topic Re: AMEX BCP Denied in Credit Card Applications

[Update Message#19] -AMEX BCP Denied

CreditPacMan — Fri, 25 Mar 2022 03:22:22 GMT

Well, it has been six months since the last AMEX account I opened so I decided to take the plunge and apply for the BCP since I have been looking for a good rewards card for groceries and streaming services.

I got the pop-up that I was not eligible for the SUB , and after submitting the application I was instantly denied.

FICO score is 722 and UTI is 5%.

No HP so far but I noticed that soft pulled me 3 days ago.

Weird is that the application status page still shows "In Progress".

Re: AMEX BCP Denied

DONZI — Sat, 19 Mar 2022 08:55:10 GMT

Was that a pre-qualified variety of application?

I've not read of any DP about a HP ack pop-up related to time since last approval, etc.

Re: AMEX BCP Denied

CreditPacMan — Sat, 19 Mar 2022 08:59:18 GMT

@DONZI wrote:
Was that a pre-qualified variety of application?

I've not read of any DP about a HP ack pop-up related to time since last approval, etc.

Sorry it was a typo .. I meant the pop up was about the SUB

Re: AMEX BCP Denied

DONZI — Sat, 19 Mar 2022 18:26:17 GMT

Ah. I was first going to assume you were referring to the no bonus pop-up but then figured the pop-up mentioned was about a HP warning, assuming there is one.

Was that a cold app or was it an optimistic pre-qualified style application?

I've been thinking about an additional amex card but it'd be following pretty new approval with them.. ~3 months ago. Don't want to push my luck with them.

Had you closed or PC something with them recently? IIRC, I'd not read about any subs withheld simply due to proximity to the last approval.

Re: AMEX BCP Denied

FinStar — Sat, 19 Mar 2022 13:10:31 GMT

@CreditPacMan wrote:
Well, it has been six months since the last AMEX account I opened so I decided to take the plunge and apply for the BCP since I have been looking for a good rewards card for groceries and streaming services.

I got the pop-up that I was not eligible for the SUB , and after submitting the application I was instantly denied.

FICO score is 722 and UTI is 5%.

No HP so far but I noticed that soft pulled me 3 days ago.

Weird is that the application status page still shows "In Progress".

The application status page sometimes takes a while to sync up with the results.

I recall you opened a couple AmEx CCs back in October and one of them you were denied the SUB for previously cited reasons 🤔 So, I'm curious to know why this particular BCP application was denied.

https://ficoforums.myfico.com/t5/Credit-Cards/AMEX-Bonvoy-SUB-UPDATE-Message-7/m-p/6416397#M1793791

Re: AMEX BCP Denied

CreditPacMan — Sat, 19 Mar 2022 18:17:23 GMT

I called the application status line and for some reason after entering my details the system said it could not locate my application!

EDIT: I just called to ask about the reasons. They used a month old report (nothing really has changed since) with a score of 732. They mentioned a number of reasons one was the length of time with American Express which was confusing to me since I have been on and off with them since 2012.

So I requested the application be sent for a manual review. Fingers crossed.

1@FinStar wrote:
@CreditPacMan wrote:
Well, it has been six months since the last AMEX account I opened so I decided to take the plunge and apply for the BCP since I have been looking for a good rewards card for groceries and streaming services.

I got the pop-up that I was not eligible for the SUB , and after submitting the application I was instantly denied.

FICO score is 722 and UTI is 5%.

No HP so far but I noticed that soft pulled me 3 days ago.

Weird is that the application status page still shows "In Progress".

The application status page sometimes takes a while to sync up with the results.

I recall you opened a couple AmEx CCs back in October and one of them you were denied the SUB for previously cited reasons 🤔 So, I'm curious to know why this particular BCP application was denied.

https://ficoforums.myfico.com/t5/Credit-Cards/AMEX-Bonvoy-SUB-UPDATE-Message-7/m-p/6416397#M1793791

Re: AMEX BCP Denied

dunn2500 — Wed, 23 Mar 2022 06:40:13 GMT

they pre qualified me for hilton honors surpass card, and i got the ''welcome offer not offered do you still want to proceed with app''

@DONZI wrote:
Ah. I was first going to assume you were referring to the no bonus pop-up but then figured the pop-up mentioned was about a HP warning, assuming there is one.

