topic Re: When should I apply for Vantage? in Credit Card Applications

When should I apply for Venture?

creditwraith — Sat, 29 Aug 2015 01:35:33 GMT

So from what I understand, Cap 1 is using Fico 04 for the approval. Just pulled my scores today:

TU Fico 8: 629, Fico 4: 682

EX Fico 8: 657, Fico 8 Bankcard: 682, Fico 3: 673 (No Fico 4 was provided)

EQ Fico 8: 625, Fico 5 Bankcard: 670 (No Fico 4 was provided)

I don't come back on the prequalified check with Cap 1. Just got their QS1 MC and was immediately approved for 3k SL when I apped about 45 days ago. It looks to me based on what I see above with the TU Fico 4 that my other two scores should be high enough to get it but who knows. BK 7 discharged over three years ago, and have had a Cap 1 Plat MC for over three years never late. In the last three years, I have had one 30 day late on a card in January of this year and thats it. I do have one open collection for 338 bucks from Feb of 2014.

Should I just wait for the prequalify to happen? Its hard to tell because I dont know what the Fico 4 scores are for EX and EQ. My gut tells me to wait until January and see if the scores come up some more and for the QS1 MC to get its auto increase. The highest cards I have are the QS1 for 3k and the Plat at $1250. Income is 120k. Current UTI is 9%, and I have been making 1500 dollar payments on the QS1 a couple times per month.

What do you guys think?

Re: When should I apply for Vantage?

Anonymous — Fri, 28 Aug 2015 20:27:07 GMT

Did you mean when should you apply for a Venture card? If so, I definitely recommend waiting awhile. If you can wait until January that would be best.

Re: When should I apply for Vantage?

taxi818 — Fri, 28 Aug 2015 20:50:24 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
Did you mean when should you apply for a Venture card? If so, I definitely recommend waiting awhile. If you can wait until January that would be best.

Agreed you should wait. scores just on the low side. and also hard for the fico 04 scores to change.compared to the fico 08. for some reason my equifax 04 score just won't change. not like the others. Ex and Tu. they change when my fico 8 changes. But Eq is the main score that Cap one looks at when you app. If you are not getting a Congratulations. Don't even waste your time. as the pre qual with cap one is pretty accurate. you could always ignore us and cold app. Stranger things have happened. But chance wise it would not be wise thing to do.

Re: When should I apply for Vantage?

creditwraith — Sat, 29 Aug 2015 01:39:31 GMT

Sorry for the typo guys, had been reading a Fico vs Fako article before posting, just fixed the subject line. Definitely not going to ignore the folks here, and really im just looking for a higher limit card by April. I don't want to waste three HPs if I'm not going to get it, im fine waiting for the prequal to give me the green light. One question about the Fico 04, I have the 3B ultimate and only got a Fico 04 from one of the CBs. How do I get the others?

Re: When should I apply for Vantage?

Anonymous — Sat, 29 Aug 2015 02:07:02 GMT

Sorry to ask this as a complete credit newbie, but how do you get your FICO 4 scores? Is the FICO that Capital One gives a FICO 4?

Just to clarify, Is the free monthly FICO score that Capital One provides to members a FICO 4?

Re: When should I apply for Vantage?

creditwraith — Sat, 29 Aug 2015 02:15:01 GMT

Welcome to the forums, and pull up a chair because all of this is fun. Basically, the score that Capital One is using for their credit tracker is based on Vantage 3 (I believe) and isn't the same as a true FICO score. And in fact, Capital One isn't using their own credit tracker score to measure you for approvals or credit line increases (CLI).

While FICO is the major scoring system used by the vast majority of lendors, they have different scoring models. The one that FICO likes to advertise the most is the FICO 08 score (which is named after 2008). But then there are other scores like FICO 08 Bankcard which is specifically geared towards credit cards (even though most credit card lendors don't use it.) There is also FICO 08 Auto for car loans.

