topic Re: AMEX Minimum Payment with Cashback in Credit Cards

AMEX Minimum Payment with Cashback

dlister70 — Thu, 31 Jan 2019 16:54:57 GMT

I'm redeeming cashback on my blue cash card this month, and once I redeem it, I will owe less than what the minimum payment is. So when I pay off the remaining balance, I will not have paid enough to match the minimum payment, but the balance will be zero. I assume this is fine, but I didn't want to risk getting a late payment fee for not making the minimum payment so I asked AMEX chat. They said that I would get the late fee.

I think that the CSR is wrong, but I don't want to risk my perfect payment history to find out. I just went ahead and paid the statement balance, and will let my cashback redemption result in them owing me money on the next statement.

To better illustrate the point, here's some numbers:

Statement balance: $50

Minimum payment: $35

Cashback redemption: $30

So when I redeem the cashback, I'll only have $20 left on the statement balance, which is less than the $35 minimum payment. I don't think it should matter because when I pay the $20 the end result is a zero balance, but can anyone confirm that the CSR is wrong in this instance?

Re: AMEX Minimum Payment with Cashback

FinStar — Thu, 31 Jan 2019 17:01:39 GMT

AFAIK, the cashback redemption applies to the current statement cycle, not the previous one.

So, hypothetically, if you were to have any existing transactions in the current, non-billed statement, those would be offset by the statement credit.

Re: AMEX Minimum Payment with Cashback

CGeorge — Thu, 31 Jan 2019 17:02:29 GMT

Personally, I think that the CSR is wrong.

I would be interested in hearing what others have to say...

Re: AMEX Minimum Payment with Cashback

K-in-Boston — Thu, 31 Jan 2019 17:17:35 GMT

@FinStar wrote:
AFAIK, the cashback redemption applies to the current statement cycle, not the previous one.

So, hypothetically, if you were to have any existing transactions in the current, non-billed statement, those would be offset by the statement credit.

I agree with FinStar that this is more likely to be the way credits are handled. Other lenders like Discover will apply cash back to your account and it will count toward any payment due. Amex is issuing you a credit on your currently open statement period, which ends 25 days prior to your next due date. Average Consumer wouldn't go 25 days on their card without making additional purchases, so in most scenarios this wouldn't really be an issue. But my guts tells me that you would still need to pay the minimum amount due to avoid a late penalty, and you would need to pay the statement balance in full in order to avoid accruing interest and losing your grace period on new purchases.

Assuming you have time prior to the due date, the easiest way to tell this for sure would be to let the credit post and then look on your account to see what numbers appear for "minimum payment due" and "remaining statement balance."

Re: AMEX Minimum Payment with Cashback

SouthJamaica — Thu, 31 Jan 2019 17:41:59 GMT

@dlister70 wrote:
I'm redeeming cashback on my blue cash card this month, and once I redeem it, I will owe less than what the minimum payment is. So when I pay off the remaining balance, I will not have paid enough to match the minimum payment, but the balance will be zero. I assume this is fine, but I didn't want to risk getting a late payment fee for not making the minimum payment so I asked AMEX chat. They said that I would get the late fee.

I think that the CSR is wrong, but I don't want to risk my perfect payment history to find out. I just went ahead and paid the statement balance, and will let my cashback redemption result in them owing me money on the next statement.

To better illustrate the point, here's some numbers:

Statement balance: $50
Minimum payment: $35
Cashback redemption: $30

So when I redeem the cashback, I'll only have $20 left on the statement balance, which is less than the $35 minimum payment. I don't think it should matter because when I pay the $20 the end result is a zero balance, but can anyone confirm that the CSR is wrong in this instance?

When there's a minimum payment due, it has to be paid in money, not in cashback statement credits. Period.

Re: AMEX Minimum Payment with Cashback

dlister70 — Thu, 31 Jan 2019 20:04:41 GMT

@SouthJamaica wrote:
@dlister70 wrote:
I'm redeeming cashback on my blue cash card this month, and once I redeem it, I will owe less than what the minimum payment is. So when I pay off the remaining balance, I will not have paid enough to match the minimum payment, but the balance will be zero. I assume this is fine, but I didn't want to risk getting a late payment fee for not making the minimum payment so I asked AMEX chat. They said that I would get the late fee.

