topic Re: Citibank Debit Card with EMV chip technology in Personal Finance

Citibank Debit Card with EMV chip technology

Anonymous — Sun, 18 Oct 2015 03:14:11 GMT

Does anyone know for sure what's happening with this? I'm currently waiting on what's supposed to be a chip card in the mail. Apparently some phone agents think they can actually ship out updated cards for you. But they are not always correct because when it comes in the mail it is just a regular old card.

However citibanks website at this point in time, since it is the October EMV compliance deadline, I would think they are ready to start shipping.

Citibank apowars to be updating cards in waves. I haven't seen anyone get one yet but I have no idea on how it's happening, even though I've seen advertisements and was notified on my statement that I'd be getting one soon.

Sigh. I just like chip cards they look really cool and I have to have that added security wherever I go.

Re: Citibank Debit Card with EMV chip technology

jsucool76 — Sun, 18 Oct 2015 06:03:12 GMT

I just spoke with a citigold representative who informed me the chip card rollout is sep 1 through mid november 2015, so everyone should have one by this time next month.

Re: Citibank Debit Card with EMV chip technology

Anonymous — Sun, 18 Oct 2015 12:46:09 GMT

Sounds good so far

Re: Citibank Debit Card with EMV chip technology

CreditCuriosity — Sun, 18 Oct 2015 13:29:11 GMT

Wow UsBank is actually ahead of citi on this one amazing! I received my UsBank debit card months ago. This one isn't expected along with my CU's debit card.

Re: Citibank Debit Card with EMV chip technology

Anonymous — Sun, 18 Oct 2015 14:52:49 GMT

The U.S. is trying its best. I've seen lots of progression towards this effort. Target has enabled it's EMV, which was really important to bring customers back into the stores for the holidays. After that breach customers are sure to use EMV, and I think the use is quite high.

I've seen CVS replace its equipment. And about 80 percent of the stores I shop at have the hardware in place already but the interface isn't quite ready to accept it yet.

We'll get there. I'll let you know what I get in the mail this week.

Re: Citibank Debit Card with EMV chip technology

tacpoly — Sun, 18 Oct 2015 16:17:24 GMT

My husband got his (citigold) a couple of weeks ago. I'm still waiting for mine (also citigold).

It looks much better than the previous card.

Re: Citibank Debit Card with EMV chip technology

Anonymous — Sun, 18 Oct 2015 16:28:51 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
The U.S. is trying its best. I've seen lots of progression towards this effort. Target has enabled it's EMV, which was really important to bring customers back into the stores for the holidays. After that breach customers are sure to use EMV, and I think the use is quite high.

I've seen CVS replace its equipment. And about 80 percent of the stores I shop at have the hardware in place already but the interface isn't quite ready to accept it yet.

We'll get there. I'll let you know what I get in the mail this week.

We could have done a lot better, IMO. Everyone had 3+ years to do this but waited until the last second to start. Small businesses have been getting the hardware but have not been trained on it at all. At best they figure out that the chip means to immediately insert but a lot of the time they're still swiping first and only inserting after the machine tells them to. And if you try to use NFC it will blow their minds, if they let you; small businesses don't even know their new equipment can accept Apple Pay and similar.

Basically most of the stores that made the deadline were the ones that got hit by breaches before, e.g. Target and Home Depot.

Re: Citibank Debit Card with EMV chip technology

Anonymous — Mon, 19 Oct 2015 01:21:55 GMT

Apple Pay really is the first line of defense in this whole thing.

EMV is hefty in requirements, preperation and cost. That's not the customer's problem however, customers who are concerned about their security are already going to know what to do, whether they're using Apple Pay or EMV.

The EMV rollout has been chaotic because that's the nature of the business. Businesses all have different initiatives. One might praise Walgreens for their Apple Pay acceptance, yet they don't take EMV. Then turn around and praise Target for their EMV acceptance, but they don't take Apple Pay.

