topic Re: My new AMEX bce - envelope arrived OPENED!!! >='( in Credit Cards

My new AMEX bce - envelope arrived OPENED!!! >='(

Anonymous — Sat, 08 Jul 2017 08:36:17 GMT

Folks, CaptainJ is beside himself! Not just the usual George Costanza level of being riled up, no, this has gone to a new level. Some of you will remember my recenty, and semi-epic saga to get approved for this card. Some may even remember my "recon" call to make sure they made up for their antics by placing it in "rush" status, and assuring me it would arrive before I left town.

It turns out that some un?fortunate circumstances brought me back much sooner than anticipated. As you may have guessed by now, the card did NOT arrive on the date I made sure to ask multiple times if it would. My recordings of this, if I should have any, are useless because when I joked about them after getting tired of hearing the canned "this call may be recorded for training purposes", I was told to turn off my recording. SMH at hypocrisy.

So I live in an apartment building, andafter just arriving back, I was for a moment pleased to see a large envelope had been slid under my door....until I saw it looked molested. Even then, I was still kind of excited and ready to get the card activated, to have it do it's aging before I do my proper round 2 of rebuilding in 6 months(this and Citi Costco, a "bonus" of being forced to wait so long for this card to be approved despite it's pre-qualified status, were just a prologue). That brings me to another question: in the aging of the new account, is it a)approval date, or b)activation date?

So inside the big envelope, is the usual business-sized AMEX envelope, but apparently that too had been opened!!!!!! Not only that, but the paperwork had been turned around so that you couldnt see my name through the window. Unless an AMEX employee manually did that being it wasnt going to be mailed the normal way... although I doubt that, I had to open up that possibility, no pun intended. "Luckily", the card was still in there. Or does it matter? I mean the person would have my name/address, all the proper numbers to be able to use the card in the future, right?

Does this mean I have no option but to call and cancel tomorrow?

My next question: If cancelling a card doesnt change AAoA for 10 years, it certainly would if I had TWO brand new cards(albeit 1 closed and no credit line), correct?!? On top of the other reasons for frustration, can you understand this additional salt in the wound? And part B of that question(I care much less, but it might help someone else), would that count twice against the Chase 5/24, or just once?

Folks, I am not an expert or a high roller here, but I hope you can see I put some thought into this. My ICON is a Credit Crusader(tm), and I try to fight the good fight. What gets me is the gall of the person to then slide it under my door as an act of protection after the molestation.

The best laid plans of mice and man, oft go awry. Also reminds me of a line from the Rush song, "Bravado", "And when the dust has cleared, and victory denied...". I really put my all into working AMEX on this, and their lack of care and this vandal's actions have really upset me.

Further, I only put the home address as it was required [Mod Edit]. I told them I wanted it mailed to my PO Box/billing address. Heck, I prequalified through the PO Box address! I dont mean to sound like an ingrate, but AMEX really dropped the ball here. Or do I deserve this for some reason? I suppose I should wait to hear from the court of public opinion. Until then, I think I just may go back to the bottle. I mean this event wasnt even the worse news of the day! I'd be grateful for any answers or advice. The 2nd "new" account is probably what would anger me the worse. Please say that wont be the case.

Re: My new AMEX bce - envelope arrived OPENED!!! >='(

Anonymous — Sat, 08 Jul 2017 08:40:03 GMT

Thank you for the very entertaining read! As I'm a credit rebuilding neophyte, I can't speak with much authority on your questions. I will say, though, that in my experience, accounts age from the time they're opened vs activated.

Additionally, I'll proffer an alternate point of view on the mail molestation situation. I, too, live in an apartment, and it's not terribly uncommon to receive mail not intended for me. There have been a couple of instances where I opened the mail before I noticed that it wasn't mine. I've always promptly taken it to the proper apartment, and explained the error. I have also received mail from neighbors that has been opened. So, while I would still err on the side of caution in your case, it's entirely possible (probable, even) that your mail was not nefariously molested.

Re: My new AMEX bce - envelope arrived OPENED!!! >='(

Anonymous — Sat, 08 Jul 2017 08:41:18 GMT

[Mod Edit] Perhaps just frustrated at some of the silly (yes, silly) requirements placed on us by the PA?

