Informal Poll: What's your Fico 4 vs. Fico 8 point diff?

[Anonymous]

My lender pulled 04 scores are about 20 points higher than the 08 scores here on myfico across all 3 bureaus

[HiLine]

So far we've got:

HiLine: 47-52

libby2015: 18

EW800: 37

iv: 34-74

soloman: 25

EricDET: (6)-16

tmoney: (12)-(2)

Newbie01: ~20

[Anonymous]

Interesting, there doesn't seem to be a rhyme or reason to the differences. I don't think you can infer that it's people with lots of baddies with lower scores since I have a bunch of baddies I still need to resolve and yet my fico 4 is only 18 points different from my fico 8. Anyone else have a theory? I was hoping this poll would show some consistency, but like everything else credit related it's a shot in the dark.

[Anonymous]

My best guess is that it weighs catergories just a little different so if you rate high in categories in the 04 model that are given less weight in 08, your 04 scores will be higher and vice versa....now if we could figure out those categories and the changes to scoring weight we'd be golden

[CreditDunce]

For the past several months my EQ-04 scores have been in the 795-803 range.   TU-08 802-815.  I also was given a EX-08 score last month when I checked to see if I was pre-qualified for CreditOne CC.  It was 795?  I don't remember exactly what it was.  While I don't have direct comparison between FICO 04 to FICO 08, I think they are all in the same ballpark for me.

One of the biggest reasons why FICO 04 and FICO 08 scores can be different is FICO 04 does not discount AU accounts.  A couple of good AU accounts can really boost a FICO 04 score, not so much with FICO 08. 

Another very minor difference is FICO 04 gives you a bonus for having CC's with credit unions and banks.  Having only major bank credit cards is a very small negative.  Having only CU CC's is a slightly worse negative (but still small).    FICO 08 doesn't care about credit mix between credit union and bank credit cards.

I am sure there are many other algorithm differences.  But the above two are the ones that come to my mind.

EDIT:

A couple more things that come to mind.  FICO 08 really likes CR's with a mix of installment and revolving lines.   From reading old posts, people with only installment loans really get hammered with FICO 08.   There is also a bigger penalty for not having an open installment loan in FICO 08 than FICO 04.

[CreditDunce]

FWIW, here is an excerpt of an article describing how FICO 08 improved on FICO 04:

"FICO has modified their scoring formula to provide a better way of analyzing risk, which will help lenders to predict
the likelihood of a borrower defaulting on a loan. FICO ‘08 is predicted to help lenders reduce their default rates on
consumer loans between 5 to 15%. Here are the key differences between FICO ‘08 and other FICO models:

• FICO ‘08 is more forgiving of consumers with a couple late payments, but harder on those who are repeat offenders

• More weight will be given to consumers with a variety of credit types

• Increased protection for lenders from authorized user abuse while still recognizing legitimate authorized user accounts

• Consumers who use a high percentage of their available credit will be penalized to a greater extent"

[Calidreaming]

The thing that confuses me about my scores is that not only are there 60-70 point differences between two of my 04 and 08 FICO scores, there is over a 100 point difference between my highest and lowest 04 score.  My highest 04 score is TU at 711 but my lowest 04 is 615 with EQ (EX is in the middle at 633).  My 08 scores from here are more consistent and range from 711 to 683.

The biggest thing affecting my score is a redeemed repo back in November 2013.  I also have a medical collection I just found out about from Feb 2011 for a very small amount.  Although I never checked my credit score for many years after it was reported, I'm pretty sure it did not affect it much since I was able to qualify for great auto loan rates and any other credit I applied for. 

The next biggest issue affecting my score is my level of credit card debt.  I'm at about 50% utilization. 

[Calidreaming]

Wow great info CreditDunce.  That does seem to explain why the repo didn't hurt my 08 scores very much since the repo was my only late.  I have a long credit history with many different types of credit. 

[CreditDunce]

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@Calidreaming wrote:

The thing that confuses me about my scores is that not only are there 60-70 point differences between two of my 04 and 08 FICO scores, there is over a 100 point difference between my highest and lowest 04 score.  My highest 04 score is TU at 711 but my lowest 04 is 615 with EQ (EX is in the middle at 633).  My 08 scores from here are more consistent and range from 711 to 683.

The biggest thing affecting my score is a redeemed repo back in November 2013.  I also have a medical collection I just found out about from Feb 2011 for a very small amount.  Although I never checked my credit score for many years after it was reported, I'm pretty sure it did not affect it much since I was able to qualify for great auto loan rates and any other credit I applied for. 

The next biggest issue affecting my score is my level of credit card debt.  I'm at about 50% utilization. 

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EX, EQ and TU FICO 04/98 scores tend to vary more than FICO 08 scores.  None of the CRA's used the same algorithms as the others back then.  FICO 08 uses more similar algorithms.  And FICO 09 is supposed to be the same between the different CRA's.  FICO 08/09 scores should be more consistent than FICO 04 scores.

Still, if you haven't already done it, I would pull all three free annual credit reports.  It is very common for the listed accounts to be different between them.   For example, EQ dropped a closed credit card account from my credit report after 7 years.  The others still have the account listed.  It is quite possible for derog accounts to be on only one CR.

Auto loans are one of the easiest loans to get.  If I recall correctly, DCU requires a score of 680 or higher for their best rates.  Going through the manufacture for financing can even have lower requirements.  It makes auto loans one of the best ways to build your installment loan history.  (Another easy way to build installment loans is via a shared secured installment loan).

[Calidreaming]

Creditdunce, based on your I went ahead and got all three of my credit reports.  Turns out that the reports from all three CRAs were reflecting the repo.  However, TU was the only one that was not reporting the $41 medical collection.  I was really surprised by this.  I had been assuming that that collection was not really hurting my score and was afraid that the reason my TU was so much higher was that it was not reporting the repo.  I'm really curious as to what my score was before the repo and collection.  

I am very encouraged by this new info.  I haven't really been pushing that hard to get the collection removed because it didn't make a difference, but now I'm hoping that getting it removed will be what gets my middle score to 680 and beyond faster and so that I'm able to qualify for a decent conventional mortgage rate.