topic Re: CSP - Store card count in 5/24 rule in Credit Cards

CSP - Store card count in 5/24 rule

Anonymous — Wed, 16 Sep 2015 09:57:14 GMT

Hi all,

With a fairly thin credit file, I thought it would be best to build my credit before jumping on the CSP. I have currently opened 4 caredit cards and 1 store card in the last 24 months, and am looking at adding a new card to the mix. Being on the fringe of eligibility under the 5/24 rule, has anyone had a CSR specifically mention whether store cards are included in the count? I have seen one or two conflicting stories out there, and wanted to gather some data before wasting an inquiry.

Thanks everyone!

Re: CSP - Store card count in 5/24 rule

kdm31091 — Wed, 16 Sep 2015 10:33:51 GMT

Pretty sure any new account counts

Re: CSP - Store card count in 5/24 rule

Sharingan — Wed, 16 Sep 2015 10:52:28 GMT

I don't really see why store cards would (or even should) be excluded from their underwriting criteria. Chase could just as easily deny for inquiries, and I doubt they would sift through them looking for which ones are for store cards. A new account is a new account, and there's very little distinction when it comes to credit/charge cards.

Re: CSP - Store card count in 5/24 rule

Anonymous — Wed, 16 Sep 2015 12:44:03 GMT

Yes, as somebody else has already said, "a new account is a new account".

Wouldn't be worth the risk anyway and the HP. Just wait it out until one falls off the 24 month mark.

Re: CSP - Store card count in 5/24 rule

Anonymous — Wed, 16 Sep 2015 16:30:11 GMT

This was just posted the day before. Of course it does. A new tradeline is a new tradeline regardless of how useful it actually is.

Re: CSP - Store card count in 5/24 rule

red259 — Wed, 16 Sep 2015 19:00:11 GMT

The posts here indicate they do, but there have been other people with store cards where they appeared not to count. Just a couple of days ago someone was talking about an approval even though the person had a ton of new store cards and I have seen other reports of that, so it does not seem to be an open and shut issue when it comes to store cards. Regardless you could hit a problem due just to having four new accounts,.

Re: CSP - Store card count in 5/24 rule

kdm31091 — Wed, 16 Sep 2015 19:03:02 GMT

@red259 wrote:
The posts here indicate they do, but there have been other people with store cards where they appeared not to count. Just a couple of days ago someone was talking about an approval even though the person had a ton of new store cards and I have seen other reports of that, so it does not seem to be an open and shut issue when it comes to store cards. Regardless you could hit a problem due just to having four new accounts,.

The point is that the only way to know for 100% sure is to just apply for a card. Since OP does have 4 accounts regardless, though, I think they should wait if the CSP is important to them.

Re: CSP - Store card count in 5/24 rule

red259 — Wed, 16 Sep 2015 19:14:06 GMT

@kdm31091 wrote:
@red259 wrote:
The posts here indicate they do, but there have been other people with store cards where they appeared not to count. Just a couple of days ago someone was talking about an approval even though the person had a ton of new store cards and I have seen other reports of that, so it does not seem to be an open and shut issue when it comes to store cards. Regardless you could hit a problem due just to having four new accounts,.
The point is that the only way to know for 100% sure is to just apply for a card. Since OP does have 4 accounts regardless, though, I think they should wait if the CSP is important to them.

Assuming their score is in good shape (and that they would be approved normally) I would just pull the trigger because you are right. The only way to know is by apping.lf they want the card the worst that can happen is a denial but then they would know. If they get denied for 5/24 and they really want the CSP they will have to wait around for the new accounts to age so the inq really won't be important, because it will age at the same time. If they don't want to wait around for the CSP well they know they can apply for other cards in the future. If they get the CSP with this app then they have their card and can app for whatever cards they want in the future without worrying about new accounts preventing them from getting the CSP. Point is if this is the card they want and they get denied they will have to wait around anyway. This is assuming that it will be at least six months before any of OPs accounts hits the two year mark. If it is under six months until then there would be a good argument for waiting. Rereading the original post and seeing the talk about having a thin file I am not sure how strong the approval chances are outside of the 5/24 rule. We would likely need more information to venture a guess at that (such as current cards, age of cards, credit lines).

Re: CSP - Store card count in 5/24 rule

DeeBee78 — Thu, 17 Sep 2015 01:20:24 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
Hi all,

With a fairly thin credit file, I thought it would be best to build my credit before jumping on the CSP. I have currently opened 4 caredit cards and 1 store card in the last 24 months, and am looking at adding a new card to the mix. Being on the fringe of eligibility under the 5/24 rule, has anyone had a CSR specifically mention whether store cards are included in the count? I have seen one or two conflicting stories out there, and wanted to gather some data before wasting an inquiry.

Thanks everyone!

