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Established Member


I couldn't for the life of me find the answer anywhere, so please forgive me if this has been answered a bazillion times before (and if it's in the wrong forum, I wasn't sure where to put it).
I'm in the process of buying a home (the closing is a couple of weeks off yet), and I'm wondering if the inquiries from the mortgage company (or from anybody really - they were hard pulls) show to other lenders when they pull my report?  The reason I'm asking is that this is the second time that I've gone through the whole mortgage thing (the first time was a year ago and my scores were horrible, so this time everything should work out - *crosses fingers*), and both times a collection agency's, collection agency's, collection agency (the ones who dwell under the bottom of the barrel) popped a new inquiry and a collection account on my report.  In both instances, the accounts they're trying to collect on are old (the one last year was something that I never remember having, but has been taken care of, this most recent one is one that I remember, but it's within a year of hitting that magic 7-year mark).  I would just dismiss it as a coincedence if it didn't happen within a couple of weeks of the mortgage company's inquiry showing up on my credit reports both times.
Am I just being paranoid, or is this an actual practice these businesses partake in?  I just got the letter from this particular collection agency a week or so back, and I fired off a request for verification of the debt and mailed it this week (I have to double-check, but I think I'm within the first 30 days from the date on the notice), so I'm going to double-check all my stuff and start the dispute process immediately, but I'm just wondering if this is something I might have to start looking out for in the coming couple of weeks?
These forums have been a Godsend, and I thank everybody in advance for the answers I'm likely to see.
Smiley Happy
Message 1 of 29
Established Member

Re: Inquiries?

Okay, so there's a little more info.

The date on the letter the creditor sent me was 07/26/07, so they definitely haven't exhausted the initial 30 days. I have sent the validation request letter, but do they have to wait the first 30 days before they can report it, or can they just pretty much do whatever the heck they want?

(Sorry about the double post, but I can't figure out how to edit a message.)

 ----- edit -----

I figured out how to edit, I just wasn't logged in before. D'oh!  Had to edit again because for some reason, posting using Firefox creates a Wall 'o Text (tm).

Message Edited by phillippbo on 08-14-2007 02:39 PM

Message Edited by phillippbo on 08-14-2007 02:41 PM
Message 2 of 29
Moderator Emeritus

Re: Inquiries?

Are the original dates of delinquency more than 7 years? If so you may be the victim of zombie debt and will have to fight for it.
That being said yes it is all too common for collectors to come out of the woodwrk when you are seeking new credit.  This is the time when you are at your most vunerable and more likely to pay and probably have the funds to do so to their way of thinking.  If their actions can endanger your home purchase, how likely are you to pay them?
Message 3 of 29
Established Member

Re: Inquiries?

The original date of delinquency on this one makes it right at 6 years old, give or take a month. There is no way that I would be able to pay it, because I've got enough of my cash on hand tied up in the loan (closing costs and such), downpayment, and moving expenses that there is a little left over, but certainly not enough to talk a creditor down from a 2400.00 balance. (This debt did belong to me, but I was stupid with money way back then and got in over my head. By the time I could afford to try to catch back up, the bank wouldn't work with me at all. I don't necessarily blame them, but when you're struggling to make ends meet, coming up with 700.00 on the spot is impossible. A couple of years later, I tried to negotiate with them, but by that point I'm thinking they were ready to toss the debt because they would only settle for all of it - which might as well have been $1 million at the time.) At any rate, I'm hoping (though, I'm not really convinced this is the kind of company that would operate completely on the up-and-up) that they will follow the law and cease collection action until the debt can be validated, which I already requested that they do. I'm just miffed that they plopped it on the report without giving me the thirty days I'm supposed to have to be able to request validation. Can they really do that?

Well, at any rate, it dropped my FICO by 10 points (to 642 EQ), which would be plenty for the loan, but I don't know how the underwriter will react to a "new account" showing up. Interestingly enough, it doesn't show as a collection, but as a credit account that's maxed out with 4 120+ days late on it...
Message 4 of 29
Moderator Emeritus

Re: Inquiries?

Okay here's the bad news.... has your home loan already closed? If not, they will probably ssee it when they run their last credit report before closing.  Sorry about that.  Is not a new account cause it shos the original date of delinquency, is the original account showing on your credit report that the lender pulled to approve you?  If it is you may be able to squeeze through but if not it could very well out the kibosh on your home plans.
Sorry read too fast.  So it shows as a new account and this is the only reference to this account on your report?  Doesn't sound good.

