topic How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts? in Credit Cards

How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

EW800 — Tue, 11 Nov 2014 21:13:06 GMT

Perhaps this may vary by credit card company, however I was just wondering if anyone has experience with how most credit card companies feel about PIF prior to statement cuts? Would they generally view this as a positive, or could it be perceived as a negative in any way?

In my case, I pay all CC's in full prior to the statement cut, other than one account, for optimum FICO scoring. When it comes to making the banks happy, I have always wondered if this looks good in their eyes, possibly increasing the chances of a auto-CLI, or if somehow they would not like this. I assume they like the good payment history, don't like that they do not make any interest, but any positives or negatives beyond this?

Thanks!

Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

Membersince2013 — Tue, 11 Nov 2014 21:24:56 GMT

Only company that might have a problem is Amex. Other companies MIGHT not care. Amex MIGHT FR you.

Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

Involver — Tue, 11 Nov 2014 21:30:53 GMT

As long as you are paying your bill on time your lender of choice will not care.

To suggest that American Express with FR you for paying your balance before a statement cut is beyond ridiculous.

Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

CreditCuriosity — Tue, 11 Nov 2014 21:54:52 GMT

Why should it even matter if you pay bills before statement cut or after? I always pay it before it is due.. Am I missing something?

Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

SunriseEarth — Wed, 12 Nov 2014 19:31:15 GMT

@Membersince2013 wrote:
Only company that might have a problem is Amex. Other companies MIGHT not care. Amex MIGHT FR you.

I would actually say the opposite is true, since AMEX hates balances likes when members PIF. However, many have reported success with CL growth even with balances. Anecdotally, high balances with low payments may result in AA. SyncB appears to like balances to post, since that generates statements and statements allow for CLIs through use of the LUV button (this isn't true for auto-CLIs or calls to Credit Solutions--YMMV). There there's CCCs, like Citi, that block make it (IMHO) difficult for new cardholders from paying off anything over the posted balance; however, I'm not sure that means that they like posted balances; they may just want to see established use/payment patterns. It really is YMMV with the CCCs.

(Edited: my original post was hastily made from my phone and I didn't properly address the complex way in which CCCs view balances and payment. As I don't want to contribute to misinformation, I have amplified my original post)

Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

Chris679 — Tue, 11 Nov 2014 22:23:49 GMT

@Involver wrote:
As long as you are paying your bill on time your lender of choice will not care.

To suggest that American Express with FR you for paying your balance before a statement cut is beyond ridiculous.

Totally agree and wish people would stop scaring everyone and convincing everyone that you need to walk around on pins and needles to keep CCCs happy.

OP pay your cards whenever YOU feel like it, on time of course.

Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

FinStar — Tue, 11 Nov 2014 23:00:19 GMT

@Chris679 wrote:
@Involver wrote:
As long as you are paying your bill on time your lender of choice will not care.

To suggest that American Express with FR you for paying your balance before a statement cut is beyond ridiculous.
Totally agree and wish people would stop scaring everyone and convincing everyone that you need to walk around on pins and needles to keep CCCs happy.

OP pay your cards whenever YOU feel like it, on time of course.

Exactly.

Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

FinStar — Tue, 11 Nov 2014 23:07:58 GMT

@SunriseEarth wrote:
@Membersince2013 wrote:
Only company that might have a problem is Amex. Other companies MIGHT not care. Amex MIGHT FR you.
I would actually say the opposite is true, since AMEX hates balances. I think it varies with CCC. SyncB likes balances to post, since that generates statements and statements allow for CLIs. There there's CCCs, like Citi, that block new cardholders from paying off anything over the posted balance. It's probably a tossup with other companies.

Some inacurate points. AMEX may frown upon carrying a revolving balance for a period of time but not necessarily if someone revolved for 2 or 3 months (again all driven by internal score factors, history, etc.). Same thing with charge cards, pay before cycle date or after cycle date - as long as it's paid when it's due. The FR piece is definitely overblown in these forums.

For SYNCB, there is no exact formula and your statement appears inacurate. I have yet to let any balance report for SYNCB on any of the 10 CC's I have with them and it has not hindered auto-CLIs, let alone requesting one when needed - statements still generate for the great majority of them with a 0 balance. This will vary by individual of course since all kinds of variables are take into account such as an individual's credit profile.