Customers now more than ever have to make choices in their best interest. A cashier is not going to have those best interests at heart. They're waiting for you to slide and get out.

Re: Citibank Debit Card with EMV chip technology

Anonymous — Mon, 19 Oct 2015 02:47:44 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
Apple Pay really is the first line of defense in this whole thing.

EMV is hefty in requirements, preperation and cost. That's not the customer's problem however, customers who are concerned about their security are already going to know what to do, whether they're using Apple Pay or EMV.

The EMV rollout has been chaotic because that's the nature of the business. Businesses all have different initiatives. One might praise Walgreens for their Apple Pay acceptance, yet they don't take EMV. Then turn around and praise Target for their EMV acceptance, but they don't take Apple Pay.

Customers now more than ever have to make choices in their best interest. A cashier is not going to have those best interests at heart. They're waiting for you to slide and get out.

Without EMV though a lot of these places would never have bothered with Apple Pay/NFC. That's a large part of why the tap cards failed to catch on before.

BTW Walgreens accepts both now.

Re: Citibank Debit Card with EMV chip technology

jsucool76 — Mon, 19 Oct 2015 03:06:01 GMT

It was just the lack of infrastructure for NFC. The reason NFC has made a comeback with Apple Pay, Google Wallet (Now android pay) and samsung pay, and whoever pay is because on a cell phone there is actually security. You need to use a password or a fingerprint to activate the transfer. With NFC cards, the weakness of RFID skimming was identified pretty quickly, and banks had no way around it so they just started phasing out NFC cards.

Re: Citibank Debit Card with EMV chip technology

Anonymous — Mon, 19 Oct 2015 03:30:32 GMT

@jsucool76 wrote:
It was just the lack of infrastructure for NFC. The reason NFC has made a comeback with Apple Pay, Google Wallet (Now android pay) and samsung pay, and whoever pay is because on a cell phone there is actually security. You need to use a password or a fingerprint to activate the transfer. With NFC cards, the weakness of RFID skimming was identified pretty quickly, and banks had no way around it so they just started phasing out NFC cards.

If that were the case they would have been phased out in other countries as well. That's not actually the case, though--in fact, AmEx is offering it on the physical cards again in the US and elsewhere. Most other banks stopped offering them because no one used them. Mainly because tapping was possible almost nowhere. Chicken and egg problem.

Apple Pay has a chance because it got released about the same time that stores had to upgrade for EMV anyway. So instead of buying the absolute cheapest possible terminals without NFC (which they would have done if Apple wasn't in the picture), retailers are shelling out a bit more money for the NFC capable ones instead. Otherwise adopting NFC would have been a much tougher sell; it would also cost Apple a significant amount of money since they'd probably have to pay retailers to upgrade terminals again just a year or two after they upgraded for EMV. Instead, they just needed to ink marketing deals with a representative subset of major retailers and let Apple's track record and mindshare do the rest.

Re: Citibank Debit Card with EMV chip technology

Anonymous — Mon, 19 Oct 2015 04:16:05 GMT

Apple Pay worked with any existing terminals.

There was a lot more collaboration with Apple, banks and merchants to make Apple Pay the huge success that it is.

Meanwhile, people are actually still questioning the benefits of EMV chip technology.

The whole argument about EMV being so widely used around the world except for the U.S., .... ok. But guess what, well the U.S. is leading in mobile payments and that's beyond EMV. And Apple Pay is faster than EMV, a technology which ironically is slower than a magnetic swipe.

Personally, I just want the chip cards because they look cool.

In my opinion, this effort of chip cards will never be fully realized.

Re: Citibank Debit Card with EMV chip technology

Anonymous — Mon, 19 Oct 2015 06:00:10 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
Apple Pay worked with any existing terminals.

There was a lot more collaboration with Apple, banks and merchants to make Apple Pay the huge success that it is.

Meanwhile, people are actually still questioning the benefits of EMV chip technology.

