topic Re: Venture X vs Fidelity Rewards Visa in Credit Cards

Venture X vs Fidelity Rewards Visa

Varsity_Lu — Fri, 29 Nov 2024 15:44:09 GMT

Now that Fidelity has added TSA PreCheck credit as a benefit, how does it stack up to the Venture X card? Obviously the SUB on X is better, but after that, is there any difference? X has a $395 annual fee which can be recouped via the 10,000 points anniversary bonus and the $300 annual Capital One Travel credit. Fidelity has no annual fee. Both are 2% on everything cards. The downside I see with X is that you are basically locked into Cap One's travel portal. With Fidelity you can take the cash and shop around. What are your experiences with these cards? Which one is better than the other in your opinion?

Re: Venture X vs Fidelity Rewards Visa

Anonymous — Fri, 29 Nov 2024 16:28:11 GMT

They are IMO very different cards! Fidelity is really pure cashback, that has recently added two "travel-friendly" features (no FTF and now TSA-Pre/GE refund) but it is a 2% cashback card.

Venture X is best used as a travel card. Apart from using the portal, which may have downsides as you suggest, you can also transfer points to travel partners. If you want aspirational travel (and you may well not) transferring points usually requires much less spend than trying to get enough cashback rewards to pay for a ticket/stay.

Re: Venture X vs Fidelity Rewards Visa

Varsity_Lu — Fri, 29 Nov 2024 16:38:51 GMT

What is "aspirational travel"? Never heard that phrase before. Nor has my wife.

Re: Venture X vs Fidelity Rewards Visa

Varsity_Lu — Fri, 29 Nov 2024 16:54:37 GMT

Just Googled it and all I read about is the Maldives. What am I missing?

Re: Venture X vs Fidelity Rewards Visa

Patient957 — Fri, 29 Nov 2024 17:02:12 GMT

@Varsity_Lu wrote:
Just Googled it and all I read about is the Maldives. What am I missing?

Try looking up "Capital One transfer partners."

Capital One VX offers the ability to transfer points out to airline and hotel transfer partners. Fidelity does not.

Aspirational travel is just what the words say. Think big fun trips in business class and staying at amazing hotels, all for free, i.e. point redemptions.

Re: Venture X vs Fidelity Rewards Visa

Patient957 — Fri, 29 Nov 2024 17:09:50 GMT

@Patient957 wrote:
@Varsity_Lu wrote:
Just Googled it and all I read about is the Maldives. What am I missing?
Try looking up "Capital One transfer partners."

Capital One VX offers the ability to transfer points out to airline and hotel transfer partners. Fidelity does not.

Aspirational travel is just what the words say. Think big fun trips in business class and staying at amazing hotels, all for free, i.e. point redemptions.

This is the fundamental difference between travel and pure cash back cards. You're really comparing apples and oranges.

Re: Venture X vs Fidelity Rewards Visa

Varsity_Lu — Fri, 29 Nov 2024 18:24:01 GMT

I need real world examples. I'll start, although my only experience with points is with Hilton. Right now I can book a room at the Niagara Falls Hilton for 38,000 points or $141. I'd have to spend over $6,000 buying groceries on a Surpass Card to earn that many points. However, if I just buy groceries with my Savor card, I'd earn $141 on just over $4,000 spent. So, I'd be much better off just paying cash for the room.

So, help me understand why cash back, saving up, and getting the best deal isn't the way to go? Can you give me real numbers as examples to know what kind of deals exist in the points world?

Re: Venture X vs Fidelity Rewards Visa

Patient957 — Fri, 29 Nov 2024 18:39:17 GMT

@Varsity_Lu wrote:
I'd have to spend over $6,000 buying groceries on a Surpass Card to earn that many points.

Now you're adding a hotel card to the mix and you're comparing apples to oranges to bananas. Travel Rewards vs Cash Back vs Hotel Card.

You really just need to understand the fundamental differences between these categories of credit cards. Then you run the numbers and decide what's best for your specific use case. We could spend all week going back and forth on various redemptions on various hotel or travel cards and comparing them to cash back, and we would get nowhere.