For what it's worth, here's a thread from a couple of days ago where someone with 8 new accounts got the CSP. Four of those accounts were store cards:

http://ficoforums.myfico.com/t5/Credit-Card-Applications/Chase-CSP-Pre-qualified/m-p/4230543#M84807

Re: CSP - Store card count in 5/24 rule

Sharingan — Thu, 17 Sep 2015 02:10:28 GMT

The issue I see is that there are still a lot more stories of people being declined with more than 5 new of any kind of account than there are of those being approved with similar profiles (or being comprised of mostly store cards) after this criteria was established. A couple of anomalous anecdotal accounts to the contrary wouldn't inspire a lot of confidence for me. Would I still go on to apply or suggest to others that they should? Probably not. Are there those who ... slip through the cracks or satisfy a criteria not known to anyone here? Absolutely.

Re: CSP - Store card count in 5/24 rule

red259 — Thu, 17 Sep 2015 02:21:14 GMT

@Sharingan wrote:
The issue I see is that there are still a lot more stories of people being declined with more than 5 new of any kind of account than there are of those being approved with similar profiles (or being comprised of mostly store cards) after this criteria was established. A couple of anomalous anecdotal accounts to the contrary wouldn't inspire a lot of confidence for me. Would I still go on to apply or suggest to others that they should? Probably not. Are there those who ... slip through the cracks or satisfy a criteria not known to anyone here? Absolutely.

The number of people being denied by the 5/24 rule who have more than four non-store credit card accounts aren't really relevant here. The question is how many people are being denied under the 5/24 rule when they have four or less non-store cards and the only reason they would fall into the 5/24 category is because of store cards. I have seen people reporting in that situation of gettng approvals. I have not been seeing people saying that they were being denied solely for the 5/24 when store cards were being counted. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but I just don't recall seeing those posts. If anyone has been denied because their store cards counted please post your datapoints, since it would be helpful for people like OP to know.

Re: CSP - Store card count in 5/24 rule

Sharingan — Thu, 17 Sep 2015 04:00:50 GMT

@red259 wrote:
@Sharingan wrote:
The issue I see is that there are still a lot more stories of people being declined with more than 5 new of any kind of account than there are of those being approved with similar profiles (or being comprised of mostly store cards) after this criteria was established. A couple of anomalous anecdotal accounts to the contrary wouldn't inspire a lot of confidence for me. Would I still go on to apply or suggest to others that they should? Probably not. Are there those who ... slip through the cracks or satisfy a criteria not known to anyone here? Absolutely.
The number of people being denied by the 5/24 rule who have more than four non-store credit card accounts aren't really relevant here. The question is how many people are being denied under the 5/24 rule when they have four or less non-store cards and the only reason they would fall into the 5/24 category is because of store cards. I have seen people reporting in that situation of gettng approvals. I have not been seeing people saying that they were being denied solely for the 5/24 when store cards were being counted. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but I just don't recall seeing those posts. If anyone has been denied because their store cards counted please post your datapoints, since it would be helpful for people like OP to know.

Actually, that's not the question at all. The query was for an admission from a Chase CSR on this topic, which I doubt (and haven't heard of) any explicitly state that Chase treats store cards any differently. I purposely left the first sentence broad to include any and all because I don't believe that they make a distinction, as I eloquently stated in my first post in this thread. Therefore, it is relevant to the point I made earlier. Like I said, there are significantly more people being denied for this rule than there are of those being approved with similar numbers of new accounts. If there are any exceptions, I don't believe it's because they do not 'count store cards,' but rather some other criteria not known. Historically, I don't believe that Chase has ever distinguished between store and bank cards, so that is why I don't believe there's a difference now... along with believing that it sounds kind of ridiculous.

The point I'm getting at is that I would consider other possible justifications for deviating approvals, rather than looking at a store card. That's all I have for this topic.

Re: CSP - Store card count in 5/24 rule

red259 — Thu, 17 Sep 2015 04:19:23 GMT

@Sharingan wrote:
@red259 wrote:
@Sharingan wrote:
The issue I see is that there are still a lot more stories of people being declined with more than 5 new of any kind of account than there are of those being approved with similar profiles (or being comprised of mostly store cards) after this criteria was established. A couple of anomalous anecdotal accounts to the contrary wouldn't inspire a lot of confidence for me. Would I still go on to apply or suggest to others that they should? Probably not. Are there those who ... slip through the cracks or satisfy a criteria not known to anyone here? Absolutely.
The number of people being denied by the 5/24 rule who have more than four non-store credit card accounts aren't really relevant here. The question is how many people are being denied under the 5/24 rule when they have four or less non-store cards and the only reason they would fall into the 5/24 category is because of store cards. I have seen people reporting in that situation of gettng approvals. I have not been seeing people saying that they were being denied solely for the 5/24 when store cards were being counted. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but I just don't recall seeing those posts. If anyone has been denied because their store cards counted please post your datapoints, since it would be helpful for people like OP to know.
Actually, that's not the question at all. The query was for an admission from a Chase CSR on this topic, which I doubt (and haven't heard of) any explicitly state that Chase treats store cards any differently. I purposely left the first sentence broad to include any and all because I don't believe that they make a distinction, as I eloquently stated in my first post in this thread. Therefore, it is relevant to the point I made earlier. Like I said, there are significantly more people being denied for this rule than there are of those being approved with similar numbers of new accounts. If there are any exceptions, I don't believe it's because they do not 'count store cards,' but rather some other criteria not known. Historically, I don't believe that Chase has ever distinguished between store and bank cards, so that is why I don't believe there's a difference now... along with believing that it sounds kind of ridiculous.

