topic Re: Closing an amex card after retention offer in Credit Cards

Closing an amex card after retention offer

red259 — Sat, 01 Apr 2023 21:37:26 GMT

My amex AF/statement is due 4/5/23. On 4/5/22 I accepted a retention offer. Amex is telling me if I close or downgrade the plat card before or on 4/5/23 they will clawback all those points. This seems rather stupid because I paid a full AF and its a year later but this is what they are telling me. There is no retention offer because I accepted a retention offer in the prior 12 months.

My question is how can I proceed at this point. Can I just pay the balance owed without shelling out the money for the AF and then contact them on 4/6/23? If I do this will I be hit with any interest/late fees or negative reprecussions? I think some lenders don't hit you with late fees/interest on annual fee charges. Again we are talking only about what is owed on the AF as all the regular charges will be paid off in advance. Will there be a retention offer suddenly on 4/6/23 or do you need to wait 13 months for that? How will it play out if I try to downgrade at that point? Closing date was 3/10/23. My understanding is you can get a refund on the AF if you close the account within 30 days of the closing date. What is the best way to proceed here?

Re: Closing an amex card after retention offer

K-in-Boston — Sat, 01 Apr 2023 21:50:36 GMT

It sounds like you waited right at the 30 days mark last year so the timing is tricky. When you accepted the offer last year, they would have made it clear that you would forfeit that if downgraded or closed within 1 year. And they are strict when it comes to that year; 366 days is okay, 365 is not. Thankfully the chat agent let me know that when I closed my personal Delta Platinum card and I just waited and did it a day later. (I got the retention offer a day after my statement closed the prior year.)

The AF is part of the minimum due. Most likely your choices are pay or forfeit. There have been some YMMV posts stating AFs were given a prorated refund when closing or downgrading after the 30 days.

Re: Closing an amex card after retention offer

red259 — Sat, 01 Apr 2023 21:59:30 GMT

@K-in-Boston wrote:
It sounds like you waited right at the 30 days mark last year so the timing is tricky. When you accepted the offer last year, they would have made it clear that you would forfeit that if downgraded or closed within 1 year. And they are strict when it comes to that year; 366 days is okay, 365 is not. Thankfully the chat agent let me know that when I closed my personal Delta Platinum card and I just waited and did it a day later. (I got the retention offer a day after my statement closed the prior year.)

The AF is part of the minimum due. Most likely your choices are pay or forfeit. There have been some YMMV posts stating AFs were given a prorated refund when closing or downgrading after the 30 days.

Actually they didn't make it clear at all. I definetly would have remembered that part of the conversation. I found out on my own through reading up on it. I also think we need to back up here. My payment due date is five days before the 30 day mark. The two dates are not the same. So I don't believe I am forfeiting that retention bonus by contacting them the day after the payment is due. The question is whether or not the AF and being a day late is going to trigger all the late fees etc, I know with some lenders it does not. I would really hate to pay out all that money and then have to wait for amex to send me a refund in the mail.

Re: Closing an amex card after retention offer

K-in-Boston — Sat, 01 Apr 2023 23:33:26 GMT

When I wrote "right at the 30 days mark last year so the timing is tricky" maybe "too close to the 30 day mark" would have been better wording. Again, the AF would be part of the statement balance. One thing I realize I assumed since you have more than 1 thread going on Amex cards is that this was a charge card, in which case the fee is part of the minimum payment due. If this is a revolving product and your minimum payment is lower, then you would be safe not paying it by that part by the due date but may have some residual interest charged.

Re: Closing an amex card after retention offer

red259 — Sat, 01 Apr 2023 23:39:35 GMT

@K-in-Boston wrote:
When I wrote "right at the 30 days mark last year so the timing is tricky" maybe "too close to the 30 day mark" would have been better wording. Again, the AF would be part of the statement balance. One thing I realize I assumed since you have more than 1 thread going on Amex cards is that this was a charge card, in which case the fee is part of the minimum payment due. If this is a revolving product and your minimum payment is lower, then you would be safe not paying it by that part by the due date but may have some residual interest charged.