There's a million youtube channels that do this for a living. Go check them out.

You love your Fidelity card, that's cool. But many people are going to get more value out of VX, for their own specific use case.

Re: Venture X vs Fidelity Rewards Visa

Varsity_Lu — Fri, 29 Nov 2024 19:07:05 GMT

I don't have either card, just trying to understand the differences. I have watched several YouTube videos, but honestly, most of them are ramblings. I have yet to see one that gives me real numbers so I can see the value. Most just say Cap One points are worth $.01 each. Ok. So, VX is a 2% card then. So is Fidelity. I'm not seeing how they are that different. And since I don't have these cards, I can't just crunch the numbers. There's no way for me to see the numbers. That's why I am asking here.

What would you say the fundamental differences are between these two types of cards?

Re: Venture X vs Fidelity Rewards Visa

Patient957 — Fri, 29 Nov 2024 19:26:14 GMT

@Varsity_Lu wrote:
I don't have either card, just trying to understand the differences. I have watched several YouTube videos, but honestly, most of them are ramblings. I have yet to see one that gives me real numbers so I can see the value.

Here's a good video on aspirational redemptions:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S7vV7rAvDkc

Nothing like this is possible with cash back. He's getting 5 cents per point on some of these redemptions. Can't do that with cash back.

Re: Venture X vs Fidelity Rewards Visa

Patient957 — Fri, 29 Nov 2024 20:07:37 GMT

@Varsity_Lu wrote:
What would you say the fundamental differences are between these two types of cards?

Cash back: Consistent value at 1 CPP, in most cases. Has advantage of simplicity. No transfer to travel partners. Usually no AF.

Travel rewards: Earn flexible points that can be transferred to a variety of hotel and airline transfer partners. Sometimes offer outsized redemption values at 2+ CPP and sometimes even up to 5 CPP or more (aka "aspirational redemptions"). Have annual fees and large SUBs.

Hotel or Airline Cards: Earn inflexible miles and points for redemption only at a specific brand. Sometimes come with big status upgrades. Most have AFs. Come with big SUBs.

These are 3 different beasts.

I'm sure others can think of more differences, but these are some fundamental differences off the top of my head.

Re: Venture X vs Fidelity Rewards Visa

Windchill92 — Fri, 29 Nov 2024 20:57:12 GMT

@Patient957 wrote:
@Varsity_Lu wrote:
What would you say the fundamental differences are between these two types of cards?
Cash back: Consistent value at 1 CPP, in most cases. Has advantage of simplicity. No transfer to travel partners. Usually no AF.

Travel rewards: Earn flexible points that can be transferred to a variety of hotel and airline transfer partners. Sometimes offer outsized redemption values at 2+ CPP and sometimes even up to 5 CPP or more (aka "aspirational redemptions"). Have annual fees and large SUBs.

Hotel or Airline Cards: Earn inflexible miles and points for redemption only at a specific brand. Sometimes come with big status upgrades. Most have AFs. Come with big SUBs.

These are 3 different beasts.

I'm sure others can think of more differences, but these are some fundamental differences off the top of my head.

One question @Varsity_Lu will need to ask himself & the Mrs. is if they really value travel rewards / free bookings / transfer partners enough to justify a hotel or rewards card. BTW, the $141 booking + $9 + 1,872 HH points can be recouped after 3 quarters of the Surpass statement credit ($52*12 HHpoints/dollar * 3 quarters = 1,872).

I, myself, only book a hotel once or twice a year, and that has caused me to semi-regret getting the Surpass, even moreso since I've hit the SUB for 130,000 HH pts. If you reliably travel enough, travel cards can definitely make sense. Fanatics of travel cards talk about them like they're the greatest thing since sliced bread, but I'll hold that only a subset of cardholders can truly benefit from travel cards, whilst everyone will—in fact—benefit from cash back cards. If you go out of your way to book travel just to use the points, that's not organic spend. Queue the "cash is king" phrase...