Then you have FICO 04, which is of course based on the older 2004 metrics. So one of the tricks when you want to apply for a loan, credit card, etc is know which of these scoring models the lendor is going to be examining your TransUnion, Equifax and Experian report through. It might be an EQ 04, or an EX08, or a TU 08 Bankcard score.

In my case, when you apply with Cap 1, they pull all three and use the FICO 04 scoring model.

Hope that helps!

Re: When should I apply for Vantage?

Anonymous — Sat, 29 Aug 2015 02:26:01 GMT

This is where my brain freezes.

Capital One gives members a monthly FICO score based on Vantage, but doesn't even use Vantage when you apply for one of their cards???

I'm going to have a few beers now!

Re: When should I apply for Vantage?

taxi818 — Sat, 29 Aug 2015 03:48:56 GMT

@creditwraith wrote:
Sorry for the typo guys, had been reading a Fico vs Fako article before posting, just fixed the subject line. Definitely not going to ignore the folks here, and really im just looking for a higher limit card by April. I don't want to waste three HPs if I'm not going to get it, im fine waiting for the prequal to give me the green light. One question about the Fico 04, I have the 3B ultimate and only got a Fico 04 from one of the CBs. How do I get the others?

If you got the 3b Monitoring. you already got all 3. you just are not looking in the right place. When you log in. you will see the Dashboard showing all 3 scores like you see below in my signature. click on the indiviual score. like EQ . Transunion or Experian.

There it will show you all your scores.

starting with the most common used fico. which is fico 08. Working its way down.

then will show you common 04 score.

Then auto enhanced 08

auto enhanced 04

Bankcard 08

bankcard 04.

As stated above by another poster. in this case cap one really only uses 04 when it comes to the venture card. not all of their products. Quicksilver and others they are using 08. and also correct. on their credit tracker they are using vantage score and they also clearly state they don't use that when making credit decisions. that is just used for educational purposes to show you how your credit score is trending. Fico is truly the only method of finding true score.

Im also finding out once in a while other lenders will use fico 4 versions as well. recently asked for cli for Diners Club. they used 04 version and my credit unioin only uses 04 version. these lenders are slow to change. so now i will focus on lenders using the 08 version.

Re: When should I apply for Vantage?

Anonymous — Sat, 29 Aug 2015 04:03:15 GMT

taxi818,

That is great information shared!

Re: When should I apply for Vantage?

Anonymous — Sat, 29 Aug 2015 04:39:54 GMT

@taxi818 wrote:
As stated above by another poster. in this case cap one really only uses 04 when it comes to the venture card. not all of their products. Quicksilver and others they are using 08. and also correct. on their credit tracker they are using vantage score and they also clearly state they don't use that when making credit decisions. that is just used for educational purposes to show you how your credit score is trending. Fico is truly the only method of finding true score.
Im also finding out once in a while other lenders will use fico 4 versions as well. recently asked for cli for Diners Club. they used 04 version and my credit unioin only uses 04 version. these lenders are slow to change. so now i will focus on lenders using the 08 version.

Oh wow I wish I'd known that earlier today when I managed to get my approval for the Venture. I'm sure I only got it because my 04 are way above my 08 scores. Like 60 to 70 points across all three. No wonder I got shot down on the QS which I apped second. I should have apped the VentureOne as my second app with them today to make the three pulls count. I might have gotten a 3K VentureOne along with my Venture if they happen to use the 04's on that one as well.

Re: When should I apply for Vantage?

Anonymous — Sat, 29 Aug 2015 04:48:58 GMT

I read the post by taxi818 and tried to memorize but had to bookmark. A lot of good information.

Re: When should I apply for Vantage?

Anonymous — Sat, 29 Aug 2015 05:14:44 GMT

OP that's a tough call. You're probably close. I just apped the Venture today and was approved and anyone looking at my profile would never guess that I'd have gotten it. Did you pull your scores here? What you're looking for if you pulled the 3B is the All Industry Version (Used in Mortgage Lending) Score 5 for EQ, Score 4 for TU and Score 2 for EX. I was just past 700 for EQ and EX on those and 668 for TU. I kind of wish I'd waited but I know the next round in about a year I can probably pull a much higher SL and lower rate so I'll roll the one I just got today into that one after six months.

