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What is the future for Vantage Scores?

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Anonymous
Not applicable

What is the future for Vantage Scores?

I know that in this forum, "Vantage" is a 4 letter word.   What is the general consensus of the future of this score?   Will it ever get any traction with lenders to use it either concurrently or in place of FICO scores, ever?
 
I am looking for impartial responses (i.e. no "drinking the FICO kool aid" responses please).  I understand that were this to happen, it would threaten the very foundation of Fair Isaac Co., which I certaintly do not want to happen.   But I also doubt that the Big 3 would have come out with this scoring model if they weren't intending on pushing very hard to eventually make it the standard.
Message 1 of 11
10 REPLIES 10
Anonymous
Not applicable

Re: What is the future for Vantage Scores?

It is my understanding that of the few companies that are pulling them - they are pulling them along with FICO.

If you look at this from a lender perspective- getting the data of both- over time you could look and see witch had a better predictive formula.

There may a chance (as I have heard from a close friend) the the CRA's are giving Vantage for free or close to it in order to get it out into the market place.

No one in their right mind would just drop FICO that is a industry standard and jump onto a new scoring system with no history of being a valid predictor.
Message 2 of 11
haulingthescoreup
Moderator Emerita

Re: What is the future for Vantage Scores?

I pulled my Vantage score in a spirit of what-the-heck. It is 805, which counts as a B or Prime Plus. I read an online article (bankcard.com, maybe) that says multiplying your Vantage score by 0.86 should yield your FICO. It's dead-on for TU, close for EX, and way off for EQ. Basically, by using Vantage, a lender would hit two of my three FICO's pretty well on target.

So to me, it looks like a way for the lenders to get out of paying for FICO's. What's weird to me is what they said was hurting my score:
# The available credit across your open credit card accounts is too low. Having low available credit amounts on credit card accounts has a negative impact on your credit score. ('Scuse me? $52K+ CC CL's, $38K+ CC CL without AU account; util is 1/100 of 1%)

# The average loan amount across open, recently reported real estate accounts, such as a mortgage, is too low. Having low loan amounts has a negative impact on your credit score. (Geeze, sorry that I don't live in CA or Hawaii or Boston, and that we only needed a $100K mortgage, plus now I have the $50K HELOC)

# Your report shows that the time since your oldest credit account or loan was opened is too short. Having credit accounts or loans open for a longer period of time has a positive impact on your credit score. (20 years on closed gas card, 18 years on AU CC, 12 years on re-fi'd mortgage)

# Your report shows that the time since your most recent late payment on a credit account or loan is too short. Recent late payments have a negative impact on your credit score. (well, yeah..)

# Your report shows one or more inquiries on file. Each time a potential lender pulls your credit report for review, an inquiry is placed on your file. While having inquiries on file does affect your score, the impact is minimal. (2 on EQ, 1 on EX, 0 on TU)
The complaint about low available credit on CC's and not enough mortgage debt makes this look to me like they are deliberately skewing this to encourage us to app, which certainly will make their customers (lenders) happy. And maybe, maybe, they're not counting the AU account, which is interesting. The whole thing seems more sell-more-credit-driven than actuarially-driven.
* Credit is a wonderful servant, but a terrible master. * Who's the boss --you or your credit?
FICO's: EQ 781 - TU 793 - EX 779 (from PSECU) - Done credit hunting; having fun with credit gardening. - EQ 590 on 5/14/2007
Message 3 of 11
Anonymous
Not applicable

Re: What is the future for Vantage Scores?

     Credit score formulas continue to revise their formulas to be less about predicting how likely you are to make payments on time, and more about how much of a sucker you are.  It's very hard to get a high score without at least 4 significant accounts with balances...but who's really more likely to make a payment on a new loan on time:

     Someone who: a) Maintains a variety of account types with large amounts owed yet good utilization ratios and payment history or b) Someone who PAYS OFF THEIR STUPID DEBTS.  Scenario (a) will recieve a high credit score despite all the debt they are juggling when obviously someone who strives to pay off their debts has MUCH BETTER odds of being able to keep up payments on a new debt.  Scenario (b) will watch their credit score drop to 450 and 80% of banks will refuse them credit because of their score or make them a crappy offer.

     Anyone bothering to jump through the hoops creditors have built into credit scoring so they can have a high credit score is indeed a slave to them and a sucker!  I keep closing credit cards that jack up my interest rate or implement annual/monthly fees and I am working on paying off all debt.  I have watched my credit score dive 55 points because of it, but at least I can see being debt free on the horizon.  It will be nice when my possessions and soul belong to me instead of some bank.

Message 4 of 11
smallfry
Senior Contributor

Re: What is the future for Vantage Scores?

You got it Hauling. Why should anyone score higher with an up to the eyeballs mortgage than someone who paid off a home mortgage in under ten years. Banks want you to be in debt. Of course they want their money back but on their timetable. In the old days you were more likely to be approved for a loan if there were no or few calls on your paycheck. Whatever.
Message 5 of 11
AndySoCal
Valued Contributor

Re: What is the future for Vantage Scores?

