topic Re: Getting balance chased because of AMEX in Credit Cards

Getting balance chased because of AMEX

Anonymous — Mon, 29 Jun 2020 12:11:49 GMT

I had a auto loan. I had it paid to 10%. I had no inquires.

I bought a new vehicle with one inquiry from my credit union. I was at 70% LTV on the vehicle.

Total loan is $20,000

I got a personal inquiry from the PPP loan from .GOV for my business. all within a month

So two inquiries.

History on me is My credit is 788 no late payments.

I have a high income this year and last year. Gross will be very large

I made 80k 2018. 2019 I made more. Made a gross of $230k for the first six months of this year

I had a balance on my AMEX of $3,800. My limit was $25,700

I got a email from them and check my account and they dropped the limit to $3820

I paid the account in full to zero balance. I had a platinum card from them and cancelled that

I called them and they said they would review it. I get a call back from them and they will fix it possibly but I need to provide all these income documents for all my income, assets, and business income (would cost me money to get my accountant to do it for me).Plus I really think everything they asked for is invasive for the small amount they are willing to lend me ($25,700 credit limit). So I tell them forget

I get a warning from myfico about getting balanced chased because my limit dropped.

Now I get a notice for Chase. I check my account and balance chased again. I paid in full.

I assume now discover is going to see I am getting balance chased and drop my limit (owe $2999 limit is $23,000)

What can I do to save my discover account?

Only thing that changed was the two inquires and the new auto loan.

Re: Getting balance chased because of AMEX

Brian_Earl_Spilner — Mon, 29 Jun 2020 12:09:29 GMT

How long have you been carrying balances?

Re: Getting balance chased because of AMEX

coldfusion — Mon, 29 Jun 2020 12:14:01 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
I had a auto loan. I had it paid to 10%. I had no inquires.
I bought a new vehicle with one inquiry from my credit union. I was at 70% LTV on the vehicle.
Total loan is $20,000
I got a personal inquiry from the PPP loan from .GOV for my business. all within a month
So two inquiries.

History on me is My credit is 788 no late payments.
I have a high income this year and last year. Gross will be very large
I made 80k 2018. 2019 I made more. Made a gross of $230k for the first six months of this year

I had a balance on my AMEX of $3,800. My limit was $25,700
I got a email from them and check my account and they dropped the limit to $3820
I paid the account in full to zero balance.

I called them and they said they would review it. I get a call back from them and they will fix it possibly but I need to provide all these income documents for all my income, assets, and business income (would cost me money to get my accountant to do it for me).Plus I really think everything they asked for is invasive for the small amount they are willing to lend me ($25,700 credit limit). So I tell them forget
I get a warning from myfico about getting balanced chased because my limit dropped.

Now I get a notice for Chase. I check my account and balance chased again. I paid in full.
I assume now discover is going to see I am getting balance chased and drop my limit (owe $2999 limit is $23,000)

What can I do to save my discover account?
Only thing that changed was the two inquires and the new auto loan.

What about the PPP loan? You scared the lenders with your additional loans compounded by you already carrying balances, which is why AMEX wanted to perform a financial review.

About all you can do is cross your fingers and hope that you don't get balance chased by Discover and if you do to call and plead your case.

Re: Getting balance chased because of AMEX

Anonymous — Mon, 29 Jun 2020 12:16:23 GMT

I am never over six percent of my total credit limits across the accounts. That card had heavy use but I kept the balance relatively low. Always paid below 4K. If I should pay off my discover I will do that now. Just don't know what to do

Re: Getting balance chased because of AMEX

Anonymous — Mon, 29 Jun 2020 12:18:41 GMT

I actually did not get the PPP loan. I have a inquiry. It was for the $1000 per employee they gave me. It's not a loan I need to pay back and nothing shows up on my credit outside of the inquiry

Re: Getting balance chased because of AMEX

Anonymous — Mon, 29 Jun 2020 12:19:09 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
I had a auto loan. I had it paid to 10%. I had no inquires.
I bought a new vehicle with one inquiry from my credit union. I was at 70% LTV on the vehicle.
Total loan is $20,000
I got a personal inquiry from the PPP loan from .GOV for my business. all within a month
So two inquiries.

