topic Re: Amex FR in Credit Cards

Amex FR

Anonymous — Sun, 17 Jun 2018 00:44:13 GMT

Whatup everybody..So on Fri I was checking out my accounts

and it said charging suspended and to call them. So obviously I called them and sure enough they were conducting a financial review. They asked a bunch of questions and I have to say they were extremely nice. Anyway we went over several charges on my accounts. They asked me several times how much I make which I thought was weird. At the end they requested 3 months bank statements. So my question what is everyones opinion on the FR? Do you think I have anything to worry about. Also what is the time line of these things? Anyway thanks in advance..

Just FYI my income is around 110k and I don't engage in MS.

Re: Amex FR

AverageJoesCredit — Sun, 17 Jun 2018 01:25:54 GMT

What kind of charges were in question if you dont mind sharing?

Re: Amex FR

CreditCuriosity — Sun, 17 Jun 2018 01:31:14 GMT

three months bank statements arent bad vs. 4506 their typical method of FR's.. Assuming you aren't living beyond your means you should come out fine as long as you didn't lie on the application and matches pretty closely to said bank statements you should be good with all you said.

Re: Amex FR

Anonymous — Sun, 17 Jun 2018 02:22:06 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
Whatup everybody..So on Fri I was checking out my accounts
and it said charging suspended and to call them. So obviously I called them and sure enough they were conducting a financial review. They asked a bunch of questions and I have to say they were extremely nice. Anyway we went over several charges on my accounts. They asked me several times how much I make which I thought was weird. At the end they requested 3 months bank statements. So my question what is everyones opinion on the FR? Do you think I have anything to worry about. Also what is the time line of these things? Anyway thanks in advance..

Just FYI my income is around 110k and I don't engage in MS.

Looks like it's time to just drop AMEX.

I don't know why people put up with this stupid crap... People should just laugh at them and go to the one of a million competitors who offer similar products. People should be honest on their application regarding income information, but it's the entire principal of the idea, plus the embarassment of declined transactions because the only other way to find out you have a FR request is through the website.

If people started stepping on AMEX's throat when they insist on doing FR's, they'd either stop doing them or lose a ton of business. Nobody else does FR's as much as AMEX and clearly they're not the company they used to be.

Re: Amex FR

red259 — Sun, 17 Jun 2018 02:16:39 GMT

This post isn't helpful. What charges did they ask about and how much are you running through the amex cards? Carrying any balances with amex or anyone else?

Re: Amex FR

Loquat — Sun, 17 Jun 2018 03:47:24 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
Whatup everybody..So on Fri I was checking out my accounts
and it said charging suspended and to call them. So obviously I called them and sure enough they were conducting a financial review. They asked a bunch of questions and I have to say they were extremely nice. Anyway we went over several charges on my accounts. They asked me several times how much I make which I thought was weird. At the end they requested 3 months bank statements. So my question what is everyones opinion on the FR? Do you think I have anything to worry about. Also what is the time line of these things? Anyway thanks in advance..

Just FYI my income is around 110k and I don't engage in MS.
Looks like it's time to just drop AMEX.

I don't know why people put up with this stupid crap... People should just laugh at them and go to the one of a million competitors who offer similar products. People should be honest on their application regarding income information, but it's the entire principal of the idea, plus the embarassment of declined transactions because the only other way to find out you have a FR request is through the website.

If people started stepping on AMEX's throat when they insist on doing FR's, they'd either stop doing them or lose a ton of business. Nobody else does FR's as much as AMEX and clearly they're not the company they used to be.

I think this advice is a bit of an overstep. I understand some don't want to play the tax transcript game with Amex but this is a simple request for bank statements which is, in my opinion, a lot better than having to turn over your tax info.

If the OP decides to comply or not is completely their choice and it will be respected around these here forums...but suggesting that someone ditch Amex (or any lender) simply because they ask for income verification as they allow your to borrow thousands of unsecured dollars is a bit of an overstep in my opinion.

To the OP, browse the forums and ask questions like you have. Take in all the information you so desire and make an informed decision. Don't let the thoughts and opinions of anyone here outweigh that of your own. Best of luck to you in whatever decision you make.

Re: Amex FR

red259 — Sun, 17 Jun 2018 04:11:10 GMT

Between giving over tax documents and showing a few months of bank statements i'd be more likely to opt for the bank statements, although I'm not sure I would comply with even that. I've been with amex for years and never had an issue and have excellent credit. If they all of a sudden started demanding this stuff I'd probably just tell them to pound pavement because I am not super impressed with their cards. If I was someone with an extremely thin credit profile or extremely high volume of spend in comparison to my limit I would probably comply because then it would be understandable their concern. OP can do what they want as there is no right or wrong answer.

