topic Re: Fluz App Rewards Change - Paypal Key in Credit Cards

Fluz App Rewards Change - Paypal Key

UncleB — Sat, 02 Oct 2021 05:07:36 GMT

Edit: 10/2/2021 - Fluz now disallows the Paypal Key - their system "sees" it as a prepaid card, and will not let it be added. My PPK that was previously added was removed by their system.

I got an email from Fluz notifying me that their rewards scheme has changed. Now, there's an added reward percentage for using a non-credit card payment source:

Get ready to earn up to 3% more, app-wide.

Your cash back rates just got a major update. Use a payment method without credit card fees to earn up to 3% more than before, every time you pay with Fluz.

Basically the best discount is for linking your bank account and paying via ACH, but there's also an additional discount for linking a debit card. For 'grins' I linked my Paypal Key Mastercard, and as I had hoped the Fluz app recognized it as debit.

To see if it would actually work I purchased a Walmart gift card with Paypal Key, using my USAA Limitless as the funding source, and it worked - my Fluz rewards were 1.5%, whereas the rewards are only 0.5% when using a credit card. Combined with 2.5% on the Limitless, that's a total of 4% back for Walmart, not too shabby for someone with significant Walmart purchases.

I made another purchase using my BBVA Clearpoints to see how the charge will (eventually) code... Fluz is said to pass the correct MCC, but since it's also looping through Paypal I'll honestly be amazed if it makes the journey with the right info. Since Paypal Key transactions can take a few extra days to post it might be next week before I know for sure, but either way I'll come back and report.

There are some caveats with Fluz... you're buying a gift card, and of course there's always some (slight) risk when doing that and you'll lose any extended warranty, etc. that a credit card would provide. But for many situations this could still work out well (assuming Paypal doesn't nerf the key, of course).

There's also this about Fluz rewards... back in September, they changed how they payout. You now have to earn a one-time $26 before you can get to your rewards. From the site:

UPDATE: As of Sept. 23, 2020, we recently updated the $26 lifetime cashback requirement to include Fluz balance payments. You must hit the minimum requirement of lifetime earn of $26 first before you can withdraw it or use it to buy more gift cards. This is a one time requirement only. After you've hit $26 in earnings, you may withdraw anytime even if it's just $1.

https://help.fluz.app/hc/en-us/articles/360022359771-Can-I-pay-with-my-available-Fluz-Pay-balance-

I checked the app, and I'm actually over half-way there without even trying (from purchases made last summer/fall during the Amex promo) and in any case this won't be a significant hurdle to reach for those who find this beneficial.

Sorry for the length of this post, but I wanted to provide as much detail up-front as possible.

Edited to add: Write-up from Doc - https://www.doctorofcredit.com/fluz-app-buy-exact-value-gift-cards-at-a-discount/

Re: Fluz App Rewards Change - Paypal Key

imaximous — Fri, 05 Feb 2021 16:44:06 GMT

I got into the paypal key game a little too late. In fact, so late that I haven't even had the chance to use it.

I also kind of abandoned my Fluz app a few months ago -- sort of lost interest. I still got another $5.15 to go before I can make my first redemption. I'm going to try a Starbucks reload with PP Key and see what happens. I want my $26

Re: Fluz App Rewards Change - Paypal Key

Credit12Fico — Fri, 05 Feb 2021 18:02:11 GMT

I'm also having trouble getting to $26, this helps. I only really have interest in the Amazon cards which don't have great payout.

I'm waiting for the nerf on this though. Seems a bit too good to be true.

Re: Fluz App Rewards Change - Paypal Key

SecretAzure — Fri, 05 Feb 2021 18:20:41 GMT

Never heard of Fluz (sounds like a disease really). Does this mean I could fund Paypal Key (3%) with my Chase Freedom Unlimited (1.5%) and then use Key to fund Fluz (the exact gift card amount) and get 1.5% back on Amazon gift card?

If so...what the hell math did I just do? How much would I be earning in that scenario? Is it 3.38% cash back?