At any rate, the Fidelity 2%er requires $1,250 spend before points are eligible for redemption ...and make sure you transfer to your CMA/Brokerage or other Fidelity acct since [iirc] they're valued at <1 cpp for a statement credit. The longtime SUB for it is $150 on $1000 spend...there's two links out there so make sure to apply thru it.

Re: Venture X vs Fidelity Rewards Visa

citymunky — Fri, 29 Nov 2024 21:28:33 GMT

@Varsity_Lu wrote:
Now that Fidelity has added TSA PreCheck credit as a benefit, how does it stack up to the Venture X card? Obviously the SUB on X is better, but after that, is there any difference? X has a $395 annual fee which can be recouped via the 10,000 points anniversary bonus and the $300 annual Capital One Travel credit. Fidelity has no annual fee. Both are 2% on everything cards. The downside I see with X is that you are basically locked into Cap One's travel portal. With Fidelity you can take the cash and shop around. What are your experiences with these cards? Which one is better than the other in your opinion?

I must have missed that benefit announcement about TSA PreCheck.

Just as the other mention, the VX is premium travel rewards card (marketed to people who want to redeem they rewards for travel based peaks, airport lounges, etc). Like other premium travel cards such as the AMEX Platinum and the Chase Sapphire Reserve, there is high annual fee to pay, however the benefits that cards offers usually provides value that basically pays for itself (TSA pre-check credits, Walmart+ credits, Car rental perks, etc, etc)

On the other hand the Fidelity Rewards Visa is a Cash Back rewards cards (marketed to people who want to redeem they rewards primary as cash back). However the Real Super power of the Fidelity card, and what makes it the best CB card on the market IMO is the ability to redeem your cash back as a deposit into any Fidelity (i.e. IRAs, brokerage, HSA, etc, etc). I my case I able to desposit over $1,000 of CB rewards into my IRA.

But if you really want to redeem Fidelity CB rewards for travel, they do offer a "travel portal" where you are able to earn an elevated reward percentage.

Re: Venture X vs Fidelity Rewards Visa

Varsity_Lu — Fri, 29 Nov 2024 23:12:28 GMT

Ok, I am going to pose a situation and I want to hear people's thoughts on the logic. Mind you, this is coming from a guy with almost no knowledge of how this travel points world works.

Person 1 is a cash back guy averaging 3% using several cards. He runs $2k per month through his cards and at the end of the year has put $720 into savings for travel.

Person 2 uses a VX card and runs $2k per month through it. At the end of the year he has 48,000 points. He has to pay the AF so I'm going to not consider the 10,000 anniversary points or the $300 portal credit into the mix for now.

The question is whether 48,000 points are more valuable for travel than $720 cash. If YouTube is to be believed, the 48,000 points are roughly worth $480.

Am I way off base here? I guess this was the logic that lead me to pose my OP.

Re: Venture X vs Fidelity Rewards Visa

Varsity_Lu — Fri, 29 Nov 2024 23:18:16 GMT

@citymunky wrote:
I must have missed that benefit announcement about TSA PreCheck.

TSA was just added a few weeks ago I believe. I don't have the card, but I read about it on a thread here on MF.

Re: Venture X vs Fidelity Rewards Visa

Saleen099 — Fri, 29 Nov 2024 23:24:13 GMT

@Varsity_Lu wrote:
@citymunky wrote:
I must have missed that benefit announcement about TSA PreCheck.
TSA was just added a few weeks ago I believe. I don't have the card, but I read about it on a thread here on MF.

https://www.doctorofcredit.com/fidelity-2-card-adds-100-tsa-precheck-or-global-entry-credit-plus-rental-car-insurance/

Re: Venture X vs Fidelity Rewards Visa

Anonymous — Fri, 29 Nov 2024 23:51:38 GMT

@Varsity_Lu wrote:

The question is whether 48,000 points are more valuable for travel than $720 cash. If YouTube is to be believed, the 48,000 points are roughly worth $480.

Am I way off base here? I guess this was the logic that lead me to pose my OP.

