topic Re: WF Propel denial. Recon worth it? in Credit Card Applications

WF Propel denial. Recon worth it?

mumbogray — Mon, 25 Mar 2019 22:02:35 GMT

Hey all,

I have been trying to get in with Wells for a few months. Recently denied for the Propel. I'm wondering if its worth the Recon, considering the dp's I have. I have had a very active year, but their cited reasons for denial are a little iffy this time.

They pulled EX at 703. Reasons for denial are:

Amount owed on bank card with the highest balance is too high relative to the credit limit.
Too many credit accounts opened in the last three months (We look at how muvh new credit you may be taking on).
Not enough accounts paid as agreed on your credit file (We look for a history of on-time payments).

As part of the EX denial letter, it also lists key factors negatively affecting my credit score:

Length of time accounts have been established
Proportion of balances to credit limits too high on revolving accounts
Length of time revolving accounts have been estalished
Too many inquiries in the last twelve months

So if the denial reasons are the only issue, I think my chances could be high. If they will then go ahead and cite one of those other bullets, I might as well not bother.

When I originally applied in Oct 2018, I was denied, tried recon twice, and still denied. At the time, I believe they pulled EX in the 7teens. I don't have my letter, but I was basically denied for a thin profile, too many recent accounts, and too many inqs. I was on a spree at the time, mentioned below. I opened a checking/savings account with them in Dec 2018, and have been using it with DD and to pay some bills. Also got a sub lol. I had an unexpected but necessary car purchase in Jan. It was within my means 18K + tax + warranty. Insurance gave me $5k, and my parents offered $5k if got a newish car. I put $4k down on my discovercard. I let them know I might do that, and they offered 0% apr for a year. My dad co-signed on the loan, I was 7teens, but his was higher.

The recent app on my Propel seems focused on this car loan for the denials, and fair enough. The first reason cites my $4000/$4500 use limit on discover. I have the ability to pay it down, transfer the balance, etc., but I'm currently paying it off at $400 a month. The uti is high on discover, but under 30% overall. If Wells would approve, I would pay it down or open a CD with them to show it's nbd. I have never carried a balance before this. I'm thinking this might also be the "not enough accounts paid as agreed" denial reason, as I am currently not paying in full? I have never missed a payment, and always paid in full prior to the car purchased. If 2/3 denials reasons are simply that balance, would they approve if I agreed to pay it down?

The other reason, too many credit accounts in the last three months, is probably including the car loan and FKFCU. I applied for FK in Nov 2018, but the approval process took a while. The card was finally opened in Dec 2018. When I applied for Propel recently, it was still within 3 months of that, by days. At this point it is now longer than 3 months. The car loan is a joint account with my dad, and his score is 800+. I dont know if explaining that would make them feel safer.

Prior to the last year I was not active. 1 Discover closed 2014-2016, 1 current discover from 2016, and a $16k student loan that technically shows since 2014, but had deferred payments for a while. I now have:

Citi DC (Sep 2018) $4600 >now $5600
Uber Visa (Oct 2018) $4500
Discover CLI (around then) > $4500
Ducks unlimited, US Cash+, and WF Propel denials (Oct 2018)
FKFCU platinum visa (Nov-Dec 2018) $4000
$18k car loan at 2.99% (Jan 2019)

One baddie removed from major CRAs many months ago, after collections agreed. Maybe a smaller agency like Sage is hurting me? Currently 687 EX, TU and EQ low 700s. Dropped a stupid amount of points on EX for being credit seeking after the latest wells app, but they cant see that XD. 6+ months ago I was 50 points higher, but my profile was too skinny. Sorry if I got a little winded there .

Re: WF Propel denial. Recon worth it?

AverageJoesCredit — Mon, 25 Mar 2019 22:26:37 GMT

I believe your profile is still too thin or new to overturn this. I would garden a year, continue to make ontime payments and by this time next year youll have a much better chance

Re: WF Propel denial. Recon worth it?

CreditInspired — Mon, 25 Mar 2019 23:09:40 GMT

@mumbogray wrote:
Hey all,

I have been trying to get in with Wells for a few months. Recently denied for the Propel. I'm wondering if its worth the Recon, considering the dp's I have. I have had a very active year, but their cited reasons for denial are a little iffy this time.

They pulled EX at 703. Reasons for denial are:
Amount owed on bank card with the highest balance is too high relative to the credit limit.
Too many credit accounts opened in the last three months (We look at how muvh new credit you may be taking on).
Not enough accounts paid as agreed on your credit file (We look for a history of on-time payments).
As part of the EX denial letter, it also lists key factors negatively affecting my credit score:
Length of time accounts have been established
Proportion of balances to credit limits too high on revolving accounts
Length of time revolving accounts have been estalished
Too many inquiries in the last twelve months
So if the denial reasons are the only issue, I think my chances could be high. If they will then go ahead and cite one of those other bullets, I might as well not bother.