Was that a cold app or was it an optimistic pre-qualified style application?

I've been thinking about an additional amex card but it'd be following pretty new approval with them.. ~3 months ago. Don't want to push my luck with them.

Had you closed or PC something with them recently? IIRC, I'd not read about any subs withheld simply due to proximity to the last approval.

....i declined offer but what does that mean?.......you will be approved with no welcome offer or just declined?.....i have 2 cards with them in good standing

Re: AMEX BCP Denied

DONZI — Wed, 23 Mar 2022 08:05:49 GMT

@dunn2500

If you login to the amex website and check for pre-qualified card offers (any/all of cards may be pre-qualified, not just the 'featured' ones shown) then select "Apply" for any of them, the wording is different between pre-approved and not.

It'll show:

"<your first name>, you are pre-approved!

Get a decision in as little as 30 seconds."

..or something different...along the lines of 'Expand your relationship..' <--- this is more questionable but can be approval, review, denied, etc.

When the 'no bonus' pop-up occurs I don't know, but I expect regardless of when, there will still be visible the above pre-approval (or not) greeting as described above.

Whether you accept or decline to "Apply & Submit" because they state no bonus will be offered, that AFAIK does not negate the current pre-approval status.

Hence, applying later for the card (still showing as pre-approved) and accepting that no bonus will be offered, there is (still) normally a good chance of success getting the card.

Re: AMEX BCP Denied

dunn2500 — Wed, 23 Mar 2022 09:09:06 GMT

@DONZI wrote:
@dunn2500
If you login to the amex website and check for pre-qualified card offers (any/all of cards may be pre-qualified, not just the 'featured' ones shown) then select "Apply" for any of them, the wording is different between pre-approved and not.

It'll show:
"<your first name>, you are pre-approved!
Get a decision in as little as 30 seconds."

..or something different...along the lines of 'Expand your relationship..' <--- this is more questionable but can be approval, review, denied, etc.

When the 'no bonus' pop-up occurs I don't know, but I expect regardless of when, there will still be visible the above pre-approval (or not) greeting as described above.

Whether you accept or decline to "Apply & Submit" because they state no bonus will be offered, that AFAIK does not negate the current pre-approval status.

Hence, applying later for the card (still showing as pre-approved) and accepting that no bonus will be offered, there is (still) normally a good chance of success getting the card.

yeah i am sorry, it says i am pre approved not pre qualified.....exactly as you described it has first name and get decision in as little as 30sec........and still says i am today but the welcome bonus is kind of why i wanted it along with benefits.....is it possible welcome offer will be offered at later date? or possible it will still offered on approval today?......am only 6 months in with AMEX......carry low balance and PIF

Re: AMEX BCP Denied

bigseegar — Wed, 23 Mar 2022 11:23:45 GMT

Did I see in addition post where you had this card before and got upset at your CL and Closed it and not really all that long ago? Also didn't you close other AmEx cards as well? If so I'd sure tend to think that was the reason you were denied the card again.

Re: AMEX BCP Denied

W261w261 — Wed, 23 Mar 2022 12:17:25 GMT

@bigseegar, you might have been remembering my experience. I apped the BCP, was approved at lower limit, closed the card immediately, changed my mind (discovered I could transfer CL from another card), reapplied, was denied, waited 2 or 3 weeks, saw I was pre-approved, apped again, and got the no-Sub pop-up. Hopped over to Navy, got the More Rewards with a better CL (was my 2nd card with them, Visa Sig was 1st), pondered my situation, decided to go for the Amex BC, got denied because of "too much recent activity in the Blue family." Whew! Thank goodness for SP's.