History on me is My credit is 788 no late payments.
I have a high income this year and last year. Gross will be very large
I made 80k 2018. 2019 I made more. Made a gross of $230k for the first six months of this year

I had a balance on my AMEX of $3,800. My limit was $25,700
I got a email from them and check my account and they dropped the limit to $3820
I paid the account in full to zero balance.

I called them and they said they would review it. I get a call back from them and they will fix it possibly but I need to provide all these income documents for all my income, assets, and business income (would cost me money to get my accountant to do it for me).Plus I really think everything they asked for is invasive for the small amount they are willing to lend me ($25,700 credit limit). So I tell them forget
I get a warning from myfico about getting balanced chased because my limit dropped.

Now I get a notice for Chase. I check my account and balance chased again. I paid in full.
I assume now discover is going to see I am getting balance chased and drop my limit (owe $2999 limit is $23,000)

What can I do to save my discover account?
Only thing that changed was the two inquires and the new auto loan.

#1 - breathe - it'll be ok.

#2 - Remember correlation does not imply causation

LOTS of folks with high incomes and potentially artifically high credit lines are having AA taken against them, usually in the form of CLD. They *likely* aren't intentionally balance chasing you. They are reducing their risk in a time when they think they're about to get skinned alive by people defaulting.

If you haven't been *USING* the credit line and just paying down a balance, or if you have been using it, but not nearly up to its credit line, I suspect the issuers decided - independently - to review lines, as they are reviewing *EVERYONE'S* lines.

Just call chase - they have been reversing CLDs for some folks. Discover likely will as well, if they CLD you.

It is a sign of the times, not one issuer following the other BECAUSE of action taken by the other. Again - your profile probably looks risky to them. Remember - LAST time they took a massive haircut (think 08) it was folks in your profile that caused a lot of losses for them. High credit limits, high incomes, all of a sudden losing those incomes, running up their debt, and deciding to default on obligations.

Provide the income verification they ask for, and as long as your income relatively matches what you *told* them your income was, you'll be fine.

(this happened to me last year... someone had to talk me down from the ledge, too... [ahem - she was quite a bit less gentle than this... @Remedios ] because surely, one did it because the other did it... was Amex and Chase - just like here... after MUCH discussion, I finally realized it was more likely they both responded to the same stimuli - in my case, new accounts in my credit file - in other words, my own doing. In your case, they're looking at market conditions, income, and the type of profile that screwed them last time they took a bath).

Re: Getting balance chased because of AMEX

Brian_Earl_Spilner — Mon, 29 Jun 2020 12:22:23 GMT

Utilization is only part of it. Doesn't matter if you keep it below 4k if it never gets paid or cycled off. Amex will just see that even though you're never paying them off, you're applying for more credit. Chase is being proactive. I doubt discover will do anything, but who knows in the current economic climate.

Re: Getting balance chased because of AMEX

Remedios — Mon, 29 Jun 2020 12:56:18 GMT

@Anonymous That's rough, I'm sorry

I know you said you carried some balance on your Amex card, but did your spending increase as your income increased? How about on charge card?

While Chase is not a fan of escalating balances, your balance with them really isnt in the amounts they typically start responding to with AA, even if Amex does it.

It's very strange.

I dont think you have to worry about Discover, especially because you paid closed accounts, your utilization will not spike, and if you dont owe them money, I just dont see Disco jumping in

Re: Getting balance chased because of AMEX

Anonymous — Mon, 29 Jun 2020 13:07:35 GMT

@Remedios wrote:
@Anonymous That's rough, I'm sorry

I know you said you carried some alance on your Amex card, but did your spending increase as your income increased? How about on charge card?

While Chase is not a fan of escalating balances, your balance with them really isnt in the amounts they typically start responding to with AA, even if Amex does it.
It's very strange.

I dont think you have to worry about Discover, especially because you paid closed accounts, your utilization will not spike, and if you dont owe them money, I just dont see Disco jumping in

My spending has stayed similar. I owe discover $2999. Should I pay it off now?

Re: Getting balance chased because of AMEX

Remedios — Mon, 29 Jun 2020 13:16:38 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:

@Remedios wrote:
@Anonymous That's rough, I'm sorry

I know you said you carried some alance on your Amex card, but did your spending increase as your income increased? How about on charge card?

While Chase is not a fan of escalating balances, your balance with them really isnt in the amounts they typically start responding to with AA, even if Amex does it.
It's very strange.