Re: Amex FR

Anonymous — Sun, 17 Jun 2018 04:31:15 GMT

I have 2 questions for the OP if he/she is willing to answer because i'm trying to understand why FR happens at all.

How many accounts do you have with AMEX and approximately for how long?

Do you believe that there is a possibility that the review is happening due to certain charges or a weird change in spending pattern?

Re: Amex FR

red259 — Sun, 17 Jun 2018 04:43:43 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
I have 2 questions for the OP if he/she is willing to answer because i'm trying to understand why FR happens at all.

How many accounts do you have with AMEX and approximately for how long?
Do you believe that there is a possibility that the review is happening due to certain charges or a weird change in spending pattern?

Yea the problem with these threads are people post they got FR'd and then provide scant details which causes a bunch of speculation. Hopefully the OP will come back and answer some of the followup questions. 9 times out of 10 its pretty obvious why an FR happened once you have the details of the surrounding circumstances and knowing what triggered it tends to calm people down.

Re: Amex FR

UpperNwGuy — Sun, 17 Jun 2018 09:04:47 GMT

I agree with the others who have posted. It would be helpful for OP to provide us with more information so we can learn more about what triggers Amex financial reviews.

Re: Amex FR

Anonymous — Sun, 17 Jun 2018 16:27:25 GMT

@Loquat wrote:
@Anonymous
I think this advice is a bit of an overstep. I understand some don't want to play the tax transcript game with Amex but this is a simple request for bank statements which is, in my opinion, a lot better than having to turn over your tax info.

If the OP decides to comply or not is completely their choice and it will be respected around these here forums...but suggesting that someone ditch Amex (or any lender) simply because they ask for income verification as they allow your to borrow thousands of unsecured dollars is a bit of an overstep in my opinion.

To the OP, browse the forums and ask questions like you have. Take in all the information you so desire and make an informed decision. Don't let the thoughts and opinions of anyone here outweigh that of your own. Best of luck to you in whatever decision you make.

True - a bank statement request is better than a tax form request.

And yes, it's their choice on whether to comply or not; however, they're looking for advice. My advice is to just laugh at them and walk away. Nobody should have to jump through hoops for a card unless it's the Centurion Card or the JP Morgan Reserve or something.

Re: Amex FR

CreditCuriosity — Sun, 17 Jun 2018 16:41:47 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
@Loquat wrote:
@Anonymous
I think this advice is a bit of an overstep. I understand some don't want to play the tax transcript game with Amex but this is a simple request for bank statements which is, in my opinion, a lot better than having to turn over your tax info.

If the OP decides to comply or not is completely their choice and it will be respected around these here forums...but suggesting that someone ditch Amex (or any lender) simply because they ask for income verification as they allow your to borrow thousands of unsecured dollars is a bit of an overstep in my opinion.

To the OP, browse the forums and ask questions like you have. Take in all the information you so desire and make an informed decision. Don't let the thoughts and opinions of anyone here outweigh that of your own. Best of luck to you in whatever decision you make.

True - a bank statement request is better than a tax form request.

And yes, it's their choice on whether to comply or not; however, they're looking for advice. My advice is to just laugh at them and walk away. Nobody should have to jump through hoops for a card unless it's the Centurion Card or the JP Morgan Reserve or something.

Providing 3 bank statements is certainly not jumping through hoops.. If more lenders even asked for the basics alot less people with get into credit trouble. Just my 2 cents.. Not saying that is OP's case at all, but blindly trusting an unsecure debt without any proof of assets is risky and putting any lender at risk. Least with a car it is a secured asset and can be repoed. I hardly think it is asking to much for pay stubs

Re: Amex FR

AverageJoesCredit — Sun, 17 Jun 2018 16:38:39 GMT

Lol, if one could be approved for a Centurian card or the JP Morgan Reseve, I dont imagine those individuals jumping through hoops.

Re: Amex FR

Anonymous — Sun, 17 Jun 2018 16:39:00 GMT

@CreditCuriosity wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
@Loquat wrote:
@Anonymous
I think this advice is a bit of an overstep. I understand some don't want to play the tax transcript game with Amex but this is a simple request for bank statements which is, in my opinion, a lot better than having to turn over your tax info.

If the OP decides to comply or not is completely their choice and it will be respected around these here forums...but suggesting that someone ditch Amex (or any lender) simply because they ask for income verification as they allow your to borrow thousands of unsecured dollars is a bit of an overstep in my opinion.

