES back to the orginial discussion the scores on this site have to BIG OF A VARIANCE with mortgage pulls.  I will tell you its a FACT!  It takes better credit to get a mortgage than it does a credit card PERIOD!

[Revelate]

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@bigjim1 wrote:

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@Revelate wrote:

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@bigjim1 wrote:

I can assure you after many years in the credit/banking business, if your credit is GOOD enough for a mortgage loan, you WILL qualify for a credit card!  But the reverse is not true at all!  Many people get approved for credit cards who CAN NOT qualify for a mortgage loan based off their credit!

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I don't normally do this but that's not accurate at all.  You can currently qualify for a conventional mortgage from any lender at a 640, and there are many at 620 minimum, at least 1 at 600, and I heard rumors that may have even dropped to 580.

I can list dozens of credit cards which the application would be laughed at even at a FICO of 640 let alone lower than that.  Yes there are some credit cards which can be qualified for below any mortgage underwriting standard when we're talking just FICO scores, but the vast majority which are commonly talked about and suggested on this forum simply aren't.

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Mr MODERATOR you ARE WRONG!  My information IS CORRECT!  YOU obviously do not know much about the industry because everyone on this discussion has said that there myfico scores are MUCH higher than their mortgage pulls!  Therefore giving them better credit scores when applying for credit cards.   I TOO CAN list dozens of credit cards you can get, when you can not qualify for a mortgage loan....THEY some may not be the best credit cards in the industry but YOU CAN get one!  Period!  I am not talking about pre-paid cards either....And from what i have seen on this site, usually your non mortgage pulls for credit cards your scores are MUCH higher than 620!  In my case overf 50 points higher....so it is EASIER to qualify for for a credit card.  I am a perfect example!  I have credit cards offers right now a mile long!  Because myfico says my middle scores are above 660!  But on the mortgage side its only 593....PERFECT example of my original statement....AGain this ALL GOES back to the orginial discussion the scores on this site have to BIG OF A VARIANCE with mortgage pulls.  I will tell you its a FACT!  It takes better credit to get a mortgage than it does a credit card PERIOD!

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I apologize for coming across poorly, thank you for pointing that out.

I was not commenting on whether the scores where were better or worse than what one receives on a tri-merge pull: if the selected algorithms aren't identical of course the scores won't match.  Secondly, the people who's scores are higher on a mortgage pull aren't complaining: it's a self-selecting set of data across the massive consumer base of which the forum population is an incredibly small portion... and the ones seeing a major drop with FICO '08 vs. the mortgage pull, need to tweak their report a bit... though mortgage underwriting penalizes thin files anyway even if FICO '04 doesn't so they needed to do some work anyway and that's rather moot.

You are correct to state there are some credit cards which can be qualified for below a 600, though they almost all involve a security deposit... just like a mortgage (downpayment) and I was wrong to insinuate that all credit cards were higher which in re-reading my message, I could see how you came to that conclusion.  Much like there are multiple tiers of mortgages, there are multiple tiers of credit cards, but that said, the majority of credit cards are more difficult to qualify for than the current conventional mortgage standards, with the exception that you typically need 4 tradelines for underwriting a mortgage, whereas you can pickup a secured card (or a student one maybe) with a no-file even: I would suggest that's not germane to the discussion on FICO scoring, but the only card you can maybe qualify for from WF is their secured one at the level their standard conventional mortgage underwriting is at: given that they are the largest mortgage originator, I think my statement is fair as a result with the further explanation in this post.

[bigjim1]

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@Revelate wrote:

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@bigjim1 wrote:

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@Revelate wrote:

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@bigjim1 wrote:

I can assure you after many years in the credit/banking business, if your credit is GOOD enough for a mortgage loan, you WILL qualify for a credit card!  But the reverse is not true at all!  Many people get approved for credit cards who CAN NOT qualify for a mortgage loan based off their credit!

---

I don't normally do this but that's not accurate at all.  You can currently qualify for a conventional mortgage from any lender at a 640, and there are many at 620 minimum, at least 1 at 600, and I heard rumors that may have even dropped to 580.

I can list dozens of credit cards which the application would be laughed at even at a FICO of 640 let alone lower than that.  Yes there are some credit cards which can be qualified for below any mortgage underwriting standard when we're talking just FICO scores, but the vast majority which are commonly talked about and suggested on this forum simply aren't.

