topic Re: How do you think auto CLI’s work? in Credit Cards

How do you think auto CLI’s work?

SRT4kid93 — Sat, 24 Aug 2024 14:58:26 GMT

I know that none of us know the answer to this for sure, unless some of us have worked at credit card companies before (which is possible)

but how do you guys think the auto credit limit increases work?

Accounts are reviewed every 6-12 months. Everyone knows that, but what triggers the computer to give you an auto CLI in between those benchmarks? And once the computer is triggered to review your account, what exactly does it review, and what is it looking for?

I can only assume the computer cannot be as thorough as a human. It probably just looks for certain thresholds to be met/exceeded.

Re: How do you think auto CLI’s work?

urbex — Sat, 24 Aug 2024 15:26:25 GMT

@SRT4kid93 wrote:
I know that none of us know the answer to this for sure, unless some of us have worked at credit card companies before (which is possible)

but how do you guys think the auto credit limit increases work?

Same way new card approvals work - it depends.

Every instituation has their own criteria, and it can vary from card to card. It can even vary day to day.

Much the same as why did Cap1 flat deny my CLI request on a 11 year old QS account that is currently at a $6500 CL with zero baddies, ever, and was my daily driver card for a number of years. Reason given? Something like "not enough experience at current credit level" . Yet gave me a $10K increase (total $20K CL now) 2 minutes after the QS CLI request on a 10 MONTH old Savor One card that I've barely used?

Logically, it could be argued that it would be in Cap1's better interest to push me towards using the QS more as they're likely to be giving me more cash back on the Savor card, yet the bigger CLI on the Savor makes me more likely to use that one. But then, maybe their algorithm shows that I've made more purchases that fall under the "everything else" category, so they would have paid out more on the 1.5% QS than the 1.0% Savor. I haven't tracked it that granularly, so I don't really know, and that half a percent doesn't really mean anything to me on the relatively low amounts I've run through either of those cards.

Why is it one creditor will only give some people a new $500 card, and another will give that same person a $25K card 5 minutes later? I've even seen myself at the same creditor. Years ago I applied for an AmEx card. Approved at $2500. Got curious, and applied for another AmEx immediately afterwards...$10K approval. I could understand the $10K first, and the $2500 second, assuming I hit their limit threshold. But it makes no sense on the surface why the higher limit card came second.

Reality is that no one is going to tell you exactly how this works. If the exact workings were to be disclosed, it would completely destroy the whole system, as all of us could then easily game the system on a wide scale, and it would then only track how well someone can cheat.

Re: How do you think auto CLI’s work?

SRT4kid93 — Sat, 24 Aug 2024 15:33:19 GMT

Yea I was more looking for each persons best guess based on their experience. I know there's no way that industry secret could ever be revealed unless there was a high level employee who decided to become a whistleblower after leaving a company.

although that would only tell us what that specific company looked for so I guess we could would need a whistle blower for each card issuer which would take a large scale collaboration between them

Re: How do you think auto CLI’s work?

Kforce — Sat, 24 Aug 2024 16:49:19 GMT

@SRT4kid93 wrote:

I can only assume the computer cannot be as thorough as a human.
[ Can look at hundreds of facts is a fraction of a second and not be biased ]

It probably just looks for certain thresholds to be met/exceeded.
[ What is a person supposed to consider? ]

The computer is looking at the same things people programed it to look at.

Better precision, less time and no person involved.

(Age of accounts, inquiries, scores, income, spend, your DTI, history,

other account limits, total CL's, number of cards, etc.)

We will never know the order or thresholds, why worry about it?

Will be different for every issuer !

Better to calculate where you spend money, what cards would benefit you best,

what card should be next, best way to pay your card, etc.

Work on things that you can control, not what thresholds a bank/CU

sets in a program.

Use your card's as you need, pay on time and worry about things that

you can control, improve, change.

If you knew, Cap-1's exact numbers, thresholds, what exact impact would that

have for you. If you need two more years history, 3 less inquiries, 5k better income, and

$500/m more spend, would you get a CL increase any faster. Spend the extra 500/mo etc.

Re: How do you think auto CLI’s work?

SRT4kid93 — Sat, 24 Aug 2024 17:52:26 GMT

I get what you are saying, but in terms of humans vs computer. Well I think companies reconsideration lines prove my point. You are denied by a computer, but then you talk to a person and get approved.

computers only look at the numbers, humans can take into account why things happened.

a great example is if an authorized user maxed out your card without your knowledge. Is that your fault? Should you be blamed for someone else's negligence? The computer doesn't care, it sees the numbers and makes it's determination.

another example is something that happened to my friend. He accidentally missed a payment one month, and then got back on track the next month. But since he missed a payment without realizing it. Every single payment from there own, went towards the previous month. So let's say he missed marchs payment, but paid In April.

aprils payment went towards the march missed payment, then he got blamed for missing April as well

paid in may, that payment went towards April's balance, he got hit for missing mays payment

paid in June, went towards mays balance, got hit for missing junes payment.

before he knew it, he got blamed for missed 10 payments without realizing it when in reality he only missed 1.