To the OP, browse the forums and ask questions like you have. Take in all the information you so desire and make an informed decision. Don't let the thoughts and opinions of anyone here outweigh that of your own. Best of luck to you in whatever decision you make.

True - a bank statement request is better than a tax form request.

And yes, it's their choice on whether to comply or not; however, they're looking for advice. My advice is to just laugh at them and walk away. Nobody should have to jump through hoops for a card unless it's the Centurion Card or the JP Morgan Reserve or something.
Providing 3 bank statements is certainly not jumping through hoops.. If more lenders even asked for the basics alot less people with get into credit trouble. Just my 2 cents.. Not saying that is OP's case at all, but blindly trusting an unsecure debt without any proof of assets is risky and putter any lender at risk. Least with a car it is a secured asset and can be repoed. I hardly think it is asking to much for pay stubs

Agreed - but do it before lending the money in the first place... Not after the fact.

Re: Amex FR

UpperNwGuy — Sun, 17 Jun 2018 18:47:01 GMT

I agree with mountaindewvoltage. They should do it before the fact. Suddenly shutting down a card without warning for a financial review not only angers the cardholder, but it also creates an embarrasing situation for both retail merchant and customer when the card is denied at the register in front of a line of people.

Re: Amex FR

Loquat — Sun, 17 Jun 2018 23:42:48 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
@CreditCuriosity wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
@Loquat wrote:
@Anonymous
I think this advice is a bit of an overstep. I understand some don't want to play the tax transcript game with Amex but this is a simple request for bank statements which is, in my opinion, a lot better than having to turn over your tax info.

If the OP decides to comply or not is completely their choice and it will be respected around these here forums...but suggesting that someone ditch Amex (or any lender) simply because they ask for income verification as they allow your to borrow thousands of unsecured dollars is a bit of an overstep in my opinion.

To the OP, browse the forums and ask questions like you have. Take in all the information you so desire and make an informed decision. Don't let the thoughts and opinions of anyone here outweigh that of your own. Best of luck to you in whatever decision you make.

True - a bank statement request is better than a tax form request.

And yes, it's their choice on whether to comply or not; however, they're looking for advice. My advice is to just laugh at them and walk away. Nobody should have to jump through hoops for a card unless it's the Centurion Card or the JP Morgan Reserve or something.
Providing 3 bank statements is certainly not jumping through hoops.. If more lenders even asked for the basics alot less people with get into credit trouble. Just my 2 cents.. Not saying that is OP's case at all, but blindly trusting an unsecure debt without any proof of assets is risky and putter any lender at risk. Least with a car it is a secured asset and can be repoed. I hardly think it is asking to much for pay stubs
Agreed - but do it before lending the money in the first place... Not after the fact.

So with your analogy you're saying if a card holder earns a quarter million dollars annually, today, when they apply for a card that should be true and indicative of their future earnings and a lender shouldn't at any point ever request validity of income afterwards?

I know and work with people who are promoted and demoted on regular basis. Companies come and go, people retire, get laid off, terminated, or just flat out quit. I'd be willing to bet that a small percentage of people ever call lenders and report a DECREASE in come. Should a lender continue to let those who have income reduced continue to borrow at the same level in 2018 when their earning a quarter mil even if by next year their not even earning half of that? It's interesting no one has a problem providing income when they're wanting an increase but if the lender wants to verify that you can actually afford the credit given, then game over.

I agree with CC, lenders should ask for a lot more up front and in my opinion should continue to ask for validity thereafter if risk calls for it. Like it or not, as I've said before, their money, their rules. And to those who say to walk away from lenders that do this...if every lender would step up their verification game they could *potentially* weed out those who have problems with compliance and send them back to the debit card world from which they came.

Re: Amex FR

Anonymous — Sun, 17 Jun 2018 23:56:19 GMT

@Loquat wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
@CreditCuriosity wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
@Loquat wrote:
@Anonymous
I think this advice is a bit of an overstep. I understand some don't want to play the tax transcript game with Amex but this is a simple request for bank statements which is, in my opinion, a lot better than having to turn over your tax info.

If the OP decides to comply or not is completely their choice and it will be respected around these here forums...but suggesting that someone ditch Amex (or any lender) simply because they ask for income verification as they allow your to borrow thousands of unsecured dollars is a bit of an overstep in my opinion.

To the OP, browse the forums and ask questions like you have. Take in all the information you so desire and make an informed decision. Don't let the thoughts and opinions of anyone here outweigh that of your own. Best of luck to you in whatever decision you make.