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Mr MODERATOR you ARE WRONG!  My information IS CORRECT!  YOU obviously do not know much about the industry because everyone on this discussion has said that there myfico scores are MUCH higher than their mortgage pulls!  Therefore giving them better credit scores when applying for credit cards.   I TOO CAN list dozens of credit cards you can get, when you can not qualify for a mortgage loan....THEY some may not be the best credit cards in the industry but YOU CAN get one!  Period!  I am not talking about pre-paid cards either....And from what i have seen on this site, usually your non mortgage pulls for credit cards your scores are MUCH higher than 620!  In my case overf 50 points higher....so it is EASIER to qualify for for a credit card.  I am a perfect example!  I have credit cards offers right now a mile long!  Because myfico says my middle scores are above 660!  But on the mortgage side its only 593....PERFECT example of my original statement....AGain this ALL GOES back to the orginial discussion the scores on this site have to BIG OF A VARIANCE with mortgage pulls.  I will tell you its a FACT!  It takes better credit to get a mortgage than it does a credit card PERIOD!

---

I apologize for coming across poorly, thank you for pointing that out.

I was not commenting on whether the scores where were better or worse than what one receives on a tri-merge pull: if the selected algorithms aren't identical of course the scores won't match.  Secondly, the people who's scores are higher on a mortgage pull aren't complaining: it's a self-selecting set of data across the massive consumer base of which the forum population is an incredibly small portion... and the ones seeing a major drop with FICO '08 vs. the mortgage pull, need to tweak their report a bit... though mortgage underwriting penalizes thin files anyway even if FICO '04 doesn't so they needed to do some work anyway and that's rather moot.

You are correct to state there are some credit cards which can be qualified for below a 600, though they almost all involve a security deposit... just like a mortgage (downpayment) and I was wrong to insinuate that all credit cards were higher which in re-reading my message, I could see how you came to that conclusion.  Much like there are multiple tiers of mortgages, there are multiple tiers of credit cards, but that said, the majority of credit cards are more difficult to qualify for than the current conventional mortgage standards, with the exception that you typically need 4 tradelines for underwriting a mortgage, whereas you can pickup a secured card (or a student one maybe) with a no-file even: I would suggest that's not germane to the discussion on FICO scoring, but the only card you can maybe qualify for from WF is their secured one at the level their standard conventional mortgage underwriting is at: given that they are the largest mortgage originator, I think my statement is fair as a result with the further explanation in this post.

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1.  I THANK YOU for the apology....but i still think you missed my entire point...again if you read the topic this and all the other posts originated with the discussion about how their are huge differences in the mortgage hard pulls verses the scores given with myfico.

2.  Under the current mortgage scoring I DO NOT qualify for a conventional loan because my middle score is showing as a 593....however the same score on myfico is 661 more than enough to get a good (not necessarily great) credit card offer without it being secured.

3.  In the last 24 months i have bought a newer 4 door jeep with interest rates at a respectable 3.2%.  I also bought a Harley 2 months ago with again a very respectable 4,5%.  And i have also got two credit cards both with 5,000 limits and the rates are at 14.9% not bad either....

4.  The reason is because myfico scores are SIGNIFICANTLY higher 661 and 693.

5.  I think this more than proves my point of my original statement and the fact that began this discussion about the huge 50 plus differences in the myfico scores verses the hard pull tri merges alot (not all) mortgage companies use....

6.  Therefore if your myfico scores (which are being used for credit cards, and autos and consumer loans) are much higher in many cases, but in my case for sure then yes it is EASIER to get a good credit card than a mortgage loan....

7.  You can not use the 620 or 600 as the bench mark for mortgage loans as compared to the same bench mark for credit cards because the myfico score is much higher in many if not most cases..

8.  If you read all the posts from the beginning you would see that many people started this thread because the experienced the same issue i did....mortgage scores are much lower than (any many cases over 50 points lower) than the myfico scores are.

Thank you and have a good day!

[bdhu2001]

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@bigjim1 wrote:

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@Revelate wrote:

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@bigjim1 wrote:

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@Revelate wrote:

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@bigjim1 wrote:

I can assure you after many years in the credit/banking business, if your credit is GOOD enough for a mortgage loan, you WILL qualify for a credit card!  But the reverse is not true at all!  Many people get approved for credit cards who CAN NOT qualify for a mortgage loan based off their credit!