As far as Citi, incorrect again - there's options. You can call and make a payment over the phone or push through your bank before the 1st statement is due, so there is nothing "prohibitive".

Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

Anonymous — Tue, 11 Nov 2014 23:10:27 GMT

@FinStar wrote:
@Chris679 wrote:
@Involver wrote:
As long as you are paying your bill on time your lender of choice will not care.

To suggest that American Express with FR you for paying your balance before a statement cut is beyond ridiculous.
Totally agree and wish people would stop scaring everyone and convincing everyone that you need to walk around on pins and needles to keep CCCs happy.

OP pay your cards whenever YOU feel like it, on time of course.
Exactly.

+1 here.

@FinStar wrote:

Some inacurate points. AMEX may frown upon carrying a revolving balance for a period of time but not necessarily if someone revolved for 2 or 3 months (again all driven by internal score factors, history, etc.). Same thing with charge cards, pay before cycle date or after cycle date - as long as it's paid when it's due. The FR piece is definitely overblown in these forums.

I had completely the opposite experience with AMEX and carrying a balance as i've said many times.

Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

Anonymous — Wed, 12 Nov 2014 01:54:22 GMT

@Membersince2013 wrote:
Only company that might have a problem is Amex. Other companies MIGHT not care. Amex MIGHT FR you.

How original, bringing Amex as a monster in another fabricated horror credit story.

The only problem with PIF before statement cut is that lately EX reporting has changed and they are not reporting activity prior to Statement Cut.

In the past, even if you paid before SC, if had a highest balance record, for example, it would be reported by EX. Last month, I broke three high balance records, with three different banks, I didn't let any of them post and EX did not report one iota of activity in any of the three accounts. That is new and I don't like it.

Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

HiLine — Wed, 12 Nov 2014 05:40:21 GMT

It's hard to tell how each bank views this. With BofA, I almost always paid in full before a statement cut, and I got a huge CLI from 2k to 12k. With Chase, I also paid in full the same way until a few months ago when I let large balances get reported; Chase gave me a pretty good CLI without asking, from 6.5k to 10.5k.

Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

SunriseEarth — Wed, 12 Nov 2014 19:49:40 GMT

@FinStar wrote:
@SunriseEarth wrote:
@Membersince2013 wrote:
Only company that might have a problem is Amex. Other companies MIGHT not care. Amex MIGHT FR you.
I would actually say the opposite is true, since AMEX hates balances. I think it varies with CCC. SyncB likes balances to post, since that generates statements and statements allow for CLIs. There there's CCCs, like Citi, that block new cardholders from paying off anything over the posted balance. It's probably a tossup with other companies.
Some inacurate points. AMEX may frown upon carrying a revolving balance for a period of time but not necessarily if someone revolved for 2 or 3 months (again all driven by internal score factors, history, etc.). Same thing with charge cards, pay before cycle date or after cycle date - as long as it's paid when it's due. The FR piece is definitely overblown in these forums.

For SYNCB, there is no exact formula and your statement appears inacurate. I have yet to let any balance report for SYNCB on any of the 10 CC's I have with them and it has not hindered auto-CLIs, let alone requesting one when needed - statements still generate for the great majority of them with a 0 balance. This will vary by individual of course since all kinds of variables are take into account such as an individual's credit profile.

As far as Citi, incorrect again - there's options. You can call and make a payment over the phone or push through your bank before the 1st statement is due, so there is nothing "prohibitive".

Anecdotally, AMEX still seems to prefer the "charge card" model. There are plenty of examples where people carry balances and get CLIs and there are other examples of those who carry high balances and make low payments and then experience AA. My statement that "AMEX hates balances" was too broad and misleading, so I have amended it. Carrying a balance doesn't mean AMEX will slap you on the wrist. However, they do seem to like PIF. But I will agree with the overall idea that people seem too scared of AMEX taking AA.

As for SyncB, I've never received a statement when a zero balance has posted on my Amazon, JCP, or Wal-Mart, and that experience has been shared by many members here. The 4 statement rule definitely seems applicable to the LUV button, however auto-CLI and Credit Solutions are definitely the easiest ways around that. I have since clarified that in my original post.

