topic Re: Show mortgage payment or not when apping after chapter 7? in Credit Cards

Show mortgage payment or not when apping after chapter 7?

reno55 — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 02:23:59 GMT

After our discharge since we never reaffirmed our mortgage will never again report,which can be good or bad.

At any rate when applying down the road for cards should we state we own with a mortgage payment if it never reports again?

Re: Show mortgage payment or not when apping after chapter 7?

Anonymous — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 02:44:45 GMT

Yes. I would. The only alternative is renting and you are not doing that.

Re: Show mortgage payment or not when apping after chapter 7?

fittiger — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 03:02:38 GMT

Do they ask if you own with a mortgage payment or do they just ask if you own or rent?

I think if you just say you own they will assume you don't have a mortgage payment if they don't see a mortgage on your CR????

Re: Show mortgage payment or not when apping after chapter 7?

Anonymous — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 03:51:27 GMT

But if OP has a mortgage pyt and fails to disclose it; its a lie and unethical - IMO

Re: Show mortgage payment or not when apping after chapter 7?

Anonymous — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 03:56:44 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
But if OP has a mortgage pyt and fails to disclose it; its a lie and unethical - IMO

Fraud

Re: Show mortgage payment or not when apping after chapter 7?

Anonymous — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 04:08:17 GMT

@ Dustink

In a word, yes.

Re: Show mortgage payment or not when apping after chapter 7?

fittiger — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 15:46:12 GMT

Either one of us doesn't understand the OP's original question or I think somebody's being overly dramatic.

@Dustink.....Fraud is defined by intentional deception. Our credit worthiness in the eyes of creditors is based on our credit reports. Why offer them anything unasked that may hurt yourself. They sure as heck don't accept additional positive information that isn't in there...."I promise I pay all my bills on time even though you dont see that".

@09Lexie.....this whole board is about how to play the "credit game". Do you also think its unethical to lower your revovlving utility just so you can app for new credit and larger credit limits so you can charge more balances, or simply just maximizing your credit profile before apping? The lenders might see this as unethical or luring to trick them into giving you credit.

Should someone applying for credit who knows they just had an account go to collections disclose that information to the creditor during the application process? I'm betting your answer is no.....and I fail to see the difference.

The OP is asking about a hypothetical credit application down the road and whether they should disclose information, that may hurt their chances, assuming it isn't asked for.

Lying is unethical....and fraud. Applyin for credit you know you cant or wont pay back is unethical and fraud. Not disclosing information that isn't asked for is playing the credit game, IMO.....and there's nothing wrong with it.

What's really unethical is for these banks to have accepted hundreds of millions of dollars to keep themselves in business while kicking families out of their homes and not even attempting to work things out with them.

So when these banks are honest and fairand not accepting public funds...go ahead and automatically disclose whatever you want.

Re: Show mortgage payment or not when apping after chapter 7?

reno55 — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 15:56:40 GMT

@fittiger I couldn't have put it better myself. We are not committing fraud as I am simply asking since there will NEVER be proof of a positive or negative payment on this mortgage again... It appears on our report that the house went with the bk.

II think it's a reasonable question to ask

Re: Show mortgage payment or not when apping after chapter 7?

fittiger — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 16:07:23 GMT

I think if they ask for your mortgage information you have to provide it and should not lie. Otherwise, just don't bring it up.

Re: Show mortgage payment or not when apping after chapter 7?

Anonymous — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 17:46:28 GMT

My point was simple, if asked on a cr application - and I know of none that do not ask housing info- and OP is making a mortgage pyt and fails to disclose it is lying. Lying on a cr application is fraud.

@fittiger

Regarding util and lowering them for your chances of approval. Most on this board understand how FICO scoring works - we decide if we wish to PIF each month or carry a balance. Comparing lowering one's util to obtain a cr approval is not even in the same ballpark as deliberately failing to disclose. In your scenario, why not inflates one's income cause that is also a determining factor on approval. IMO, that is also unethical and lying

We can agree or disagree- but if you were a lender and reviewed an application where the mtg pyt is left blank and made a decision to approve cause now OPs d-t-I is lower, would not you feel deceived?