I think that the CSR is wrong, but I don't want to risk my perfect payment history to find out. I just went ahead and paid the statement balance, and will let my cashback redemption result in them owing me money on the next statement.

To better illustrate the point, here's some numbers:

Statement balance: $50
Minimum payment: $35
Cashback redemption: $30

So when I redeem the cashback, I'll only have $20 left on the statement balance, which is less than the $35 minimum payment. I don't think it should matter because when I pay the $20 the end result is a zero balance, but can anyone confirm that the CSR is wrong in this instance?
When there's a minimum payment due, it has to be paid in money, not in cashback statement credits. Period.

If I owed $100, and redeemed $25 cashback.. then obviously I'd still need to pay at least $35 because I still owe more than the minimum payment. But when I only owe $20 left, it seems strange that they'd still want me to pay $35 and then turn around and credit me back $15 of it.

I mean, it's entirely possible that you are correct.. I'm asking because I don't know the answer. But if the minimum payment is more than the balance, I would think that paying the balance would be sufficient to not trigger a late payment. Again, I don't want to test this theory, and I'm just curious if anyone else has already tested it in the past to know the answer for certain.

Re: AMEX Minimum Payment with Cashback

FinStar — Thu, 31 Jan 2019 20:36:51 GMT

FWIW, the answer I provided above is because a similar instance had transpired. However, I was aware, per the T&Cs as to how those redemptions would apply statements-wise, that it didn't matter.

I knew that a statement had already generated whereby the redemption would not count per se, only for the current statement cycle. Since I PIF'd anyways and didn't have any upcoming transactions, I let the statement generate with the credit balance with the redemption and requested a refund. So, the CSR is correct. Up to you if you need more examples or would like to test your theory.

Re: AMEX Minimum Payment with Cashback

MakingProgress — Thu, 31 Jan 2019 20:43:48 GMT

@dlister70 wrote:
@SouthJamaica wrote:
@dlister70 wrote:
I'm redeeming cashback on my blue cash card this month, and once I redeem it, I will owe less than what the minimum payment is. So when I pay off the remaining balance, I will not have paid enough to match the minimum payment, but the balance will be zero. I assume this is fine, but I didn't want to risk getting a late payment fee for not making the minimum payment so I asked AMEX chat. They said that I would get the late fee.

I think that the CSR is wrong, but I don't want to risk my perfect payment history to find out. I just went ahead and paid the statement balance, and will let my cashback redemption result in them owing me money on the next statement.

To better illustrate the point, here's some numbers:

Statement balance: $50
Minimum payment: $35
Cashback redemption: $30

So when I redeem the cashback, I'll only have $20 left on the statement balance, which is less than the $35 minimum payment. I don't think it should matter because when I pay the $20 the end result is a zero balance, but can anyone confirm that the CSR is wrong in this instance?
When there's a minimum payment due, it has to be paid in money, not in cashback statement credits. Period.
If I owed $100, and redeemed $25 cashback.. then obviously I'd still need to pay at least $35 because I still owe more than the minimum payment. But when I only owe $20 left, it seems strange that they'd still want me to pay $35 and then turn around and credit me back $15 of it.

I mean, it's entirely possible that you are correct.. I'm asking because I don't know the answer. But if the minimum payment is more than the balance, I would think that paying the balance would be sufficient to not trigger a late payment. Again, I don't want to test this theory, and I'm just curious if anyone else has already tested it in the past to know the answer for certain.

Have you made any purchases on this card since your last statement cut? To not make the entire min payment your current account balance (not last statement blance) must be a zero. In your example after your cash back credit you have a $20 balance left from the last statement. If you have made a $100.00 purchase since your statment generated your account balance would be $120 and you would need to pay at least the min of $35. If you make NO purchases after your last statement generated and your current statment will close at a 0 balance then you would only need to pay the $20 to bring your account balance to 0.

