topic Re: Is there a better general travel card than PenFed Pathfinder? in Credit Cards

Is there a better general travel card than PenFed Pathfinder?

phantasm — Sat, 21 Jan 2023 05:16:19 GMT

I recently got the PenFed Pathfinder card as an honors advantage member. Among others, some standout perks are:

50K SUB ~ $425-$500
4X points on all travel categories including things like EZ Pass, Ferries, etc
Reimbursement for Global Entry/TSA Precheck up to $100
$100 Annual "domestic air ancillary travel" statement credit - has some limitations like cabin upgrades
Priority Pass membership (discounted use); I think you can use the credit above for this

Points can be exchanged for travel, merchandice, merchant GC, or Visa GC. The latter comes to about $0.0085/pt. The former you can get closer to 1:100. Effectively this makes it anwhere from a 3.4-4% CB card (for travel). Annoyingly, however, is that unless you are looking for a GC from Panera, IHop, or Chipolte, redemption is in increments of $25 (except travel, I think). Therefore you are almost always going to have points "left behind". Another annoyance is that if you are wanting to create a single bucket of points by getting the Platinum Rewards for gas, you are supposedly out of luck (according to the CSR).

Is this the best general purpose travel card out there or is there something better I should take a look at?

Re: Is there a better general travel card than PenFed Pathfinder?

mgood — Sat, 21 Jan 2023 12:10:23 GMT

There are certainly more popular travel cards out there from Amex, Chase, etc. What's "better" is going to be up to the individual and how much you spend, how much you travel, and how you hope to use the rewards. I think the Pathfinder looks pretty good. If PenFed ever starts letting us PC from one card to another, I'll change my Gold to a Pathfinder to get some kind of rewards out of it.

@phantasm wrote:
Points can be exchanged for travel, merchandice, merchant GC, or Visa GC. The latter comes to about $0.0085/pt. The former you can get closer to 1:100. Effectively this makes it anwhere from a 3.4-4% CB card (for travel). Annoyingly, however, is that unless you are looking for a GC from Panera, IHop, or Chipolte, redemption is in increments of $25 (except travel, I think). Therefore you are almost always going to have points "left behind". Another annoyance is that if you are wanting to create a single bucket of points by getting the Platinum Rewards for gas, you are supposedly out of luck (according to the CSR).

That's exactly like the rewards system I have with the Platinum, which is a card I like quite a bit. Yeah, it's a little annoying that there are points "left behind," but I can use them next time. I didn't know that points wouldn't transfer between cards like Platinum and Pathfinder. I haven't looked at those details all that close because I haven't tried to get a Pathfinder.

Re: Is there a better general travel card than PenFed Pathfinder?

OmarGB9 — Sun, 22 Jan 2023 00:55:25 GMT

Agreed with the above about "better" being subjective. What is "better" for you may not be "better" for someone else.

Re: Is there a better general travel card than PenFed Pathfinder?

phantasm — Sun, 22 Jan 2023 03:18:24 GMT

@OmarGB9 wrote:
Agreed with the above about "better" being subjective. What is "better" for you may not be "better" for someone else.

Care to qualify this a bit more? For me a general travel card is one that is all purpose and not specific to a single use case. I'd love to hear some other examples of generic travel cards and how they rank against the PenFed card.

Re: Is there a better general travel card than PenFed Pathfinder?

mgood — Sun, 22 Jan 2023 03:31:23 GMT

@phantasm wrote:
I'd love to hear some other examples of generic travel cards and how they rank against the PenFed card.

This may be an unpopular suggestion, but I'd say go watch YouTube. There are lots of comparisons of travel cards there.

I say it could be unpopular here becuase there is a lot of inaccurate information there and a lot of YouTubers get paid to promote certain cards. So just take their glowing reviews with a grain of salt. Probably not a whole lot of discussion of PenFed there, but there are many videos on Chase vs Amex vs whoever. You can get an idea of the pros and cons of various travel cards and compare those to what PenFed offers.