I dont think you have to worry about Discover, especially because you paid closed accounts, your utilization will not spike, and if you dont owe them money, I just dont see Disco jumping in
My spending has stayed similar. I owe discover $2999. Should I pay it off now?

I dont think you have to pay the entire amount unless you want to, but do make a sizable payment, maybe 50% of your balance.

Paying in full is probably a safer alternative.

Re: Getting balance chased because of AMEX

recoveringfrombk7 — Mon, 29 Jun 2020 13:51:05 GMT

@coldfusion wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
I had a auto loan. I had it paid to 10%. I had no inquires.
I bought a new vehicle with one inquiry from my credit union. I was at 70% LTV on the vehicle.
Total loan is $20,000
I got a personal inquiry from the PPP loan from .GOV for my business. all within a month
So two inquiries.

History on me is My credit is 788 no late payments.
I have a high income this year and last year. Gross will be very large
I made 80k 2018. 2019 I made more. Made a gross of $230k for the first six months of this year

I had a balance on my AMEX of $3,800. My limit was $25,700
I got a email from them and check my account and they dropped the limit to $3820
I paid the account in full to zero balance.

I called them and they said they would review it. I get a call back from them and they will fix it possibly but I need to provide all these income documents for all my income, assets, and business income (would cost me money to get my accountant to do it for me).Plus I really think everything they asked for is invasive for the small amount they are willing to lend me ($25,700 credit limit). So I tell them forget
I get a warning from myfico about getting balanced chased because my limit dropped.

Now I get a notice for Chase. I check my account and balance chased again. I paid in full.
I assume now discover is going to see I am getting balance chased and drop my limit (owe $2999 limit is $23,000)

What can I do to save my discover account?
Only thing that changed was the two inquires and the new auto loan.
What about the PPP loan? You scared the lenders with your additional loans compounded by you already carrying balances, which is why AMEX wanted to perform a financial review.

About all you can do is cross your fingers and hope that you don't get balance chased by Discover and if you do to call and plead your case.

I'd be really surprised if the PPP loan application caused the problem. DH has been playing the balance transfer game for about 1.5 years on a starting debt of about 30k and also took a PPP loan for our business. We have about 1.5 years left to get to 0 on the BTs, but none of his lenders has blinked yet. In fact, two of the 3 cards left with balances just gave him CLIs and Disco sent checks just last week. Something is definitely odd here, seems like each of the lenders is spooking each other. Don't think closing AMEX was ideal, I would have sent the docs.

Re: Getting balance chased because of AMEX

Anonymous — Mon, 29 Jun 2020 14:31:54 GMT

@recoveringfrombk7 wrote:
@coldfusion wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
I had a auto loan. I had it paid to 10%. I had no inquires.
I bought a new vehicle with one inquiry from my credit union. I was at 70% LTV on the vehicle.
Total loan is $20,000
I got a personal inquiry from the PPP loan from .GOV for my business. all within a month
So two inquiries.

History on me is My credit is 788 no late payments.
I have a high income this year and last year. Gross will be very large
I made 80k 2018. 2019 I made more. Made a gross of $230k for the first six months of this year

I had a balance on my AMEX of $3,800. My limit was $25,700
I got a email from them and check my account and they dropped the limit to $3820
I paid the account in full to zero balance.

I called them and they said they would review it. I get a call back from them and they will fix it possibly but I need to provide all these income documents for all my income, assets, and business income (would cost me money to get my accountant to do it for me).Plus I really think everything they asked for is invasive for the small amount they are willing to lend me ($25,700 credit limit). So I tell them forget
I get a warning from myfico about getting balanced chased because my limit dropped.

Now I get a notice for Chase. I check my account and balance chased again. I paid in full.
I assume now discover is going to see I am getting balance chased and drop my limit (owe $2999 limit is $23,000)

What can I do to save my discover account?
Only thing that changed was the two inquires and the new auto loan.
What about the PPP loan? You scared the lenders with your additional loans compounded by you already carrying balances, which is why AMEX wanted to perform a financial review.

About all you can do is cross your fingers and hope that you don't get balance chased by Discover and if you do to call and plead your case.

I'd be really surprised if the PPP loan application caused the problem. DH has been playing the balance transfer game for about 1.5 years on a starting debt of about 30k and also took a PPP loan for our business. We have about 1.5 years left to get to 0 on the BTs, but none of his lenders has blinked yet. In fact, two of the 3 cards left with balances just gave him CLIs and Disco sent checks just last week. Something is definitely odd here, seems like each of the lenders is spooking each other. Don't think closing AMEX was ideal, I would have sent the docs.