The Vantage score is not produced by the same company as the FICO score. As a result some lenders in my opinion are skeptical about using the score.  FICO aka Fair Isaac has a very good repuation in the lending history as well as a very good track record. There has been some that have tried to place the some blame on the FICO as part of the problem for the housing / mortgage mess. I feel that is unjust. As a result of that skepticism that score has not been widely used.
FICO Scores XPN v8 802 V2 831 (SDFCU) TUC 803 v8 EFX 807 (10/2023)
Discover 09/90 19,000, JCPenney 10/2008 4,700 US Bank Cash+ 12,000 Citibank Custom Cash 5/2015 11,100 C State Dept. FCU 15,000 06/2023 , 02/2024 Redstone FCU Signature VISA 10,000 Banking: Ally Bank Credit Unions: Lafayette FCU Quorum FCU State Department FCU State Department FCU Pelican State CU Redstone FCU

Message 6 of 11
creditwherecreditisdue
Senior Contributor

Re: What is the future for Vantage Scores?

For Reference:

 

Vantage:  TU = 813/B, EX = 791/C, EQ = 802/B

 

Vantage reasons:

 

  • You have no real estate accounts that can be used in determining a credit score. [ TransUnion ,  Experian ,  Equifax ]   A healthy balance of credit and loan accounts is key to achieving a high credit score. It is important to build a record of responsible credit use over time with different types of accounts. True, but not much of a reason.
  • Not enough of your accounts are consistently paid on time. [ TransUnion ,  Experian ,  Equifax ]   Payment history is a significant factor in the credit scoring process. Regular on time payments may make you more creditworthy to potential lenders. I have no lates on TU whatsoever, 10+ year history.
  • The available credit on your open revolving credit accounts is too low. [ TransUnion ,  Experian ,  Equifax ]   Having credit available to you is a sign that you are able to manage your finances responsibly. Lenders usually like to see that consumers have a large amount of credit available to them. Sure. [NOT!]
  • The sum of your bank credit card account balances is too high. [ TransUnion ,  Experian ,  Equifax ]   High credit balances may be considered by lenders to be a negative factor when determining creditworthiness. Paying down your balance may improve your score. UTIL = 8%.

 

FICO: TU = 755, EQ = 724

 

Other that a few INQ's the information on EX and EQ is the same. TU info is different (no lates, one less TL - a newish one). 

Like I've said before, Vantage favors high CL's and more TL's. It also favors mortgage holders. It seems to be another one of those scoring models that favors app'ing.

Message 7 of 11
daisyduke
Valued Contributor

Re: What is the future for Vantage Scores?

True Credit now gives Vantage Scores...I happen to love this - I have 2 paid never late mortgages on my CR. This is the thanks i get

 

  • None of your real estate accounts show a credit amount. [ TransUnion ,  Experian ,  Equifax ]   Lenders may be able to better evaluate your creditworthiness if there is more information about your accounts on your credit report.
  •  

    yeah, cause they were paid!! Never late! two mortgages! (thank you ex husband)

     

    then I get conflicting information:

    • None of your installment accounts show a credit amount. [  Experian ,  Equifax ]   Lenders may be able to better evaluate your creditworthiness if there is more information about your accounts on your credit report.

    I paid off my car, never late!

     

    • The balances on your installment accounts are too high in comparison to their credit limits. [ TransUnion ]   It is a good idea to use your accounts regularly, but remember to keep your balances low in comparison to your available credit limits. Having a high ratio of balances to credit limits on open accounts may be viewed negatively by lenders.

    I got a new car loan, never late!

     

    The explanations are not accurate.

     


    Starting Score: 682 EQ, 663 TU
    Current Score: 687 EQ - 705 TU on 7/18/10
    Goal Score: 700 + both EQ and TU


    Take the FICO Fitness Challenge
    Message 8 of 11
    marty56
    Super Contributor

    Re: What is the future for Vantage Scores?

    Mine told me my 2% util, all from one CC at 7% util was too high.

     

    LOL lucky those comments dont get forwarded to potential lenders, especially those that also can't do math or RTFR.

    1/25/2021: FICO 850 EQ 848 TU 847 EX
    Message 9 of 11
    Jazzzy
    Valued Contributor

    Re: What is the future for Vantage Scores?

    In my experience, the suggestions given by some of these FAKO scores can be damaging. For example, a TransRisk score will give you your best rating in number of accounts only if you have 40+ accounts.

     

    Because of school loans that keep getting transferred around, I currently have 35 accounts on my EQ report. I have a red flag on my FICO report by my number of accounts that tells me that having 35 accounts is hurting my FICO score.

     

    Therefore, TransRisk would have you do exactly the opposite of what my EQ FICO is indicating.

    Message 10 of 11
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