Re: Fluz App Rewards Change - Paypal Key

imaximous — Fri, 05 Feb 2021 21:59:27 GMT

@UncleB Not sure how you made it work, but I added my PP Key to Fluz and it's showing the same rate as a credit card. It's not getting recognized as a debit

Re: Fluz App Rewards Change - Paypal Key

imaximous — Fri, 05 Feb 2021 22:04:47 GMT

@SecretAzure wrote:
Never heard of Fluz (sounds like a disease really). Does this mean I could fund Paypal Key (3%) with my Chase Freedom Unlimited (1.5%) and then use Key to fund Fluz (the exact gift card amount) and get 1.5% back on Amazon gift card?

If so...what the hell math did I just do? How much would I be earning in that scenario? Is it 3.38% cash back?

If you get Fluz to recognize PP Key as a debit card, then you get the rate that shows there for debit as opposed to credit.

For Amazon, you'd get 1.5% on Fluz plus 1.5% Chase FU. Total 3% cashback. Not worth it if you have Prime and an Amazon card that pays 5%.

This is a better deal when buying other store gift cards without any special bonus categories. But, it's not working for me as PP Key is getting the same rate as credit cards on Fluz.

Re: Fluz App Rewards Change - Paypal Key

UncleB — Fri, 05 Feb 2021 22:39:12 GMT

@imaximous wrote:
@UncleB Not sure how you made it work, but I added my PP Key to Fluz and it's showing the same rate as a credit card. It's not getting recognized as a debit

I added it as a debit card (not credit)... I just checked, and it's still working for me:

With my Paypal Key debit Mastercard:

This is with an Amex credit card:

Re: Fluz App Rewards Change - Paypal Key

imaximous — Sat, 06 Feb 2021 00:19:31 GMT

@UncleB I did select "Add Debit Card" when choosing the new payment method. Not sure why it didn't work for me. I may have to get a new PP Key and try again later. 😔

Re: Fluz App Rewards Change - Paypal Key

UncleB — Sat, 06 Feb 2021 01:00:13 GMT

@imaximous wrote:
@UncleB I did select "Add Debit Card" when choosing the new payment method. Not sure why it didn't work for me. I may have to get a new PP Key and try again later. 😔

Hopefully you'll be able to get it to work. If you can't, even without the Paypal Key I can still see some interesting possibilities since Fluz is now supposed to report the appropriate MCC for many gift cards.

https://help.fluz.app/hc/en-us/community/topics/360001819452-Stacking-It-

This in particular could be interesting:

Which merchants on Fluz will code as GROCERY?

Fluz

MCC Code 5411

Amazon Fresh	GROCERY
Dean & DeLuca	GROCERY
Giant Eagle	GROCERY
Kroger	GROCERY
Sheetz	GROCERY
Target	GROCERY
Walmart Grocery	GROCERY
Wine.com	GROCERY

"Walmart Grocery' is curious, since as far as I know Walmart Grocery doesn't take Walmart gift cards for payment (it's been a while, so this might have changed). ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Either way, Walmart Grocery has a slightly higher (0.5%) reward rate over 'regular' Walmart gift cards, so if they're interchangeable that could be useful even without Paypal Key assuming they code properly as 'grocery'.

Re: Fluz App Rewards Change - Paypal Key

imaximous — Sat, 06 Feb 2021 01:57:20 GMT

I just also noticed they have more GCs in the "Office" category.
Really interesting they added Apple to the list.
That could work out to 2.5% on Fluz plus 5% Chase Ink. Plus the possibility to stack with other portals when buying an Apple product.

I'm gonna start playing around with some small GCs to make sure they code properly.

Re: Fluz App Rewards Change - Paypal Key

UncleB — Sat, 06 Feb 2021 02:04:52 GMT

@imaximous wrote:
I just also noticed they have more GCs in the "Office" category.
Really interesting they added Apple to the list.
That could work out to 2.5% on Fluz plus 5% Chase Ink. Plus the possibility to stack with other portals when buying an Apple product.

