topic Re: Final by First Bank in Credit Cards

Final by First Bank

DaJagman — Wed, 28 Sep 2016 22:08:43 GMT

Did anyone else get this email to apply as a VIP?

Re: Final by First Bank

Anonymous — Wed, 28 Sep 2016 22:20:05 GMT

@DaJagman wrote:
Did anyone else get this email to apply as a VIP?

That's a pretty awesome looking card.

Re: Final by First Bank

Anonymous — Thu, 29 Sep 2016 05:31:07 GMT

getfinal.com?

a CC that generates disposable CC #'s after each purchase? seems pretty useless. But hey...

Re: Final by First Bank

Anonymous — Thu, 29 Sep 2016 06:32:18 GMT

Thanks for the share!

Re: Final by First Bank

Anonymous — Thu, 29 Sep 2016 08:58:34 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
getfinal.com?

a CC that generates disposable CC #'s after each purchase? seems pretty useless. But hey...

You do understand that a magnetic stripe transaction uses static information, correct?

Just like the new chips on these cards when inserted at a terminal, this card generates a new CC# or "token" every time the card is used to help prevent cloning. Grandma's credit card gets skimmed because of the static, permanent data stolen from a card when it's swiped or used online.

Re: Final by First Bank

heyryan — Thu, 20 Oct 2016 23:21:51 GMT

I received an email telling me I'd be receiving my invite code to apply in a couple of hours. Not many details other than that though...

Re: Final by First Bank

mattmyFIC0 — Thu, 20 Oct 2016 23:46:24 GMT

I just got my VIP code to apply. Not sure who they pull and I'm all frozen so I hope to hear back from them in regards to which CRA they use. If I do I'll report back.

Re: Final by First Bank

heyryan — Thu, 20 Oct 2016 23:49:47 GMT

I'm skipping this one. 18% APR and crappy cash back, no Android app yet, etc. The only interesting selling point are the disposable card #s, but not worth another inquiry and new account.

Re: Final by First Bank

mattmyFIC0 — Thu, 20 Oct 2016 23:49:53 GMT

Ugh..... Another EX puller apparently.

The card is interesting but my EX is pretty beat up right now.

Anyone have any experience with First Bank & Trust?

Re: Final by First Bank

Anonymous — Tue, 25 Oct 2016 19:43:54 GMT

did you ever sign up?

Re: Final by First Bank

Anonymous — Tue, 25 Oct 2016 20:51:00 GMT

@heyryan wrote:
I'm skipping this one. 18% APR and crappy cash back, no Android app yet, etc. The only interesting selling point are the disposable card #s, but not worth another inquiry and new account.

$0 "first year" annual fee is also questionable phrasing, so I looked at the terms on their website and, yep, it's a $49 annual fee

Pass

Re: Final by First Bank

r34dy2fly — Tue, 25 Oct 2016 23:15:28 GMT

Seriously.... why? If someone is skimming your card, you're not liable for the charges anyway and most banks these days will send a card out ASAP. If you have a premium card, they'll even overnight it, except for the Sapphire Reserve since it seems they ran out of the metal cards.

What need is this card actually filling?

Re: Final by First Bank

r34dy2fly — Tue, 25 Oct 2016 23:22:50 GMT

Okay so after reading and watching their intro video, I guess I have a better understanding. So you have different card numbers for different merchants. No printed number or permanant number on the card itself and if you deny a transaction, that number gets trashed. How... exactly is that going to be feasible for them? I understand that there are 20 trillion combinations but I'm pretty sure credit card companies are given a set number of numbers so there is no overlap with other providers no? Just thinking what day to day would be like for me, that's like.... 100 numbers a week as I travel quite frequently for my job. Man... I don't know. The disgusting annual fee doesn't help either with only 1% cash back.

Re: Final by First Bank

r34dy2fly — Tue, 25 Oct 2016 23:25:21 GMT

Wait... the numbers are printed on the card itself. So basically you're paying $50/yr just for the ability to create a virtual number? Certain cards (eg. USAA) you have the ability to create one anyway. And it doesn't cost money...

Re: Final by First Bank

austinguy907 — Tue, 25 Oct 2016 23:42:08 GMT

r34dy..... let's put it this way... if you have to make 3 posts in a row about it then it's really not worth getting anything that isn't straight forward when it comes to $ isn't worth the hassle of figuring it out.

Re: Final by First Bank

Anonymous — Tue, 25 Oct 2016 23:54:41 GMT

@r34dy2fly wrote:
Okay so after reading and watching their intro video, I guess I have a better understanding. So you have different card numbers for different merchants. No printed number or permanant number on the card itself and if you deny a transaction, that number gets trashed. How... exactly is that going to be feasible for them? I understand that there are 20 trillion combinations but I'm pretty sure credit card companies are given a set number of numbers so there is no overlap with other providers no? Just thinking what day to day would be like for me, that's like.... 100 numbers a week as I travel quite frequently for my job. Man... I don't know. The disgusting annual fee doesn't help either with only 1% cash back.

Right-o.

Major credit cards have a specific set of rules in regards to how the numbers are (store cards are different so I won't include them here):

the first number indicates the network. American Express is 3, Visa is 4, MasterCard is 5, Discover is 6.

The next 5 numbers indicate the bank and the type of card (example: 517805 is a MasterCard issued by Cap One - both my plat secured and QS1 have this sequence so I think the indication here is that it's not co-branded and they are lower tier cards).

The remaining 9-10 digits (15 total for AMEX, 16 total for Visa, MasterCard, Discover) are the account number and a couple check digits to assure it's valid, based on a formula involving some fairly simple math to check for a valid number.