Ok. It is a charge card. I want to be clear though. I know the AF is included in the statement balance. BUT its included in the statement balance of other lenders yet they treat it differently e.g. don't count the AF for late fees etc. So are you saying that Amex definetly considers the AF exactly the same as any other charge on the statement for those purposes or are you just assuming the AF is considered the same because they list everything all together on the balance due? I think Chase was the one I recently had this issue with missing a payment because the AF posted and I had no other activity and they didn't hit me with any interest or late fees.

Re: Closing an amex card after retention offer

K-in-Boston — Sun, 02 Apr 2023 00:01:32 GMT

I have no idea how they would ultimately treat that plan in practice, but they do include it as part of your minimum payment due by X and Amex is usually pretty strict on receiving money on their terms. The scenario you're proposing (not paying the minimum due including the annual fee, and then closing the card shortly after payment is due) is a new frontier to me.

Re: Closing an amex card after retention offer

red259 — Sun, 02 Apr 2023 00:03:56 GMT

Gonna do the math this weekend. It doesn't seem like I can get a retention offer until the 13 month mark so that is out. If I have to pay the AF on the statement due date or face penalties then what I may do is pay the fee, wait until the following day where I am still within the 30 days and downgrade the card to a green card. The rest of the AF should should get credited to that green card minus the amount for the green card AF. Then I will upgrade my gold card to plat and hope they they offer me an upgrade from green to gold in the future (because when I am not spending towards signup bonuses the gold card is one of my main drivers). For the time being I can use the green card for things like transit and restaurants. I'll have to be putting spend on my upgraded plat card and if I get my new chase card so its not like the gold card was gonna get much use over the next month and then I will likely be overseas next month so that is two months where I wouldn't even really be using the gold card anyway.

If I do the math and the plat card just doesn't make sense then I guess if I have to pay the AF to keep the points then that is what I will do and I will just close the card before the 30 day mark and they will have to send me a check which is a hassle but I don't see much other choice.

Re: Closing an amex card after retention offer

red259 — Sun, 02 Apr 2023 00:08:08 GMT

@K-in-Boston wrote:
I have no idea how they would ultimately treat that plan in practice, but they do include it as part of your minimum payment due by X and Amex is usually pretty strict on receiving money on their terms. The scenario you're proposing (not paying the minimum due including the annual fee, and then closing the card shortly after payment is due) is a new frontier to me.

Yea technically that is correct but to be specific I am paying everything in the statement balance EXCEPT the AF by the due date. I'm not going to attempt this unless I can get some kinda verification that they handle AF's differently. As I mentioned in a post I just made one option I am looking at is downgrading. If I'm downgrading then there isn't a whole lot of downside to paying the AF because it will just be credited to the account. Becomes a bit tricker if I am looking to make a full closure. This is a learning lesson for me to not wait until the last minute to deal with retention offers because this put me in a real pickle.

Re: Closing an amex card after retention offer

SouthJamaica — Sun, 02 Apr 2023 01:42:52 GMT

@red259 wrote:
My amex AF/statement is due 4/5/23. On 4/5/22 I accepted a retention offer. Amex is telling me if I close or downgrade the plat card before or on 4/5/23 they will clawback all those points. This seems rather stupid because I paid a full AF and its a year later but this is what they are telling me. There is no retention offer because I accepted a retention offer in the prior 12 months.

My question is how can I proceed at this point. Can I just pay the balance owed without shelling out the money for the AF and then contact them on 4/6/23? If I do this will I be hit with any interest/late fees or negative reprecussions? I think some lenders don't hit you with late fees/interest on annual fee charges. Again we are talking only about what is owed on the AF as all the regular charges will be paid off in advance. Will there be a retention offer suddenly on 4/6/23 or do you need to wait 13 months for that? How will it play out if I try to downgrade at that point? Closing date was 3/10/23. My understanding is you can get a refund on the AF if you close the account within 30 days of the closing date. What is the best way to proceed here?

My advice would be to pay it all, including the annual fee. Then on May 5th or later close the card.

Re: Closing an amex card after retention offer

red259 — Sun, 02 Apr 2023 02:32:50 GMT

@SouthJamaica wrote:
@red259 wrote:
My amex AF/statement is due 4/5/23. On 4/5/22 I accepted a retention offer. Amex is telling me if I close or downgrade the plat card before or on 4/5/23 they will clawback all those points. This seems rather stupid because I paid a full AF and its a year later but this is what they are telling me. There is no retention offer because I accepted a retention offer in the prior 12 months.

