topic Re: CSP almost 1 year old - worth the AF? in Credit Cards

CSP almost 1 year old - worth the AF?

Anonymous — Wed, 20 Jan 2016 08:36:02 GMT

Hi. My card is ready for its first AF and I am wondering if I should downgrade. It is my only real travel card of my 7 and I used it extensively for 4 trips last year. I eat out frequently and use it but I have discover and nfcu cash rewards that have no fee. I received the bonus last year and more than obtained additional points to offset the fee. I plan more travel this year. My only other fee card is a $55 Amex senior gold card that has 24 years of backdated history and occasional good offers. My card apping is done indefinitely-last one was in June 2015 for a low limit high interest discover that has grown. I also have an old freedom with a small line of $1200. CSP is 8k.

Opinions? Thanks.

Re: CSP almost 1 year old - worth the AF?

manyquestions — Wed, 20 Jan 2016 08:56:49 GMT

It wasn't worth it for me, but you probably want to calculate out your expected spend and see if using the CSP vs. your other cards will give you more benefit than the annual fee amount.

Re: CSP almost 1 year old - worth the AF?

Anonymous — Wed, 20 Jan 2016 08:57:44 GMT

You will have to crunch some numbers. Does the AF outweigh the cost of the rewards you are earning. Can you do better on another card, based on your spending habits. Very subjective as only you can make that determination.

Re: CSP almost 1 year old - worth the AF?

Mattopotamus — Wed, 20 Jan 2016 10:51:08 GMT

Also remember that if you book travel through ultimate rewards there is a 20% discount. That alone can cover the AF with just a couple of trips.

Re: CSP almost 1 year old - worth the AF?

bch238 — Wed, 20 Jan 2016 11:14:37 GMT

What other have said, depends on what your spending habits are. Do you eat out a lot? Do you travel a lot? Lots of useful point transfer partners, Southwest among them. Chase c/s is the best there is, IMO. You call, a human being answers and knows who you are. Citi has recently become a close second. Amex has slid to trash level in the past two years with uninformed and disinformative reps.

Re: CSP almost 1 year old - worth the AF?

takeshi74 — Wed, 20 Jan 2016 14:59:29 GMT

You can't poll to determine if something is worth it to you. Worth is always highly subjective, regardless of topic. My CSP is worth it to me but that doesn't mean anything to you unless your spend, redemptions, etc are similar enough to my own.

For any rewards card you should be crunching the numbers for your spend. For rewards cards like the CSP you also need to consider how the redemption methods you're using are impacting your rewards value. If you cannot or will not perform this sort of analysis, cash back cards are much easier since it's just a matter of spend * cash back rate.

@Mattopotamus wrote:
Also remember that if you book travel through ultimate rewards there is a 20% discount. That alone can cover the AF with just a couple of trips.

Carefully compare. Better value is generally attained by transferring but it really depends on the specifics.

Re: CSP almost 1 year old - worth the AF?

jawbrkr — Thu, 21 Jan 2016 01:36:32 GMT

@takeshi74 wrote:
You can't poll to determine if something is worth it to you. Worth is always highly subjective, regardless of topic. My CSP is worth it to me but that doesn't mean anything to you unless your spend, redemptions, etc are similar enough to my own.

For any rewards card you should be crunching the numbers for your spend. For rewards cards like the CSP you also need to consider how the redemption methods you're using are impacting your rewards value. If you cannot or will not perform this sort of analysis, cash back cards are much easier since it's just a matter of spend * cash back rate.

@Mattopotamus wrote:
Also remember that if you book travel through ultimate rewards there is a 20% discount. That alone can cover the AF with just a couple of trips.
Carefully compare. Better value is generally attained by transferring but it really depends on the specifics.

I have heard in the past people say there us a no AF version of the CSP that one can downgrade to. How true is this? Anyone know? I have to consider whether i want to keep my CSP and pay the annual fee or downgrade to the regular CS. If they do in fact allow a downgrade to that, I might consider it. I use the CSP as my main card and spend mostly on it but my spend at the moment is definitely not enough to warrant paying Chase $95 every year.

Re: CSP almost 1 year old - worth the AF?

Anonymous — Thu, 21 Jan 2016 01:46:16 GMT

you can downgrade the chase sapphire preferred to a sapphire. You'll lose out on the 20% discount when using points on travel. The no FTF. The 1:1 point transfer for travel programs.

I looked at a flight on ultimate rewards recently and it's the same on the site as it is on there but with UR I got 20% off using the points--it's a domestic trip so I opted to use my miles on delta instead (have a lot) and it was 35,000 miles when the face value of the tickets were around 300$

So you can see it's a bit helpful, if you really look and wait you can get even better deals, which is why I opt not to use it just yet--I have a colleague who booked tickets to HK for free basically with his points. The deal was pretty good, better than if he paid cash with the carrier direct.

