topic Preparing for FICO 2008: which CCC's will or won't let AU's convert to joint users? in Credit Cards

Preparing for FICO 2008: which CCC's will or won't let AU's convert to joint users?

haulingthescoreup — Sat, 08 Mar 2008 23:43:31 GMT

Well, who knows when (or if!) FICO 2008 will kick in, suddenly removing a lot of credit history from current AU's (authorized users)? I figured it might be time to start a thread on which CCC's will and will NOT allow the AU's to switch to joint. I put it on General Credit Issues instead of Credit Cards, because it feels like a more "credit-y" issue to me, but mods, please feel free to move it if you think it best.

Just to summarize, there will still be AU status, so others can have a card with their name on it that they can use, and I think (?) it might even be reported on a credit report. But these accounts will be ignored in figuring your FICO scores.

My personal opinion is that it's probably smartest not to use joint accounts at all --there are too many sad surprises in credit and marriage these days, and it's an awful risk to allow your credit to be vulnerable to someone else's actions. You will be stuck with paying off the card if the other person runs it up and takes off. So if losing an AU account doesn't appreciably change a credit report, you might want to just let it go.

Being an AU on an account doesn't automatically mean that you will be hurt if it stops reporting. The things to look for are: (1) what does it do to your overall and average credit history, and (2) how much will your total amount of credit be reduced? (this can greatly affect your util.) In my case, losing my AU card will mean that my total length of credit history will drop from 18 years to 12, and average will drop from 4 years to 3. My total available credit will drop $14.4K, but I have a lot in my own name, and my util is 1%, so it won't have an immediate effect, but it's potentially out there.

There are also supposed to be new score buckets being created, and I suspect that it's for this very reason: to allow "de-AU'd" consumers to retain decent scores. I've decided to hold off switching my one AU card to joint until we see what's what.

Edit: It looks like I was wrong on the new buckets! From what I understand, there won't be any buckets created to rescue AU's who lost all their history.

But if you are comfortable with joint status, and your scores and history really do wind up getting hurt, it would be useful to know your options, IMHO. So here are the 2 things I know about !

Discover will allow conversion from AU to joint status, and the CSR told me that they do NOT pull scores on the person converting. The idea is that if the original card-holder is comfortable with it, that's all they need. After all, if the new person is a complete credit disaster and screws everything up, they can still come after the original. (Remember? --that's the dangerous thing about joint.)

American Express will NOT allow AU's to convert to joint, because they don't have joint status, period, from what I understand. I'm not yet in the "AmEx mafia", so please chime in with more info if you've got it.

I would think that this decision will be made by lender, rather than by card type, in most cases. Has anyone heard from Citi, Chase, a particular credit union, etc. whether they allow AU's to switch to joint, and what's involved?

Message Edited by haulingthescoreup on 03-08-2008 03:43 PM

Re: Preparing for FICO 2008: which CCC's will or won't let AU's convert to joint users?

demi — Thu, 22 Nov 2007 18:04:40 GMT

Out of curiousity, since in am in the process of buying a home that is yet to be built....assuming I am approved under the current scoring models, and by the time I actually close (est spring) the new scoring comes in....is there a chance, all other things in my credit stable, that it could affect my rates?

Re: Preparing for FICO 2008: which CCC's will or won't let AU's convert to joint users?

fused — Thu, 22 Nov 2007 18:15:17 GMT

CITI: No, AU accounts can't covert to joint accounts

Chase: Yes, AU accounts can convert to joint accounts. Expect a hard pull for the AU who is apping for joint and not the original primary card holder.

Message Edited by fused on 11-22-2007 08:15 AM

Re: Preparing for FICO 2008: which CCC's will or won't let AU's convert to joint users?

MidnightVoice — Thu, 22 Nov 2007 19:32:09 GMT

My Local Credit union - will convert with no pulls.

Re: Preparing for FICO 2008: which CCC's will or won't let AU's convert to joint users?

haulingthescoreup — Fri, 23 Nov 2007 01:37:46 GMT

@demi wrote:
Out of curiousity, since in am in the process of buying a home that is yet to be built....assuming I am approved under the current scoring models, and by the time I actually close (est spring) the new scoring comes in....is there a chance, all other things in my credit stable, that it could affect my rates?

What role does your AU account play on your report? Is it the oldest account; gives your total credit a big boost and thus helps lower your util; is clean and the rest is not; has baddies and the rest is clean?

edit: Mortgages aren't purely score-driven, and your lender should be well aware of the new rules, if they've kicked in by then. Also, you might wind up in one of the new buckets that will preserve your scores.

Message Edited by haulingthescoreup on 11-22-2007 05:37 PM

Re: Preparing for FICO 2008: which CCC's will or won't let AU's convert to joint users?

Anonymous — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 00:49:47 GMT

I called AMEX this morning to ask about AU. I was told that I am responsible for charges that I MAKE if the account goes into default (hence the separate account numbers on the cards).