Re: Is there a better general travel card than PenFed Pathfinder?

phantasm — Sun, 22 Jan 2023 03:43:51 GMT

@mgood wrote:
@phantasm wrote:
I'd love to hear some other examples of generic travel cards and how they rank against the PenFed card.
This may be an unpopular suggestion, but I'd say go watch YouTube. There are lots of comparisons of travel cards there.
I say it could be unpopular here becuase there is a lot of inaccurate information there and a lot of YouTubers get paid to promote certain cards. So just take their glowing reviews with a grain of salt. Probably not a whole lot of discussion of PenFed there, but there are many videos on Chase vs Amex vs whoever. You can get an idea of the pros and cons of various travel cards and compare those to what PenFed offers.

Yeah -- same reason why TPG, Forbes, and others aren't my first stop for unbiased comparisons. To me MyFico forums has been a bit of a gold mine, much better than r/creditcards. I also like DoctorofCredit but having others' unbiased opinions is the best.

Re: Is there a better general travel card than PenFed Pathfinder?

OmarGB9 — Sun, 22 Jan 2023 05:10:51 GMT

@phantasm wrote:
@OmarGB9 wrote:
Agreed with the above about "better" being subjective. What is "better" for you may not be "better" for someone else.
Care to qualify this a bit more? For me a general travel card is one that is all purpose and not specific to a single use case. I'd love to hear some other examples of generic travel cards and how they rank against the PenFed card.

Well, you'd probably want to look at NFCU Flagship or Amex Platinum or Chase CSR/CSP, aka the usual/most popular cards.

Re: Is there a better general travel card than PenFed Pathfinder?

mgood — Sun, 22 Jan 2023 05:15:48 GMT

@phantasm wrote:
@mgood wrote:
@phantasm wrote:
I'd love to hear some other examples of generic travel cards and how they rank against the PenFed card.
This may be an unpopular suggestion, but I'd say go watch YouTube. There are lots of comparisons of travel cards there.
I say it could be unpopular here becuase there is a lot of inaccurate information there and a lot of YouTubers get paid to promote certain cards. So just take their glowing reviews with a grain of salt. Probably not a whole lot of discussion of PenFed there, but there are many videos on Chase vs Amex vs whoever. You can get an idea of the pros and cons of various travel cards and compare those to what PenFed offers.
Yeah -- same reason why TPG, Forbes, and others aren't my first stop for unbiased comparisons. To me MyFico forums has been a bit of a gold mine, much better than r/creditcards. I also like DoctorofCredit but having others' unbiased opinions is the best.

You can learn a lot watching those vids. Just don't start believing that every word they speak is fact.

Re: Is there a better general travel card than PenFed Pathfinder?

Hoben02 — Sun, 22 Jan 2023 12:46:17 GMT

What's lacking on that card is the value from transfer partners. Most of the transfer partners from the majors you should be able to get over one cent/point.

Re: Is there a better general travel card than PenFed Pathfinder?

Anonymous — Sun, 22 Jan 2023 13:15:48 GMT

@Hoben02 wrote:
What's lacking on that card is the value from transfer partners. Most of the transfer partners from the majors you should be able to get over one cent/point.

Right, or even, in the case of say CSP, enhanced value in the portal, where points are worth 1.25c (and yes, arguments about whether the portals are the best value......)

Which is not to say the Penfed card isn't good for the right person. It's more a cashback card with travel categories than a classic travel card (although global entry credit goes a little against that!)

Re: Is there a better general travel card than PenFed Pathfinder?

phantasm — Sun, 22 Jan 2023 13:17:17 GMT

@OmarGB9 wrote:
@phantasm wrote:
@OmarGB9 wrote:
Agreed with the above about "better" being subjective. What is "better" for you may not be "better" for someone else.
Care to qualify this a bit more? For me a general travel card is one that is all purpose and not specific to a single use case. I'd love to hear some other examples of generic travel cards and how they rank against the PenFed card.
Well, you'd probably want to look at NFCU Flagship or Amex Platinum or Chase CSR/CSP, aka the usual/most popular cards.

Thanks for the suggestions!

I checked out NFCU, but even with the $49AF, it offers only 3X pts. It does match the global entry credit but is missing the $100 ancillary credit and priority pass membership.