Re: How do you think auto CLI’s work?

IsambardPrince — Sat, 24 Aug 2024 19:53:00 GMT

The way an auto CLI works is that the bank sees you struggling with debt and wants to help you struggle more so they increase your limit up to their appetite for risk.

Re: How do you think auto CLI’s work?

urbex — Sat, 24 Aug 2024 20:18:13 GMT

@SRT4kid93 wrote:
a great example is if an authorized user maxed out your card without your knowledge. Is that your fault? Should you be blamed for someone else's negligence? The computer doesn't care, it sees the numbers and makes it's determination.

before he knew it, he got blamed for missed 10 payments without realizing it when in reality he only missed 1.

You seem to have a fundamental misunderstanding of how all this works. An AU on your card is no different than you co-signing on a loan for someone else. Someone else fails to make the payments on the loan, and the loan servicer will be coming after you for the money. Is it your fault? Probably not, but you're still responsible for it.

Miss a loan payment, and it doesn't just disappear. Next month, it's still due in ADDITION to the current month's payment. Your friend didn't just miss March's payment - he continued to miss payments for the next 9 months because that's how long it took him to catch up. If all he sent was one month's payment every month, then he continued to be behind for 9 months.

Re: How do you think auto CLI’s work?

SRT4kid93 — Sat, 24 Aug 2024 20:22:48 GMT

@urbex

Yes that is exactly what I just said. I don't think there is any misunderstanding on my end.

I understand how AU's work and that they are technically your responsibility. And I understand that it was my friends fault for missing all those payments.

I was simply saying that when a computer looks over your account and sees those things. It doesn't care why it happened cause it doesn't have feelings.

but when a person looks over your account and gives you a chance to explain the situation. It's possible they will push through your approval because they have compassion and understanding, when a computer does not.

is it probable? No, cause the companies are out to make money. But is it possible? Yes.

and that is why I will always prefer that a human handles my account, rather than a computer.

Re: How do you think auto CLI’s work?

Anonymous — Sat, 24 Aug 2024 23:21:16 GMT

@SRT4kid93 wrote:
a great example is if an authorized user maxed out your card without your knowledge. Is that your fault?

Without a question. Unequivocally Yes

In that example, the computer and any human review; you are being blamed for your own negligence.

Re: How do you think auto CLI’s work?

Thomas_Thumb — Sun, 25 Aug 2024 00:02:20 GMT

If you have an AU on your card, you can and should limit their spend potential. I'd say to no more than 20% of a low to moderate CL card. If it is a high limit card, 10% max. The only exception might be if it is a spouse and divorce is not on the horizon.

The primary card holder knows they are legally responsible for payment of card balances. The same holds for cosigners of loans even though responsibility is joint.

When it comes to AU cards or cosigning, just say no.

Re: How do you think auto CLI’s work?

Thomas_Thumb — Sun, 25 Aug 2024 00:18:17 GMT

@SRT4kid93 wrote:

how do you guys think the auto credit limit increases work?

what triggers the computer to give you an auto CLI in between those benchmarks?

Forget about auto CLIs! I never had one in 40 years. Also never had a manual CLI denied.

Take matters into your own hands, request CLIs manually if you want them. Take advantage of posted strategies leading up to a manual CLI request.

Re: How do you think auto CLI’s work?

AndySoCal — Sun, 25 Aug 2024 01:05:18 GMT

@SRT4kid93 @urbex There is a big difference on being a authorized user on an account and being a co-signer on an account. The big difference is this as an authorized user is not financially responsible for the account. The person who made them an authorized user is the that is financially responsible. Let us say dad made his child an authorized user on his credit card. Dad gave the child the credit card. The child can spend until there hearts content. It's dad that is financially responsible for paying the card.The arrangment between dad and child on paying what the child spends is irrelevant.

A loan where you have a signer and co-signer is different. The signer is the primary one that is responsible. If the signer cannot pay the bill the co-signer is also responsible for the payment. In this both parties are responsible which different than an authorized user.

I have said this before in several posts on the forum. In my opinion most authorized users should not get any point benefits from FICO. Why should a consumer get any benefit for something they did nothing to contribute to. In the workplace what would your response be if a coworker received credit for something that the coworker contributed o thing to. There several cases where an authorized user should get some benefits this one example. Let us say there is a stay at home dad or mom due to a special needs son. Whichever that person is making non financial contributions to help take care of the needs at home. As I stated before ther are others.

Re: How do you think auto CLI’s work?

FicoMike0 — Sun, 25 Aug 2024 01:11:22 GMT

I got an auto cli last year when my amex bce turned 6 months. I didn't know to request one. They went $6000 to $9000, right after I got a wells card with a $8500 cl. Seemed like a competion, lol. I since asked amex for 3X which they approved, $27000. I then tried for $20000 from wells, they only went $10700 (+25%). Wells wouldn't meet the ante.