So the reality is there's still a TON of combinations that could be there, but there could be an issue if a ton of people are constantly creating burner numbers on this account. I suppose that remains to be seen.

Re: Final by First Bank

r34dy2fly — Tue, 25 Oct 2016 23:52:20 GMT

As a bank examiner and potential community bank starter, I'm always interested in seeing new products on the market and evaluating them. That said, I really don't understand the point of the card. It's just such a niche product that I can't see a lot of people falling in line behind it. Especially with an annual fee attached. This is one example where I feel like the founder is coming from a tech background and not a card services background.

Re: Final by First Bank

r34dy2fly — Wed, 26 Oct 2016 00:00:10 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
@r34dy2fly wrote:
Okay so after reading and watching their intro video, I guess I have a better understanding. So you have different card numbers for different merchants. No printed number or permanant number on the card itself and if you deny a transaction, that number gets trashed. How... exactly is that going to be feasible for them? I understand that there are 20 trillion combinations but I'm pretty sure credit card companies are given a set number of numbers so there is no overlap with other providers no? Just thinking what day to day would be like for me, that's like.... 100 numbers a week as I travel quite frequently for my job. Man... I don't know. The disgusting annual fee doesn't help either with only 1% cash back.
Right-o.

Major credit cards have a specific set of rules in regards to how the numbers are (store cards are different so I won't include them here):

the first number indicates the network. American Express is 3, Visa is 4, MasterCard is 5, Discover is 6.

The next 5 numbers indicate the bank and the type of card (example: 517805 is a MasterCard issued by Cap One - both my plat secured and QS1 have this sequence so I think the indication here is that it's not co-branded and they are lower tier cards).

The remaining 9-10 digits (15 total for AMEX, 16 total for Visa, MasterCard, Discover) are the account number and a couple check digits to assure it's valid, based on a formula involving some fairly simple math to check for a valid number.

So the reality is there's still a TON of combinations that could be there, but they'd blow through them pretty quickly if a lot of people are constantly generating new numbers for this card.

According to my very loose math, that's about 3,628,800 different combinations they can run with with the card number breakdown you've provided (thanks for that!).

As I said, I travel the state / country for work doing about 100 transactions a week, give or take. This is for vending machines, breakfast/lunch/dinner, drinks with co-workers, flights, hotels, gas, etc. That means within 1 year, I'll blow through about 4000 numbers a year and that's a modest 40 week calendar year instead of the 52 to account for vacation time, re-occuring transactions, etc. That means there can only be 907 of card users like me or they'll be out of numbers or will have to recycle numbers. Is that what they're going for? Recycling numbers at some point? I mean, with enough users, that may just be a week or two between the # being active.

I'm sure they got this all figured out or they wouldn't have pushed ahead but it seems a bit silly to me. Interesting to see though... I'm hoping to create a card myself one day so I'm almost always interested in seeing new and different types of cards out there .

Re: Final by First Bank

Anonymous — Wed, 26 Oct 2016 00:05:46 GMT

@r34dy2fly wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
@r34dy2fly wrote:
Okay so after reading and watching their intro video, I guess I have a better understanding. So you have different card numbers for different merchants. No printed number or permanant number on the card itself and if you deny a transaction, that number gets trashed. How... exactly is that going to be feasible for them? I understand that there are 20 trillion combinations but I'm pretty sure credit card companies are given a set number of numbers so there is no overlap with other providers no? Just thinking what day to day would be like for me, that's like.... 100 numbers a week as I travel quite frequently for my job. Man... I don't know. The disgusting annual fee doesn't help either with only 1% cash back.
Right-o.

Major credit cards have a specific set of rules in regards to how the numbers are (store cards are different so I won't include them here):

the first number indicates the network. American Express is 3, Visa is 4, MasterCard is 5, Discover is 6.

The next 5 numbers indicate the bank and the type of card (example: 517805 is a MasterCard issued by Cap One - both my plat secured and QS1 have this sequence so I think the indication here is that it's not co-branded and they are lower tier cards).

The remaining 9-10 digits (15 total for AMEX, 16 total for Visa, MasterCard, Discover) are the account number and a couple check digits to assure it's valid, based on a formula involving some fairly simple math to check for a valid number.

So the reality is there's still a TON of combinations that could be there, but they'd blow through them pretty quickly if a lot of people are constantly generating new numbers for this card.
According to my very loose math, that's about 3,628,800 different combinations they can run with with the card number breakdown you've provided (thanks for that!).

As I said, I travel the state / country for work doing about 100 transactions a week, give or take. This is for vending machines, breakfast/lunch/dinner, drinks with co-workers, flights, hotels, gas, etc. That means within 1 year, I'll blow through about 4000 numbers a year and that's a modest 40 week calendar year instead of the 52 to account for vacation time, re-occuring transactions, etc. That means there can only be 907 of card users like me or they'll be out of numbers or will have to recycle numbers. Is that what they're going for? Recycling numbers at some point? I mean, with enough users, that may just be a week or two between the # being active.

I'm sure they got this all figured out or they wouldn't have pushed ahead but it seems a bit silly to me. Interesting to see though... I'm hoping to create a card myself one day so I'm almost always interested in seeing new and different types of cards out there .

It's possible they have multiple bank codes to combat this issue (which would be a change in the five digits after the network indicator), but I couldn't really speak to that. This seems like it's coming from a relatively small bank, though, so I don't know if they've secured multiple bank codes or not.

Re: Final by First Bank

Anonymous — Wed, 26 Oct 2016 01:02:23 GMT

Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought that the random number was for online transactions only. If you physically use the card it would use the number embossed on the card, am I correct?