Is it worth it to me? Better then Amazon prime.

Is it worth it to you? You'll have to do the deciding

Re: CSP almost 1 year old - worth the AF?

CreditCuriosity — Thu, 21 Jan 2016 01:54:07 GMT

Don't forget about primary renter insurance coverage a benefit that is overlooked on this card alot which can pay the AF there alone

Re: CSP almost 1 year old - worth the AF?

red259 — Thu, 21 Jan 2016 02:30:41 GMT

@CreditCuriousity wrote:
Don't forget about primary renter insurance coverage a benefit that is overlooked on this card alot which can pay the AF there alone

This is worth it to some people but to people who do not have a car it doesn't make a difference. To OP whether or not the card is worthwhile depends on your spending habits and how you value the benefits. Since I have the ink card I didn't need to keep my CSP so I downgraded to a CS which has no AF but allows me to still get the dining bonus and I use the card quite a bit. If I did not have the ink card then I would have paid the AF on the CSP, because I want the ability to transfer to chase travel partners and I tend to earn a decent amount of them through my various spend with Chase. If you are not earning enough Chase URs for worthwhile redemptions with Chase (or you are not interested in redeeming with a Chase travel partner) then the is likely not worth it after the first year. If you have upcoming travel it is nice have a no FTF card and the CSP gives extra points for travel. On a side note I just learned today that visa charges an extra percentage point on the foreign coversion rate vs what mastercard/amex charge. So for visa you pay an extra cent for every dollar spent. Its a small increase but can add up if you are spending significant amounts overseas.

Re: CSP almost 1 year old - worth the AF?

Anonymous — Thu, 21 Jan 2016 05:15:06 GMT

Based on how much you travel, and that you have a freedom, I would keep it.

If you do the math and you ended up spending under 2375 for the year on dining/travel, then you lose money. (unless you rent cars a ton and that was used a lot)

If you would have spent that same amount on the Chase Sapphire you would have been better off. I would always tell someone to downgrade and just keep $500 on it. That way one day if you decide to get the ink or travel more you can go back to CSP and not deal with the hassle.

Re: CSP almost 1 year old - worth the AF?

red259 — Thu, 21 Jan 2016 06:19:59 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
Based on how much you travel, and that you have a freedom, I would keep it.

If you do the math and you ended up spending under 2375 for the year on dining/travel, then you lose money. (unless you rent cars a ton and that was used a lot)

If you would have spent that same amount on the Chase Sapphire you would have been better off. I would always tell someone to downgrade and just keep $500 on it. That way one day if you decide to get the ink or travel more you can go back to CSP and not deal with the hassle.

Can you explain the $2375 figure? Why is the card worth keeping if you spend over that amount on dining compared to the no AF CS? I'm just curious about the math and what the significance of that cutoff is.

Re: CSP almost 1 year old - worth the AF?

Anonymous — Thu, 21 Jan 2016 07:20:45 GMT

My average dining is over $300/month and get a slightly better return on CSP than on the discover (2% until June) or NFCU (1.5%). I rented cars 3 times last year and used CSP for primary insurance. I also like the trip cancellation feature of the card. I usually transfer points from freedom to CSP and use them for trips and get the 20% point bonus on chase travel. I don't transfer points to airlines. I easily surpassed the $95 fee in points last year minus the 40K bonus (now 50K), so I guess I'll keep it for another year, since I plan to do a lot of traveling this year as well. Learning about the 1% visa conversion rate is interesting. I have amex but no mastercard. NFCU has no FTF and no fee. My amex cards carry a 2.7% FTF. Upgrading to platinum and its $450 fee or PRG ($195) doesn't make sense at this time since I don't travel internationally often and only make $50K a year. So for how I use it, I guess the $95 fee is reasonable, given how much I use the card, at least for one more year. If I stop traveling next year I'll downgrade to CS if it is still available. I have budgeted for the fee that hits on February 1.

Thanks to all who responded to my initial post.

Re: CSP almost 1 year old - worth the AF?

NRB525 — Thu, 21 Jan 2016 10:49:55 GMT

+1 to always keeping it as a Sapphire at least, though I would leave the CL at $5,000 at a minimum, actually I would not change the CL at all. Re-PC back to CSP when points usage gets into the plan.

Consider transfers to Hyatt, not just airlines. There are some lower tier Hyatt's that get good redemption rates and may be in locations you are headed.

For now though, your plan to pay the AF is good. Your travel spend may shift, if you already used the bonus points, so besides dining you may be adding some airfare spend to the 2pt category.