Of course I could be completely wrong.

Re: AMEX Minimum Payment with Cashback

SouthJamaica — Thu, 31 Jan 2019 20:54:44 GMT

@dlister70 wrote:
@SouthJamaica wrote:
@dlister70 wrote:
I'm redeeming cashback on my blue cash card this month, and once I redeem it, I will owe less than what the minimum payment is. So when I pay off the remaining balance, I will not have paid enough to match the minimum payment, but the balance will be zero. I assume this is fine, but I didn't want to risk getting a late payment fee for not making the minimum payment so I asked AMEX chat. They said that I would get the late fee.

I think that the CSR is wrong, but I don't want to risk my perfect payment history to find out. I just went ahead and paid the statement balance, and will let my cashback redemption result in them owing me money on the next statement.

To better illustrate the point, here's some numbers:

Statement balance: $50
Minimum payment: $35
Cashback redemption: $30

So when I redeem the cashback, I'll only have $20 left on the statement balance, which is less than the $35 minimum payment. I don't think it should matter because when I pay the $20 the end result is a zero balance, but can anyone confirm that the CSR is wrong in this instance?
When there's a minimum payment due, it has to be paid in money, not in cashback statement credits. Period.
If I owed $100, and redeemed $25 cashback.. then obviously I'd still need to pay at least $35 because I still owe more than the minimum payment. But when I only owe $20 left, it seems strange that they'd still want me to pay $35 and then turn around and credit me back $15 of it.

I mean, it's entirely possible that you are correct.. I'm asking because I don't know the answer. But if the minimum payment is more than the balance, I would think that paying the balance would be sufficient to not trigger a late payment. Again, I don't want to test this theory, and I'm just curious if anyone else has already tested it in the past to know the answer for certain.

No I have never tested it. But I read the "terms and conditions" and "disclosures" and the like, and they always say that the redemption does not apply towards the minimum payment due.

And guess what it says for your Amex Blue Cash Everyday card:

"You cannot use cash back to pay your Minimum Due."

Re: AMEX Minimum Payment with Cashback

Anonymous — Thu, 31 Jan 2019 21:00:05 GMT

Copied and pasted directly from Amex:

You can redeem reward dollars for statement credits
whenever your total available reward dollar balance
is 25 or more. The statement credit will appear on
your Card Account within 3 days and will apply to the
billing period in which it appears. Reward Dollars
redeemed for a statement credit cannot be used to
pay your Minimum Payment Due.

Re: AMEX Minimum Payment with Cashback

Anonymous — Thu, 31 Jan 2019 21:16:31 GMT

If you're still unsure, always go by "Minimum Due" and "Remaining Statement Balance", if the cashback credit counts, the amount will be deducted from the amount due as if you made a mid-cycle payment. In this case, it will not because cashback credit can't be use for minimum or previous balance, you will still need to pay the full amount listed on your dashboard.

Re: AMEX Minimum Payment with Cashback

Anonymous — Thu, 31 Jan 2019 23:26:49 GMT

I posted a very similar question a few days ago, and started to go through my history to see how cashback was treated. I knew I had done similar things before, but thought it was on another card. then I found this:

The top portion is my actual statement, and the bottom is the "recent activity" page. You can see that I paid less than the statement balance, and made the rest up with credits. I never saw any changes due to this (late payment, interest, etc). I suppose that since what I paid would have covered the minimum it is a bit different, but it does make me question how these things work vs how the CSRs I spoke with said they do regarding statement credits.

Re: AMEX Minimum Payment with Cashback

NRB525 — Fri, 01 Feb 2019 00:05:22 GMT

There is a simple solution, keep using the card for purchases.

Re: AMEX Minimum Payment with Cashback

SouthJamaica — Fri, 01 Feb 2019 03:24:58 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
I posted a very similar question a few days ago, and started to go through my history to see how cashback was treated. I knew I had done similar things before, but thought it was on another card. then I found this:

The top portion is my actual statement, and the bottom is the "recent activity" page. You can see that I paid less than the statement balance, and made the rest up with credits. I never saw any changes due to this (late payment, interest, etc). I suppose that since what I paid would have covered the minimum it is a bit different, but it does make me question how these things work vs how the CSRs I spoke with said they do regarding statement credits.

