topic Re: Beginner Travel Card in Credit Cards

Beginner Travel Card

Anonymous — Thu, 21 May 2020 12:06:57 GMT

I just recently got the CFU in April $1700 SL and Amex Everyday $2000 SL in May. I am currently a college student and will be traveling abroad twice in the next 2 years and looking for a beginner travel card that offers some cool perks. I was looking at the BofA Premium Rewards but have seen many people get denied. I have also looked at the CapOne Venture but I'm worried about them being inquiry sensitive?

I have 4 inquiries in the last 12 months. One was for my apartment at school. The other 3 - 2 mentioned above - and BofA Cash Rewards in October $1500 SL. I have relationship with BofA and am preapproved for the BofA Premium Rewards. I won't be getting another card until September. Appreciate any insight you guys may have into other cards, odds, etc. The only other card I have is a DiscoverIT Student from April of last year with $3100 CL.

I wanted the Amex Gold but the reason I won't be getting that even though it makes sense is that there's never a downgrade option and I don't want to tie myself down so early with a forced AF card. My worry with CSP is that I don’t 1 have enough history with them and 2 won’t be able to qualify for $5000 SL. I don’t know though

Uti: <1%

AAoA: <1 year because of recent inquiries

Score through Experian ~740

Re: Beginner Travel Card

Brian_Earl_Spilner — Thu, 21 May 2020 12:41:05 GMT

Not understanding what you're saying about the gold. You can always downgrade, it's just recommended to wait until the 13th month, when the second AF hits. At its current 35k sub, at worst redemption, which is for cash, you'll still get the equivalent of $210. Transferring it to most partners will equal $310. That's not including taking advantage of the $120 dining and the $100 airline credits. Getting an upgraded sub of 45k ups it to $270 and $450, respectively. It's not hard to offset the AF the first year, which is why many will take the gold for the sub and downgrade to the green the second year.

Re: Beginner Travel Card

Anonymous — Thu, 21 May 2020 12:48:13 GMT

I could definitely get positive EV from the Gold Card. But if I get it right now then I'm stuck paying the AF forever - since even if I downgrade to a Green there's still an AF. I don’t know if i want a forced AF card as my 5th card because I don't ever want to have to cancel my first cards. I also would rather apply for the Platinum to get higher offer and then downgrade to gold year after for better SUB but I wouldn't be able to get that right now imo.

Re: Beginner Travel Card

TSlop — Thu, 21 May 2020 13:05:34 GMT

I'm personally not worried about HPs, so if I saw a pre-approval for the PR, I'd go for it. It's one of my favorite cards and will be my go-to when I qualify for preferred rewards.

I don't know if your relationship with BoA includes a wealth management adviser, but if it does, you could talk to him/her about applying as well. Mine asked me about it once and I informed him I already had it. I like to believe they can help "push" a decision if it wasn't going the right way for you. This is how I got my very first credit card at PNC. I was denied for it back around 2006 and when I got a car loan the same year, the person at the bank asked if I wanted to get a credit card. I said I was denied previously and he went away and then came back and said he got me approved. YMMV.

As for what to suggest if you don't go with the PR, I'm sure others have/will chime in.

Re: Beginner Travel Card

Brian_Earl_Spilner — Thu, 21 May 2020 13:35:48 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
I could definitely get positive EV from the Gold Card. But if I get it right now then I'm stuck paying the AF forever - since even if I downgrade to a Green there's still an AF. I don’t know if i want a forced AF card as my 5th card because I don't ever want to have to cancel my first cards. I also would rather apply for the Platinum to get higher offer and then downgrade to gold year after for better SUB but I wouldn't be able to get that right now imo.

Not getting your logic. The CSP has an annual fee as well. Nobody offers a downgrade sub and unlike chase, amex will offer you upgrade and retention offers fairly consistently which is why churners will downgrade and upgrade every year to take advantage of it.

