topic Re: AMEX Financial Review in Credit Cards

AMEX Financial Review

QuakerOatmeal — Sat, 12 May 2018 16:51:34 GMT

I came across a video on youtube on the "Dreaded AMEX Financial Review", and one of the reason for a trigger would be using your card at work. Is this true? After some digging around I also came across a website that states:

"USING YOUR CARD AT YOUR PLACE OF BUSINESS:
We all have done this, to cover a check or to pay the client but this is a strict no from Amex. Based on the Latest policies laid for using Amex this would lead to automatic account cancellation for 60% of the cases. Remaining 40% cases the account is put under a severe financial review. They want to look at your recent finances like bank statements, taxes, fico scores etc."

Maybe I'm naive but why would this trigger a FR? I'm an insurance agent, so I put a lot of my expenses on my card and pay them almost immediately. I don't normally use my AMEX because AMEX is rarely accepted.

For example I have an errors and ommission policy premium due, instead of paying with a check, I pay with a card to get points, then pay it in full.

Why would this be an issue? Is this something I should immediately stop doing?

Another example, my mom is self employed and has an AMEX platinum card.... for years, since about the early 80s and she's a travel agent. Oftentimes when customers pay cash, she'll do the transaction through her AMEX and over the years shes accrued tons and tons of points, would this be bad for her too? Or has she just not triggered this?

I just don't get why this would trigger a FR. :-/

Re: AMEX Financial Review

Appleman — Sat, 12 May 2018 20:02:32 GMT

I am not a business owner, but from what I have read on these forums personal and business expenses should not be mixed.

I am sure other who are business owners will provide their input.

Re: AMEX Financial Review

redpat — Sun, 13 May 2018 05:43:45 GMT

No we haven’t all done this.

You can’t swipe your personal or your business card through your business merchant account. That is a form of a cash advance and self dealing. You could also get your merchant account shut down.

If you need to cover checks then your business needs a bank line of credit.

You can use your personal card for business expenses and reimburse yourself but a BIG NO NO to swipe your own account.

Re: AMEX Financial Review

QuakerOatmeal — Sun, 13 May 2018 13:17:10 GMT

My office doesn’t have a merchant services account. I don’t usually ever use my personal cards at work, but since I got an spg with a spend 3,000 in 3 months SUB with a 1,000 CL I’ve been looking for ways to get there. One of them being “oh here’s my offices Elizabethtown gas bill, I wonder if they take Amex?” It’s mostly for relatively (under 1,000 dollar office expenses, that I then pay my Amex with the office account online.)

If this is wrong, or going to get me in trouble I’ll stop. But again I don’t use it to pay myself or any employees, I use it to pay things like gas and electric, internet bills and sometimes an insurance premium or two if the insurance company takes Amex. Then I just pay Amex directly with the business account.

Re: AMEX Financial Review

SouthJamaica — Sun, 13 May 2018 13:23:18 GMT

@QuakerOatmeal wrote:
My office doesn’t have a merchant services account. I don’t usually ever use my personal cards at work, but since I got an spg with a spend 3,000 in 3 months SUB with a 1,000 CL I’ve been looking for ways to get there. One of them being “oh here’s my offices Elizabethtown gas bill, I wonder if they take Amex?” It’s mostly for relatively (under 1,000 dollar office expenses, that I then pay my Amex with the office account online.)

If this is wrong, or going to get me in trouble I’ll stop. But again I don’t use it to pay myself or any employees, I use it to pay things like gas and electric, internet bills and sometimes an insurance premium or two if the insurance company takes Amex. Then I just pay Amex directly with the business account.

A credit card company could close your account for using a personal card for a business's expenses.

Re: AMEX Financial Review

QuakerOatmeal — Sun, 13 May 2018 13:26:55 GMT

Ugh, okay, guess I’ll cut that out! Darn.

Re: AMEX Financial Review

redpat — Sun, 13 May 2018 13:51:11 GMT

@SouthJamaica wrote:
@QuakerOatmeal wrote:
My office doesn’t have a merchant services account. I don’t usually ever use my personal cards at work, but since I got an spg with a spend 3,000 in 3 months SUB with a 1,000 CL I’ve been looking for ways to get there. One of them being “oh here’s my offices Elizabethtown gas bill, I wonder if they take Amex?” It’s mostly for relatively (under 1,000 dollar office expenses, that I then pay my Amex with the office account online.)

If this is wrong, or going to get me in trouble I’ll stop. But again I don’t use it to pay myself or any employees, I use it to pay things like gas and electric, internet bills and sometimes an insurance premium or two if the insurance company takes Amex. Then I just pay Amex directly with the business account.
A credit card company could close your account for using a personal card for a business's expenses.