When I originally applied in Oct 2018, I was denied, tried recon twice, and still denied. At the time, I believe they pulled EX in the 7teens. I don't have my letter, but I was basically denied for a thin profile, too many recent accounts, and too many inqs. I was on a spree at the time, mentioned below. I opened a checking/savings account with them in Dec 2018, and have been using it with DD and to pay some bills. Also got a sub lol. I had an unexpected but necessary car purchase in Jan. It was within my means 18K + tax + warranty. Insurance gave me $5k, and my parents offered $5k if got a newish car. I put $4k down on my discovercard. I let them know I might do that, and they offered 0% apr for a year. My dad co-signed on the loan, I was 7teens, but his was higher.

The recent app on my Propel seems focused on this car loan for the denials, and fair enough. The first reason cites my $4000/$4500 use limit on discover. I have the ability to pay it down, transfer the balance, etc., but I'm currently paying it off at $400 a month. The uti is high on discover, but under 30% overall. If Wells would approve, I would pay it down or open a CD with them to show it's nbd. I have never carried a balance before this. I'm thinking this might also be the "not enough accounts paid as agreed" denial reason, as I am currently not paying in full? I have never missed a payment, and always paid in full prior to the car purchased. If 2/3 denials reasons are simply that balance, would they approve if I agreed to pay it down?

The other reason, too many credit accounts in the last three months, is probably including the car loan and FKFCU. I applied for FK in Nov 2018, but the approval process took a while. The card was finally opened in Dec 2018. When I applied for Propel recently, it was still within 3 months of that, by days. At this point it is now longer than 3 months. The car loan is a joint account with my dad, and his score is 800+. I dont know if explaining that would make them feel safer.

Prior to the last year I was not active. 1 Discover closed 2014-2016, 1 current discover from 2016, and a $16k student loan that technically shows since 2014, but had deferred payments for a while. I now have:
Citi DC (Sep 2018) $4600 >now $5600
Uber Visa (Oct 2018) $4500
Discover CLI (around then) > $4500
Ducks unlimited, US Cash+, and WF Propel denials (Oct 2018)
FKFCU platinum visa (Nov-Dec 2018) $4000
$18k car loan at 2.99% (Jan 2019)
One baddie removed from major CRAs many months ago, after collections agreed. Maybe a smaller agency like Sage is hurting me? Currently 687 EX, TU and EQ low 700s. Dropped a stupid amount of points on EX for being credit seeking after the latest wells app, but they cant see that XD. 6+ months ago I was 50 points higher, but my profile was too skinny. Sorry if I got a little winded there .

First a question. Why are you continuously applying for credit? IMHO, it’s time to garden and let your AoYA reach a year.

Second, I think you should heed WF reasons for denial. And they’re not iffy! You have opened 5 CCs and a car loan since September. Discover is almost maxed out. That’s a lot. You may already be perceived as desperately seeking credit. This is not a good look.

I don’t think you would be successful at a recon for my reasons stated above and WFs reasons.

Re: WF Propel denial. Recon worth it?

mumbogray — Tue, 26 Mar 2019 00:33:25 GMT

@AverageJoesCredit wrote:
I believe your profile is still too thin or new to overturn this. I would garden a year, continue to make ontime payments and by this time next year youll have a much better chance

Thanks for the advice. I expect to be back in the mid 700s after gardening for a while. I was hoping to get the propel in this round, but I suppose I will have to wait.

@CreditInspired wrote:
First a question. Why are you continuously applying for credit? IMHO, it’s time to garden and let your AoYA reach a year.

Second, I think you should heed WF reasons for denial. And they’re not iffy! You have opened 5 CCs and a car loan since September. Discover is almost maxed out. That’s a lot. You may already be perceived as desperately seeking credit. This is not a good look.

I don’t think you would be successful at a recon for my reasons stated above and WFs reasons.

It is 3 new CCs since sept + auto loan. Discover is almost max with $4000, but I could pay it now if that would approve me. And I'm still under 30% uti overall, including my daily spend across all cards. AAoA is 1y10mo. I agree if they cited the new accounts and inquiries, I wouldn't bother asking about recon. But they really seemed to focus on the discover balance. And since I would be willing to pay it off, I wanted to know if it would go anywhere. They didn't mention the recent 3-6mo accounts, just the new car loan and discover balance.

Not continuously applying for random credit though. I had a 750 Fico and a slim profile, and wanted to maximize my spend categories. 4% dining, 5% gas, 2% anything are good cards to have. All I'm doing is moving daily spend to cards that maximize categories I want for the long term. Every card I applied for was because it had a category I could use. I want in with Wells for this. Propel + Visa sig is a nice combo for no AF travel. However I do not want to be perceived as credit seeking. Is this something that a creditor holds onto, or just a temporary hiccup? AKA are they more likely to deny me, after previously denying me?

Experian did knock me for credit seeking after the latest denial. I have 4-6 inqs on each CRA, experian the most. 4 new accounts, 700ish FICO. I'm ready to garden for a year or two, but wanted the Propel sooner than later.