Message Edited by esshua on 02-06-2008 07:49 PM

Re: Preparing for FICO 2008: which CCC's will or won't let AU's convert to joint users?

Anonymous — Mon, 31 Dec 2007 19:35:13 GMT

Is it a Green Card? My mom made me an AU on her American Express account also without my prior knowledge. She rolls some of her balance into a flex account. The rest is paid at the end of the month. The flex account shows as an installment account on my credit reports. There is no reference to the card as a revolving account on my credit reports. I haven't spoken to anyone at AMEX but I sort of assumed that legally, I would not be responsible for my charges (of course I would never default on my mom's card). I didn't know they could hold an AU responsible for charges. I thought that was the risk with adding on an AU. Oh and I have a seperate number too. However, I don't have any inquiries from AMEX.

Here comes my sinister side:

I thought of something concerning someone making you an AU on an account. Is there a way to prove consent. Without consent is it against the law? I could just imagine some ex girlfriend who still might have a person's info (and SS#), adding this guy to an account that is a high util mess and hence lowering his credit score ... right in the middle of buying a home! I wonder if anyone has done this. That would be the ultimate kick in the you-know-whats.

Re: Preparing for FICO 2008: which CCC's will or won't let AU's convert to joint users?

Anonymous — Mon, 31 Dec 2007 19:42:32 GMT

It's a Delta Sky Miles Account...

Here are the T&C from the Amex website... I bolded the juicy stuff...

But what I don't like is that Amex would make a 15 y/o kid an AU. Do they really think they can hold that kid responsible for anything? lol...

Terms and Conditions
By entering my name on the application form, I represent that I am a Delta SkyMiles Options Credit cardmember having a Card account with American Express and I ask that an Additional Card (s) be issued on my account to the individual (s) whose name (s) appears "Additional Card Applicant Information" section of the application form. I understand that an Additional Card will not be issued if I have a defaulted account with you or if the Additional Card applicant (s) has ever had a defaulted account with you. I agree to be liable for all charges to any Card (s) issued on my request, including charges incurred with any Additional Card (s) issued on my account now or in the future. The Additional Card applicant(s) is aware that they may be responsible for payment of their own charges if I fail to pay them, and their own credit record may be affected by non-payment of the account.

I represent that the Additional Card applicant (s) is aware that you may verify and exchange information on them, including requesting reports from consumer reporting agencies. If they ask whether or not a consumer report was requested, you will tell them, and if you received a report, you will give them the name and address of the agency that furnished it. If the Card(s) is issued, they have authorized you and your affiliates and subsidiaries to contact these sources for information at any time and to use any information obtained about them for marketing and administrative purposes unless I instruct you otherwise.

Only qualified individuals 15 or over may be approved for the Card.

Re: Preparing for FICO 2008: which CCC's will or won't let AU's convert to joint users?

Anonymous — Mon, 31 Dec 2007 19:44:05 GMT

fused wrote:
CITI: No, AU accounts can't covert to joint accounts

Chase: Yes, AU accounts can convert to joint accounts. Expect a hard pull for the AU who is apping for joint and not the original primary card holder.

Message Edited by fused on 11-22-2007 08:15 AM

Just want to add re: Chase.

Not only do they pull a hard INQ on the AU who is apping for joint, but a Chase CSR even told me that the AU's CR will determine if the joint status is even allowed, and if it is subpar, it could lead to a change in terms (read AA) on the account, which would affect the existing primary cardholder as well!

Not sure how true that is, as Chase CSRs have given me bad info in the past.

Message Edited by cheddar on 12-31-2007 11:44 AM

Re: Preparing for FICO 2008: which CCC's will or won't let AU's convert to joint users?

haulingthescoreup — Tue, 01 Jan 2008 01:51:12 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
Just want to add re: Chase.

Not only do they pull a hard INQ on the AU who is apping for joint, but a Chase CSR even told me that the AU's CR will determine if the joint status is even allowed, and if it is subpar, it could lead to a change in terms (read AA) on the account, which would affect the existing primary cardholder as well!

Not sure how true that is, as Chase CSRs have given me bad info in the past.

Well, geeze, aren't they just the funnest people? Where do they get off taking AA on the original account?

Even if they have suddenly found out that the AU is wobbly in credit terms, the whole definition of the primary cardholder is that s/he is responsible for the card.

BTW, the BofA site says that if someone goes on as AU, that person is responsible for his/ her charges.

Re: Preparing for FICO 2008: which CCC's will or won't let AU's convert to joint users?

Anonymous — Thu, 24 Jan 2008 22:21:58 GMT

My DW has a Chase and a BoA CC that I'm an AU on. Sounds like Chase will earn me a hard inq if I apply for joint status. Does anyone know if BoA would do the same? If BoA would soft inq me I might go for joint with them and then apply for another CC on my own. Thanks in advance.