Re: My new AMEX bce - envelope arrived OPENED!!! >='(

SunriseEarth — Sat, 08 Jul 2017 08:44:16 GMT

Portions of posts that were found to be unrelated to the purpose of the myFICO Forums have been removed. Edits and removal of posts in reference to the original post have also been made. --SE

Re: My new AMEX bce - envelope arrived OPENED!!! >='(

SunriseEarth — Sat, 08 Jul 2017 08:49:26 GMT

IMHO, the card was delivered to the wrong address, opened by a nosy neighbor, and then shuffled back into an envelope that was shoved under your door. I would call AMEX and advise them of the situation and request a new card be sent to you. You may want to see if they can expedite the card, given the circumstances. Since it's quite possible that someone has your full card #, CVV, and address, there is a high risk of fraud. Also, pay close attention to your transactions and advise AMEX if anything suspicious comes through.

Re: My new AMEX bce - envelope arrived OPENED!!! >='(

Anonymous — Sat, 08 Jul 2017 10:43:56 GMT

My first card ever -- my Disco -- arrived opened too. I was able to see that USPS marked my card delivered when I had not received it. I called for a replacement and requested Fedex. Since you requested the express delivery, Fedex likely couldn't be sent to a PO box, thus why you received it at your home address. Just call for a new number, no biggie, no harm. Just make sure you don't end up with 2 accounts listed on any of your CR's.

Re: My new AMEX bce - envelope arrived OPENED!!! >='(

Gmood1 — Sat, 08 Jul 2017 13:50:02 GMT

Atleast yours arrived. One of my Amex cards never did. Lol
I had forgotten about it. Finally called and had them send me another with different numbers two months later.
Sounds like more of a mistake than anything else with your incident. I've opened a pile of mail, only to find one piece in the bunch wasn't mine.

Re: My new AMEX bce - envelope arrived OPENED!!! >='(

Anonymous — Sat, 08 Jul 2017 14:05:50 GMT

Initial AMEX cards will come in a larger envelope with a normal, unsealed envelope containing the card inside. Replacement cards will come in a plain white envelope with only the card attached to one sheet of paper. Yes, you had a nosy neighbor. Call AMEX and report this and they will send you another card. I repeat, the replacement card *will* come in a plain white envelope through USPS unless you request an alternate shipping method. Watch your account online just to make sure something didn't or doesn't slip through the cracks.

Best of luck to you.

Re: My new AMEX bce - envelope arrived OPENED!!! >='(

bourgogne — Sat, 08 Jul 2017 14:28:45 GMT

did you try and activate the card? my cards inside the ups have never been sealed and always turned around. just use it, I would not call or do anything but use it

Re: My new AMEX bce - envelope arrived OPENED!!! >='(

Anonymous — Sun, 09 Jul 2017 05:50:10 GMT

Here's the thing, a guy on my floor left a note on his door a couple of months ago asking for whomever stole the groupon of his to return it. I also have had a groupon stolen, as well as a newegg package, and more recently a prescription from walgreens stolen(I was out of town and figured it would save me time, and had no idea it wasnt coming through the USPS to my mailbox). I asked for confirmation the card would be setnt to my PO box even though the card was promised to be sent before I left town, which again, it was not. I dont want any accounts attached to my home address, which is the address of my bankruptcy, though the government requires it, to supposedly help fight terrorism. That is part of credit discussion as much as anything, as it is printed right on the forms we have to fill out, and is something we are subjected to and need not be censored any more than anything else we mention from credit applications.

As to the large envelope being delivered to the wrong person, it certainly as not, as it wouldnt fit in any of the mailboxes even if it was sent USPS(although I would have gotten a slip to pick it up at the post office). It likely was left either in the foyer or just inside the door, or possibly against a door...but I doubt in that case the person delivering it would put it against the wrong door. So I am open to hearing what folks think now that they have a better idea of the situation.

On the phone I specifically asked them about the issue of sending to a PO Box through an expedited method. I think I already said that, but maybe some folks missed it. I was not irresponsible, and I took the time to be sure it would be sent to the PO box, because I know some companies will not. I even repeated the question to them after I got the answer as well, because I know sometimes people get into systematic processes and dont pay attention.