Message Edited by Brammy on 08-14-2007 10:54 PM
Message 5 of 29
Established Member

Re: Inquiries?

The home loan has not closed yet (tentatively set for 08/27), and I'm sure that it'll show.

This particular account is already on the credit report from the original creditor, but the underwriter didn't have any trouble with it (other than requiring 5% down, which isn't bad). The only thing that I can see is the date first reported (08/01/07, but it didn't actually show until today) and not the date of delinquency, but I don't know if they can see that or not.

I was wrong, though, the description shows as a collection account, so if I can't get anywhere in the next week or so, I'll get on the horn with my mortgage broker and see what she says. It just burns me up that they send me a letter dated 07/26/07 and tell me I have 30 days to dispute, but then about 20 days later throw it on my credit report. I've never had any other collection agency do that (the one last year was more than 30 days from the original letter - they just stalked my credit report until they saw a mortgage company show up on it). Isn't the purpose of giving the consumer the 30 days to be able to catch these BEFORE they show up?

Sorry, went on a rant there. I'll give it about a week, week and a half for my letter to get there and see what they do. If they just ignore me (which, I'm sure they will), do I have any other recourse other than crawling on my belly to the bank and hope they take pity on me?
Message 6 of 29
Established Contributor

Re: Inquiries?

You know, I have heard that the CRA's work in conjunction with some of these OC's who are trying to collect on debts that we owe and have not paid, unfortunately, and they are given a heads up when we are trying to make new credit purchases or apply for credit.  I always wondered how they would know what I was doing if someone was not informing them. Just think, debt has been owed for 6 years and not paid, and now all of a sudden because I am applying for a car loan or a mortgage, I start getting calls and letters in the mail about this debt out of nowhere.  Damned if you do and damned if you don't.  Countrywide did that to me back in April for my mtg. payment. Acted like they didn't know what to do with extra money and held the payment, caused me to have a 30 day late, score dropped 100 pts and deal was a flop.  They know...  they know....
Message 7 of 29
Established Member

Re: Inquiries?

Up until today, I'd have dismissed that talk as crazy conspiracy theory, but I think you might be on to something. If nothing else, it is a HELL of a coincidence if there WEREN'T any shenanigans going on there. I think it's downright deceitful to lie in wait until you *know* that the consumer will be up against a wall to pounce. In this case, it seems like they knew waiting the full 30 days would put me in the clear for the mortgage, so they sprung early. It'd be nice if I had confidence that the law were actually on my side, and saying I have 30 days to dispute or request validation meant that I had 30 days before any other action were taken, but I don't. What's sad is that as far as credit reporting goes, consumers have more protection than we've pretty much *ever* had in the US. Or maybe a bit less, but certainly way better than 1977 (when I was born).

Shew, I do go off on rants, don't I? Sorry about that.

I hit a bump in the road because I realized that I may have sent the validation request to the wrong address. They tell you waaaaay up at the top of the letter to "...address all future correspondence and payments concerning this account to this address...", and then draw a highlighted box around a PO Box in Newark, NJ, but then in the Wall 'o Text (tm) near the bottom of the page, they say "All dispute correspondence should be mailed to:..." then give a physical address in Bethlehem, PA. Personally, I think that's more than a little misleading because anybody with a half a brain cell would read "all future correspondence" to also mean disputes and requests for validation, though I'm sure there's at least one court of law out there who would disagree. Anywho, I printed off a new letter to mail to the dispute address, so hopefully my bases are covered.

Does anybody think I have a snowball's chance of getting this taken care of before the closing, or will the bank see the accounts as one in the same (maybe) and let me squeak by, or am I just going to have to squeeze that turnip a little more and hope there's a few drops left?

*sigh* And things were going so swimmingly so far with this...

Smiley Sad
Message 8 of 29
Established Contributor

Re: Inquiries?

You know, I am not sure of anything, but I do know that I will be praying about for you and wishing you the best.
Message 9 of 29
Moderator Emeritus

Re: Inquiries?

Basically as far as the CAs knowing when you apply for new credit, they are either basically soft pulling your file every month or three and when they see new activity they go for you.  That or they have a trigger set up which some do to be notified whenever there is a new application for credit. 
It happens all the time with credit card but usually those triggers are alerts for when a credit score falls below or rises above a certain number so that they can offer better rates or rate jack you.  The universal default clause in many CC T&Cs operate on a trigger of any new derogs being reported that info is sent immediately to your card company.
The CRAs are not working in conjunction with the crediotors beyond what the creditor has paid for.
Message 10 of 29