topic Re: How do you value Amex MR Points? in Credit Cards

How do you value Amex MR Points?

Anonymous — Tue, 22 May 2018 06:59:11 GMT

My only point currency is Chase UR as of now but I'm thinking of diversifying and getting an Amex point earning card. I was looking into the ED card, which best suits my current spending habits and seems like a great no-AF card, but I'm concerned at how much value there is in MR points.

I don't want to sacrifice the opportunity cost of acquiring Chase UR points if the MR points aren't worth it. I plan on using the points for transfer partners such as Delta, JetBlue, BA, SPG, and possibly Hilton; but I'm just torn on whether I'll be spreading myself too thin (i.e not earning enough points with 1 currency for it to be worth it).

My main concern is not "putting all my eggs in one basket" with Chase UR in case of a devaluation. I just wanted to know how people here value MR. Are they really worth the 1.9CPP that 'The Points Guy' values them at? Less/More?

Thanks for the help as usual!

Re: How do you value Amex MR Points?

wasCB14 — Tue, 22 May 2018 08:04:10 GMT

A recent thread I started that might interest you: https://ficoforums.myfico.com/t5/Credit-Cards/Anticipating-point-values/td-p/5239090

I generally prioritize protection benefits over rewards, and I occasionally have some new card or retention bonus to pursue. I will also sometimes use choose a card for organizational more than financial reasons. Normal earn rates are not a terribly high priority for me.

I plan using a 1.99 cpp figure. My average is probably closer to 2.5 or 3. My best is 4.6.

Point values depend on your routes, fare class, and travel frequency. That last one often gets overlooked. The more frequently you look for award travel, the better your odds are of a nice redemption opportunity. I don't (usually) book luxury travel, but I do fly often and generally opportunistically.

Also consider not just redemption values but your actual need for points. I have gotten some great redemptions at Hyatt, but I have more hotel points than I can efficiently use whereas I burn through airline miles. That makes me reluctant to use Hyatt at times when I could be earning miles or cash.

If you want Starwood/Marriott or Hilton points, maybe just earn those directly with a cobrand card with some nice perks. I'd do more research into MRs before getting one of the MR cards. I like MRs, but you might possibly be better off sticking with URs. How have you been using your URs, and what values have you been getting? Or have you been accumulating a huge number of URs?

Re: How do you value Amex MR Points?

Anonymous — Tue, 22 May 2018 08:14:35 GMT

Personally, I got the amex platinum mainly because my home airport has a Centurion lounge. From that perspective, MR points are just gravy. My second point earning setup to Chase UR would probably be Citi TY - I don't value them as much as UR, but for year 1 I have the Premier before I can upgrade to the Prestige. The real saving grace for earning TY points is the Sears MasterCard, which can earn TY points and gets offers seems at least once per year for 10 bonus points back on gas/groceries/restaurants, or 11x TY points.

Re: How do you value Amex MR Points?

Peteyglad — Tue, 22 May 2018 11:10:50 GMT

I would say I value them around 2 CPP and I usually transfer to Delta. I have gotten more than that, but if I can get that then I am happy. Typically if I can't get 2 CPP I will just pay cash for my ticket and use the points another time.

Re: How do you value Amex MR Points?

Loquat — Tue, 22 May 2018 11:24:52 GMT

I agree with CB on this one. While point value is important I would urge you to make sure that you have a plan to use said points. MR points can be valueable if you have a plan for them and redeem them the right way. When I first got in with Amex I used them exclusively and before I knew it I had a lot of MR points and didn't have the foggiest idea of what to do with them.

I don't fly often and when I do its usally dosmestic...and that isn't where MR points really shine. I've seen better value by using them to transfer to airline partners in efforts to bump class on an international flight.

My advice to anyone getting into the MR points arena (or any points arena for that matter) is to look before you leap. I'd hate to see someone end up with lots of MR points and nothing worthwhile to do with them. I floated in that boat for quite some time and it's not fun.

Re: How do you value Amex MR Points?

Anonymous — Tue, 22 May 2018 15:05:28 GMT

@wasCB14 wrote:
A recent thread I started that might interest you: https://ficoforums.myfico.com/t5/Credit-Cards/Anticipating-point-values/td-p/5239090

I generally prioritize protection benefits over rewards, and I occasionally have some new card or retention bonus to pursue. I will also sometimes use choose a card for organizational more than financial reasons. Normal earn rates are not a terribly high priority for me.

I plan using a 1.99 cpp figure. My average is probably closer to 2.5 or 3. My best is 4.6.

Point values depend on your routes, fare class, and travel frequency. That last one often gets overlooked. The more frequently you look for award travel, the better your odds are of a nice redemption opportunity. I don't (usually) book luxury travel, but I do fly often and generally opportunistically.

Also consider not just redemption values but your actual need for points. I have gotten some great redemptions at Hyatt, but I have more hotel points than I can efficiently use whereas I burn through airline miles. That makes me reluctant to use Hyatt at times when I could be earning miles or cash.