I'm gonna start playing around with some small GCs to make sure they code properly.

That's what I'm doing... BBVA codes 'regular' Walmart as grocery, so if the MCC passes all the way through correctly that could be interesting (and even more so using the Key).

I'm also curious about Walmart Business (Fluz codes as 5111)... assuming (???) those are interchangeable with regular WM gift cards and the MCC codes correctly that could be interesting to some.

Re: Fluz App Rewards Change - Paypal Key

imaximous — Sat, 06 Feb 2021 02:14:53 GMT

@UncleB wrote:
@imaximous wrote:
I just also noticed they have more GCs in the "Office" category.
Really interesting they added Apple to the list.
That could work out to 2.5% on Fluz plus 5% Chase Ink. Plus the possibility to stack with other portals when buying an Apple product.

I'm gonna start playing around with some small GCs to make sure they code properly.
That's what I'm doing... BBVA codes 'regular' Walmart as grocery, so if the MCC passes all the way through correctly that could be interesting (and even more so using the Key).

I'm also curious about Walmart Business (Fluz codes as 5111)... assuming (???) those are interchangeable with regular WM gift cards and the MCC codes correctly that could be interesting to some.

Yes. That was already there for some time. I've used Ink for Walmart Business and Amazon Business. When I got the message about that a while back, they said Amazon Biz, Walmart Biz, Office Depot and Staples. The rest of GCs on that list are more recent.

Re: Fluz App Rewards Change - Paypal Key

UncleB — Sat, 06 Feb 2021 02:42:00 GMT

@imaximous wrote:
@UncleB wrote:
@imaximous wrote:
I just also noticed they have more GCs in the "Office" category.
Really interesting they added Apple to the list.
That could work out to 2.5% on Fluz plus 5% Chase Ink. Plus the possibility to stack with other portals when buying an Apple product.

I'm gonna start playing around with some small GCs to make sure they code properly.
That's what I'm doing... BBVA codes 'regular' Walmart as grocery, so if the MCC passes all the way through correctly that could be interesting (and even more so using the Key).

I'm also curious about Walmart Business (Fluz codes as 5111)... assuming (???) those are interchangeable with regular WM gift cards and the MCC codes correctly that could be interesting to some.
Yes. That was already there for some time. I've used Ink for Walmart Business and Amazon Business. When I got the message about that a while back, they said Amazon Biz, Walmart Biz, Office Depot and Staples. The rest of GCs on that list are more recent.

Ah, then maybe you can clear up a question I have... are gift cards for Walmart Business valid at the store for any random purchase?

Re: Fluz App Rewards Change - Paypal Key

imaximous — Sat, 06 Feb 2021 03:28:47 GMT

Yes. I don’t know if they’re different from the regular Walmart GCs but I just told the cashier I wanted to use a GC.

The only thing you may have to be careful with is using GCs on Walmart online. They like to cancel orders for whatever reason. Maybe it happened to me because I was using $200 GCs, but they canceled my orders a few times. After the third cancellation, I contacted customer service and they told me my account had been flagged by their system and all future purchases would continue to get canceled. They had to clear something on their end and made me wait like 2 or 3 days before I could order online again.
I ended up using my GC in the store because I didn’t feel like waiting or dealing with the nonsense anymore. Eventually it all got sorted out and back to normal. I just don’t use GCs online anymore to avoid the possible headaches since I buy a lot for business online, and can’t really afford to get my account suspended.

Re: Fluz App Rewards Change - Paypal Key

UncleB — Sat, 06 Feb 2021 04:21:23 GMT

@imaximous wrote:
Yes. I don’t know if they’re different from the regular Walmart GCs but I just told the cashier I wanted to use a GC.