Re: When should I apply for Vantage?

taxi818 — Sat, 29 Aug 2015 11:52:17 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
@taxi818 wrote:
As stated above by another poster. in this case cap one really only uses 04 when it comes to the venture card. not all of their products. Quicksilver and others they are using 08. and also correct. on their credit tracker they are using vantage score and they also clearly state they don't use that when making credit decisions. that is just used for educational purposes to show you how your credit score is trending. Fico is truly the only method of finding true score.
Im also finding out once in a while other lenders will use fico 4 versions as well. recently asked for cli for Diners Club. they used 04 version and my credit unioin only uses 04 version. these lenders are slow to change. so now i will focus on lenders using the 08 version.
Oh wow I wish I'd known that earlier today when I managed to get my approval for the Venture. I'm sure I only got it because my 04 are way above my 08 scores. Like 60 to 70 points across all three. No wonder I got shot down on the QS which I apped second. I should have apped the VentureOne as my second app with them today to make the three pulls count. I might have gotten a 3K VentureOne along with my Venture if they happen to use the 04's on that one as well.

Well at least you got the venture. You can keep checking pre qual. I would say in 30 days. To prevent fraud alert. And then Go for venture one. I only know this. Because I have both cards. The venture. And a quicksilver. I could not understand at first why scores with venture were so low. But on quicksilver so high. Figured it out after some research. But the real factor on venture is your eq 04 score.

Re: When should I apply for Vantage?

creditwraith — Sat, 29 Aug 2015 14:19:45 GMT

Thanks TA, yeah on the 3B Ultimate I only get a TU04 score (682) but I don't get a Fico 04 for EQ and EX. EQ score 5 is 642 and EX score 2 is 654. I think that if I just sit tight for January, I may prequalify for it. My scores have been making leaps. I do have one baddie that show on all three that first reported in Feb14 for 338 and last reported Nov14. Not sure if I should pay it or what? Money isn't an issue but I don't know if it just renews the report date and haunts me longer or how that works. Any thoughts on that?

Thanks for the awesome info Taxi, really valuable. Not sure what's up with the Fico 04 vs Score 5 and score 2 but I definitely only get TU04. I do get the 19 scores though.

Re: When should I apply for Vantage?

Anonymous — Sat, 29 Aug 2015 15:50:15 GMT

If you will use the card and need it, I would say take the plunge based on my experience. I am one to believe that your existing Cap One history and income will support an approval. I applied for the Venture back in July, 6 weeks after chapter 13 discharge (Cap One was even IIB). My FICO 8 scores were TU 605, EX 610, EQ 645, but unsure on FICO 4. My income is 150K and I've had an active Cap One Platinum for 3 years with no dings. As you can see, our scenarios are fairly similar, but you have higher scores. I would hate to steer you wrong and get denied, but I see an approval with the information provided.

Re: When should I apply for Vantage?

taxi818 — Sat, 29 Aug 2015 14:51:39 GMT

@creditwraith wrote:
Thanks TA, yeah on the 3B Ultimate I only get a TU04 score (682) but I don't get a Fico 04 for EQ and EX. EQ score 5 is 642 and EX score 2 is 654. I think that if I just sit tight for January, I may prequalify for it. My scores have been making leaps. I do have one baddie that show on all three that first reported in Feb14 for 338 and last reported Nov14. Not sure if I should pay it or what? Money isn't an issue but I don't know if it just renews the report date and haunts me longer or how that works. Any thoughts on that?

Thanks for the awesome info Taxi, really valuable. Not sure what's up with the Fico 04 vs Score 5 and score 2 but I definitely only get TU04. I do get the 19 scores though.

Tlhats funny you do get fico 04 for eq.

Equifax beacon 5! Is your fico 04 score. There is no 5 score. This is actually you fico 04. Equifax just calls it a beacon score.

Order below.