That is not exactly true. I use my personal Amex plat to my bus airfare and my CSR for all my bus and personal dining and hotels. I have two Amex business cards and one chase business cards and I have been doing this for many years. I have my personal and business checking account on them both.

it is okay to remiburse yourself for business expenses.

Re: AMEX Financial Review

QuakerOatmeal — Sun, 13 May 2018 15:09:44 GMT

So then to be clear, am I in “dangerous territory”? Because that’s precisely what I’m doing, charging business expenses every now and then (like the cable bill or the electric bill) just to keep on track to make the “spend 3,000 dollar SUB”. It’s not *huge* charges every day. Maybe 3 per month. Don’t intend on doing this normally just until I get that SUB really.

Reimbursing myself for business expenses, that is.

I’ve worked hard to be in American expresses good graces again, and don’t want to jeopardize that. If it’s an issue then fine, but if I can use it to get that SUB then even better!

Unless what you all are saying is that it’s a YMMV situation then well, I’ll stop because it’s not worth the trouble, I don’t want to lose my cards with them.

Re: AMEX Financial Review

redpat — Sun, 13 May 2018 16:08:59 GMT

OP, you should fine. From your original post I thought you were talking about swiping your own merchant account.

Amex likes usage.

Re: AMEX Financial Review

Anonymous — Mon, 14 May 2018 16:03:49 GMT

Let unpack RedPat's response a bit more;

Amex, doesnt care about you using your personal card to buy post-it notes at Office Depot for your business. Regardless of how your business reimburses you, via check, petty cash, whatever, Amex doesnt care. And truthfully, even from an accounting perspective, is NOTB.

What Amex frownes on is you swiping any card issued to you, business or personal, through your business' merchant account. As in, you have an Amex Gold Rewards card, and you swipe your own card, through the credit card machine your own business' Point Of Sale. This is the No-No.

Re: AMEX Financial Review

Brian_Earl_Spilner — Mon, 14 May 2018 16:05:48 GMT

My company has strict rules about earning rewards. We have corporate cards for fuel and expenses. We are not allowed to earn rewards through them (like our vons rewards at pumps) or use our personal cards for expenses to get rewards and then be reimbursed for them. Though the way I look at it is, if I have to use my personal card for any kind of reason, I should be able to get those rewards as I'm the one fronting the money. They don't actively check, but it cn be a terminal offense due to them looking at it as me getting free money on their dime. I would assume that it would it would trigger an AF if youre company uses AE corporate cards.

Re: AMEX Financial Review

K-in-Boston — Mon, 14 May 2018 16:06:53 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
Let unpack RedPat's response a bit more;

Amex, doesnt care about you using your personal card to buy post-it notes at Office Depot for your business. Regardless of how your business reimburses you, via check, petty cash, whatever, Amex doesnt care. And truthfully, even from an accounting perspective, is NOTB.

What Amex frownes on is you swiping any card issued to you, business or personal, through your business' merchant account. As in, you have an Amex Gold Rewards card, and you swipe your own card, through the credit card machine your own business' Point Of Sale. This is the No-No.

This exactly. Amex is actually fine with you using your personal cards for business expenses, and even for using your business card for personal expenses (for the latter, this is not true of many other lenders).

Re: AMEX Financial Review

GeorgiaBulldog — Mon, 14 May 2018 16:08:17 GMT

@QuakerOatmeal wrote:
So then to be clear, am I in “dangerous territory”? Because that’s precisely what I’m doing, charging business expenses every now and then (like the cable bill or the electric bill) just to keep on track to make the “spend 3,000 dollar SUB”. It’s not *huge* charges every day. Maybe 3 per month. Don’t intend on doing this normally just until I get that SUB really.

Reimbursing myself for business expenses, that is.

I’ve worked hard to be in American expresses good graces again, and don’t want to jeopardize that. If it’s an issue then fine, but if I can use it to get that SUB then even better!

Unless what you all are saying is that it’s a YMMV situation then well, I’ll stop because it’s not worth the trouble, I don’t want to lose my cards with them.

You're fine. My workplace reimburses us for meals on work trips, mileage, and cell phones. I am pretty sure I am the only one in the office who ever puts any of these expenses on a business card. The "using your card at work" thing sounds like swiping your card at a business you own--that will get you shut down quick. Paying bills is totally fine. I wish my employer would let me run more of their expenses through my own cards!

Re: AMEX Financial Review

Brian_Earl_Spilner — Mon, 14 May 2018 16:10:17 GMT

@K-in-Boston wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
Let unpack RedPat's response a bit more;

Amex, doesnt care about you using your personal card to buy post-it notes at Office Depot for your business. Regardless of how your business reimburses you, via check, petty cash, whatever, Amex doesnt care. And truthfully, even from an accounting perspective, is NOTB.

