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TU & EQ different on new credit?

Super Contributor

TU & EQ different on new credit?

I asked the simulator what the FICO 8 effect would be of (a) adding a new credit card or (b) increasing an existing card's limit.

 

Interestingly EQ went up 5 points & TU went down 5 points in each case.

 

 

FICO8 EQ 725 TU 750 EX 717 Total revolving credit 443500
9 REPLIES
Community Leader
Senior Contributor

Re: TU & EQ different on new credit?

It could be that the simulator is just wacked.  That's been true so many times before I wouldn't have trouble believing it here as well.  In fact, that is almost certainly part of the explanation -- at least of the CRA score that goes up.  I can imagine reasons why a person's score could go up as a result of adding a new card.  For example, if the person only had 1-2 cards to begin with, or if that person had a high utilization.  But in your case you already have MANY cards and your utilization is extremely low (with almost all cards reporting $0).  I cannot think of any other situation where one's score should be improved than the ones I mentioned, so the simulator seems to be just wrong here.  (Though I'd fascinated to hear if that actually happened to you.)

 

But let's suppose the simulator was right, or more reasonably let's imagine it predicted a zero point change at one bureau vs. a 10 point drop at the other..  The explanation might not have to do with the FICO 8 algorithm working differently at the two bureaus, but rather it could be that the data in the reports could be subtly different.  For example, suppose there was a different number of inquiries at each bureau, or suppose the age of youngest account was 2 months at one and 13 months at another.  Or suppose the AAoA was 6.0 at one bureau and 6.2 at the other -- the AAoA after the account was added could be 5.9 and 6.1

Super Contributor

Re: TU & EQ different on new credit?


CreditGuyInDixie wrote:

It could be that the simulator is just wacked.  That's been true so many times before I wouldn't have trouble believing it here as well.  In fact, that is almost certainly part of the explanation -- at least of the CRA score that goes up.  I can imagine reasons why a person's score could go up as a result of adding a new card.  For example, if the person only had 1-2 cards to begin with, or if that person had a high utilization.  But in your case you already have MANY cards and your utilization is extremely low (with almost all cards reporting $0).  I cannot think of any other situation where one's score should be improved than the ones I mentioned, so the simulator seems to be just wrong here.  (Though I'd fascinated to hear if that actually happened to you.)

 

But let's suppose the simulator was right, or more reasonably let's imagine it predicted a zero point change at one bureau vs. a 10 point drop at the other..  The explanation might not have to do with the FICO 8 algorithm working differently at the two bureaus, but rather it could be that the data in the reports could be subtly different.  For example, suppose there was a different number of inquiries at each bureau, or suppose the age of youngest account was 2 months at one and 13 months at another.  Or suppose the AAoA was 6.0 at one bureau and 6.2 at the other -- the AAoA after the account was added could be 5.9 and 6.1


Well I have a credit limit increase just starting to roll in, and a new card which hasn't reported yet, so I'll be able to update when the real world effect or noneffect is felt.

 

I'm predicting no effect from either event, but what do I know?

FICO8 EQ 725 TU 750 EX 717 Total revolving credit 443500
Community Leader
Senior Contributor

Re: TU & EQ different on new credit?

I assume your CLI did not involve a hard pull, right?

 

Did the simulator use any language that might suggest it was assuming a hard pull for the CLI?  Like "applying for a CLI"? 

 

If the simulator is not assuming a hard pull for the CLI, then that is more evidence still of its craziness -- given that it predicts a score drop caused by the CLI at one CRA.  The only way I can imagine a CLI resulting in a score decrease is if it were some weird thing like raising a CL from 49k to 70k, resulting in a tradeline that got dropped from the util calculation. 

Super Contributor

Re: TU & EQ different on new credit?


CreditGuyInDixie wrote:

I assume your CLI did not involve a hard pull, right?

 

Did the simulator use any language that might suggest it was assuming a hard pull for the CLI?  Like "applying for a CLI"? 

 

If the simulator is not assuming a hard pull for the CLI, then that is more evidence still of its craziness -- given that it predicts a score drop caused by the CLI at one CRA.  The only way I can imagine a CLI resulting in a score decrease is if it were some weird thing like raising a CL from 49k to 70k, resulting in a tradeline that got dropped from the util calculation. 


You must have me confused with someone who doesn't have 9 million hard pulls. Hard pulls don't affect my score ever, because I'm so over the line of being "very poor" in that department. But no the CLI didn't involve a hard pull.

 

No the simulator doesn't say things like that.

 

The simulator did not distinguish between different amounts. E.g. I tried the new credit card at different amounts, from 5k to the real amount which is 30k, and likewise with the credit limit increase from 1k to the real amount which is 8500, and the results were the same regardless of amount.

 

Most likely it's just another example of the simulator not working... but I have had an instance of the simulator working well... so one never knows.

 

 

 

FICO8 EQ 725 TU 750 EX 717 Total revolving credit 443500
Super Contributor

Re: TU & EQ different on new credit?

OK so I pulled my 3B report, after I was sure EQ and EX had the 8500 credit limit increase.

 

There was a 3 point increase on EQ (the simulator had predicted 5 points). That's a pretty good prediction, in my book.

 

There was no change in EX, as the simulator predicted.

 

Unfortunately, the CLI hasn't reported to TU yet, so I'll have to wait on that one.

FICO8 EQ 725 TU 750 EX 717 Total revolving credit 443500
Super Contributor

Re: TU & EQ different on new credit?

Just noticed an interesting difference between my EQ reports and my reports for TU & EX.

 

EQ lists my AAoA as 27 months, while TU & EX list it at 34 months.

So I went down the account list, to see what's causing it, and noticed that several closed revolving accounts which are reported in TU & EX are no longer reported in EQ, and that one of those accounts omitted by EQ was a backdated American Express account opened in 1988.

FICO8 EQ 725 TU 750 EX 717 Total revolving credit 443500
Super Contributor

Re: TU & EQ different on new credit?

Update.

 

Interestingly EQ FICO 8 did go up 5 points, although it was in 2 increments: 3 points when a credit limit went up 8500, and 2 points when the new credit card reported. EX has not moved, as the simulator predicted. TU has had only 1 of the 2 events report, and hasn't moved so far.

FICO8 EQ 725 TU 750 EX 717 Total revolving credit 443500
Highlighted
Super Contributor

Re: TU & EQ different on new credit?

Fascinating the way it turned out.

 

1. I knew I was getting a credit limit increase on a card and I was getting a new card.

2. Before either event reported, I input the info into the FICO 8 simulator, to see what the simulator's prediction would be.

3. When I input the CLI the simulator said: EQ +5 TU -5 EX +-0

4. When I input the new card the simulator said: EQ +5 TU -5 EX +-0.

5. When the CLI AND the new card had reported, the results were: EQ +5 TU -5 EX +-0

 

 

FICO8 EQ 725 TU 750 EX 717 Total revolving credit 443500
Regular Contributor

Re: TU & EQ different on new credit?

I find the simulator to be useless in my account as it's based on data that is 2 months old.

A lot has changed in my credit profile during the past two months. Are there any other simulators out that that are based on more current data?

 

2/2012 CH13 filed; 1/2017 DC
Start EQ 568 TU 600 EX 627
Current EQ 676 TU 694 EX 699
1/2017 Car loan
$500 Credit builder loan, paid and closed 8/2017