Common score. equifax

Equifax 5. Previous. Used in mortgage. This is 04

equifax auto enhanced 08

equifax auto enhanced 5. This is 04

equifax bank card. 08

equifax bankcard 5. This is 04.

Looks like you just don't understand. That version 5 for Equifax are your 04 scores. This is what you see. Like all of us. And all of those are your 04 scores

Re: When should I apply for Vantage?

Anonymous — Sat, 29 Aug 2015 14:52:34 GMT

Congrats on getting the other new card. As with what others said, your scores are on the low end. Why not just enjoy what you just got and work on increasing your score?

There is no rush to get the Venture man. Get your scores higher. Period.

Your gut, your own intuition is telling you to not apply. Why not listen to your gut? If we would just slow the heck down, often we know exactly what the right thing to do is.

You don't need to apply even if you could get approved. 3 HPs with your current scores is not worth it. Reevalute it in January like you said. I encouarge applying when your scores are better, you have thought if the card is a match to your profile and you need it. The Venture card (which I dont have) is good if you get a high limit since it can help with your utilization % provided you don't rack up debt with it. But honestly it is not an impressive card for rewards. I only see the beenfit of a high SL.

Re: When should I apply for Vantage?

Anonymous — Sat, 29 Aug 2015 14:54:53 GMT

@creditwraith wrote:
Thanks TA, yeah on the 3B Ultimate I only get a TU04 score (682) but I don't get a Fico 04 for EQ and EX. EQ score 5 is 642 and EX score 2 is 654. I think that if I just sit tight for January, I may prequalify for it. My scores have been making leaps. I do have one baddie that show on all three that first reported in Feb14 for 338 and last reported Nov14. Not sure if I should pay it or what? Money isn't an issue but I don't know if it just renews the report date and haunts me longer or how that works. Any thoughts on that?

Thanks for the awesome info Taxi, really valuable. Not sure what's up with the Fico 04 vs Score 5 and score 2 but I definitely only get TU04. I do get the 19 scores though.

You'll want to look at the scores under "COMMONLY USED IN MORTGAGE LENDING" on your 3B report. For EQ it's FICO Score 5, EX FICO Score 2 and TU FICO Score 4. Your TU 04 score is probably good enough but I think Taxi said the most weight is put on the EQ 04 score which is your Score 5 and you said it's 642? In my case my 04 score average 50 to 60 points more than my 08 scores. The only thing I can come up with for as to why is that my last two baddies a CO auto loan and it's 60 and 90 day lates that's 6 years old and a 6 1/2 year old unpaid judgement (with Cap1 of all lenders) ding me much less on the 04 scores than they do on the 08 scores. What's the baddie from Feb 14? A CA for $338? Who's the CA reporting it? May want to look at the rebuilding section of the forum and see if it's one that would do a PFD if you pay it in full. A recent collection is almost certainly holding your scores back some. My TU score is lagging behind EQ and EX for me by 40+ points due to a LabCorp collection that showed up only on TU ealier this year. I'm working on getting it fixed as it was supposed to be fully covered by insurance.

Re: When should I apply for Vantage?

Anonymous — Sat, 29 Aug 2015 15:46:30 GMT

I saw the score that Cap1 provides for us jumped for my wife yesterday, so I helped her app. She had 2 cards on preapproval, the QS Visa and the Venture. Went ahead and went for both...$3k on QS and $10k on Venture. All she had in her name prior to that was a $500 Platinum card from them for a month.

Watch the prequal site. It is dead on.

Re: When should I apply for Vantage?

Anonymous — Sat, 29 Aug 2015 16:50:52 GMT

I have 3b monitoring now. Ive had it for over a year but for the life of me i cant see anything besides fico8 scores. Do i really have to upgrade to 3b ultimate just to see them? Or will they be available when i get my yearly reports? Sucks its like a punishment for being a customer for longer, whereas new customers get them all.

Or am i I just crazy and theyre somehow there? I dont see the page taxi mentioned above. Even on full desktop site, it brings me the my mobile dashboard it seems.

Sorry if i shouldve made a new post... Im asking here because i also want to app for venture. Thanks op