The only thing you may have to be careful with is using GCs on Walmart online. They like to cancel orders for whatever reason. Maybe it happened to me because I was using $200 GCs, but they canceled my orders a few times. After the third cancellation, I contacted customer service and they told me my account had been flagged by their system and all future purchases would continue to get canceled. They had to clear something on their end and made me wait like 2 or 3 days before I could order online again.
I ended up using my GC in the store because I didn’t feel like waiting or dealing with the nonsense anymore. Eventually it all got sorted out and back to normal. I just don’t use GCs online anymore to avoid the possible headaches since I buy a lot for business online, and can’t really afford to get my account suspended.

This is great to know, and I suspect the gift cards offered by Fluz for "Walmart Grocery" are the same as well. I'll buy a small one (WM Grocery) to see how the MCC flows for BBVA.

I learned a while back to avoid gift cards with online orders for the reason you mention... Macy's is bad about that as well. Even worse, Macy's would cancel the order *after* processing the gift card, so the customer has to proactively call them to ask to be mailed a gift card for the purchase amount.

For Walmart I load the gift card(s) into Walmart Pay, so it's easy-peasy to use them at the register (even multiples) without having to have a discussion, LOL.

Re: Fluz App Rewards Change - Paypal Key

UncleB — Sat, 06 Feb 2021 04:31:31 GMT

I went ahead and bought a card for "Walmart Grocery" and I can confirm it's the same as a 'regular' WM gift card... I was able to load it into Walmart Pay successfully.

Also, the authorization for the card for WM Grocery shows up as "FLUZ FRESH LLC," which is different from the regular WM gift card. I suspect this is because the MCC is (probably) different.

Now the only question is if the MCC will be passed through Paypal on to the issuer. If so, that will be a total of 5% back for Walmart (using Paypal Key with BBVA Clear points), and if not then I'll give it a try without using the Paypal Key, which would still be an additional 1%. Another angle... use with PP Key, but with the USAA Limitless since the MCC doesn't matter. That would still be (total) 4.5%, which isn't too shabby.

I've never been so curious for a charge to post!

Re: Fluz App Rewards Change - Paypal Key

imaximous — Sat, 06 Feb 2021 05:53:39 GMT

It’s very interesting how Fluz runs its business trying to accommodate buyers so purchases code for their specific credit cards. They must have different businesses and allocate their GCs by grouping them for the specific MCC.

When they added Apple Pay as a payment method, I was very tempted to use my AR but I chickened out because USB isn’t very fond of GC purchases.
I worked too hard to grow that card and didn’t want to risk losing it 😅

With Walmart and Amazon, I haven’t really used Fluz much because I can just use the store cards for 5%. I’m still in the first year with my Walmart CC, so Walmart Pay in store still counts as 5%. I’ll be more inclined to buy Fluz GCs after the year is up.
I’d normally value 5 URs from Ink more than 5% cash back, but since I’m not traveling, it’s all the same nowadays. It also hurts less not having to cash out URs 😂

Re: Fluz App Rewards Change - Paypal Key

UncleB — Sat, 06 Feb 2021 06:38:39 GMT

@imaximous wrote:
It’s very interesting how Fluz runs its business trying to accommodate buyers so purchases code for their specific credit cards. They must have different businesses and allocate their GCs by grouping them for the specific MCC.

When they added Apple Pay as a payment method, I was very tempted to use my AR but I chickened out because USB isn’t very fond of GC purchases.
I worked too hard to grow that card and didn’t want to risk losing it 😅

With Walmart and Amazon, I haven’t really used Fluz much because I can just use the store cards for 5%. I’m still in the first year with my Walmart CC, so Walmart Pay in store still counts as 5%. I’ll be more inclined to buy Fluz GCs after the year is up.
I’d normally value 5 URs from Ink more than 5% cash back, but since I’m not traveling, it’s all the same nowadays. It also hurts less not having to cash out URs 😂

I might be reading too much into things, but it does seem like they know who their customers are, LOL.

I'm with you on not using the AR for Fluz... it would be perfect (effective 4.5% off any GC when using Google Pay) but like you I worked too hard to get it and it's working too well for me to poke that bear, LOL.

