topic Re: Amex request for tax transcripts in Credit Card Applications

Personal Amex through corporate card, part 2

KJinNC — Sun, 30 Jun 2019 13:45:37 GMT

Re: Personal Amex through corporate card, part 2

Anonymous — Mon, 17 Jun 2019 16:44:30 GMT

So, they did what I said they would do w/ the 2nd app appearing as Cancelled.

Here's the next step. Call them and dig into it with a rep to see if it's something that can be turned into an approval. Cancelled apps aren't a denial. They simply mean they're in a manual review of sorts usually.

Re: Personal Amex through corporate card, part 2

KJinNC — Mon, 17 Jun 2019 16:53:22 GMT

Thanks - should I just call the number on the back of my corporate card, or is there a better number to call?

Re: Personal Amex through corporate card, part 2

Anonymous — Mon, 17 Jun 2019 16:58:05 GMT

I think the corp # might get you further. I don't know of a specific # that's used for recon w/ Amex that's more beneficial than any other. Maybe hop on chat through your corp login and ask them for the best number or start with the chat agent (usually not able to recon on the personal side).

Re: Personal Amex through corporate card, part 2

Namaste7 — Mon, 17 Jun 2019 17:46:45 GMT

@KJinNC wrote:
[...] But, I have a corporate Amex card, and there is a rumor that if you apply via the "welcome offers" list you see when you log into your corporate account that you are guaranteed approval.

[...]

Greetings OP. I think expection of a guaranteed approval is strong position to take. Even with companies that participate in AMEX's Corporate Advantage Program (aka CAP), approvals are not fully guanrateed and may include stipulations that impact the approval success rate (e.g., previously unpaid debts with AMEX, current or recent BK, FICO score is below internal threshold etc...).

Note: The CAP program is targeted to large corporations that use the AMEX Corporate program. Given the relationship with the corporation, AMEX will offer certain cards (Platinum, Gold, and BCP) with an annual fee offset credit and possibly less stringent approval requirements.

Re: Personal Amex through corporate card, part 2

AverageJoesCredit — Mon, 17 Jun 2019 17:48:42 GMT

Im stunned your oldest account is 2 months old and you were able to open 8 accounts in 2 months. Nothing is ever guaranteed with Amex and even if you are just shooting for data points, your behavior might rub them wrong and put you on some kind of list. Not saying it exists or would happen, but, in todays credit environment where data is king i wouldnt be suprised to see excessive credit seeking doesnt factor somewhere in their databases. Good luck though

Re: Personal Amex through corporate card, part 2

KJinNC — Mon, 17 Jun 2019 18:01:32 GMT

Namaste: Thanks - none of those factors would apply (I have not burned Amex, I have never declared bankruptcy etc), aside from possibly falling below a scoring threshhold, as described.

I don't see "guaranteed offer" or "pre-qualified offer" etc, I just see "welcome offer".

The card I want is the Amex Gold. My understanding is that the underwriting is the same or very similar for green/gold/platinum. Gold fits my needs the best.

There is nothing else I intend to apply for in the next 6-12 months, other than secured cards graduating and maybe some CLIs for the cards in my signature. Thanks!

Re: Personal Amex through corporate card, part 2

KJinNC — Tue, 18 Jun 2019 00:11:47 GMT

AverageJoe: Well, see my signature - those are the accounts. The only one that could be considered a bit difficult to qualify for is the car loan, because it's a good rate. For that, I can thank my mom for creating a Coastal Federal Credit Union account for me back when Mark Wahlberg was Markie Mark. Being a member for 32 years 2 months paid off there.

I think a human looking at my activity would probably figure out what's going on. Not like I am going to open a bunch of secured cards so I can run up charges and then declare bankruptcy, or, like I am going to open secured cards so I can keep the lights on. But for computer scoring, they are scary. In any case, the thing I am testing is "does having a corporate Amex all but guarantee getting a personal Amex?" If I need to be able to qualify for the card without the corporate card factor, that's not much of a test of the corporate card factor.

Re: Personal Amex through corporate card, part 2

Namaste7 — Mon, 17 Jun 2019 18:21:55 GMT

@KJinNC wrote:
Namaste: Thanks - none of those factors would apply (I have not burned Amex, I have never declared bankruptcy etc), aside from possibly falling below a scoring threshhold, as described.

Advice - Garden for 12 months (but at least 6 months) to give time for your Experian score to generate and your profile reflects several months of on-time payment history. AMEX is an Experian puller and without a score, you could end up with a denial. Within a year, you'll have a stronger profile and you may be able to close any secured, high-interest rate or AF cards.

I doubt that the CAP program is going anywhere. It's an easy way to entice AMEX Corporate cardholders to transition their personal spend to AMEX--that's a win for AMEX.

Re: Personal Amex through corporate card, part 2

KJinNC — Mon, 17 Jun 2019 18:56:27 GMT

Thanks - in 6-12 months, I think I'd qualify for the card without any benefit of the corporate card thing. The reason I've applied now is that if the corporate card thing works and I get approved, it would be a June 2019 account age, nearly the same as my other stuff, so it'll all age together. If it doesn't work (and so far, it hasn't, and I am skeptical it will), it doesn't matter, because I am not worried about inquiries or account age at this point as they are already far-gone for the near future. I am gardening other than this Amex situation, and if I give up on that, I'll be just gardening entirely. Meantime, posting here for info for others about whether the corporate card thing is a major factor.