---

I don't normally do this but that's not accurate at all.  You can currently qualify for a conventional mortgage from any lender at a 640, and there are many at 620 minimum, at least 1 at 600, and I heard rumors that may have even dropped to 580.

I can list dozens of credit cards which the application would be laughed at even at a FICO of 640 let alone lower than that.  Yes there are some credit cards which can be qualified for below any mortgage underwriting standard when we're talking just FICO scores, but the vast majority which are commonly talked about and suggested on this forum simply aren't.

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Mr MODERATOR you ARE WRONG!  My information IS CORRECT!  YOU obviously do not know much about the industry because everyone on this discussion has said that there myfico scores are MUCH higher than their mortgage pulls!  Therefore giving them better credit scores when applying for credit cards.   I TOO CAN list dozens of credit cards you can get, when you can not qualify for a mortgage loan....THEY some may not be the best credit cards in the industry but YOU CAN get one!  Period!  I am not talking about pre-paid cards either....And from what i have seen on this site, usually your non mortgage pulls for credit cards your scores are MUCH higher than 620!  In my case overf 50 points higher....so it is EASIER to qualify for for a credit card.  I am a perfect example!  I have credit cards offers right now a mile long!  Because myfico says my middle scores are above 660!  But on the mortgage side its only 593....PERFECT example of my original statement....AGain this ALL GOES back to the orginial discussion the scores on this site have to BIG OF A VARIANCE with mortgage pulls.  I will tell you its a FACT!  It takes better credit to get a mortgage than it does a credit card PERIOD!

---

I apologize for coming across poorly, thank you for pointing that out.

I was not commenting on whether the scores where were better or worse than what one receives on a tri-merge pull: if the selected algorithms aren't identical of course the scores won't match.  Secondly, the people who's scores are higher on a mortgage pull aren't complaining: it's a self-selecting set of data across the massive consumer base of which the forum population is an incredibly small portion... and the ones seeing a major drop with FICO '08 vs. the mortgage pull, need to tweak their report a bit... though mortgage underwriting penalizes thin files anyway even if FICO '04 doesn't so they needed to do some work anyway and that's rather moot.

You are correct to state there are some credit cards which can be qualified for below a 600, though they almost all involve a security deposit... just like a mortgage (downpayment) and I was wrong to insinuate that all credit cards were higher which in re-reading my message, I could see how you came to that conclusion.  Much like there are multiple tiers of mortgages, there are multiple tiers of credit cards, but that said, the majority of credit cards are more difficult to qualify for than the current conventional mortgage standards, with the exception that you typically need 4 tradelines for underwriting a mortgage, whereas you can pickup a secured card (or a student one maybe) with a no-file even: I would suggest that's not germane to the discussion on FICO scoring, but the only card you can maybe qualify for from WF is their secured one at the level their standard conventional mortgage underwriting is at: given that they are the largest mortgage originator, I think my statement is fair as a result with the further explanation in this post.

---

1.  I THANK YOU for the apology....but i still think you missed my entire point...again if you read the topic this and all the other posts originated with the discussion about how their are huge differences in the mortgage hard pulls verses the scores given with myfico.

2.  Under the current mortgage scoring I DO NOT qualify for a conventional loan because my middle score is showing as a 593....however the same score on myfico is 661 more than enough to get a good (not necessarily great) credit card offer without it being secured.

3.  In the last 24 months i have bought a newer 4 door jeep with interest rates at a respectable 3.2%.  I also bought a Harley 2 months ago with again a very respectable 4,5%.  And i have also got two credit cards both with 5,000 limits and the rates are at 14.9% not bad either....

4.  The reason is because myfico scores are SIGNIFICANTLY higher 661 and 693.

5.  I think this more than proves my point of my original statement and the fact that began this discussion about the huge 50 plus differences in the myfico scores verses the hard pull tri merges alot (not all) mortgage companies use....

6.  Therefore if your myfico scores (which are being used for credit cards, and autos and consumer loans) are much higher in many cases, but in my case for sure then yes it is EASIER to get a good credit card than a mortgage loan....

7.  You can not use the 620 or 600 as the bench mark for mortgage loans as compared to the same bench mark for credit cards because the myfico score is much higher in many if not most cases..

8.  If you read all the posts from the beginning you would see that many people started this thread because the experienced the same issue i did....mortgage scores are much lower than (any many cases over 50 points lower) than the myfico scores are.