Re: Beginner Travel Card

Remedios — Thu, 21 May 2020 13:39:24 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
I could definitely get positive EV from the Gold Card. But if I get it right now then I'm stuck paying the AF forever - since even if I downgrade to a Green there's still an AF. I don’t know if i want a forced AF card as my 5th card because I don't ever want to have to cancel my first cards. I also would rather apply for the Platinum to get higher offer and then downgrade to gold year after for better SUB but I wouldn't be able to get that right now imo.

What exactly is "forced AF"?

Re: Beginner Travel Card

Anonymous — Thu, 21 May 2020 14:07:16 GMT

If I was to get any AMEX charge card right now, in order to keep that account open I have to pay an annual fee every year for as long as I keep it. Since I've recently started my credit career whatever accounts I open right now I want to keep forever. Therefore I'm stuck paying an AF forever because I won't want to close this account in 10 years due to its length. But if I get another card woth an AF w/ downgrade option to no annual fee I can sock drawer it and not have to worry whatsoever about keeping it open/closing it.

Re: Beginner Travel Card

Anonymous — Thu, 21 May 2020 14:09:13 GMT

Yes, but it can be downgraded to a freedom if I wasn't getting positive EV or wanted to use something else ( Maybe Amex down the line) Didn't know about the retention offers and upgrade/downgrade. Definitely going to look into that as that adds a lot of value to offset the AF. Thanks

Re: Beginner Travel Card

Remedios — Thu, 21 May 2020 14:19:40 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
If I was to get any AMEX charge card right now, in order to keep that account open I have to pay an annual fee every year for as long as I keep it. Since I've recently started my credit career whatever accounts I open right now I want to keep forever. Therefore I'm stuck paying an AF forever because I won't want to close this account in 10 years due to its length. But if I get another card woth an AF w/ downgrade option to no annual fee I can sock drawer it and not have to worry whatsoever about keeping it open/closing it.

You cannot have your cake and eat it.

You're not "stuck" paying it, you get something in return for it, and no one is forcing you to apply for any card with AF.

Keeping cards forever is silly, romantic notion. Benefits change, get nerfed, none of it is static.

Honestly, I would just stick with no AF cards in your case for the time being.

AF is not a punishment, you're trading AF for perks and additional benefits those cards provide.

Give yourself some time until you get a better understanding and see what works for you.

Re: Beginner Travel Card

Anonymous — Thu, 21 May 2020 14:22:23 GMT

I understand no one forces you to pay it and that's why I mentioned I wasn't going to get it lol. I'm just trying to build a good card foundation that I can keep forever to maintain my AAoA and not have to pay any AF for these cards. Later once I have more time under my belt I can afford to apply for cards and eventually cancel them and have them have less of an impact.

Re: Beginner Travel Card

FieryDance — Thu, 21 May 2020 17:21:22 GMT

I share your idea that it is not ideal to get cards without free downgrade paths when you are starting out, trying to build up AAoA. My recommendations to college aged folks: if you have options, opt for a no AF Visa or MasterCard from a large national bank with flexible PC options.

Now I don't know what your definition of a beginner travel card is but I'd imagine to a college student it's more about money saving and budget travel rather than status, lounge access or luxury. If that's the case, a free cash back card may fit your needs better than most "travel" cards.

BoA PR is essentially a cash back card but with an AF and I would only recommend it if you are at least Platinum with BoA. If you want to try out Chase's system, get the Chase trifecta by adding a CSP and a Freedom. Reevaluate after one year, you will have the option to upgrade the CSP to CSR or downgrade to CF/CFU. IMO UR is easier for beginners than MR because you have access to Chase portal and cash back as options.

Re: Beginner Travel Card

Anonymous — Fri, 22 May 2020 07:59:53 GMT

Among no annual fee cards, Bank of America Cash Rewards set to Travel earns 3% (more if you have money with them or Merrill such as an IRA) on a wide variety of travel merchants (biggies plus garages, toll booths, amusement parks, taxis, AirBNB, Uber, etc). These come in Mastercard (basic, MLB) and Visa (Komen, US Pride, Wildlife). They also provide a nice sign up bonus of 15-20% on the first $500 or $1000 of spending.