AmEx platinum is $695AF but if you use a number of their perks can eliminate the fee. The challenge with this card is that you have to book hotels through Amex travel to get 5x pts. If you cruise, use ferries, or pay tolls, you are out of luck with this card earning 5x rewards.

Chase and C1 both require booking in their ecosystem to maximize rewards. Which may be fine for some but does offer less flexibility in day to day use. Less clear are their availability for use with cruises, ferries, and tolls if that is your sort of thing.

Thanks again for the suggestions but will keep looking! 😀

Re: Is there a better general travel card than PenFed Pathfinder?

Absolution16 — Fri, 10 Mar 2023 04:36:58 GMT

@mgood

If PenFed ever starts letting us PC from one card to another, I'll change my Gold to a Pathfinder to get some kind of rewards out of it.

I take it, by this statement, that PenFed does NOT allow PCing between their credit cards currently?

Re: Is there a better general travel card than PenFed Pathfinder?

mgood — Fri, 10 Mar 2023 11:51:37 GMT

@Absolution16 wrote:
@mgood

If PenFed ever starts letting us PC from one card to another, I'll change my Gold to a Pathfinder to get some kind of rewards out of it.

I take it, by this statement, that PenFed does NOT allow PCing between their credit cards currently?

It's been over a year since I've asked or seen anyone here talk about it, but at that time they did not. No way. They don't seem to be aware that that's a thing that anyone does. I've asked multiple people there.

Re: Is there a better general travel card than PenFed Pathfinder?

SouthJamaica — Fri, 10 Mar 2023 20:58:16 GMT

@phantasm wrote:
I recently got the PenFed Pathfinder card as an honors advantage member. Among others, some standout perks are:
50K SUB ~ $425-$500
4X points on all travel categories including things like EZ Pass, Ferries, etc
Reimbursement for Global Entry/TSA Precheck up to $100
$100 Annual "domestic air ancillary travel" statement credit - has some limitations like cabin upgrades
Priority Pass membership (discounted use); I think you can use the credit above for this
Points can be exchanged for travel, merchandice, merchant GC, or Visa GC. The latter comes to about $0.0085/pt. The former you can get closer to 1:100. Effectively this makes it anwhere from a 3.4-4% CB card (for travel). Annoyingly, however, is that unless you are looking for a GC from Panera, IHop, or Chipolte, redemption is in increments of $25 (except travel, I think). Therefore you are almost always going to have points "left behind". Another annoyance is that if you are wanting to create a single bucket of points by getting the Platinum Rewards for gas, you are supposedly out of luck (according to the CSR).

Is this the best general purpose travel card out there or is there something better I should take a look at?

I'll bet @Aim_High or @K-in-Boston would be able to answer this question.

Re: Is there a better general travel card than PenFed Pathfinder?

Aim_High — Sun, 12 Mar 2023 18:25:05 GMT

@phantasm wrote:
I recently got the PenFed Pathfinder card as an honors advantage member. Among others, some standout perks are:
50K SUB ~ $425-$500
4X points on all travel categories including things like EZ Pass, Ferries, etc
Reimbursement for Global Entry/TSA Precheck up to $100
$100 Annual "domestic air ancillary travel" statement credit - has some limitations like cabin upgrades
Priority Pass membership (discounted use); I think you can use the credit above for this
... Is this the best general purpose travel card out there or is there something better I should take a look at?

Thanks for the tag, @SouthJamaica. The problem with OP's question (Is this the best general purpose travel card out there?) is that the value with travel cards depends a lot on the cardholder's spending patterns and methods of redemption as well as need or value-added of various perks. Those can all drastically change the scenario. And ultimately, OP (or anyone else) must do their own careful evaluation to see what works best for them.

@phantasm, I've looked into the PenFed Pathfinder card and especially for those like you and me who qualify for Honors Advantage, it makes a compelling value case. That's not to say there aren't other potentially valuable cards as well. You lay out some nice advantages in your opening statement.

I'm not sure of the 1 cpp valuation you mentioned (is that approximate value on travel purchases?) but I've often heard the 0.85 cpp valuation. I've assumed the 3.4 cpp value was closer to realistic.