True - a bank statement request is better than a tax form request.

And yes, it's their choice on whether to comply or not; however, they're looking for advice. My advice is to just laugh at them and walk away. Nobody should have to jump through hoops for a card unless it's the Centurion Card or the JP Morgan Reserve or something.
Providing 3 bank statements is certainly not jumping through hoops.. If more lenders even asked for the basics alot less people with get into credit trouble. Just my 2 cents.. Not saying that is OP's case at all, but blindly trusting an unsecure debt without any proof of assets is risky and putter any lender at risk. Least with a car it is a secured asset and can be repoed. I hardly think it is asking to much for pay stubs
Agreed - but do it before lending the money in the first place... Not after the fact.
So with your analogy you're saying if a card holder earns a quarter million dollars annually, today, when they apply for a card that should be true and indicative of their future earnings and a lender shouldn't at any point ever request validity of income afterwards?

I know and work with people who are promoted and demoted on regular basis. Companies come and go, people retire, get laid off, terminated, or just flat out quit. I'd be willing to bet that a small percentage of people ever call lenders and report a DECREASE in come. Should a lender continue to let those who have income reduced continue to borrow at the same level in 2018 when their earning a quarter mil even if by next year their not even earning half of that? It's interesting no one has a problem providing income when they're wanting an increase but if the lender wants to verify that you can actually afford the credit given, then game over.

I agree with CC, lenders should ask for a lot more up front and in my opinion should continue to ask for validity thereafter if risk calls for it. Like it or not, as I've said before, their money, their rules. And to those who say to walk away from lenders that do this...if every lender would step up their verification game they could *potentially* weed out those who have problems with compliance and send them back to the debit card world from which they came.

But (as nearly always) it's also a question of degree. "Ideally" from that viewpoint, everytime you try to make a charge above a small threshold (or perhaps always!) the issuer should ask for proof of current employment, live bank balance, and agreement from all the other issuers that you haven't also just put large charges on their cards. And clearly almost no-one would use such a card, so there has to be some balance between convenience to the user and risk for the bank. Unfortunately banks can't be too transparent about how they evaluate risk, so some people will be flagged, rightly or wrongly, without knowing why.

So, if someone feels that one issuer (say Amex) is being overly sensitive, saying switch to another issuer makes perfect sense to me.

Re: Amex FR

Loquat — Mon, 18 Jun 2018 00:56:15 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
@Loquat wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
@CreditCuriosity wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
@Loquat wrote:
@Anonymous
I think this advice is a bit of an overstep. I understand some don't want to play the tax transcript game with Amex but this is a simple request for bank statements which is, in my opinion, a lot better than having to turn over your tax info.

If the OP decides to comply or not is completely their choice and it will be respected around these here forums...but suggesting that someone ditch Amex (or any lender) simply because they ask for income verification as they allow your to borrow thousands of unsecured dollars is a bit of an overstep in my opinion.

To the OP, browse the forums and ask questions like you have. Take in all the information you so desire and make an informed decision. Don't let the thoughts and opinions of anyone here outweigh that of your own. Best of luck to you in whatever decision you make.

True - a bank statement request is better than a tax form request.

And yes, it's their choice on whether to comply or not; however, they're looking for advice. My advice is to just laugh at them and walk away. Nobody should have to jump through hoops for a card unless it's the Centurion Card or the JP Morgan Reserve or something.
Providing 3 bank statements is certainly not jumping through hoops.. If more lenders even asked for the basics alot less people with get into credit trouble. Just my 2 cents.. Not saying that is OP's case at all, but blindly trusting an unsecure debt without any proof of assets is risky and putter any lender at risk. Least with a car it is a secured asset and can be repoed. I hardly think it is asking to much for pay stubs
Agreed - but do it before lending the money in the first place... Not after the fact.
So with your analogy you're saying if a card holder earns a quarter million dollars annually, today, when they apply for a card that should be true and indicative of their future earnings and a lender shouldn't at any point ever request validity of income afterwards?

I know and work with people who are promoted and demoted on regular basis. Companies come and go, people retire, get laid off, terminated, or just flat out quit. I'd be willing to bet that a small percentage of people ever call lenders and report a DECREASE in come. Should a lender continue to let those who have income reduced continue to borrow at the same level in 2018 when their earning a quarter mil even if by next year their not even earning half of that? It's interesting no one has a problem providing income when they're wanting an increase but if the lender wants to verify that you can actually afford the credit given, then game over.