In that example you paid much more than the minimum payment.

Of course the cash back statement credit gets credited to the account; it's just that you need to pay at least the minimum payment in actual money.

Re: AMEX Minimum Payment with Cashback

dlister70 — Fri, 01 Feb 2019 04:48:39 GMT

@K-in-Boston wrote:
@FinStar wrote:
AFAIK, the cashback redemption applies to the current statement cycle, not the previous one.

So, hypothetically, if you were to have any existing transactions in the current, non-billed statement, those would be offset by the statement credit.
Assuming you have time prior to the due date, the easiest way to tell this for sure would be to let the credit post and then look on your account to see what numbers appear for "minimum payment due" and "remaining statement balance."

Ah, I hadn't thought of that. That certainly would tell the tale of what they were expecting in terms of minimum payment. I'm thinking the minimum payment would have changed to be the same as the remaining card balance. However, I already paid the thing in full and just figured that I'd let the cashback be a statement credit for the future.

I don't intend to use the AMEX card for the next two months since Discover is doing supermarket for their first quarter, so it wasn't as though the extra was going to apply to upcoming charges either, which is what prompted the question.

I guess they can just send me a check if the credit stays on there too long.

Re: AMEX Minimum Payment with Cashback

Anonymous — Fri, 01 Feb 2019 19:24:57 GMT

When I decided I was gonna stop using my BCP card and focus on points instead of cashback I made sure I got to a reward balance of $23.50 and then bought a $25 gift card at a grocery store ($25 x 6% = $1.50 plus my reward balance of $23.50 got me to the minimum $25 redemption level). I had to wait for the statement date to hit to get the rewards for the gift card and my statement said minimum payment $25.

I didn't even think about it and just used the rewards to pay the balance to $0 with no cash payment and I can tell you I was never hit with a late payment or anything.

If you are really curious in the future, in the middle of the main page of your account dashboard is a box that says Payment Required. If that box says no payment required you're good and if it still shows some sort of balance then you need to pay it.

Re: AMEX Minimum Payment with Cashback

jamesdwi — Sat, 02 Feb 2019 01:19:11 GMT

Simplist solution is to pay the minimum payment now, let the credit hit, and if the balance goes negative and you don't use the card, AMEX will cut you a check in few weeks. Problem solved.

Re: AMEX Minimum Payment with Cashback

Billybob_TX — Sat, 02 Feb 2019 02:00:03 GMT

Yes, just pay the minimum and the other cash will give you a credit balance. You will have a credit balance until you buy something else. I often pay a few bucks more than I owe so that when the statement hits it takes care of any interest also.

Re: AMEX Minimum Payment with Cashback

NRB525 — Sat, 02 Feb 2019 13:18:45 GMT

@dlister70 wrote:
@K-in-Boston wrote:
@FinStar wrote:
AFAIK, the cashback redemption applies to the current statement cycle, not the previous one.

So, hypothetically, if you were to have any existing transactions in the current, non-billed statement, those would be offset by the statement credit.

I don't intend to use the AMEX card for the next two months since Discover is doing supermarket for their first quarter, so it wasn't as though the extra was going to apply to upcoming charges either, which is what prompted the question.

I guess they can just send me a check if the credit stays on there too long.

You buy things at other places besides grocery, correct? The card still gets 1% on General spend, and even if you have a 3% Everything card, a $30 charge added to the BCE isn’t going to affect your overall reward earning.

Re: AMEX Minimum Payment with Cashback

kdm31091 — Sat, 02 Feb 2019 13:59:41 GMT

If you use the statement credit and wipe our purchases on your existing statement (i.e. the one that has not processed yet), you wouldn't have to pay anything. What AMEX is referring to is that once you owe money (the statement has closed), using a credit doesn't count as a payment against your balance. It reduces the balances but you still have to pay.

I would just use the card enough to get to a positive balance and then it's done and over with. Lost rewards will be neglible.