Ive taken what people here have said into account, but now that you know there have been multiple thefts in my building, should I ask for a card with a new number?

Next question: I had attempted fraud against 2 of my synchrony cards where they tried to change the address and have it sent to them. When they sent me new cards, they closed the accounts and made new ones, even though when I was on the phone with them I got them they told me they would not. Nobody addressed my question if they cancelled my account if it would in effect have 2 new accounts effecting my average age of accounts.

Maybe I should just roll the dice and activate it anyhow, and then I wouldnt have to worry about a "dead" brand new account effecting AAoA? As some have pointed out, there is some possibility it was an accident, regardless of the other acts of theivery... and I mean if someone did try to commit fraud, wouldnt it be easy to catch them? I did leave an angry note on my door, like the neighbor who had their groupon stolen a couple of months ago. In addition to the 3 items Ive had stolen in the last couple of years(mostly when I was out of town), this just pushed my over the edge. Maybe the brazen attitude on here is the best way to go. If the card had been stolen that's one thing, but if someone did try to use the information once I activated it, wouldnt AMEX just hold me not accountable for the fraud? In my note on the door, I said I hope whomever did it would try to do so, so that they could receive their just desserts. First regular goods stolen, then my prescription(medical things are also private and a violation of privacy), and now financial. I live in a low crime area too, which makes getting violated in these ways feel even worse, being it isnt expected.

I dont mind entertaining people at my own expense, and at times enjoy it. I wouldnt mind some understanding responses and advice, though. In 6 months I plan to go for Chase, Discover, and BOA whom I IIBed, so I really dont want to waste a "new account" if I call for a new card. Im not sure if it's possible for folks to picture themselves in my shoes and let me know what they'd do, but I'm asking.

For those who didn't see it, it was a 2 week process just to get this card that I was pre-qualifed for in real time on their website, when they took over a week just to tell me they needed an address verification done my my bank, and then another 2 days after it was faxed to AMEX from my bank they tell me they couldnt get hold of my banker, so I had to call her myself and ask her to call them, which I'm guessing isnt a part of her regular job description. If not for that and the fact that I was leaving town and had planned to be gone for 3 weeks, I wouldnt have asked for "rush" delivery. I certainly didnt with Citi, whom I was approved for instantly, while passing time reading on here while waiting for this AMEX application to be resolved. I dont want folks to get the wrong impression, but a SPREE of important apps is waiting for the 6 month aging date of these cards.

It can be hard to think/post straight when you're upset. As I said earlier, having the credit card envelopes opened wasnt even the worse thing to happen to me yesterday, it was a distant 2nd. I had just finished making travel plans on a 1000 mile trip and flying home after the other bad news, so of course this icing on the cake hit me a bit harder than it would have normally, if it helps folks to understand. Maybe youre right and I should just man up and activate it. I kind of want to say it's good not to feel alone, but then again that might sound like I'd want this to happen to someone else, so I'm not sure what to say anymore.

Re: My new AMEX bce - envelope arrived OPENED!!! >='(

Anonymous — Sun, 09 Jul 2017 05:39:06 GMT

@bourgogne wrote:
did you try and activate the card? my cards inside the ups have never been sealed and always turned around. just use it, I would not call or do anything but use it

Thanks, I truly appreciate you telling me that. If someone else can confirm that the inner envelope comes unsealed and turned around so that the address does not show through the window, then I would feel much better.

As I said before, that bit of info(I'm hoping someone confirms it) would make me much more likely to not want to bother calling to cancel that account, and would make me more likely to call and just activate it. I know I shouldnt root for a specific response as that is kind of confirmation bias, but that does seem to be by far the easiest route here, although the least safest.

I appreciate all the replies, even the ones that I dont get a warm feeling from, and the effort that went into them. I really appreciate yours though, as it lets me know that at least part of my situation was not abnormal. Can anyone confirm the AMEX inner envelope comes unsealed and turned around backwards from the address window?

Re: My new AMEX bce - envelope arrived OPENED!!! >='(

Anonymous — Sun, 09 Jul 2017 05:47:25 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
[Mod Edit] Perhaps just frustrated at some of the silly (yes, silly) requirements placed on us by the PA?