The docs would cost me money and time. They requested business documents, documents on my personal income, my bank accounts, my house what I owe vs value, retirement and investment accounts, etc.

They are not just asking for the normal form they ask for on a release of tax documents.

they are asking me to prove net worth.

At the end of the day.... IMO. They are asking for to much for the "honor" of them POSSIBLY lending me 20k at a terrible rate.

I closed the platinum. kept the balance chasing card open(everyday card) I have another card (blue cash) with them with zero balance and it still shows $7000 limit. The original limit. I never used that card

It just pissed me off because it was kind of a little hobby building up these accounts and my credit Lol.

Re: Getting balance chased because of AMEX

K-in-Boston — Mon, 29 Jun 2020 14:37:14 GMT

I'm sorry this happened to you. Amex usually only takes these measures if there is fraud (including rewards abuse) involved, they have a reason to believe reported income is significantly higher than actual income, and/or they fear you will default on the account.

Was the $4000 balance being carried on a 0% promo? How long have you had the card, and did you very recently change your reported income with them? Going from $80k to $400K+ in 2 years is a rather drastic change.

Re: Getting balance chased because of AMEX

Remedios — Mon, 29 Jun 2020 14:36:03 GMT

Okay, well...$27,000.00 is not small by any metric.

Was the card that got balance chased in 0% promo?

How about Chase card?

Re: Getting balance chased because of AMEX

Anonymous — Mon, 29 Jun 2020 14:47:39 GMT

@K-in-Boston wrote:
I'm sorry this happened to you. Amex usually only takes these measures if there is fraud (including rewards abuse) involved, they have a reason to believe reported income significantly higher than actual income, and/or they fear you will default on the account.

Was the $4000 balance being carried on a 0% promo? How long have you had the card, and did you very recently change your reported income with them? Going from $80k to $400K+ in 2 years is a rather drastic change.

My rate on the everyday card is 29.24. Not sure if that changed with the update.

they had a much lower income vs my real income. I do not do manufactured spending for rewards.

it's no big deal. Because it is true. I would have never used much of that limits. Just sucks because it took me years to hit that.

Re: Getting balance chased because of AMEX

K-in-Boston — Mon, 29 Jun 2020 14:50:00 GMT

Was your account subject to the penalty APR because of a returned payment or because of a late payment? Those are the only two possible ways to get a 29.24% APR on that card.

Re: Getting balance chased because of AMEX

Anonymous — Mon, 29 Jun 2020 14:53:28 GMT

@K-in-Boston wrote:
Was your account subject to the penalty APR because of a returned payment or because of a late payment? Those are the only two possible ways to get a 29.24% APR on that card.

Always on time

Re: Getting balance chased because of AMEX

K-in-Boston — Mon, 29 Jun 2020 14:58:52 GMT

I would check with American Express that they actually have you recorded as having on time payments without any that have been returned. That APR is the penalty APR, which per their cardholder agreement (and federal law) can only happen when a payment is late or returned. That would easily explain the balance chasing.

Re: Getting balance chased because of AMEX

recoveringfrombk7 — Mon, 29 Jun 2020 15:24:43 GMT

@K-in-Boston wrote:
I would check with American Express that they actually have you recorded as having on time payments without any that have been returned. That APR is the penalty APR, which per their cardholder agreement (and federal law) can only happen when a payment is late or returned. That would easily explain the balance chasing.

Have you received any credits back to the cards for travel perhaps / applied received credit as your payment? Someone recently went through this, but I forget which lender. Minimum payments must be made regardless of credits. Just trying to think of ways you thought you were on time and they disagreed.

Re: Getting balance chased because of AMEX

SFLSpotter9210 — Mon, 29 Jun 2020 19:11:26 GMT

It all started with Synchrony for me back in 2007 and the rest followed AMEX, CHASE and a few others. To be honest and this is just my opinion you make a strong income with your business. And your paying your accountant already why would it cost you money to get the data AMEX is already asking for? And from what your explaining your not carrying much of balances either I'm assuming your PIF when the statements hit? Then I'm only assuming the PPP hit on your CR is what's making them nervous. But if you supply them with the necessary financial data their requesting you should be fine. Good luck either way with your outcome and how you plan to handle it.