My question is how can I proceed at this point. Can I just pay the balance owed without shelling out the money for the AF and then contact them on 4/6/23? If I do this will I be hit with any interest/late fees or negative reprecussions? I think some lenders don't hit you with late fees/interest on annual fee charges. Again we are talking only about what is owed on the AF as all the regular charges will be paid off in advance. Will there be a retention offer suddenly on 4/6/23 or do you need to wait 13 months for that? How will it play out if I try to downgrade at that point? Closing date was 3/10/23. My understanding is you can get a refund on the AF if you close the account within 30 days of the closing date. What is the best way to proceed here?
My advice would be to pay it all, including the annual fee. Then on May 5th or later close the card.

Well no. If I keep the card more than 30 days beyond 3/10 then I can't get any refund back on the AF, so I'm certainly not doing that.

Re: Closing an amex card after retention offer

jojo79 — Sun, 02 Apr 2023 16:18:53 GMT

@red259 wrote:
@SouthJamaica wrote:
@red259 wrote:
My amex AF/statement is due 4/5/23. On 4/5/22 I accepted a retention offer. Amex is telling me if I close or downgrade the plat card before or on 4/5/23 they will clawback all those points. This seems rather stupid because I paid a full AF and its a year later but this is what they are telling me. There is no retention offer because I accepted a retention offer in the prior 12 months.

My question is how can I proceed at this point. Can I just pay the balance owed without shelling out the money for the AF and then contact them on 4/6/23? If I do this will I be hit with any interest/late fees or negative reprecussions? I think some lenders don't hit you with late fees/interest on annual fee charges. Again we are talking only about what is owed on the AF as all the regular charges will be paid off in advance. Will there be a retention offer suddenly on 4/6/23 or do you need to wait 13 months for that? How will it play out if I try to downgrade at that point? Closing date was 3/10/23. My understanding is you can get a refund on the AF if you close the account within 30 days of the closing date. What is the best way to proceed here?
My advice would be to pay it all, including the annual fee. Then on May 5th or later close the card.
Well no. If I keep the card more than 30 days beyond 3/10 then I can't get any refund back on the AF, so I'm certainly not doing that.

When date did the AF post? I think that's when the 30-day cancel window begins. If you're still within the window, then you still have a couple of days to downgrade and them reverse the AF (prorated) before the due date, and then just pay the new amount once done.

Re: Closing an amex card after retention offer

red259 — Sun, 02 Apr 2023 22:58:48 GMT

@jojo79 wrote:
@red259 wrote:
@SouthJamaica wrote:
@red259 wrote:
My amex AF/statement is due 4/5/23. On 4/5/22 I accepted a retention offer. Amex is telling me if I close or downgrade the plat card before or on 4/5/23 they will clawback all those points. This seems rather stupid because I paid a full AF and its a year later but this is what they are telling me. There is no retention offer because I accepted a retention offer in the prior 12 months.

My question is how can I proceed at this point. Can I just pay the balance owed without shelling out the money for the AF and then contact them on 4/6/23? If I do this will I be hit with any interest/late fees or negative reprecussions? I think some lenders don't hit you with late fees/interest on annual fee charges. Again we are talking only about what is owed on the AF as all the regular charges will be paid off in advance. Will there be a retention offer suddenly on 4/6/23 or do you need to wait 13 months for that? How will it play out if I try to downgrade at that point? Closing date was 3/10/23. My understanding is you can get a refund on the AF if you close the account within 30 days of the closing date. What is the best way to proceed here?
My advice would be to pay it all, including the annual fee. Then on May 5th or later close the card.
Well no. If I keep the card more than 30 days beyond 3/10 then I can't get any refund back on the AF, so I'm certainly not doing that.
When date did the AF post? I think that's when the 30-day cancel window begins. If you're still within the window, then you still have a couple of days to downgrade and them reverse the AF (prorated) before the due date, and then just pay the new amount once done.

Pretty sure 30 day window begins on the date of statement closing date in the cycle where AF posts unless you have something that says otherwise. Either way the AF posted on the statement closing date of 3/10 so no matter what I should have until 4/10 correct?

Re: Closing an amex card after retention offer

jojo79 — Mon, 03 Apr 2023 05:18:27 GMT

@red259 wrote:
Pretty sure 30 day window begins on the date of statement closing date in the cycle where AF posts unless you have something that says otherwise. Either way the AF posted on the statement closing date of 3/10 so no matter what I should have until 4/10 correct?