Hi, thanks for both of your posts. I didnt understand what this one meant, particularly what the PA was in reference to, but overall as well. ....I too undertsand the accidental opening of mail, and now feel kind of bad about the note I put on my door done with a sharpie, but I explained the reasons in my 2nd post that it was likely not to be an accident.

Maybe your post was replying to one of the BANNED posts, and that is why it didnt make sense to me? Man, I'm really curious what the banned posts said, and I'm a bit miffed that I may have lost preciois advice. This is quite important to me, even if others dont fully understand why. Thanks again for your posts, they were appreciated. I hope you post more around here.

Re: My new AMEX bce - envelope arrived OPENED!!! >='(

Anonymous — Sun, 09 Jul 2017 06:46:48 GMT

Just have Amex send a new card(number). Problem solved. I don't really think anyone stole your card number, but the new number will negate that absolutely.

Re: My new AMEX bce - envelope arrived OPENED!!! >='(

Anonymous — Sun, 09 Jul 2017 06:56:53 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:

Just have Amex send a new card(number). Problem solved. I don't really think anyone stole your card number, but the new number will negate that absolutely.

While that would be my normal course of action, the combination of waiting plus the possibility of having 2 brand new accounts instead of 1(as has already happened with the 2 synchrony cards I mentioned), is really limiting my desire to do so. If cancelled accounts didnt stay on your record, it wouldnt be an issue.

I'm curious if anyone else has had their AAoA effected in this manner, or if what happened when I got new numbers for 2 of my Synchony accounts was more of an exception to the general rule? Right now, it's the only evidence I have, but it's quite personal so I KNOW it's real, unlike reading something online. I suppose I could ask if I'm somehow interpreting it wrong, which I sincerely believe is possible with a great many things, if not everything.

Re: My new AMEX bce - envelope arrived OPENED!!! >='(

Man-Of-Steel — Sun, 09 Jul 2017 08:18:06 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:

Just have Amex send a new card(number). Problem solved. I don't really think anyone stole your card number, but the new number will negate that absolutely.

While that would be my normal course of action, the combination of waiting plus the possibility of having 2 brand new accounts instead of 1(as has already happened with the 2 synchrony cards I mentioned), is really limiting my desire to do so. If cancelled accounts didnt stay on your record, it wouldnt be an issue.

I'm curious if anyone else has had their AAoA effected in this manner, or if what happened when I got new numbers for 2 of my Synchony accounts was more of an exception to the general rule? Right now, it's the only evidence I have, but it's quite personal so I KNOW it's real, unlike reading something online. I suppose I could ask if I'm somehow interpreting it wrong, which I sincerely believe is possible with a great many things, if not everything.

From what I understand, Synchrony Bank is an outlier regarding this behavior. I can relate to this post, because I'm going through something similar right now with my Synchrony Marvel account. They shipped me a new image card recently and I never received it. Due to the very issue that you've reported above, I debated whether I should just close the account down or report the card missing. I reported the card missing and now I see that the Marvel tradeline shows up as a closed tradeline, with the remarks of "Credit card lost or stolen." I've never seen this happen with other CC lenders when I've had a new card account number issued due to a lost card in shipping, suspected CC breach, product change (with Capital One, Barclays, and Citi). I highly doubt that you would end up with 2 TLs with Amex, as they are in a completely different league from Synchrony Bank and again, Synchrony seems to be the outlier regarding this behavior. Now in my own situation, I'll be curious to see what happens when the new/replacement TL is added to my reports. I'm hoping that the closed account gets removed, effectively merging the 2 accounts, but we'll see. I've read where it was stated that a closed TL with the remarks of "lost or stolen" doesn't factor into the FICO scoring or AAoA, so hopefully that's true. If I end up with 2 TLs, this Marvel account is getting closed when it ages to 1 year and I won't be opening any new accounts with Synchrony Bank.

Anyway, I agree with the others who have recommended that you request a replacement card with a new account. I highly doubt that you'll end up with 2 TLs for this account (since you are dealing with Amex) and that should give you peace of mind regarding possible fraud in the future.