Re: WF Propel denial. Recon worth it?

FinStar — Tue, 26 Mar 2019 03:36:14 GMT

You can try the reconsideration approach OP, but as others have mentioned, it will likely be a challenge to overcome the primary reasons for declining the application. Exercising a PIF on Discover won't really provide the relief they're looking for at this point since it is a combination of multiple factors.

Re: WF Propel denial. Recon worth it?

mumbogray — Tue, 26 Mar 2019 04:09:42 GMT

@FinStar wrote:
You can try the reconsideration approach OP, but as others have mentioned, it will likely be a challenge to overcome the primary reasons for declining the application. Exercising a PIF on Discover won't really provide the relief they're looking for at this point since it is a combination of multiple factors.

Thanks, I remember they were not too friendly about recon last time either. Looks like it'll take me a little longer to get in with them.

Will they keep record of my previous denails/recon requests, even if I wait 2 years for the inq to drop? I suppose next time I will try in person as well.. couldn't hurt my chances.

Re: WF Propel denial. Recon worth it?

FinStar — Tue, 26 Mar 2019 04:24:12 GMT

@mumbogray wrote:
@FinStar wrote:
You can try the reconsideration approach OP, but as others have mentioned, it will likely be a challenge to overcome the primary reasons for declining the application. Exercising a PIF on Discover won't really provide the relief they're looking for at this point since it is a combination of multiple factors.
Thanks, I remember they were not too friendly about recon last time either. Looks like it'll take me a little longer to get in with them.

Will they keep record of my previous denails/recon requests, even if I wait 2 years for the inq to drop? I suppose next time I will try in person as well.. couldn't hurt my chances.

Some lenders will keep system notes (applications-wise) for up to 90-days. So, as far as your previous denial outcome or reconsideration efforts, you should be fine. And, there are instances in which you can also get lucky and reach a helpful analyst who would be willing to assist. It doesn't hurt to try either. Totally up to you.

Re: WF Propel denial. Recon worth it?

kdm31091 — Tue, 26 Mar 2019 10:30:35 GMT

Given the multiple recent accounts I would probably just let this one go and give it a good six months in the garden. At that point you'll be a better position to potentially be approved without having to recon anything. I don't think recon would be of much help here anyway.

Re: WF Propel denial. Recon worth it?

McNugget — Tue, 26 Mar 2019 21:20:35 GMT

@mumbogray wrote:
Hey all,

I have been trying to get in with Wells for a few months. Recently denied for the Propel. I'm wondering if its worth the Recon, considering the dp's I have. I have had a very active year, but their cited reasons for denial are a little iffy this time.

They pulled EX at 703. Reasons for denial are:
Amount owed on bank card with the highest balance is too high relative to the credit limit.
Too many credit accounts opened in the last three months (We look at how muvh new credit you may be taking on).
Not enough accounts paid as agreed on your credit file (We look for a history of on-time payments).
As part of the EX denial letter, it also lists key factors negatively affecting my credit score:
Length of time accounts have been established
Proportion of balances to credit limits too high on revolving accounts
Length of time revolving accounts have been estalished
Too many inquiries in the last twelve months
So if the denial reasons are the only issue, I think my chances could be high. If they will then go ahead and cite one of those other bullets, I might as well not bother.

Those are some pretty big denial issues; nothing close to being iffy. I'd garden and pay down some of the utilization. Your score seems high for somebody who has those reasons listed on their report; I'd almost expect your score to drop. I would not try to recon at this point.

Re: WF Propel denial. Recon worth it?

Anonymous — Tue, 26 Mar 2019 19:44:11 GMT

I agree with the above responses.. and that UTL is definitely not doing you any favors!

Re: WF Propel denial. Recon worth it?

mumbogray — Wed, 27 Mar 2019 04:51:31 GMT

@McNugget wrote:

Those are some pretty big denial issues; nothing close to being iffy. I'd garden and pay down some of the utilization. Your score seems high for somebody who has those reasons listed on their report; I'd almost expect your score to drop. I would not try to recon at this point.

I disagree. As mentioned, Wells denied for the discover balance uti for 2/3 reasons. I was just asking if I pay it off now, if recon would find this acceptable enough to grant a sl, as that is "66%" of the reason denied. Consensus seems to still be no. In that case I will continue paying off the balance over the next 10 months before the 0APR runs out, or 6ish months if I reapply sooner.

They other denial reason was too many accounts in the last 3 months. This is only 1 joint account, I was hoping I could overcome this as well. If they actually denied for inquiries or mentioned the 2018 accounts, I wouldn't have asked! It was unclear to me if the 2018 accounts still bothered them. They mentioned them in the first app, but it was not brought up this time; aside from in my FICO score's factors. Granted my score was on the low side for them.

feel free to share any other DPs. However as far as my app, my questions have been answered! Thanks again guys.