This language from the AMEX gold annual fee seems to confirm this: LINK HERE. I would imagine it's the same on their other AF cards; specifically this paragraph.

Amex charges the annual fee on your Card anniversary date. So if you opened your Gold Card on March 10, the fee will be charged that day and every March 10 going forward – as long as your account is open. Amex does offer a 30-day grace period for cancelations, so if next year rolls around and you’d prefer to upgrade, downgrade, or close your Card account, you can do so without having to pay the Gold Card annual fee.

THAT being said; looking at my past statements, it appears the fee does post on the closing date so that answers that.

Here was my experience when downgrading my Gold charge card, and Delta Gold revolver; hopefully it helps clarify some things, and DP's for future searches.

Gold Chargecard - $250 fee posted 12/18/22 (closing date of statement). Min Due - $40.00 on 01/12/23

Delta Gold Revolver - $99 fee posted 12/27/22 (closing date of statement). Min Due - $40.00 on 01/21/23

I waited until the January statements came out and contacted CSR 12/31/22 to ask for retention offers on both. I had none available for the chargecard, but the rep did warn that I was still within the 12 month period of my last retention offer I received, which was back on 01/07/22. I would have to wait until at least 01/08/23 to downgrade/cancel that card and not get a clawback.

For the Delta Gold - I got a retention offer that I did NOT take, and downgraded to the no-fee Delta Blue that date (01/31/22). The change was made effective that date and $97.91 of that AF was reversed, leaving me with $1.09 due 01/21/23

For the Gold charge card - I didn't message them back until 01/16/23 - Once again checked if there was a retention offer but there wasn't. I didn't want to cancel so downgraded to the Green ($150 AF). The change was made effective that day and a $230.13 AF credit was posted to my account to cancel the Gold fee (prorated), and then a $137.32 fee was charged for the 'new' Green card).

I hope this makes sense? In any event, if you are looking to have this month's minimum payment reduced, I would contact them right away to cancel/downgrade so there is still time for the changes to post before due date, unless they offer a retention offer that's too good to pass up!

Good luck!

Re: Closing an amex card after retention offer

red259 — Mon, 03 Apr 2023 18:52:15 GMT

@jojo79 wrote:
@red259 wrote:
Pretty sure 30 day window begins on the date of statement closing date in the cycle where AF posts unless you have something that says otherwise. Either way the AF posted on the statement closing date of 3/10 so no matter what I should have until 4/10 correct?
This language from the AMEX gold annual fee seems to confirm this: LINK HERE. I would imagine it's the same on their other AF cards; specifically this paragraph.

Amex charges the annual fee on your Card anniversary date. So if you opened your Gold Card on March 10, the fee will be charged that day and every March 10 going forward – as long as your account is open. Amex does offer a 30-day grace period for cancelations, so if next year rolls around and you’d prefer to upgrade, downgrade, or close your Card account, you can do so without having to pay the Gold Card annual fee.

THAT being said; looking at my past statements, it appears the fee does post on the closing date so that answers that.

Here was my experience when downgrading my Gold charge card, and Delta Gold revolver; hopefully it helps clarify some things, and DP's for future searches.

Gold Chargecard - $250 fee posted 12/18/22 (closing date of statement). Min Due - $40.00 on 01/12/23
Delta Gold Revolver - $99 fee posted 12/27/22 (closing date of statement). Min Due - $40.00 on 01/21/23

I waited until the January statements came out and contacted CSR 12/31/22 to ask for retention offers on both. I had none available for the chargecard, but the rep did warn that I was still within the 12 month period of my last retention offer I received, which was back on 01/07/22. I would have to wait until at least 01/08/23 to downgrade/cancel that card and not get a clawback.

For the Delta Gold - I got a retention offer that I did NOT take, and downgraded to the no-fee Delta Blue that date (01/31/22). The change was made effective that date and $97.91 of that AF was reversed, leaving me with $1.09 due 01/21/23

For the Gold charge card - I didn't message them back until 01/16/23 - Once again checked if there was a retention offer but there wasn't. I didn't want to cancel so downgraded to the Green ($150 AF). The change was made effective that day and a $230.13 AF credit was posted to my account to cancel the Gold fee (prorated), and then a $137.32 fee was charged for the 'new' Green card).