If you are a Costco member, the Citi Costco Anywhere card is no AF and earns 3% on a smaller group of key travel merchants such as airlines, hotels, car rentals, travel agencies and cruise lines. It also earns 4% at the gas pump at Costco.

*************

Among cards with smaller annual fees, it's hard to beat the Chase World of Hyatt card, especially if it is a daily driver and you spend $15K on the card per year.

For $95, you get one free Hyatt night certificate per year worth 15,000 points. Hyatt points are worth 1.7 cents, so that's $255 in value. In addition, you earn 2x Hyatt points (3.4%) at restaurants, gyms, transit and airlines. The card provides certain travel insurance like trip cancellation, trip delay, lost baggage and delayed baggage. The card also provides points and status at Hyatt meaning you earn 16.2% back on paid Hyatt stays.

If you spend $15,000 per year on the card, you get a 2nd free night certificate worth 15,000 points. It's like earning 1x more Hyatt point per dollar on the first $15K. So now you earn 2x everywhere (3.4%), 3x or 5.1% on restaurants, flights, gyms and transit, and 17.9% back on paid Hyatt stays.

It's the best low annual fee hotel card on the market.

Re: Beginner Travel Card

NRB525 — Fri, 22 May 2020 08:40:49 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
Among no annual fee cards, Bank of America Cash Rewards set to Travel earns 3% (more if you have money with them or Merrill such as an IRA) on a wide variety of travel merchants (biggies plus garages, toll booths, amusement parks, taxis, AirBNB, Uber, etc). These come in Mastercard (basic, MLB) and Visa (Komen, US Pride, Wildlife). They also provide a nice sign up bonus of 15-20% on the first $500 or $1000 of spending.

If you are a Costco member, the Citi Costco Anywhere card is no AF and earns 3% on a smaller group of key travel merchants such as airlines, hotels, car rentals, travel agencies and cruise lines. It also earns 4% at the gas pump at Costco.

*************
Among cards with smaller annual fees, it's hard to beat the Chase World of Hyatt card, especially if it is a daily driver and you spend $15K on the card per year.

For $95, you get one free Hyatt night certificate per year worth 15,000 points. Hyatt points are worth 1.7 cents, so that's $255 in value. In addition, you earn 2x Hyatt points (3.4%) at restaurants, gyms, transit and airlines. The card provides certain travel insurance like trip cancellation, trip delay, lost baggage and delayed baggage. The card also provides points and status at Hyatt meaning you earn 16.2% back on paid Hyatt stays.

If you spend $15,000 per year on the card, you get a 2nd free night certificate worth 15,000 points. It's like earning 1x more Hyatt point per dollar on the first $15K. So now you earn 2x everywhere (3.4%), 3x or 5.1% on restaurants, flights, gyms and transit, and 17.9% back on paid Hyatt stays.

It's the best low annual fee hotel card on the market.

WoH is an awesome card. I have one. But WoH is VISA Siggy, same $5k concern as CSP.

Re: Beginner Travel Card

NRB525 — Fri, 22 May 2020 08:44:45 GMT

Paging Capital One Quicksilver. In the category of no AF, no FTF, works everywhere card, that is Not VISA Siggy, it's really hard to beat.

Re: Beginner Travel Card

MrT_521 — Fri, 22 May 2020 10:02:39 GMT

You mention that you're planning to take two international trips in the next two years. This means that if you get a credit card with an AF, you can expect to pay the AF for two years to cover both trips, even if you get it with the intention of downgrading later. Two trips in two years is a very light schedule, and hardly worth making it an important bullet point in your search. I do not think I would look for a travel card specifically.

Personally, I think you'll do better ignoring the travel aspect of your search, with the possible exception of choosing something with no foreign transaction fee. Look for a card with a good cash back rewards. Also, a good SUB is beneficial, assuming you can meet the MSR. However, even the value of a SUB isn't so important when you plan to keep the card forever.