If I had the Walmart credit card I would be less pumped over Fluz/Walmart, but I don't and since it's now Capital One I probably won't be getting it any time soon. Walmart is a non-trivial amount of spend for me, and back when I could pay with the AR using Samsung Pay I was a happy camper, but of course that ship has sailed.

Re: Fluz App Rewards Change - Paypal Key

imaximous — Sat, 06 Feb 2021 18:50:47 GMT

@UncleB wrote:
@imaximous wrote:
It’s very interesting how Fluz runs its business trying to accommodate buyers so purchases code for their specific credit cards. They must have different businesses and allocate their GCs by grouping them for the specific MCC.

When they added Apple Pay as a payment method, I was very tempted to use my AR but I chickened out because USB isn’t very fond of GC purchases.
I worked too hard to grow that card and didn’t want to risk losing it 😅

With Walmart and Amazon, I haven’t really used Fluz much because I can just use the store cards for 5%. I’m still in the first year with my Walmart CC, so Walmart Pay in store still counts as 5%. I’ll be more inclined to buy Fluz GCs after the year is up.
I’d normally value 5 URs from Ink more than 5% cash back, but since I’m not traveling, it’s all the same nowadays. It also hurts less not having to cash out URs 😂
I might be reading too much into things, but it does seem like they know who their customers are, LOL.

I'm with you on not using the AR for Fluz... it would be perfect (effective 4.5% off any GC when using Google Pay) but like you I worked too hard to get it and it's working too well for me to poke that bear, LOL.

If I had the Walmart credit card I would be less pumped over Fluz/Walmart, but I don't and since it's now Capital One I probably won't be getting it any time soon. Walmart is a non-trivial amount of spend for me, and back when I could pay with the AR using Samsung Pay I was a happy camper, but of course that ship has sailed.

Without trying to derail the original theme of this post, I was at Walmart a couple of days ago and used my AR with Samsung Pay. The cashier said it wouldn't work anymore, but I'm just as stubborn as it gets, so I tried anyway. Well, it went through and cashier was pretty surprised. I had to make several purchases so I went for it again. Second time it failed, haha. "Payment method not allowed" or something along those lines. I know they've updated their terminals because it used to work every time. Now it's really hit or miss. Sometimes I get lucky. And I always make my purchases at the same terminal.

Walmart Pay doesn't like repeat purchases so it usually declines after 2 transactions. I don't have time to call Cap One while in the store, so I have to go in with backup plans.

Re: Fluz App Rewards Change - Paypal Key

UncleB — Thu, 11 Feb 2021 03:44:07 GMT

As promised I'm circling back to provide data points on how my two Fluz charges eventually posted to my BBVA ClearPoints Visa.

Spoiler alert: I was pleasantly surprised.

The charge on February 7 (at the bottom) was for a 'regular' Walmart gift card. While the ClearPoints Visa does code Walmart as grocery, I didn't expect a Fluz GC to trigger the grocery category.

The charge on February 9 (at the top) was for a Walmart Grocery gift card, which the Fluz support site says would code as grocery. Since I was looping the purchase through the Paypal Key (debit MasterCard) I didn't know if the original MCC would make the journey all the way to BBVA but apparently it did, since it triggered the ClearPoints grocery multiplier.

So, for Walmart Grocery that's 3% with the ClearPoints Visa and 2% with Fluz (via Paypal Key debit MasterCard) for a total of 5%... not too shabby for someone like myself who frequents Walmart. I still prefer loading up on plasic gift cards at Sam's Club when Freedom and Discover have their warehouse quarters (and using the Paypal Key in-app during Paypal quarters) but this will be useful nonetheless.

Now that I know the correct MCC is passed through to the bank (or at least can be, and at this time) I look forward to seeing what other interesting scenarios might be found.

For those who can't get Fluz to recognize their Paypal Key as debit, here's the BIN for my Key (virtual card): 520593. I've had the same Key account number since it was first available to me so possibly the BIN they assign for the Key has changed.