Re: Preparing for FICO 2008: which CCC's will or won't let AU's convert to joint users?

haulingthescoreup — Sat, 08 Mar 2008 23:27:12 GMT

Now that I have amazing mod powers, I'm moving this over to Credit Cards, where I should have started it in the first place.

We now have indications that FICO 08 will start in May 08, although maybe not for EQ for a while. BUT it doesn't mean anything until lenders actually start using it, and I don't even know if we'll be able to pull our own FICO 08 scores for a good while.

But since many of us have AU accounts, and are trying to decide whether to convert to joint, I thought I'd revive this thread, this time where it's supposed to be.

Re: Preparing for FICO 2008: which CCC's will or won't let AU's convert to joint users?

fishbjc — Sat, 08 Mar 2008 23:57:08 GMT

I dumped my AU and took dh off of my cards. I called Dell and the csr didn't understand me, I wanted to put DH on as a joint. I'll keep calling back & update you on that one!

Re: Preparing for FICO 2008: which CCC's will or won't let AU's convert to joint users?

marty56 — Sat, 08 Mar 2008 23:57:31 GMT

I have a dim view on AU and joint cards or any sharing of credit with someone else. If the gain from AU is gone, it might be a good time to cut the cord.

Just my view.

Re: Preparing for FICO 2008: which CCC's will or won't let AU's convert to joint users?

fishbjc — Sat, 08 Mar 2008 23:58:18 GMT

As far as this mortgage thing: I was watching a mortgage program (Dateline maybe) and people were getting their app's reviewed and it WAS causing issues with their loans. I don't know the entire story because I was multi-tasking during the program!!!!

Re: Preparing for FICO 2008: which CCC's will or won't let AU's convert to joint users?

haulingthescoreup — Sun, 09 Mar 2008 00:02:21 GMT

@marty56 wrote:

I have a dim view on AU and joint cards or any sharing of credit with someone else. If the gain from AU is gone, it might be a good time to cut the cord.

Just my view.

I'm a little wary of joint accounts, too. They can strike back in ugly ways.

I'm not going to switch my AU status to joint yet, because I want to see what the damage is from losing my history. Since EX (only) has a 20-year-old account, I ought be able to get a good indication of the difference between a 12-year and 20-year history.

Message Edited by haulingthescoreup on 03-08-2008 04:02 PM

Re: Preparing for FICO 2008: which CCC's will or won't let AU's convert to joint users?

Anonymous — Sun, 06 Apr 2008 19:17:54 GMT

Regarding Discover, I called them last week re: the move to put my wife on my card as joint.

The CSR told me that they only pull a soft inq on the co-borrower, just to confirm the existence of the newly added joint cardholder and their SSN.

I mailed it last week, so I will update if they end up pulling a hard inq on my wife's CR (TU by the way).

Re: Preparing for FICO 2008: which CCC's will or won't let AU's convert to joint users?

MidnightVoice — Sun, 06 Apr 2008 19:46:03 GMT

haulingthescoreup wrote:
I'm a little wary of joint accounts, too. They can strike back in ugly ways.

Everything in our life is joint - what is DW's is DWs, and what is mine is DWs

Seriously - house, pensions, IRAs, main bank accounts. I think the cars are the exeption, and her has no payments anyway.

Apart from that I am AU on one of her cards and she is AU on one of mine, so that cancels everything out and sets us both up as independant people when required

Message Edited by MidnightVoice on 04-06-2008 02:46 PM

Re: Preparing for FICO 2008: which CCC's will or won't let AU's convert to joint users?

Anonymous — Sun, 06 Apr 2008 19:43:55 GMT

Bank of America allows for joint.

We just finished the co-application process for all but one of our BofA cards. We didn't even have to fill out any paperwork; it was all done over the phone.

We're joint on everything else (checking, savings, auto, brokerage, etc) anyway, so it's not as if being joint on credit cards is somehow different from how we already live our lives.

Re: Preparing for FICO 2008: which CCC's will or won't let AU's convert to joint users?

wmarat — Sun, 20 Apr 2008 18:56:18 GMT

cheddar wrote:

fused wrote:
CITI: No, AU accounts can't covert to joint accounts

Chase: Yes, AU accounts can convert to joint accounts. Expect a hard pull for the AU who is apping for joint and not the original primary card holder.

Message Edited by fused on 11-22-2007 08:15 AM
Just want to add re: Chase.

Not only do they pull a hard INQ on the AU who is apping for joint, but a Chase CSR even told me that the AU's CR will determine if the joint status is even allowed, and if it is subpar, it could lead to a change in terms (read AA) on the account, which would affect the existing primary cardholder as well!

Not sure how true that is, as Chase CSRs have given me bad info in the past.

Message Edited by cheddar on 12-31-2007 11:44 AM

DW converted her status on my 3 chase cards from AU to joint , no hard pull.