I agree with CC, lenders should ask for a lot more up front and in my opinion should continue to ask for validity thereafter if risk calls for it. Like it or not, as I've said before, their money, their rules. And to those who say to walk away from lenders that do this...if every lender would step up their verification game they could *potentially* weed out those who have problems with compliance and send them back to the debit card world from which they came.

But (as nearly always) it's also a question of degree. "Ideally" from that viewpoint, everytime you try to make a charge above a small threshold (or perhaps always!) the issuer should ask for proof of current employment, live bank balance, and agreement from all the other issuers that you haven't also just put large charges on their cards. And clearly almost no-one would use such a card, so there has to be some balance between convenience to the user and risk for the bank. Unfortunately banks can't be too transparent about how they evaluate risk, so some people will be flagged, rightly or wrongly, without knowing why.

So, if someone feels that one issuer (say Amex) is being overly sensitive, saying switch to another issuer makes perfect sense to me.

I think we all can agree within reason what is considered extreme. Of course I'm not advocating for a lender to request said info for a pack of gum. But with that being said, the OP hasn't returned to the post and I think all view points have been made. I'll ask that this one be closed to further replies and it seems everything that can be said has been said.

Re: Amex FR

Anonymous — Mon, 18 Jun 2018 00:58:20 GMT

@Loquat wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
@CreditCuriosity wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
@Loquat wrote:
@Anonymous
I think this advice is a bit of an overstep. I understand some don't want to play the tax transcript game with Amex but this is a simple request for bank statements which is, in my opinion, a lot better than having to turn over your tax info.

If the OP decides to comply or not is completely their choice and it will be respected around these here forums...but suggesting that someone ditch Amex (or any lender) simply because they ask for income verification as they allow your to borrow thousands of unsecured dollars is a bit of an overstep in my opinion.

To the OP, browse the forums and ask questions like you have. Take in all the information you so desire and make an informed decision. Don't let the thoughts and opinions of anyone here outweigh that of your own. Best of luck to you in whatever decision you make.

True - a bank statement request is better than a tax form request.

And yes, it's their choice on whether to comply or not; however, they're looking for advice. My advice is to just laugh at them and walk away. Nobody should have to jump through hoops for a card unless it's the Centurion Card or the JP Morgan Reserve or something.
Providing 3 bank statements is certainly not jumping through hoops.. If more lenders even asked for the basics alot less people with get into credit trouble. Just my 2 cents.. Not saying that is OP's case at all, but blindly trusting an unsecure debt without any proof of assets is risky and putter any lender at risk. Least with a car it is a secured asset and can be repoed. I hardly think it is asking to much for pay stubs
Agreed - but do it before lending the money in the first place... Not after the fact.
So with your analogy you're saying if a card holder earns a quarter million dollars annually, today, when they apply for a card that should be true and indicative of their future earnings and a lender shouldn't at any point ever request validity of income afterwards?

I know and work with people who are promoted and demoted on regular basis. Companies come and go, people retire, get laid off, terminated, or just flat out quit. I'd be willing to bet that a small percentage of people ever call lenders and report a DECREASE in come. Should a lender continue to let those who have income reduced continue to borrow at the same level in 2018 when their earning a quarter mil even if by next year their not even earning half of that? It's interesting no one has a problem providing income when they're wanting an increase but if the lender wants to verify that you can actually afford the credit given, then game over.

I agree with CC, lenders should ask for a lot more up front and in my opinion should continue to ask for validity thereafter if risk calls for it. Like it or not, as I've said before, their money, their rules. And to those who say to walk away from lenders that do this...if every lender would step up their verification game they could *potentially* weed out those who have problems with compliance and send them back to the debit card world from which they came.

My analogy says to ask for proof of income before approving the card.

If a lender is so concerned about risk, then lower the credit limit or the "purchasing power." It's easier for the bank to do that, and the cardholder might be a little p'd, but at least they're able to still use their card and not have it suspended for at least a week.

The issue with CLI's is that the cardholder manually requested this action. AMEX seems to just randomly FR people for what seems like no reason at all. I could go charge a pack of gum on my Delta Gold card right now, and that may trigger a FR for all I know.

Could all lenders do what AMEX does? Sure... But the bottom line is that they don't, which is why it's easy to just laugh at AMEX and move to another issuer to put all of your spending through.

Re: Amex FR

yfan — Mon, 18 Jun 2018 01:02:01 GMT

Re: the idea that lenders should do the FR before rather than after lending money. They ARE doing it before lending money, before lending any more money to be precise.