Re: My new AMEX bce - envelope arrived OPENED!!! >='(

Anonymous — Sun, 09 Jul 2017 09:15:25 GMT

@Man-Of-Steel wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:

Just have Amex send a new card(number). Problem solved. I don't really think anyone stole your card number, but the new number will negate that absolutely.

While that would be my normal course of action, the combination of waiting plus the possibility of having 2 brand new accounts instead of 1(as has already happened with the 2 synchrony cards I mentioned), is really limiting my desire to do so. If cancelled accounts didnt stay on your record, it wouldnt be an issue.

I'm curious if anyone else has had their AAoA effected in this manner, or if what happened when I got new numbers for 2 of my Synchony accounts was more of an exception to the general rule? Right now, it's the only evidence I have, but it's quite personal so I KNOW it's real, unlike reading something online. I suppose I could ask if I'm somehow interpreting it wrong, which I sincerely believe is possible with a great many things, if not everything.
From what I understand, Synchrony Bank is an outlier regarding this behavior. I can relate to this post, because I'm going through something similar right now with my Synchrony Marvel account. They shipped me a new image card recently and I never received it. Due to the very issue that you've reported above, I debated whether I should just close the account down or report the card missing. I reported the card missing and now I see that the Marvel tradeline shows up as a closed tradeline, with the remarks of "Credit card lost or stolen." I've never seen this happen with other CC lenders when I've had a new card account number issued due to a lost card in shipping, suspected CC breach, product change (with Capital One, Barclays, and Citi). I highly doubt that you would end up with 2 TLs with Amex, as they are in a completely different league from Synchrony Bank and again, Synchrony seems to be the outlier regarding this behavior. Now in my own situation, I'll be curious to see what happens when the new/replacement TL is added to my reports. I'm hoping that the closed account gets removed, effectively merging the 2 accounts, but we'll see. I've read where it was stated that a closed TL with the remarks of "lost or stolen" doesn't factor into the FICO scoring or AAoA, so hopefully that's true. If I end up with 2 TLs, this Marvel account is getting closed when it ages to 1 year and I won't be opening any new accounts with Synchrony Bank.

Anyway, I agree with the others who have recommended that you request a replacement card with a new account. I highly doubt that you'll end up with 2 TLs for this account (since you are dealing with Amex) and that should give you peace of mind regarding possible fraud in the future.

Wow, you may have gotten me to change my mind yet again, ugh! Seriously though, I am VERY grateful for your post....if nothing else to let me feel less "alone", that someone actually GETS what I am saying, as well as letting others see that I am not crazy or just making things up. I may deal with more anxiety than the average person, but it doesn't mean the stuff isnt also objectively real, regardless of how my body interprets/feels it, right? It sucks being like some character in the movie where nobody else can see what's happening to them, you know? lol

Anyhow, I'm grateful you sharing your synchrony experiences, and that they are supposedly unlikely elsewhere. Being it was my only such experience, it was the only direct data I had. I also want to add that I am GRATEFUL to SYNCHRONY for catching someone trying to change my address, and hanging up after they asked them some question. I'm also grateful for the 4 accounts they gave to me when I was new to this board and just starting my rebuilding, and then the HUGE CLIs when I called that credit solutions or whatever number I read about on here. Other than the 2 double accounts reporting(after they specifically assured me they would not!), they have been nothing but great to me! Your experience may not be the same, but I didnt want readers to come out of this thread with a negative feeling about Synchrony. I dont really know much about the Marvel card, so I cant speak to it directly. It may be one I should look into on round 2 of my rebuild in 6 months?

Quick question though...do you think they bureaus would delete the "reported lost or stolen" accounts if we requested? I like that you said they don't effect AAoA, but I'd like to find out if that is a certainty. I really want to make the right move here, and as some may have guessed, I'm a very analytical guy at times. While some things are apparently outside our power in the popular Western understanding of reality, I'd at least like to do the best of what IS knowingly controllable, if that makes sense.

So far with me, AMEX has dropped the ball AT LEAST 4 times before I even recieved the molested envelope(taking about 9 or 10 days to tell me they needed address verification[and not with a call or email even, but luckily checked the status page on the weekend!], taking 2 more days because they "couldnt get hold of my banker", assuring me I'd have the card on 7/3 before I left town, and also assuring me it'd go to my PO box even though it was expedited...the last 2 things led to the whole opened envelope debacle...a word used about AMEX in another recent thread). It may be more than 4, but that's what I remember off the top of my head.