As for Citi, yes, it is possible to pay more than your posted balance if you are a new cardholder. But I personally consider it a "block" when I can't easily make that payment online (although you can edit the pending payment to whatever amount you want, if you click on the right place). Setting up Bill Pay or making calls adds steps to the process, so IMHO, I consider it prohibitive. I admit this is only my opinion, so I amended my original post to better reflect that.

Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

Membersince2013 — Wed, 12 Nov 2014 13:06:11 GMT

Well, the reason for making the comment is about i've read about FRs from Amex for making too many payments during a statement period.

Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

HiLine — Wed, 12 Nov 2014 16:06:45 GMT

If you go around searching on this forum enough, you'll realize that the only way to not get an Amex FR is to not have an Amex-issued card at all.

Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

takeshi74 — Wed, 12 Nov 2014 18:57:40 GMT

@EW800 wrote:
How do CCC's feel about PIF *BEFORE* statement cuts?

They don't feel anything. They're businesses. It doesn't matter. They just want to get paid on time.

@EW800 wrote:
When it comes to making the banks happy, I have always wondered if this looks good in their eyes, possibly increasing the chances of a auto-CLI, or if somehow they would not like this.

IMO there's a bit too much causality assumed with usage as well. Usage can help but usage will not overrule your credit and income which are definitely factors used to determine CLI's.

@Membersince2013 wrote:
Only company that might have a problem is Amex. Other companies MIGHT not care. Amex MIGHT FR you.

@SunriseEarth wrote:
I would actually say the opposite is true, since AMEX hates balances.

Both of these are gross oversimplifcations. The fear of FR is overblown here and the first comment just adds to it. AmEx doesn't care if you pay prior to statement end.

Similarly, "AmEx hates balances" gets parroted a lot around here and that's not the case. I've carried balances and even received CLI's while carrying balances. It's not quite so straightforward as "balance versus no balance". Don't rely on simple generalizations like these.

Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

SunriseEarth — Wed, 12 Nov 2014 19:46:56 GMT

@takeshi74 wrote:
@EW800 wrote:
How do CCC's feel about PIF *BEFORE* statement cuts?
They don't feel anything. They're businesses. It doesn't matter. They just want to get paid on time.

@EW800 wrote:
When it comes to making the banks happy, I have always wondered if this looks good in their eyes, possibly increasing the chances of a auto-CLI, or if somehow they would not like this.
IMO there's a bit too much causality assumed with usage as well. Usage can help but usage will not overrule your credit and income which are definitely factors used to determine CLI's.

@Membersince2013 wrote:
Only company that might have a problem is Amex. Other companies MIGHT not care. Amex MIGHT FR you.
@SunriseEarth wrote:
I would actually say the opposite is true, since AMEX hates balances.
Both of these are gross oversimplifcations. The fear of FR is overblown here and the first comment just adds to it. AmEx doesn't care if you pay prior to statement end.

Similarly, "AmEx hates balances" gets parroted a lot around here and that's not the case. I've carried balances and even received CLI's while carrying balances. It's not quite so straightforward as "balance versus no balance". Don't rely on simple generalizations like these.

I have amended my original post to add needed clarification, as I don't want to contribute to any further misunderstandings of this issue.

Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

Anonymous — Wed, 12 Nov 2014 19:48:05 GMT

Two questions regarding this subject:

What does FR mean?

As for PIF before statement cuts. I would assume that to some extent, this would upset CCCs because they aren't making any interest off of you? Wouldn't the CCCs want to make some sort of profit? If most customers paid before interest charges posted, wouldn't that remove the incentive for CCCs to issue CCs? Given that, I would assume that always PIF before statement cuts could potentially work against you. The same way CCCs have metrics on their customer's usage patterns to determine their eligibility for CLIs and approvals, I'm sure they have internal metrics on how much money they're making off of customers due to interest charges, AF, etc. There's gotta be a sweet spot; where they're making interest off you but you're utilizing/paying your CC responsibly. Don't take my word for it though, I am just speculating. Someone correct me if I'm wrong or if my POV is skewed.

Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

CreditCuriosity — Wed, 12 Nov 2014 19:52:02 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
Two questions regarding this subject:

What does FR mean?

As for PIF before statement cuts. I would assume that to some extent, this would upset CCCs because they aren't making any interest off of you? Wouldn't the CCCs want to make some sort of profit? If most customers paid before interest charges posted, wouldn't that remove the incentive for CCCs to issue CCs? Given that, I would assume that always PIF before statement cuts could potentially work against you. The same way CCCs have metrics on their customer's usage patterns to determine their eligibility for CLIs and approvals, I'm sure they have internal metrics on how much money they're making off of customers due to interest charges, AF, etc. There's gotta be a sweet spot; where they're making interest off you but you're utilizing/paying your CC responsibly. Don't take my word for it though, I am just speculating. Someone correct me if I'm wrong or if my POV is skewed.

FR = Financial Review

As far as interest goes one would think a CC company would like that as well meaning making money from that angel as well as long as the person has the ability to pay it back, but they also get 2-5% swipe fees depending what kinda CC it is, so they make money that way as well

Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

SunriseEarth — Wed, 12 Nov 2014 19:55:04 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
Two questions regarding this subject:

What does FR mean?

As for PIF before statement cuts. I would assume that to some extent, this would upset CCCs because they aren't making any interest off of you? Wouldn't the CCCs want to make some sort of profit? If most customers paid before interest charges posted, wouldn't that remove the incentive for CCCs to issue CCs? Given that, I would assume that always PIF before statement cuts could potentially work against you. The same way CCCs have metrics on their customer's usage patterns to determine their eligibility for CLIs and approvals, I'm sure they have internal metrics on how much money they're making off of customers due to interest charges, AF, etc. There's gotta be a sweet spot; where they're making interest off you but you're utilizing/paying your CC responsibly. Don't take my word for it though, I am just speculating. Someone correct me if I'm wrong or if my POV is skewed.

FR means Financial Review. This refers to AA (Adverse Action) taken by a CCC to where the account is reviewed and financial/tax documents are required to be submitted for resolution; this can result in CLD (credit limit decrease) and/or closed accounts if not resolved favorably.

As for interest, you can pay after a balance posts and still avoid interest, so long as you PIF by the due date (the exception to this would be CreditOne, who offers no "grace period"). The CCCs also make money from swipe fees, so even those who PIF are still a source of income for the CCCs.

Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

Anonymous — Wed, 12 Nov 2014 19:58:40 GMT

@SunriseEarth wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
Two questions regarding this subject:

What does FR mean?

As for PIF before statement cuts. I would assume that to some extent, this would upset CCCs because they aren't making any interest off of you? Wouldn't the CCCs want to make some sort of profit? If most customers paid before interest charges posted, wouldn't that remove the incentive for CCCs to issue CCs? Given that, I would assume that always PIF before statement cuts could potentially work against you. The same way CCCs have metrics on their customer's usage patterns to determine their eligibility for CLIs and approvals, I'm sure they have internal metrics on how much money they're making off of customers due to interest charges, AF, etc. There's gotta be a sweet spot; where they're making interest off you but you're utilizing/paying your CC responsibly. Don't take my word for it though, I am just speculating. Someone correct me if I'm wrong or if my POV is skewed.

FR means Financial Review. This refers to AA (Adverse Action) taken by a CCC to where the account is reviewed and financial/tax documents are required to be submitted for resolution; this can result in CLD (credit limit decrease) and/or closed accounts if not resolved favorably.

As for interest, you can pay after a balance posts and still avoid interest, so long as you PIF by the due date (the exception to this would be CreditOne, who offers no "grace period"). The CCCs also make money from swipe fees, so even those who PIF are still a source of income for the CCCs.

OH. That makes sense. In that case, it sounds like there's not much incentive to PIF after statement cuts, pending you simply don't have the funds to cover it yet or you intend on carrying a balance.

topic How do CCC's feel about PIF *BEFORE* statement cuts? in Credit Cards

How do CCC's feel about PIF *BEFORE* statement cuts?

Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF *BEFORE* statement cuts?

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topic How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts? in Credit Cards

How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

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Re: How do CCC's feel about PIF BEFORE statement cuts?

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