Where I see Pathfinder deficient, depending on travel card priorities:

No direct cash redemption option. Some competitive cards (in the $0 to $99 AF range) that offer rewards redemption at 1 cpp for cash (or statement credit - as/if cash) include NFCU Flagship, Chase Sapphire Preferred, US Bank Altitude Connect, CITI Premier, CITI Costco, and Wells Fargo Autograph. Personally, I greatly value the flexibility to redeem rewards for cash, in-portal, or transfer to partners. Merchandise and gift cards are a PITA.
While points may be worth more when redeemed for travel via PenFed (+) which effectively mimmics the 25% points magnification on cards like CSP, there isn't an option to earn enhanced points for paid bookings through the travel portal such as on CSP or USB Altitude Connect.
One big deficit is the ability to transfer points to travel partners such as is available on CSP, where points can be worth 1.5 to 2.0 cpp. In other words, even though CSP earns only 2 points per dollar for general travel purchases versus 4 points per dollar on PFP, those points could also be worth 4% if redemption method is via partners.
Meanwhile, depending on what other cards are in a wallet, PFP pays 1.5 points per dollar on any purchases other than travel, which might be worth less than 1.5% value. But some competitors pay well in other categories. (CSP: 3x dining, takeout, online grocery, streaming. CITI Premier: 3x Airfare, hotels, restaurants, gas, supermarkets. CITI Costco: 4% gas, 3x dining and travel. WF Autograph: 3x travel, transit, gas, dining, streaming, cell phone. USB AC: 4x travel and gas. 2x grocery, streaming, dining. NFCU FSR: 3% travel; 2% everything else.) To me, this makes PFP more of a niche travel card and not as flexible. It earns best when you BUY a lot of travel on the card and plan to use the points towards future travel.
It's true that Honors Advantage members get the AF waived and then get the air travel credit and TSA GE/Precheck credit, so they start out way ahead! And then they also earn the 4x points on travel. However, even though some competitors have AFs, some of them also offer credits against those including, as you mentioned the NFCU FSR's GE credit. Also Chase offers an annual $50 hotel credit on CSP, lowering the effective AF to $45. CITI Premier a $100 annual hotel credit which can fully reimburse the AF and put your net positive $5.
US Bank Altitude Connect includes (4) free annual Priority Pass lounge visits as opposed to PFP's reduced fee access, and then a reduced fee schedule for additional visits. One single factor like this could completely change the equation for a cardholder who makes frequent use of lounge visits.
Do you rent cars and ever pay the CDW coverage? CSP is rare in including PRIMARY CDW coverage which would more than pay for itself if you ever needed it. It would mean no claim against your primary insurance, no need to pay the deductible, and no worry about an accident affecting your personal insurance rates. Coverage on most of the other comparable cards is secondary, if available at all.
I couldn't find a discussion of travel insurances on the Pathfinder, but if travel protections are important, a card like CSP might come out ahead. CSP includes Trip Cancellation/Delay coverage and Baggage Delay coverage. I believe USB AC has similar coverages.
And yes, Chase has a very generous definition of travel to include crusies, tolls, and ferries. So while I don't know about all the other competitors, I do know that Chase/CSP is very inclusive.

"Merchants in the travel category include airlines, hotels, motels, timeshares, car rental agencies, cruise lines, travel agencies, discount travel sites, campgrounds and operators of passenger trains, buses, taxis, limousines, ferries, toll bridges and highways, and parking lots and garages. Merchants that provide transportation and travel-related services are not included in this category; for example, real estate agents, educational merchants arranging travel, in-flight goods and services, on-board cruise line goods and services, sightseeing activities, excursions, tourist attractions, boat rentals, merchants within hotels and airports, and merchants that rent vehicles for the purpose of hauling."

Even the $150 AF AMEX Green might be a strong competitor in the same travel-card niche, depending on situation. It earns 3x MRs on Restaurants, Transit (including trains, taxicabs, rideshare services, ferries, tolls, parking, buses, and subways), and Travel (including airfare, hotels, cruises, tours, car rentals, campgrounds, travel purchases on third party travel websites, and travel purchases on Amextravel.com). Depending on MR valuation, those points can be worth up to 6% return when transferred to partners. And if the motivation for the TSA credit is for expedited domestic security screening and your home airport has CLEAR, there is a $189 annual CLEAR credit as well as $100 in Lounge Buddy credits. Both of these credits more than refund the AF.