This is where the complexities of points come in. Cashback also has some variation e.g. with Fidelity, redeeming points into a Fidelity account gives more cash than some other choices, similarly with several issuers where pay-with-points/statement credit/pay into bank account might all have different values, But with travel, especially if you are transferring points, value very much depends on the exact details of the redemption.

In the youtube video that was linked earlier, you can see that they were getting often 4 cents per point, and up to 10 cents per point. If all redemptions were like the latter, 48,000 points would be worth $4,800. But even at 2 cpp, it's $960.

I am surprised that you are finding internet suggesting that 48,000 points is worth $480. That is, for example, the absolute minimum for Chase points, if you just cashed them in. Many other uses are higher. This is from the points guy, not everyone agrees but this is their valuation.

Program November 2024 valuation (cents) Latest news

American Express Membership Rewards	2.0	Amex is shuttering Centurion Lounge spas to add seating and combat overcrowding.
Bilt Rewards	2.05
Capital One	1.85
Chase Ultimate Rewards	2.05	Chase Sapphire Reserve® cardholders can now access select Air Canada lounges.
Citi ThankYou Rewards	1.8
Wells Fargo Rewards	1.6

Re: Venture X vs Fidelity Rewards Visa

FicoMike0 — Sat, 30 Nov 2024 00:19:37 GMT

@Varsity_Lu

You've brought up a good point, how do you compare cash back cards with points travel cards. Of the two examples you picked, one is a fee card, not the other.

Others note the difference between a general travel card and a hotel card. The difference being flexibility. That's the key. The travel card is more flexible than the hotel card. All in all, nothing is more flexible than cash. The points cards offer higher redemption if you jump through hoops.

I got the usb connect (for a $500 sub) and found it paid for global entry. This led me to look for another similar card to pay for a second ge for dw. The only no fee card I found was penfed pathfinder and the ba$tard$ turned me down. Since, I went for $49 navy flagship. The fidelity ge is new, too late for me.

As far as points vs cash, the connect sub was 50,000 points, which they cashed as $500 right into my checking.

Re: Venture X vs Fidelity Rewards Visa

Varsity_Lu — Sat, 30 Nov 2024 00:46:36 GMT

The 1 CPP value is straight from Cap One. I have zero experience so I am just going off of what they say.

I watched the video and, to be honest, the whole thing just seems so unreasonable. I'm sure he actually did travel like he said and I am glad for him, but there are a lot of unanswered questions. Like where did he get his 1 million points from? I mean, come on, the average person can't earn that many points in a normal lifetime. What is he running half a milion dollars through a card each year? Not very relatable. On top of that, all his travel seemed very laissez-faire. He pretty much just winged it. Who has three months to lolligag around the world looking for obscure high redemption value flights? Your average joe is looking for specific flights on specific days. Many of the deals he got were because he didn't have deadlines and he had a bazillion points. Most of us don't have those things.

I'm not knocking him. Really, I'm not. I'm glad he got to do this trip, but it doesn't seem to be a very good real world example of a person working a real job with a real family with real time and cash constraints. I highly doubt travel points are as valuable for us normal people.

Re: Venture X vs Fidelity Rewards Visa

Anonymous — Sat, 30 Nov 2024 01:14:34 GMT

@Varsity_Lu wrote:

I'm not knocking him. Really, I'm not. I'm glad he got to do this trip, but it doesn't seem to be a very good real world example of a person working a real job with a real family with real time and cash constraints. I highly doubt travel points are as valuable for us normal people.

Sorry, but you appear to be suffering from the "most people are really like me" syndrome. There are lots of sites devoted to people who do indeed successfully travel on points, not necessarily all the time or even frequently, but also for once-in-a-lifetime (aka aspirational!) travel for things like honeymoons or special vacations. To get 1M points you certainly don't need to spend $500K. Think of the great SUBs on some of the sign up cards, e.g. 175K MRs for the Amex Plat. Also, a lot of people, including some here, do lots of travel for their employer, and get points at no cost to them