Re: AMEX BCP Denied

SouthernCredit — Wed, 23 Mar 2022 12:27:09 GMT

Opening numerous cards in a short period of time is, to someone like Amex, the behavior of a churner. That's a sure fire way to get on their radar and not be eligible for any SUBs. You were already approved for the card once, closed it, and tried to open it again along with your other cards that were recently opened. As long as you're using them responsibly, you should be eligible for the SUBs in the future. You're just going to need to take it slow.

Years ago, I got the BCE and ED within 12 months of each other (probably 9 months apart or so). A few months after getting the ED, I got the Gold (probably just over a year after getting the BCE). I got the SUB on each of these. Shortly thereafter, I had an unexpected trip and tried for the Delta Gold to get the SUB for the trip. Despite being preapproved, I got the no SUB pop up, and decided not to apply. That pop up is their friendly way to tell you to cool the jets. It took about a year for me to not get the no SUB pop up anymore, and I can now get their SUBs for anything again.

Re: AMEX BCP Denied

bigseegar — Wed, 23 Mar 2022 13:32:47 GMT

@W261w261 wrote:
@bigseegar, you might have been remembering my experience. I apped the BCP, was approved at lower limit, closed the card immediately, changed my mind (discovered I could transfer CL from another card), reapplied, was denied, waited 2 or 3 weeks, saw I was pre-approved, apped again, and got the no-Sub pop-up. Hopped over to Navy, got the More Rewards with a better CL (was my 2nd card with them, Visa Sig was 1st), pondered my situation, decided to go for the Amex BC, got denied because of "too much recent activity in the Blue family." Whew! Thank goodness for SP's.

@W261w261 Nah, it was the OP in this post

https://ficoforums.myfico.com/t5/Credit-Cards/AMEX-Bonvoy-SUB-UPDATE-Message-7/m-p/6416397#M1793791

Re: AMEX BCP Denied

CreditPacMan — Wed, 23 Mar 2022 17:14:37 GMT

@bigseegar Yes, I had this card in 2018. I am pretty sure you saw my other posts that at that time I started maxing out my cards so AMEX CLDed the limit which was already low (from $2k to $1.2k). In 2020 I closed the card.

I did not have other AMEX cards at the time.

I don't believe closing a card is a reason for denial. I mean after all they did approve me for a Delta card which I had in 2014 and closed it too. The app right now is in reconsideration. If they end up affirming their decision that's fine, I'll give it time to cool off and try next year.

Re: AMEX BCP Denied

CreditPacMan — Wed, 23 Mar 2022 17:18:30 GMT

The SUB is never my goal when applying for a CC, sure it's nice but I think of the overall use of the card in the long run. Unlike most people who open a card with a AF to get the SUB with the intention of closing the card or downgrading I find that unethical and do not engage in that type of action myself.

That being said, with AMEX I never ever received a SUB. My CLs for any card I opened with them between 2012-2018 was always stuck at a $1k CL which was not nearly enough to encourage me to spend to get a SUB.

The problem is that AMEX refuses to realize that. If they just take a look at my history they'll realize that I got no SUB ever!

@SouthernCredit wrote:
Opening numerous cards in a short period of time is, to someone like Amex, the behavior of a churner. That's a sure fire way to get on their radar and not be eligible for any SUBs. You were already approved for the card once, closed it, and tried to open it again along with your other cards that were recently opened. As long as you're using them responsibly, you should be eligible for the SUBs in the future. You're just going to need to take it slow.

Years ago, I got the BCE and ED within 12 months of each other (probably 9 months apart or so). A few months after getting the ED, I got the Gold (probably just over a year after getting the BCE). I got the SUB on each of these. Shortly thereafter, I had an unexpected trip and tried for the Delta Gold to get the SUB for the trip. Despite being preapproved, I got the no SUB pop up, and decided not to apply. That pop up is their friendly way to tell you to cool the jets. It took about a year for me to not get the no SUB pop up anymore, and I can now get their SUBs for anything again.

Re: AMEX BCP Denied

DONZI — Thu, 24 Mar 2022 10:53:46 GMT

@dunn2500 The welcome offer denial isn't just a random occurrence.