I truly appreciate you letting me know Synchrony was an outlier, and that I should expect AMEX to finally do right by me, lol. I try to be a forgiving person, but theyve left a really bad first few impressions. I'm still on the fence, but youve changed my lean toward one of cancelling(asking for a replacement...although if I had cajones of steel[or better self esteem than average on here], I would be just outright cancelling the card. I dont really need it, or any card for that matter. I'm hoping it will prove to be of practical use, instead of just my "first post BK 'prime' card").

Re: My new AMEX bce - envelope arrived OPENED!!! >='(

Anonymous — Sun, 09 Jul 2017 11:33:30 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
[Mod Edit] Perhaps just frustrated at some of the silly (yes, silly) requirements placed on us by the PA?

Hi, thanks for both of your posts. I didnt understand what this one meant, particularly what the PA was in reference to, but overall as well. ....I too undertsand the accidental opening of mail, and now feel kind of bad about the note I put on my door done with a sharpie, but I explained the reasons in my 2nd post that it was likely not to be an accident.

Maybe your post was replying to one of the BANNED posts, and that is why it didnt make sense to me? Man, I'm really curious what the banned posts said, and I'm a bit miffed that I may have lost preciois advice. This is quite important to me, even if others dont fully understand why. Thanks again for your posts, they were appreciated. I hope you post more around here.

Yes, this post was part of a response to someone else's post; the other post was deleted, and mine was redacted, so it doesn't make sense as is. PA is the Patriot Act, by the way.

Re: My new AMEX bce - envelope arrived OPENED!!! >='(

Anonymous — Sun, 09 Jul 2017 11:52:30 GMT

Helpful suggestion: If your post is more concise and a bit shorter, it may allow more people to read through it and to help you. Just a thought.

I agree with the suggestions to cancel any card that has arrived opened and request a new card number. You would not want to risk having the card compromised and find out in six months that your number is being used fraudulently. At times, thieves do wait a few months prior to using a number. Sorry this happened, OP.

Re: My new AMEX bce - envelope arrived OPENED!!! >='(

UpperNwGuy — Sun, 09 Jul 2017 12:18:34 GMT

I also live in a high-rise apartment building, and USPS has mistakenly delivered my mail to my neighbors and vice versa. None of my credit cards have gone to my neighbors, but on two occasions unsolicited balance transfer checks from Citibank went to my neighbors. They later appeared under my door with the envelopes opened. I called Citibank and told them to stop sending me these unsolicited checks, because they were creating an unnecessary risk for me. I have a theory that USPS, at least in my city, has gotten sloppy in recent years, but my evidence is purely anecdotal.

Re: My new AMEX bce - envelope arrived OPENED!!! >='(

Anonymous — Sun, 09 Jul 2017 12:56:38 GMT

@UpperNwGuy wrote:
I also live in a high-rise apartment building, and USPS has mistakenly delivered my mail to my neighbors and vice versa. None of my credit cards have gone to my neighbors, but on two occasions unsolicited balance transfer checks from Citibank went to my neighbors. They later appeared under my door with the envelopes opened. I called Citibank and told them to stop sending me these unsolicited checks, because they were creating an unnecessary risk for me. I have a theory that USPS, at least in my city, has gotten sloppy in recent years, but my evidence is purely anecdotal.

I have one of those careless letter carriers... I tell ya, no matter where you go, the work ethic of "doing it right the first time" has almost all but disappeared... USPS is no exception. Your only recourse is having the your mail held at the post office for pick-up, that way, your address can remain on your mail, but it would be somewhat more secure than being in the hands of a lazy carrier who can't be bothered with doing their job correctly...

AMEX, upon issuing a replacement for a lost or stolen card, will NOT close your account to issue another card unless you specifically request them to do so.

The BT checks are sent from another department and are not too much different than the dept that sends the pre-qual mailers, so good luck trying to get them to stop sending them... Every 3 months, I get the BT checks from Chase, Citi and Discover. They come twice a week, every week, for a month. Seriously, I have a freaking pile of them!!!