The point I'm getting at is that I would consider other possible justifications for deviating approvals, rather than looking at a store card. That's all I have for this topic.

I agree there should be a consideration of possible other causes for the deviation by Chase. I do not think the possibility that chase would distinguish between store and regular credit cards sounds ridiculous. I'm not saying they are because I don't think there is enough data to say conclusively either way, but I could totally see a reasonable argument where chase decided they would not count store cards on the theory that a store credit card would not necessarily be a card competing for chase's spend, except maybe at that particular store. Also, if this policy is designed to minimize bonus chasers I can see a thought process where Chase decides that people apping for store cards are not doing so to chase bonuses, but are doing so because they want a discount at a particular store. Chase wants customers and even if they want to limit bonus chasers I don't think they would be as inclined to turn away people who don't have many regular credit cards but have a few low limit store cards.

Re: CSP - Store card count in 5/24 rule

kdm31091 — Thu, 17 Sep 2015 11:52:45 GMT

Point is: if you want it, apply. No one on here can tell you if you will be 100% declined. If you are declined, it's one or two wasted HPs, and you try again later. Not a big deal.

All we can do by are anecdotes and the OP has to make an informed decision about whether to apply or wait.

Re: CSP - Store card count in 5/24 rule

Open123 — Thu, 17 Sep 2015 12:56:03 GMT

Anyone have any indeas on whether or not Business TLs are counted in the 5 in 24? I'm assuming no, but wonder if anyone else has some insights.

Re: CSP - Store card count in 5/24 rule

Anonymous — Thu, 17 Sep 2015 13:01:11 GMT

The only TL that doesn't count is the Chase Co-Branded Cards (Southwest, Disney, Zappos, etc). Everything else counts.

Re: CSP - Store card count in 5/24 rule

red259 — Thu, 17 Sep 2015 18:48:20 GMT

@Open123 wrote:
Anyone have any indeas on whether or not Business TLs are counted in the 5 in 24? I'm assuming no, but wonder if anyone else has some insights.

Do you mean can you get a business card even if you have more than four in 24? If so, the answer seems to be yes as I have seen several reports of people being able to get business cards, some even after being denied for personal card for 5/24. If the question is do business cards count towards the more than fiour accounts in two months I think the answer depends on whether or not the TL is reporting to your personal credit report. Even then they may not count, but having a multiple business cards that do not show up on your report wouldn't trigger the denial since its based on new accounts not inqs.

Re: CSP - Store card count in 5/24 rule

red259 — Thu, 17 Sep 2015 18:49:39 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
The only TL that doesn't count is the Chase Co-Branded Cards (Southwest, Disney, Zappos, etc). Everything else counts.

Not sure what you are trying to convey here or which post you are responding to but this sounds wrong.

Re: CSP - Store card count in 5/24 rule

red259 — Thu, 17 Sep 2015 18:51:41 GMT

@kdm31091 wrote:
Point is: if you want it, apply. No one on here can tell you if you will be 100% declined. If you are declined, it's one or two wasted HPs, and you try again later. Not a big deal.

All we can do by are anecdotes and the OP has to make an informed decision about whether to apply or wait.

+1 This about sums it up. The only thing I would add is if OP does want to app they would want to check to see if they would qualify for a CSP if the 5/24 rule was not applicable.

Re: CSP - Store card count in 5/24 rule

Open123 — Thu, 17 Sep 2015 18:53:46 GMT

@red259 wrote:
@Open123 wrote:
Anyone have any indeas on whether or not Business TLs are counted in the 5 in 24? I'm assuming no, but wonder if anyone else has some insights.
Do you mean can you get a business card even if you have more than four in 24? If so, the answer seems to be yes as I have seen several reports of people being able to get business cards, some even after being denied for personal card for 5/24. If the question is do business cards count towards the more than fiour accounts in two months I think the answer depends on whether or not the TL is reporting to your personal credit report. Even then they may not count, but having a multiple business cards that do not show up on your report wouldn't trigger the denial since its based on new accounts not inqs.

My business TLs are all hidden, of course. I was assuming, if I were to app for the Bus Marriott, it would not count, since my app for the CSP would pull my personal CRs, which would show the recent HP, but not the Business TL.

If hidden Business TLs are unlikely to count in the 5, then I'm cleared for the CSP bonus. I'm just debating on waiting (hoping) for a 50K bonus.