The whole argument about EMV being so widely used around the world except for the U.S., .... ok. But guess what, well the U.S. is leading in mobile payments and that's beyond EMV. And Apple Pay is faster than EMV, a technology which ironically is slower than a magnetic swipe.

Personally, I just want the chip cards because they look cool.

In my opinion, this effort of chip cards will never be fully realized.

Yes, but there were a lot fewer of those pre-release. I don't have exact numbers but I think it was something like 5% of retailers or fewer who had tap-capable terminals.

Speaking of EMV, Apple Pay uses a variant of it designed for tap payments. The US also isn't actually the first to do mobile payments either--Japan's been doing it for a long while and banks in Australia and Canada have Android apps that let you tap to pay with their cards. It's just that the latter have much less of a need for it because they've been using EMV and tap-capable cards for quite a while now. Meanwhile, we're the world capital for credit card fraud whose cards were becoming less and less usable outside the country. The status quo wasn't sustainable but I don't know if mobile payments ends up being our ultimate solution; for all we know we could end up just getting used to chip and not bothering with anything else.

Re: Citibank Debit Card with EMV chip technology

Anonymous — Mon, 19 Oct 2015 11:25:47 GMT

Tap-capable cards in the U.S. was doomed from the moment it was discovered that the information can simply be scanned using a cheap device. After that, that technology was taken off the market and phased out. 6th months in and almost every bank has Apple Pay. You don't have to wait for a chip, sign, or input a pin with Apple Pay in most cases. Sounds to me like we already have our solution to fraud. People just have to use it.

Re: Citibank Debit Card with EMV chip technology

Anonymous — Mon, 19 Oct 2015 11:57:21 GMT

Apparently, Square has just barely started to issue readers for the new cards. This could be a big issue for them.

Re: Citibank Debit Card with EMV chip technology

Anonymous — Mon, 19 Oct 2015 14:12:51 GMT

Let me ask this, since the cards have a magnetic stripe anyway, are you protected just by having a chip card or can you still get victim to fraud just because you used the magnetic stripe and never the chip?

Re: Citibank Debit Card with EMV chip technology

darwin_wins — Mon, 19 Oct 2015 14:13:08 GMT

Last time I was at the branch and asked about new EMV cards they said they were sending it out to new customers but they have no idea when the existing customers may get it. I found it odd but then again when has anything not been odd with banks.

Re: Citibank Debit Card with EMV chip technology

Anonymous — Mon, 19 Oct 2015 14:28:52 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
Tap-capable cards in the U.S. was doomed from the moment it was discovered that the information can simply be scanned using a cheap device. After that, that technology was taken off the market and phased out. 6th months in and almost every bank has Apple Pay. You don't have to wait for a chip, sign, or input a pin with Apple Pay in most cases. Sounds to me like we already have our solution to fraud. People just have to use it.

That's no different from being able to read EMV cards with a cheap smartcard reader and some free software online. While the very first version of the tap cards did have security issues, just reading the newest ones won't be enough to clone cards.

As for Apple Pay, that's the big question. Usage is still very low one year out. You still have to sign and/or show the last four digits to the cashier. Even finding a place that takes it is still a problem (mainly because of the problems with the EMV rollout I said above). All of those have contributed to people thinking it's a failure already such that even if a lot of that's fixed quickly, people may not give it or similar technologies a second chance. It's very possible that people will just get used to EMV, not thinking that the technology that they had a hard time using before isn't so hard to use anymore.

Re: Citibank Debit Card with EMV chip technology

Anonymous — Mon, 19 Oct 2015 14:29:56 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
Let me ask this, since the cards have a magnetic stripe anyway, are you protected just by having a chip card or can you still get victim to fraud just because you used the magnetic stripe and never the chip?

We have zero liability either way. Just having the chip makes the retailer that hasn't upgraded yet liable for the fraud though.

Re: Citibank Debit Card with EMV chip technology

Anonymous — Mon, 19 Oct 2015 16:57:05 GMT

I trust that the breaches will come! What happens now should be interesting. I wonder who will be the first to go out of business.