If you want Starwood/Marriott or Hilton points, maybe just earn those directly with a cobrand card with some nice perks. I'd do more research into MRs before getting one of the MR cards. I like MRs, but you might possibly be better off sticking with URs. How have you been using your URs, and what values have you been getting? Or have you been accumulating a huge number of URs?

I've just started accumulating URs since October of 2017 with a CF and CFU, and currently have 65,000 points. I don't intend to use them yet so I don't know what value I'm getting as of now, but when I pick up the CSP/CSR sometime this year, I can pool all the points into that and start looking at transfer partners and specific redemptions I may want.

Thanks for the thread you sent, that was helpful! You have a good point about a person's actual "need for points" and I think I need to sit down and crunch the numbers before investing my time and effort into MR.

Re: How do you value Amex MR Points?

Anonymous — Tue, 22 May 2018 15:14:12 GMT

@Loquat wrote:
I agree with CB on this one. While point value is important I would urge you to make sure that you have a plan to use said points. MR points can be valueable if you have a plan for them and redeem them the right way. When I first got in with Amex I used them exclusively and before I knew it I had a lot of MR points and didn't have the foggiest idea of what to do with them.

I don't fly often and when I do its usally dosmestic...and that isn't where MR points really shine. I've seen better value by using them to transfer to airline partners in efforts to bump class on an international flight.

My advice to anyone getting into the MR points arena (or any points arena for that matter) is to look before you leap. I'd hate to see someone end up with lots of MR points and nothing worthwhile to do with them. I floated in that boat for quite some time and it's not fun.

Thanks for the help!

I did some quick looking and found that my goal with MR points is to fly internationally to Europe in business or first class. I definitely see your point about looking at specific redemptions before working with MR. I do want to fly first/business class internationally at one point in the future and earning MR for that feat can be a long term goal. I would likely redeem through Flying Blue or Delta due to their flights to Europe. Moreover, I could use Chase UR for award flights in economy both domestic and international. This way, my MR points have a specific purpose and I'll be able to better justify why they're worth using as a currency.

Re: How do you value Amex MR Points?

wasCB14 — Tue, 22 May 2018 16:40:35 GMT

It's not like MRs are necessarily useless for domestic flights. Delta occasionally has cheap awards, and I can book AA-operated sAAver award flights with British Airways Avios. I'm not really one to call offices of exotic airlines to fish around for award availability (and hope there's no mixup), so I like it that I can book easily with Avios online. I avoid AA's close-in award booking fee that way, too.

Re: How do you value Amex MR Points?

K-in-Boston — Tue, 22 May 2018 17:21:24 GMT

Great points made already and I agree with @wasCB14 in that I'm not one to call a partner like Garuda Indonesia to book a Delta award flight from BOS-ORD. While point values are certainly very important (I'm such an SPG fanboy because of the effective 7-8 cents per point that I've been getting), I can offer two additional things to consider. Booking airfare through Chase or Amex may not offer huge cpp value, but to the airlines those are considered the same as a paid revenue flight and earn miles and elite qualifications. While a non-sale economy Delta flight booked with SkyMiles may be 1.2 cpp, it may be worth only taking the 1 cpp through Amex for the same flight with that taken into consideration. The other thing to consider is how easy it is to rack up the points. Chase makes it pretty easy when you combine a Freedom, Freedom Unlimited and a CSP (or even better, a CSR). Amex also makes it really easy with bonus categories and Amex offers, and even with multipliers for transactions like on the ED and EDP. I'd much rather get 1 cpp from a program that averages me earning 3 points for every dollar I spend than to earn 2.5 cpp from a program where I'm averaging about 1 point per dollar.

For me, my MR cards are relegated to Amex Offers and airfare (5x on Platinum). Branching out into 2 primary programs shouldn't be spreading yourself too thin. My main ones are SPG/Marriott, MRs, URs, and I am now dabbling in TYPs. And if your end goal is Flying Blue (KLM/Air France), all four of those are wonderful because they are all transfer partners.

Re: How do you value Amex MR Points?

Anonymous — Tue, 22 May 2018 17:45:55 GMT

Often the value of any CC reward point is how flexible you are in your travel plans. If you are willing to be patient and spend the time searching for international business/first class seats you can score some very high redemption rates. In December, 2016 I was able to transfer Amex MR points to Virgin America and from there used them to book Virgin Australia business (more like first class as it’s their highest level on this route) for 2 from LA to Sydney at a rate just under $.08 because one there was a bonus transfer rate of 25% at the time and two, we were very flexible on the travel date. I just did a quick check now for redeeming Virgin Atlantic points for same travel and redemption was around $.038. That’s why I know when these points are valued around $.02 that there are a lot of people wasting MR/UR/TY points on statement credits and gift cards. :-/

Re: How do you value Amex MR Points?

wasCB14 — Tue, 22 May 2018 18:08:24 GMT

And, on the note of flexibility, there are often more cheap awards available if you're willing to take an indirect flight (sometimes with a much longer itinerary). I try to avoid them whenever I can fly nonstop, though I did make an exception a few months ago for a cheap Alaska itinerary (fare sale) where I flew solo and had a modest layover at SEA (with Cent lounge access) between SNA and EWR.