Use the Freedom regularly too, take advantage of the 5pt categories.

Good luck!

Re: CSP almost 1 year old - worth the AF?

Anonymous — Thu, 21 Jan 2016 16:36:37 GMT

If you would have spent that same amount on the Chase Sapphire you would have been better off. I would always tell someone to downgrade and just keep $500 on it. That way one day if you decide to get the ink or travel more you can go back to CSP and not deal with the hassle.

Can you give a little more detail on this? Is it really that esy to go from the CS to the CSP? Looks like OP has decided to go another year, which is about what I think I would do but I find this interesting.

Re: CSP almost 1 year old - worth the AF?

red259 — Thu, 21 Jan 2016 18:32:41 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:

If you would have spent that same amount on the Chase Sapphire you would have been better off. I would always tell someone to downgrade and just keep $500 on it. That way one day if you decide to get the ink or travel more you can go back to CSP and not deal with the hassle.
Can you give a little more detail on this? Is it really that esy to go from the CS to the CSP? Looks like OP has decided to go another year, which is about what I think I would do but I find this interesting.

Going from a CSP to a CS is like a 2 minute phone call to Chase. It is not difficult at all, you just call the number on the back of the card.

Re: CSP almost 1 year old - worth the AF?

Anonymous — Thu, 21 Jan 2016 18:39:21 GMT

@red259 wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:

If you would have spent that same amount on the Chase Sapphire you would have been better off. I would always tell someone to downgrade and just keep $500 on it. That way one day if you decide to get the ink or travel more you can go back to CSP and not deal with the hassle.
Can you give a little more detail on this? Is it really that esy to go from the CS to the CSP? Looks like OP has decided to go another year, which is about what I think I would do but I find this interesting.
Going from a CSP to a CS is like a 2 minute phone call to Chase. It is not difficult at all, you just call the number on the back of the card.

Okay, I was more refering to the fact that it looks like you're saying you could switch back tot he CSP if you change your mind.

Re: CSP almost 1 year old - worth the AF?

red259 — Thu, 21 Jan 2016 18:42:24 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
My average dining is over $300/month and get a slightly better return on CSP than on the discover (2% until June) or NFCU (1.5%). I rented cars 3 times last year and used CSP for primary insurance. I also like the trip cancellation feature of the card. I usually transfer points from freedom to CSP and use them for trips and get the 20% point bonus on chase travel. I don't transfer points to airlines. I easily surpassed the $95 fee in points last year minus the 40K bonus (now 50K), so I guess I'll keep it for another year, since I plan to do a lot of traveling this year as well. Learning about the 1% visa conversion rate is interesting. I have amex but no mastercard. NFCU has no FTF and no fee. My amex cards carry a 2.7% FTF. Upgrading to platinum and its $450 fee or PRG ($195) doesn't make sense at this time since I don't travel internationally often and only make $50K a year. So for how I use it, I guess the $95 fee is reasonable, given how much I use the card, at least for one more year. If I stop traveling next year I'll downgrade to CS if it is still available. I have budgeted for the fee that hits on February 1.

Thanks to all who responded to my initial post.

Even if you decide to keep it I would recommend calling in to see if there is a retention offer. Chase is a bit stingy with this card when it comes to offers, but if you are putting enough through the card they may throw enough points your way to totally offset the AF. They won't waive the AF, but the points may be even more valuable.

Re: CSP almost 1 year old - worth the AF?

red259 — Thu, 21 Jan 2016 18:45:28 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
@red259 wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:

If you would have spent that same amount on the Chase Sapphire you would have been better off. I would always tell someone to downgrade and just keep $500 on it. That way one day if you decide to get the ink or travel more you can go back to CSP and not deal with the hassle.
Can you give a little more detail on this? Is it really that esy to go from the CS to the CSP? Looks like OP has decided to go another year, which is about what I think I would do but I find this interesting.
Going from a CSP to a CS is like a 2 minute phone call to Chase. It is not difficult at all, you just call the number on the back of the card.
Okay, I was more refering to the fact that it looks like you're saying you could switch back tot he CSP if you change your mind.

I didn't say that, but I don't see any reason why you can't upgrade again later on. You may need to wait a year or so under the CARD act, but I'm sure Chase would be more than happy to upgrade people. Probably what I would do (depending on my number of accounts in the prior two years) is just apply for a new CSP if more than two years has passed so that I could get another signup.

Re: CSP almost 1 year old - worth the AF?

Anonymous — Thu, 21 Jan 2016 19:14:25 GMT

If you utilize all the advantages of the CSP (which btw is my favorite card next to my AMEX BCP) it is well worth it. The AF is offset by so many ways with the CSP; ONLY if you use the card for all the benefits they offer. JMHO.