I am an expat and so I prioritize cards with no FTF, but as I travel internationally fairly often, I don't mind paying an AF for good travel benefits. Many of my cards have either an AF or a FTF, but two that I have without either are Capital One QuickSilver and HSBC Cash Rewards Mastercard. There are many more too. You specifically mentioned being leery of Capital One, but I would highly recommend their QuickSilver credit card.

Re: Beginner Travel Card

Anonymous — Fri, 22 May 2020 13:42:40 GMT

Definitely want to get in with Capital One... j worried they won't like my inquiries. As for the WoH I'm worried about it being a VS. I think I'd be able to cover low AF cards as I'd be flying to South Africa and Europe (more than one flight in Europe) and would easily spend ~1500 for those flights. I think I'm going to try for the CapOne Venture and then downgrade

Re: Beginner Travel Card

NRB525 — Fri, 22 May 2020 16:05:21 GMT

Good luck on the application, Venture has a nice SUB.

However Venture is WEMC, which leads to the same $5k minium limit issues. It is also an "advanced" Cap One card. If someone has a credit file with other larger limit cards, that can be successful. For a first CapOne just starting out, I'm not sure I'd go there just yet.

The Quicksilver has no minimum CL, earns you 1.5% everywhere, which is nearly the same as Venture, no AF, no FTF. Spend some time with the QS, like 12 months, and Venture should be a shoe-in.

Re: Beginner Travel Card

Anonymous — Fri, 22 May 2020 16:15:14 GMT

I did not know this! Glad I found out now. I will probably just try and create a relationship with them with their lower tier cards. I'm looking to try and get my first 5k card so I can potentially get approved down the line. I'm going to try the Amex 3x but hope that everything going on right now doesn't ruin my chances as I'll be eligible in July

Re: Beginner Travel Card

Anonymous — Fri, 22 May 2020 16:37:12 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
If I was to get any AMEX charge card right now, in order to keep that account open I have to pay an annual fee every year for as long as I keep it. Since I've recently started my credit career whatever accounts I open right now I want to keep forever. Therefore I'm stuck paying an AF forever because I won't want to close this account in 10 years due to its length. But if I get another card woth an AF w/ downgrade option to no annual fee I can sock drawer it and not have to worry whatsoever about keeping it open/closing it.

As time goes on, you may want to consider the assumption I noted in bold above. There are arguments about keeping your first card(s) for as long as you can, and there is some merit to that argument, but it is not as simple as some may think. Even if your first card(s) ends up being closed, you do benefit from the payment history of it on your report (assuming that record is positive). It will stay on your report for 10 years after it is closed. Now, opening and closing cards does impact your Average Age of Accounts (AAoA), but that portion of the FICO scoring model has a lower percentage when compared to the impact of account payment history.

This information leads many (inlcuding me) to argue that one does not need to keep their first card(s) open for life (or even 10 years), as long as one considers the implications of closing and opening cards. These actions do impact a younger, thin file more than an older, thick file, so you still need to be cautious at your stage in your credit journey. However, this information means you do not need to be stuck with any cards. It all depends on how you weigh all relevant factors pertaining to your finances and your preferences. Just make sure to keep up good payment history and good credit use habits.

Re: Beginner Travel Card

Brian_Earl_Spilner — Fri, 22 May 2020 17:51:41 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
I did not know this! Glad I found out now. I will probably just try and create a relationship with them with their lower tier cards. I'm looking to try and get my first 5k card so I can potentially get approved down the line. I'm going to try the Amex 3x but hope that everything going on right now doesn't ruin my chances as I'll be eligible in July

You may not be able to get the QS right out of the gate. I believe they require 3 years of credit history or 3 years with a certain card limit before they'll approve you for one of their prime cards. You may have to go with a Platinum and then upgrade it in about 4 months to a QS. That's what I did to get one.