Re: Personal Amex through corporate card, part 2

NRB525 — Mon, 17 Jun 2019 19:09:25 GMT

OP did you get any HP notice for either of these apps?

Re: Personal Amex through corporate card, part 2

KJinNC — Mon, 17 Jun 2019 19:27:22 GMT

Yes, for the first one that was denied.

Re: Personal Amex through corporate card, part 2

AverageJoesCredit — Mon, 17 Jun 2019 20:17:07 GMT

I may be ignorant on this but i just dont see having a Corporate Amex card translating to being able to get a personal Amex just because as there seems to be a world of difference in the two, ie different underwriting, one's business that might have people with it who cant qualify for a personsl one maybe because their personal credit is a mess but because its under corporate are given access , while other is more based on an indivuals credit worthiness. Data points for someone is always good, so more power to ya

Re: Personal Amex through corporate card, part 2

Anonymous — Mon, 17 Jun 2019 20:22:19 GMT

@AverageJoesCredit wrote:
I may be ignorant on this but i just dont see having a Corporate Amex card translating to being able to get a personal Amex just because as there seems to be a world of difference in the two, ie different underwriting, one's business that might have people with it who cant qualify for a personsl one maybe because their personal credit is a mess but because its under corporate are given access , while other is more based on an indivuals credit worthiness. Data points for someone is always good, so more power to ya

Think of it this way. If someone has a corp card then Amex basically knows the income of the person through the employer. It's like a reverse 4506-T POI request when coming at Amex from the Personal side.

Now, when you leave the employer you forfeit the AF Credit that's part of the program but, you keep the card.

Re: Personal Amex through corporate card, part 2

KJinNC — Tue, 18 Jun 2019 13:54:44 GMT

I did not just decide "hey, I have a corporate Amex, I bet they will give me a personal Amex for that reason," that is a widely held theory. This thread is called "part 2" because somebody else created a thread based on the same concept. I am interested in helping prove or disprove it. I would prefer, for my own sake, if it's true, but if it's not true, that ok also. It's just good info for the future.

As for reasons why Amex would do it (if indeed they do): keep corporate customers happy? "I know where you work" in case of defaults? Assumption that a corporation issuing you a card means that some large entity trusts you? Bug in the system where it treats you as an existing customer for purposes of applications? Don't know, can only speculate, if it's true at all.

But again: I am in an unusual situation in which my account age is basically non-existent, and I am buried in hard inquiries, and have nothing I want to apply for until next year aside from this particular card, and I have no accounts that are really susceptible to adverse actions, so applying won't hurt anything even if the theory is wrong.

Re: Personal Amex through corporate card, part 2

coldfusion — Mon, 17 Jun 2019 21:34:56 GMT

Aren't the Exclusive Personal Card Offers via CAP explicitly phrased as offers to apply? That's my recollection.

Re: Personal Amex through corporate card, part 2

KJinNC — Mon, 17 Jun 2019 21:55:07 GMT

Yes, they are not described as any sort of guarantee, preapproval, or prequalification. They are simply labeled "welcome offer" with an Apply button.

But, multiple people have reported that anecdotally, it's a guaranteed or virtually guaranteed approval. That is what I am testing. As an example, someone said that his friend's daughter had a completely blank credit profile, but had her choice of Amex cards as soon as she got her corporate card, picked one, and was approved. I don't remember which, BCE or BCP I think, but she could have chosen Gold if she'd wanted. However, that is not first-hand info from a board member, and something may have been lost in translation. My profile represents someone who would not normally be approved for an Amex, but, not someone who would scare away even bottom-feeding lenders. If it's a virtually guaranteed approval, that would most likely mean I'd be approved, which would mean I'd get my card, and the community would get a strong data point.

The OP of the "part 1" version of this thread got approved, though his profile is better than mine, and I think he might have been approved with no corporate card brownie points (not sure).

If anyone wondering "where does this idea come from?" or "why is he doing this?" could read the prior posts first, that would be helpful so the thread isn't cluttered with multiple similar explanations. Thanks!

Re: Personal Amex through corporate card, part 2

KJinNC — Mon, 17 Jun 2019 23:26:30 GMT

I called Amex. The gentleman I spoke with didn't have any useful info for me. He gave me this number to call tomorrow: 888-800-7325. Per him, it is some kind of corporate Amex group that is open pretty much business hours. Will try tomorrow and post if they tell me anything interesting.

Re: Personal Amex through corporate card, part 2

NRB525 — Mon, 17 Jun 2019 23:49:04 GMT

AJC, this is definitely a Thing. AMEX figures the employer thinks enough of the employee to hire them and issue a travel card. AMEX, with their spend tracking algorithm is willing to take a chance on a potential long term customer who comes with references. And, to entice the employee, give them ( me ) a discount on the AF.

Now, from this OP experience there may be a combination needed, employer reference and credit bureau, but that will be clarified when OP calls for more info.

Re: Personal Amex through corporate card, part 2

tbque — Tue, 18 Jun 2019 13:45:47 GMT

Wishing the OP of the second thread much luck!