Overall, PenFed Pathfinder can be a very competitive travel card for the right person, spend, and redemption plans. But ultimately, doing the "personal math" on travel card value is an unavoidable part of evaluating them for yourself. YMMV.

Re: Is there a better general travel card than PenFed Pathfinder?

Absolution16 — Sat, 11 Mar 2023 01:21:05 GMT

@mgood

Thank you for that valuable information. Then I will have to think real hard to see whatever credit card I apply for with PenFed, it would have to be something I plan to keep long term, as I am not a churner and want to avoid closing any opened credit card accounts.

Re: Is there a better general travel card than PenFed Pathfinder?

Roisin — Sat, 11 Mar 2023 02:32:21 GMT

First class post, @Aim_High.

Re: Is there a better general travel card than PenFed Pathfinder?

Beefy1212 — Sat, 11 Mar 2023 05:21:02 GMT

@phantasm wrote:
I recently got the PenFed Pathfinder card as an honors advantage member. Among others, some standout perks are:
50K SUB ~ $425-$500
4X points on all travel categories including things like EZ Pass, Ferries, etc
Reimbursement for Global Entry/TSA Precheck up to $100
$100 Annual "domestic air ancillary travel" statement credit - has some limitations like cabin upgrades
Priority Pass membership (discounted use); I think you can use the credit above for this
Points can be exchanged for travel, merchandice, merchant GC, or Visa GC. The latter comes to about $0.0085/pt. The former you can get closer to 1:100. Effectively this makes it anwhere from a 3.4-4% CB card (for travel). Annoyingly, however, is that unless you are looking for a GC from Panera, IHop, or Chipolte, redemption is in increments of $25 (except travel, I think). Therefore you are almost always going to have points "left behind". Another annoyance is that if you are wanting to create a single bucket of points by getting the Platinum Rewards for gas, you are supposedly out of luck (according to the CSR).

Is this the best general purpose travel card out there or is there something better I should take a look at?

Have you considered the USB altitude go/connect? some one correct me if I am wrong but those points are transferable. The real benefit here though is

Connect
4X points on travel, gas stations and EV charging stations

Go

4X points on dining, takeout and restaurant delivery

That is a lot of catagories at 4x points far more than the PenFed and you still get the priority pass and TSA pre-check The difference is PenFed is free USB after year 1 is not, and Penfed has almost no way to earn points to pay for your trip other than paying for a trip. Gas/Dinning gives you a way to make points to pay for a trip, and then has a way to make points while on your trips.

If you find you like USBs setup you can always turn that connect into some no af card and then get a Reserve and the reserve has a 50% redemption bonus on travel making mobile wallet a defacto 4.5x points on all purchases again finding ways to make points to use for travel not at 1.5x. No one wants to spend 50-100k to get a free 1k flight think about it, at that point why not just get a bunch of 5% cb cards and pay for the travel.

If you haven't guessed I am not a fan of the PenFed card, in fact all their cards have some systemic issue in how they make/spend points other than their 2% card. if you want to churn a sub bonus by all means get the Penfed, I think USB and Chase for that matter make far more sense if you want to card to be useful after that sub.

Re: Is there a better general travel card than PenFed Pathfinder?

Beefy1212 — Sat, 11 Mar 2023 05:26:10 GMT

@Roisin wrote:
First class post, @Aim_High.

Agreed... I should have made it to the end of the thread before saying the same thing "crudely" as @Aim_High

Re: Is there a better general travel card than PenFed Pathfinder?

Anonymous — Sat, 11 Mar 2023 17:58:42 GMT

@Beefy1212 wrote:
Have you considered the USB altitude go/connect? some one correct me if I am wrong but those points are transferable.

The points are not transferable to partners. This is also true of the Altitude Reserve. Points can be used in the portal etc, but there is no equivalent to Chase/Citi/Amex/Cap One etc transfer to partner programs.