Thank you and have a good day!

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I have my scores for both and bigjim1 you are correct.  The FICO scored used for mortgages is indeed quite a bit lower than the FICO score for a bankcard or auto loan.

But that is logical.  Remember a credit card may be on the hook for $500 or a few thousand; a car loan for approx 35K will cover most people; a mortgage will start at approx 60K minimum and the median home sales price 275K.  It's quite a bit more than that in some states. In California it's currently 447K and I shudder to think what it may be in New York.

Anyway, the scores coincide with the level of risk the lender is taking.  Generally, people need a mode of transportation to earn a living, but they don't need to own a home or have a credit card.

[bigjim1]

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@bdhu2001 wrote:

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@bigjim1 wrote:

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@Revelate wrote:

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@bigjim1 wrote:

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@Revelate wrote:

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@bigjim1 wrote:

I can assure you after many years in the credit/banking business, if your credit is GOOD enough for a mortgage loan, you WILL qualify for a credit card!  But the reverse is not true at all!  Many people get approved for credit cards who CAN NOT qualify for a mortgage loan based off their credit!

---

I don't normally do this but that's not accurate at all.  You can currently qualify for a conventional mortgage from any lender at a 640, and there are many at 620 minimum, at least 1 at 600, and I heard rumors that may have even dropped to 580.

I can list dozens of credit cards which the application would be laughed at even at a FICO of 640 let alone lower than that.  Yes there are some credit cards which can be qualified for below any mortgage underwriting standard when we're talking just FICO scores, but the vast majority which are commonly talked about and suggested on this forum simply aren't.

---

Mr MODERATOR you ARE WRONG!  My information IS CORRECT!  YOU obviously do not know much about the industry because everyone on this discussion has said that there myfico scores are MUCH higher than their mortgage pulls!  Therefore giving them better credit scores when applying for credit cards.   I TOO CAN list dozens of credit cards you can get, when you can not qualify for a mortgage loan....THEY some may not be the best credit cards in the industry but YOU CAN get one!  Period!  I am not talking about pre-paid cards either....And from what i have seen on this site, usually your non mortgage pulls for credit cards your scores are MUCH higher than 620!  In my case overf 50 points higher....so it is EASIER to qualify for for a credit card.  I am a perfect example!  I have credit cards offers right now a mile long!  Because myfico says my middle scores are above 660!  But on the mortgage side its only 593....PERFECT example of my original statement....AGain this ALL GOES back to the orginial discussion the scores on this site have to BIG OF A VARIANCE with mortgage pulls.  I will tell you its a FACT!  It takes better credit to get a mortgage than it does a credit card PERIOD!

---

I apologize for coming across poorly, thank you for pointing that out.

I was not commenting on whether the scores where were better or worse than what one receives on a tri-merge pull: if the selected algorithms aren't identical of course the scores won't match.  Secondly, the people who's scores are higher on a mortgage pull aren't complaining: it's a self-selecting set of data across the massive consumer base of which the forum population is an incredibly small portion... and the ones seeing a major drop with FICO '08 vs. the mortgage pull, need to tweak their report a bit... though mortgage underwriting penalizes thin files anyway even if FICO '04 doesn't so they needed to do some work anyway and that's rather moot.

You are correct to state there are some credit cards which can be qualified for below a 600, though they almost all involve a security deposit... just like a mortgage (downpayment) and I was wrong to insinuate that all credit cards were higher which in re-reading my message, I could see how you came to that conclusion.  Much like there are multiple tiers of mortgages, there are multiple tiers of credit cards, but that said, the majority of credit cards are more difficult to qualify for than the current conventional mortgage standards, with the exception that you typically need 4 tradelines for underwriting a mortgage, whereas you can pickup a secured card (or a student one maybe) with a no-file even: I would suggest that's not germane to the discussion on FICO scoring, but the only card you can maybe qualify for from WF is their secured one at the level their standard conventional mortgage underwriting is at: given that they are the largest mortgage originator, I think my statement is fair as a result with the further explanation in this post.

---

1.  I THANK YOU for the apology....but i still think you missed my entire point...again if you read the topic this and all the other posts originated with the discussion about how their are huge differences in the mortgage hard pulls verses the scores given with myfico.

2.  Under the current mortgage scoring I DO NOT qualify for a conventional loan because my middle score is showing as a 593....however the same score on myfico is 661 more than enough to get a good (not necessarily great) credit card offer without it being secured.