(That is, I started in southern California, had a comfortable layover in Seattle, then continued to New Jersey.)

Re: How do you value Amex MR Points?

TheBoondocks — Tue, 22 May 2018 18:49:51 GMT

Yeah, I was thinking whether I should do the min spend for Everyday or the Delta Gold, knowing that Everyday is worth 1.9/2c and Delta at 1.2c, but only reason why I'm getting Everyday is because I also want to transfer to Delta.

I'm willing only to spend $1K, so Everyday incognito is 15k points. And Delta Gold is I believe 35K. Which one would you do? Thanks!

Re: How do you value Amex MR Points?

Anonymous — Tue, 22 May 2018 20:32:18 GMT

@TheBoondocks wrote:
Yeah, I was thinking whether I should do the min spend for Everyday or the Delta Gold, knowing that Everyday is worth 1.9/2c and Delta at 1.2c, but only reason why I'm getting Everyday is because I also want to transfer to Delta.

I'm willing only to spend $1K, so Everyday incognito is 15k points. And Delta Gold is I believe 35K. Which one would you do? Thanks!

Delta is easier to get approved for, EveryDay is more flexible with the points. If you really just want to convert ED to Delta SkyMiles then just app for the Delta card because you'll get more miles that way.

Re: How do you value Amex MR Points?

K-in-Boston — Tue, 22 May 2018 20:37:43 GMT

Assuming that you’d be transferring MRs to SkyMiles and booking economy and would be putting minimal spend on either card, the Delta would be the clear winner. You’d also get perks with the Delta card. If you’d consider spending more for a SUB, there are substantially better offers for both the Gold and Platinum SkyMiles cards, though. While the AF is not waived the first year, the Platinum is a no-brained for most if you fly Main Cabin domestic with a companion at least once a year.

Re: How do you value Amex MR Points?

Anonymous — Tue, 22 May 2018 21:53:27 GMT

@wasCB14 wrote:
It's not like MRs are necessarily useless for domestic flights. Delta occasionally has cheap awards, and I can book AA-operated sAAver award flights with British Airways Avios. I'm not really one to call offices of exotic airlines to fish around for award availability (and hope there's no mixup), so I like it that I can book easily with Avios online. I avoid AA's close-in award booking fee that way, too.

Speaking of booking award travel through alliance partners, are you able to book Alaska award tickets by transferring Amex MR to Virign America?

Re: How do you value Amex MR Points?

wasCB14 — Tue, 22 May 2018 22:05:28 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
@wasCB14 wrote:
It's not like MRs are necessarily useless for domestic flights. Delta occasionally has cheap awards, and I can book AA-operated sAAver award flights with British Airways Avios. I'm not really one to call offices of exotic airlines to fish around for award availability (and hope there's no mixup), so I like it that I can book easily with Avios online. I avoid AA's close-in award booking fee that way, too.
Speaking of booking award travel through alliance partners, are you able to book Alaska award tickets by transferring Amex MR to Virign America?

Virgin America no longer exists as a loyalty program, and Alaska is not an MR partner. Alaska is a 1:1 Starwood transfer partner. However, like most (if not all) Starwood-to-airline transfers, it can take several days for the miles to appear.

Re: How do you value Amex MR Points?

Anonymous — Tue, 22 May 2018 22:08:21 GMT

How about transferring from Emirates then booking award travel on Alaska? I'm not too familiar with booking award travel on partnered airlines and how it all works. Their sites are also quite confusing regarding this.

Re: How do you value Amex MR Points?

wasCB14 — Tue, 22 May 2018 22:18:13 GMT

I have never flown Emirates, nor booked a partner flight through them. I don't even have an account with them, so can't tell you how easy or complicated it would be.

My advice is to not make it too complicated too quickly. You've mentioned an interest in a lot of different airlines and I don't sense you have much loyalty to any of them.

Re: How do you value Amex MR Points?

K-in-Boston — Tue, 22 May 2018 23:57:18 GMT

Most partner awards (and even each program’s own awards) are purposely vague. I’m not a huge fan of Southwest’s model since you can’t get great redemption value, but at least it is VERY easy to understand. I’m not sure about using Emirates to book on Alaska. Generally Alaska is great for booking other airlines, though. Especially if you’re looking for premium cabins on long flights like US to Oceania.

Re: How do you value Amex MR Points?

Anonymous — Wed, 23 May 2018 00:18:29 GMT

@wasCB14 wrote:
I have never flown Emirates, nor booked a partner flight through them. I don't even have an account with them, so can't tell you how easy or complicated it would be.

My advice is to not make it too complicated too quickly. You've mentioned an interest in a lot of different airlines and I don't sense you have much loyalty to any of them.

I see your point. I don't really have any loyalties to any of the airlines I mentioned so I may as well just focus on 1 goal if/when I begin to accrue Amex MR points - to take a flight somewhere on First or Business class with points. That's really my only goal and I don't care which airline I'm taking as long as it's an international flight and it's worth the redemption.