Re: Show mortgage payment or not when apping after chapter 7?

reno55 — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 18:16:24 GMT

Wow lexie you must work for a bank

Re: Show mortgage payment or not when apping after chapter 7?

fittiger — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 18:39:28 GMT

@09Lexie

I asked the question as to whether or not the application process asked for mortgage payment information or just if you owned or rented...and further said only disclose your mortgage info if asked for it. You proceeded to call me out as being unethical. I NEVER said lie, only not disclose adverse information if you're not asked for it. And this is exactly the same as manipulating your utility or credit profile to be approved or receive better credit.....you're working the system to make yourself look better in a creditors eyes.

Next time, please expound on your reply if you're going to call someone unethical. Had you simply said, "every application I've ever seen asks for mortgage payment information and lying about mortgage payments when asked is unethical" would have been enough to keep your reply from sounding pompous.

Re: Show mortgage payment or not when apping after chapter 7?

Anonymous — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 18:43:25 GMT

What about those elitely sought after credit cards and tradelines that are hidden? Like BML and I think there's a Chase one... Not disclosing any debt you have associated with those would be similar to not disclosing a mortgage that doesn't report on your CR... But no one critiques people who use those tradelines to hide their debt before applying for other credit.

It's certainly a bit shady not to admit to the mortgage, but there are many ways to look at it - things are rarely black and white.

For example you said "our" and "we" so if you're applying for separate credit products (not joint) you could always explain that the mortgage is taken from your other half's income, or only half of the mortgage comes from your income - since applicants are supposed to only include their personal income now instead HHI (which irks me since things like Medicaid/other medical assistance from clinics and gov. assistance are based of HHI still even if unmarried), why should you both have to claim a full mortgage/rent payment if you're both employed and contributing to expenses?

Re: Show mortgage payment or not when apping after chapter 7?

Anonymous — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 18:52:46 GMT

@fittiger

My response did not call you or the OP out as unethical. I was referring to the question asked: namely is it right or wrong to purposefully deceive the lender? My response to you which I expounded on included an additional hypothetical if you will - in reference to inflate one's income.

If you believed I was personalizing my opinion of you, I was not.

Re: Show mortgage payment or not when apping after chapter 7?

Anonymous — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 19:07:41 GMT

09Lexie - are you aware that some credit card applications do not ask for a housing payment if you put "Own" for housing status? Chase for example.

I believe the OP may be referring to these situations.

Re: Show mortgage payment or not when apping after chapter 7?

Anonymous — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 19:12:10 GMT

@ creditcardz

Yes, I am aware that cc apps ask for own/rent. Then there is a box 'usually' asking for amount. I believe the question was...do you put an amount there just because it is not on your cr. should you leave that box blank?

Re: Show mortgage payment or not when apping after chapter 7?

Adalen — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 20:10:15 GMT

I agree that it sounds pretty unethical to me. I mean, if you have to ask..

Re: Show mortgage payment or not when apping after chapter 7?

Anonymous — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 20:12:05 GMT

I just think it is important to distinguish between the applications that will allow you to enter in an monthly amount after selecting own, and those that won't (like Chase).

Obviously not supplying a mortage payment with the latter would not be fraud or unethical at all. But I agree that if asked for an amount, one should provide an accurate number regardless if it is on his/her credit report.

Re: Show mortgage payment or not when apping after chapter 7?

reno55 — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 20:27:35 GMT

Sheesh who knew asking this question would turn into this

Re: Show mortgage payment or not when apping after chapter 7?

fittiger — Thu, 25 Apr 2013 20:47:20 GMT

@09Lexie

I apologize if I came across too aggressively. I felt like you were calling me unethical and did not understand my point about there not being a spot for mortgage payment.