I hope this makes sense? In any event, if you are looking to have this month's minimum payment reduced, I would contact them right away to cancel/downgrade so there is still time for the changes to post before due date, unless they offer a retention offer that's too good to pass up!

Good luck!

I can't do this. The due date is exactly one year from when I accepted the retention offer. If I did this there would be a clawback of 40k points. I can only make the change after the due date.

Re: Closing an amex card after retention offer

SouthJamaica — Mon, 03 Apr 2023 20:14:44 GMT

@red259 wrote:
@SouthJamaica wrote:
@red259 wrote:
My amex AF/statement is due 4/5/23. On 4/5/22 I accepted a retention offer. Amex is telling me if I close or downgrade the plat card before or on 4/5/23 they will clawback all those points. This seems rather stupid because I paid a full AF and its a year later but this is what they are telling me. There is no retention offer because I accepted a retention offer in the prior 12 months.

My question is how can I proceed at this point. Can I just pay the balance owed without shelling out the money for the AF and then contact them on 4/6/23? If I do this will I be hit with any interest/late fees or negative reprecussions? I think some lenders don't hit you with late fees/interest on annual fee charges. Again we are talking only about what is owed on the AF as all the regular charges will be paid off in advance. Will there be a retention offer suddenly on 4/6/23 or do you need to wait 13 months for that? How will it play out if I try to downgrade at that point? Closing date was 3/10/23. My understanding is you can get a refund on the AF if you close the account within 30 days of the closing date. What is the best way to proceed here?
My advice would be to pay it all, including the annual fee. Then on May 5th or later close the card.
Well no. If I keep the card more than 30 days beyond 3/10 then I can't get any refund back on the AF, so I'm certainly not doing that.

I'm pretty sure my experience with American Express has been that they issued me a pro-rated refund. But what do I know? It was years ago, and I'm no American Express expert.

Re: Closing an amex card after retention offer

jojo79 — Mon, 03 Apr 2023 20:25:36 GMT

@red259 wrote:
I can't do this. The due date is exactly one year from when I accepted the retention offer. If I did this there would be a clawback of 40k points. I can only make the change after the due date.

Ahh... my bad; I missed the date you accepted the offer; I would say then you're only option would be to make the payment due, and contact them on 04/06 or 04/07 to downgrade/cancel and either have them issue a refund if you cancel, or take the prorated statement credit next month.

It may be worth a chat with CSR on options, or to see if reducing you payment below the minimum due will have a negative impact on your relationship with them, if you explain why. I'd error on the side of caution and just pay what's due, and deal with refund/credit after. In any event, you'll still owe about one month of the AF.

Re: Closing an amex card after retention offer

red259 — Mon, 03 Apr 2023 20:36:16 GMT

@SouthJamaica wrote:
@red259 wrote:
@SouthJamaica wrote:
@red259 wrote:
My amex AF/statement is due 4/5/23. On 4/5/22 I accepted a retention offer. Amex is telling me if I close or downgrade the plat card before or on 4/5/23 they will clawback all those points. This seems rather stupid because I paid a full AF and its a year later but this is what they are telling me. There is no retention offer because I accepted a retention offer in the prior 12 months.

My question is how can I proceed at this point. Can I just pay the balance owed without shelling out the money for the AF and then contact them on 4/6/23? If I do this will I be hit with any interest/late fees or negative reprecussions? I think some lenders don't hit you with late fees/interest on annual fee charges. Again we are talking only about what is owed on the AF as all the regular charges will be paid off in advance. Will there be a retention offer suddenly on 4/6/23 or do you need to wait 13 months for that? How will it play out if I try to downgrade at that point? Closing date was 3/10/23. My understanding is you can get a refund on the AF if you close the account within 30 days of the closing date. What is the best way to proceed here?
My advice would be to pay it all, including the annual fee. Then on May 5th or later close the card.
Well no. If I keep the card more than 30 days beyond 3/10 then I can't get any refund back on the AF, so I'm certainly not doing that.
I'm pretty sure my experience with American Express has been that they issued me a pro-rated refund. But what do I know? It was years ago, and I'm no American Express expert.

I'm pretty sure I read you can't get a refund after 30 days. Maybe you can't get a full refund after that time and I just misunderstood.