3.  In the last 24 months i have bought a newer 4 door jeep with interest rates at a respectable 3.2%.  I also bought a Harley 2 months ago with again a very respectable 4,5%.  And i have also got two credit cards both with 5,000 limits and the rates are at 14.9% not bad either....

4.  The reason is because myfico scores are SIGNIFICANTLY higher 661 and 693.

5.  I think this more than proves my point of my original statement and the fact that began this discussion about the huge 50 plus differences in the myfico scores verses the hard pull tri merges alot (not all) mortgage companies use....

6.  Therefore if your myfico scores (which are being used for credit cards, and autos and consumer loans) are much higher in many cases, but in my case for sure then yes it is EASIER to get a good credit card than a mortgage loan....

7.  You can not use the 620 or 600 as the bench mark for mortgage loans as compared to the same bench mark for credit cards because the myfico score is much higher in many if not most cases..

8.  If you read all the posts from the beginning you would see that many people started this thread because the experienced the same issue i did....mortgage scores are much lower than (any many cases over 50 points lower) than the myfico scores are.

Thank you and have a good day!

---

I have my scores for both and bigjim1 you are correct.  The FICO scored used for mortgages is indeed quite a bit lower than the FICO score for a bankcard or auto loan.

But that is logical.  Remember a credit card may be on the hook for $500 or a few thousand; a card for approx 30K will cover most people; a mortgage will start at approx 60K minimum and the median home sales price 275K.  It's quite a bit more than that in some states. In California it's currently 447K and I shudder to think what it may be in New York.

Anyway, the scores coincide with the level of risk the lender is taking.  Generally, people need a mode of transportation to earn a living, but they don't need to own a home or have a credit card.

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Thank you bdhu1,  that was my whole point exactly  to begin with!  If myfico scores are higher (and they are, in some cases by more than 50 points) then it is obviously easier to get the credit card because the scores are mugh higher than mortgage pulls to begin with.  Beleive my although I am no longer in the banking business, i was an Ex Vp for the mortgage opns division, for mercantile, bought by firststar, bought by US Bank....there were people who could get our own credit card (not a debit card) that we would have never made a mortgage loan to.

[Kazuya]

Hey guys back with some personal news since I participated in this convo.

Leased a new Lexus IS250 today. My fico equifax score is 748. The dealer today pulled and got a 742. So was good news for me.

The way I see it, at least for auto loans, is if your fico score is that high and you been oustanding with your auto loans then you will more or less will be able to depend on my fico. I have one car payed off under my name and about to be done with a 2nd before I got this lease.

[bigjim1]

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@Kazuya wrote:
Hey guys back with some personal news since I participated in this convo.

Leased a new Lexus IS250 today. My fico equifax score is 748. The dealer today pulled and got a 742. So was good news for me.

The way I see it, at least for auto loans, is if your fico score is that high and you been oustanding with your auto loans then you will more or less will be able to depend on my fico. I have one car payed off under my name and about to be done with a 2nd before I got this lease.

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Sounds like great news, as i have mentioned before, my only real  issue with myfico is the large discrepency in hard mortgage pulls....other than mortgages it seems to be right on....as i mentioned in my previous posts i have bought new cars and a new harley in the last 24 months at really good interest rates...no issues....I wanted to buy a another house and use my va, which i have never used, thats when i found out the scores were much lower....just had 50-60 points lower on the hard mortgage pullpulls....other than that I LIKE THIS SITE!

[tieton]

Great news Kazuya, good for you!

If it helps anyone, after settling my annoyance level  down I figured out what my issue was. My utilization on my two credit cards was high. Maxed out in-fact. I'm assuming that as a credit union the model of score they use dings pretty hard on that. My TU score from myFico was showing a 683, whereas the one BECU pulled was sitting at a 629. Applying for that LOC while my cards were used up was stupid! I've been playing this credit game hard enough since 2008, I should know better. I assumed since my score was 683 even with maxed CCs, it would all be good. WRONG! Don't do that. That was the only reason I was denied. The fine folks at BECU actually called me back and said pay it down a little, wait a month re-apply and it should go through no problem. So, I will pay both down to a nice level of 1 or 2% here in a week and get fixin' to app. Even though that will result in another INQ, it will only be a second one. May as well ask for the Visa while I'm at it too. LOL