~~If what @bigseegar mentioned is the history then that probably explains the SUB denial.~~

If the card is important to you then go for it without the bonus. That would demonstrate to amex that you're not just chasing bonus and closing cards for game. Otherwise, no telling on when welcome offers will show back up. There is a lot of discussion here about that which might help you get an idea when to expect to see amex offer cash/point sign up incentives to you again.

I specify cash/point above because I don't know if they withhold other things like 1st year waived annual fee or 0% APR, etc perks also.

@CreditPacMansorry, got on a tangent didn't intend to promote hijacking of your thread.

Re: AMEX BCP Denied

SoCalGardener — Thu, 24 Mar 2022 17:07:06 GMT

@CreditPacMan wrote:
The SUB is never my goal when applying for a CC, sure it's nice but I think of the overall use of the card in the long run. Unlike most people who open a card with a AF to get the SUB with the intention of closing the card or downgrading I find that unethical and do not engage in that type of action myself.

Same here!!

I appreciate that. Thanks for posting.

Re: AMEX BCP Denied

dunn2500 — Thu, 24 Mar 2022 23:34:12 GMT

@DONZI wrote:
@dunn2500 The welcome offer denial isn't just a random occurrence.

~~If what @bigseegar mentioned is the history then that probably explains the SUB denial.~~

If the card is important to you then go for it without the bonus. That would demonstrate to amex that you're not just chasing bonus and closing cards for game. Otherwise, no telling on when welcome offers will show back up. There is a lot of discussion here about that which might help you get an idea when to expect to see amex offer cash/point sign up incentives to you again.

I specify cash/point above because I don't know if they withhold other things like 1st year waived annual fee or 0% APR, etc perks also.

@CreditPacMansorry, got on a tangent didn't intend to promote hijacking of your thread.

yeah am not a CC churner, and dont open and close cards.....dont really even have many cards but thanks for advice, just would have been nice is all

Re: AMEX BCP Denied

CreditPacMan — Fri, 25 Mar 2022 03:21:57 GMT

The status finally changed after a manual review and today it was officially declined.

The reasons provided on the letter are:

1- The length of time you have been a customer with American Express is too short.

2- The number of creditors who have reviewed your credit report.

3- The number of credit card accounts on which, in our estimation, you have not paid a majority of the balance in recent months as indicated in your credit report.

I am really scratching my head trying to understand #1 and #3. I have had numerous AMEX cards starting in 2012 all the way to 2020. For almost 15 months I did not have any AMEX cards and I just came back with them in October of 2021. Are they not counting my history with them in the past 10 years?

Also, my utilization is like 2% right now and out of 25 accounts I have open only 3 are reporting balances so not sure how to explain #3.

Re: AMEX BCP Denied

FinStar — Fri, 25 Mar 2022 04:19:35 GMT

@CreditPacMan wrote:
The status finally changed after a manual review and today it was officially declined.
The reasons provided on the letter are:

1- The length of time you have been a customer with American Express is too short.
2- The number of creditors who have reviewed your credit report.
3- The number of credit card accounts on which, in our estimation, you have not paid a majority of the balance in recent months as indicated in your credit report.

I am really scratching my head trying to understand #1 and #3. I have had numerous AMEX cards starting in 2012 all the way to 2020. For almost 15 months I did not have any AMEX cards and I just came back with them in October of 2021. Are they not counting my history with them in the past 10 years?

Also, my utilization is like 2% right now and out of 25 accounts I have open only 3 are reporting balances so not sure how to explain #3.

It appears the manual review team stuck with the original decision.

I realize you're attempting to rationalize your reasons, but they've made the call. Keep in mind, regardless of whether you were a previous AENB customer, reason #1 is evaluating your most recent experience with them. You closed your accounts with them in the past, this is a new slate (i.e. your closed accounts are not active to be evaluated). The third reason is using trended data, and recent months can include up to the last 12 months. Obviously, their AI/algorithms have the data, we do not.