What Amex frownes on is you swiping any card issued to you, business or personal, through your business' merchant account. As in, you have an Amex Gold Rewards card, and you swipe your own card, through the credit card machine your own business' Point Of Sale. This is the No-No.

This exactly. Amex is actually fine with you using your personal cards for business expenses, and even for using your business card for personal expenses (for the latter, this is not true of many other lenders).

U.S. Bank allows it as well, but my company does not. I have a co-worker that paid for his Vegas trip with his corporate card and paid it off next statement. He just got a slap on the wrist and they sent a company-wide memo. Lol

Re: AMEX Financial Review

Anonymous — Mon, 14 May 2018 18:50:12 GMT

OP said:

Another example, my mom is self employed and has an AMEX platinum card.... for years, since about the early 80s and she's a travel agent. Oftentimes when customers pay cash, she'll do the transaction through her AMEX and over the years shes accrued tons and tons of points, would this be bad for her too? Or has she just not triggered this?

Just wondering what "do(es) the transaction" mean here? Does she, e.g. book the trip with an airline using her card or does she have a merchant account (in which case the previous warnings apply). If she is just booking with third parties, to me the danger would be that spend appears too high for declared income, which could generate an FR.

Re: AMEX Financial Review

Anonymous — Mon, 14 May 2018 18:51:28 GMT

I recall a post can't recall if was here or on another board about person who charged co stuff in their amex and then compnay did not pay back for 60 days and the poster did not have cash to pay bill. So long Amex.

Using the biz card for personal is a no no. DW is involved on the board of directors of a group where this happened. Person was fired police report filed. Even if they pay back personal it is no no.

Re: AMEX Financial Review

Anonymous — Mon, 14 May 2018 19:03:53 GMT

Some here are getting confused with the terms.

YOU CAN use your personal card to purchase business related items (AMEX doesn't know if you're buying pencils for you or your business)

YOU CAN'T use your personal card to swipe it using your merchange account.

Re: AMEX Financial Review

UncleB — Mon, 14 May 2018 21:11:46 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
I recall a post can't recall if was here or on another board about person who charged co stuff in their amex and then compnay did not pay back for 60 days and the poster did not have cash to pay bill. So long Amex.

Using the biz card for personal is a no no. DW is involved on the board of directors of a group where this happened. Person was fired police report filed. Even if they pay back personal it is no no.

A company I worked for 'back in the day' had a similar prohibition on using a corporate card for personal charges; generally it was grounds for termination. However this was the company policy, not Amex policy.

A friend I had during that same period who was with another company could use his corporate card for personal purchases with no problems whatsoever, as long as the bill was paid.

What we're trying to drill-down here is if Amex has any issues with what goes on a card... the consensus seems to be that swiping any Amex card on one's own merchant account is always a no-no, however reasonable spending in either direction shouldn't be an issue.

What I do see as a problem (and I think this was mentioned further up by @Anonymous) is if one has spending on a personal card that's wildly out-of-line with what Amex thinks you can pay back based on your income, regardless of if you're being reimbursed or not.

Re: AMEX Financial Review

Anonymous — Mon, 14 May 2018 22:02:24 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
I recall a post can't recall if was here or on another board about person who charged co stuff in their amex and then compnay did not pay back for 60 days and the poster did not have cash to pay bill. So long Amex.

Using the biz card for personal is a no no. DW is involved on the board of directors of a group where this happened. Person was fired police report filed. Even if they pay back personal it is no no.

Far from the truth with Amex. They have encouraged business card card holders to use their business cards for personal expenses.

Re: AMEX Financial Review

wasCB14 — Mon, 14 May 2018 22:36:54 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
I recall a post can't recall if was here or on another board about person who charged co stuff in their amex and then compnay did not pay back for 60 days and the poster did not have cash to pay bill. So long Amex.

Using the biz card for personal is a no no. DW is involved on the board of directors of a group where this happened. Person was fired police report filed. Even if they pay back personal it is no no.
Far from the truth with Amex. They have encouraged business card card holders to use their business cards for personal expenses.

We have two separate issues here...

A business with multiple owners or many employees may have a policy that forbids employees from putting personal spend on a card that is in the business's name (like a corporate card). If the employee pays the card off with personal funds, it's not theft but it may confuse the business's accounting records and still be against the business's rules. If the employee has the business pay the card off, it's theft from the business. Any theft, regardless of the amount, may easily lead to dismissal or legal action. If the business pays the card off and claims a deduction, it could also lead to problems with the IRS if the tax return is incorrect in some manner.

At the other extreme, a sole proprietor may put personal spend on a small business card in the sole proprietor's name. So long as the bill gets paid and the personal spend is not claimed as a business tax deduction, no one really cares.