Re: How do you think auto CLI’s work?

urbex — Sun, 25 Aug 2024 01:18:15 GMT

@AndySoCal wrote:
@SRT4kid93 @urbex There is a big difference on being a authorized user on an account and being a co-signer on an account. before ther are others.

Read the whole reply, not just the first two sentences. There was important information in the 3rd sentence that clarifies the point.

Re: How do you think auto CLI’s work?

SRT4kid93 — Mon, 26 Aug 2024 04:01:33 GMT

I have had the exact opposite experience. I can't seem to get a manual CLI approved. But I get auto ones no problem. The thing is the auto increases are always very small

Re: How do you think auto CLI’s work?

Anonymous — Mon, 26 Aug 2024 15:47:00 GMT

@SRT4kid93 wrote:
I have had the exact opposite experience. I can't seem to get a manual CLI approved. But I get auto ones no problem. The thing is the auto increases are always very small

What auto ones do you get? On what cards? And what cards have you tried to get a manual CLI approved?

Re: How do you think auto CLI’s work?

SRT4kid93 — Mon, 26 Aug 2024 15:55:51 GMT

@Anonymous

the more recent cards I'm talking about are capone and credit one. Both are well known for almost non existent credit increases. In the past I also dealt with discover.

if I'm being the denials for the manual increases are mostly my fault. For capital one I tried twice, once when I first got the card, and again after my first statement posted. "Account too new" were the reasons for both denials

credit one i think my also be my fault? I tried requesting an increase at 3 months after card opening. Got an auto increase at 6 months. Then tried requesting again at 11 months.

it said "account too new". So either they don't accept manual increase requests until the 1 year point, or they meant to say it hasn't been long enough since I received my last increase. Since it hasn't been 6 months since then.

so yes I requested these increases not expecting anything but I had heard of people gettting they increase requests granted after the first statement posted, and some people immediately after getting the card so I figured I would try.

Re: How do you think auto CLI’s work?

SRT4kid93 — Mon, 26 Aug 2024 15:59:02 GMT

@Anonymous

Part 2 of original post:

this is why I have been asking the best way to get approved for manual increases and best way to trigger auto increases.

so far my only luck has been at the 6 month mark when they auto reviewed my account. And the increases are usually extremely small. But again, my accounts are all very new.

Re: How do you think auto CLI’s work?

urbex — Mon, 26 Aug 2024 18:08:28 GMT

@SRT4kid93 wrote:
this is why I have been asking the best way to get approved for manual increases and best way to trigger auto increases.

No, you were telling us how you think you're going to social engineer your way in to bigger CLIs.

That's not going to happen, especially not with deep sub prime lenders like Credit One. Those places absolutely DON'T want you to rack up large balances because most of the people who do that at that risk level will end up defaulting. That's why you're paying high fees and interest - it covers the people who default.

As was already mentioned, there's NO broadband answer to CLI data, whether it's actual factual data or a good guess. But what IS factual data - "my accounts are all new". THAT'S your answer - you still need to prove yourself. Those of us who are getting big jumps aren't doing it on 6 month old credit files. I'd wager its even uncommon for well established files to get big jumps on low SLs that early. My own $10K+ jumps didn't happen until the accounts were at least 2-3 years old, and were well used, and for the most part followed the 2X-3X line. I.E - I'm not getting a $10K CLI on a card that previously had a $2K CL.

I think in the past decade, I've gotten maybe 2 auto CLIs. I've had cards that sat for 5-6 years without a CLI, then manual request tripled the limit immediately. I've never gotten a CLI, auto or manual, from Chase, and those cards are 10+ years old. But I've gotten a number of CLIs from various Sync accounts that were only a couple years old. I've had one with Discover IT that took it from 10K to $17.2K (yeah...strange limit, lol). Cap1 has never approved any CLI on my 11 year old well used $6.5K QS, yet doubled the Savor from $10K-$20K at 10 months with nothing more than a $2K 0% BT on it. I'm GUESSING it's because there's still 6 months left in the 0% period, and the algorithm is set to assume I'm looking to BT more to it.

Re: How do you think auto CLI’s work?

SRT4kid93 — Mon, 26 Aug 2024 23:34:56 GMT

Yes,

I have given up on my credit one account when it comes to increases. That was my first and my oldest card and my attention has since turned to cap one and chase as my profile is exponentially better now. And cap one and chase are both way better cards than credit one.

I wasn't trying to say I could talk my way into increases. I was simply saying that I would rather have humans review my case. And I want to work with companies who give their customers that option. It was simply a statement on how customer service has gone way downhill, and customers have been reduced to numbers in an algorithm. The length of time your account has been open was simply an example of why computers suck. The computer says "acct open less than 6 months, auto rejection and there's nothing you can do about it" they do not give the computer the ability to over ride this. They are programmed to reject anyone under this threshold. So that's what they do.

where a human can over rule that system and approve your increase on a case by case basis. Will a human make a difference? Probably not, but at least I have that option.