My VS 3.0 negative reason codes!

[Anonymous]

So, after seeing my TU FICO 08 shoot up 68 points yesterday, I refreshed my Chase "Credit Journey" today to look at how it compares.  I don't care about the score (826) but did enjoy reading the reason codes.  The 4 negative reason codes I have are:

1 - "The date that you opened your oldest account it too recent."  My oldest account is 16 years old.  Not sure how that's too recent.  I was thinking that maybe it's only considering open accounts, as that 16 year old account is closed.  My oldest open account is 9 years old, so maybe that's what's too new in the eyes of VS 3.0.

2 - "You have too many inquiries on your credit report."  I have 4 on TU.  2 of them are from within the last 12 months, the other 2 are 16 months old.

3 - "The balances on your accounts are too high compared to loan amounts."  Due to my mortgage, my installment loan utilization sits around 70%, so I have no problem with this reason code.

4 - "Your largest credit limit on open bankcard or revolving accounts is too low."  This one I find interesting/amusing.  First, I didn't know that VS 3.0 took into consideration your credit limits [compared to FICO].  I do have 3 revolvers however with credit limits $30k+ with the highest being $40k.  I would never have thought that VS 3.0 likes to see a > $40k limit on a revolver in order to not impose a scoring penalty.

[marty56]

In some cases I think the advice given by VS scores could actually lower your FICO score.  I think my orginally mortgage company used a Vantage score and I have heard that Kohls does but really not sure.

[Kree]

I think its worth noting that once you hit 800, all it has left is nitpick reasons.  A negative factor at 600 could account for 50-100 points, but the higher you go, the less likely that is. Once you break 800, the cons on your report are probably all 5-10 point off. So you are left with ambiguous reasons. (opinion)

[Anonymous]

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@Kree wrote:

I think its worth noting that once you hit 800, all it has left is nitpick reasons.  A negative factor at 600 could account for 50-100 points, but the higher you go, the less likely that is. Once you break 800, the cons on your report are probably all 5-10 point off. So you are left with ambiguous reasons. (opinion)

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Do you mean specifically VS 3.0 negative reason codes or are your referring to FICO reason codes?  While I'm given 4 positive FICO reason codes, my negative section has stated "no factors available" for some time now.  In the eyes of FICO, there's nothing imposing a penalty on my score.  In the eyes of VS 3.0, however, there are 4.

[Kree]

I meant in general, but it is observational not factual. The higher my score goes, the more nitpicky it gets. I'm happy to get the "short credit history" despite 12+ years, because it means the big negs are going away.

[Anonymous]

Where are you seeing your negative reason codes?  I guess my point is that from what I've seen, FICO doesn't provide negative reason codes for no reason, as evidenced by the fact that I get none since there are no factors adversely impacting my score.  It does seem that VS 3.0 is able to provide plenty though on the same profile.

[Kree]

myFICO scores/factors

My highest score is 743. up from 630, so I've been following my factors as my score creeps up.  Using a simulator, I can say factor 1. heavy use of credit, is about 70 points. Meaning factor 2-4 are about 10 points each.

I assume this is a general thing.  As I've never seen more than 4 factors, they just list the top 4, and as the big ones go away, you see smaller and smaller factors.

[Anonymous]

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@Anonymous wrote:

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@Kree wrote:

I think its worth noting that once you hit 800, all it has left is nitpick reasons.  A negative factor at 600 could account for 50-100 points, but the higher you go, the less likely that is. Once you break 800, the cons on your report are probably all 5-10 point off. So you are left with ambiguous reasons. (opinion)

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Do you mean specifically VS 3.0 negative reason codes or are your referring to FICO reason codes?  While I'm given 4 positive FICO reason codes, my negative section has stated "no factors available" for some time now.  In the eyes of FICO, there's nothing imposing a penalty on my score.  In the eyes of VS 3.0, however, there are 4.

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Some credit monitoring systems (e.g. myFICO Ultimate) have indeed made the decision to hide all negative reason statements if the FICO 8 score is over 800.  But I don't think that is because the algorithm is not generating them.  It's just a decision of the people who designed that particular CMS.  I am basing that on the fact that my FICO 8 classic scores have been over 801 for a long time -- and I get the scores via my credit card.  (As of today a TU FICO of 819 from Bank of America, EX FICO of 828 from Amex)  Both scores always have reason negative reason codes attached, though not the full four.

[Thomas_Thumb]

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@Anonymous wrote:

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@Anonymous wrote:

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@Kree wrote:

I think its worth noting that once you hit 800, all it has left is nitpick reasons.  A negative factor at 600 could account for 50-100 points, but the higher you go, the less likely that is. Once you break 800, the cons on your report are probably all 5-10 point off. So you are left with ambiguous reasons. (opinion)

---

Do you mean specifically VS 3.0 negative reason codes or are your referring to FICO reason codes?  While I'm given 4 positive FICO reason codes, my negative section has stated "no factors available" for some time now.  In the eyes of FICO, there's nothing imposing a penalty on my score.  In the eyes of VS 3.0, however, there are 4.

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Some credit monitoring systems (e.g. myFICO Ultimate) have indeed made the decision to hide all negative reason statements if the FICO 8 score is over 800.  But I don't think that is because the algorithm is not generating them.  It's just a decision of the people who designed that particular CMS.  I am basing that on the fact that my FICO 8 classic scores have been over 801 for a long time -- and I get the scores via my credit card.  (As of today a TU FICO of 819 from Bank of America, EX FICO of 828 from Amex)  Both scores always have reason negative reason codes attached, though not the full four.

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^ Correct. Based on the reports I received from MyFico, they stop providing negative reason codes when scores are within 50 points of the model max (e.g above 800 for Classic Fico models that range 300 to 850; above 850 for industry specific models that range 250 to 900).

However, some free Fico scores I receive through credit cards display a couple negative reason statements even when scores are within 2 and 5 points of Max for (TU derived score) and 8 points of max for (EQ derived score).

Side note: VS 3.0  looks at inquiries for a full 2 years - not just one. Thus, if a profile has no inquiries in the last 12 months but some between 12 and 24 months, they may still see a negative reason code relating to inquiries..

[Anonymous]

CGID and TT, great information above and thank you for that.

Kree, I'd strongly advise against using a credit simulator to attempt to quantify the impact of negative reason codes on your score, as simulators are often extremely inaccurate.