topic Re: Score updates coming quick in Understanding FICO® Scoring

Score updates coming quick

Stryder — Wed, 02 Nov 2016 19:32:41 GMT

I have posted on other threads that a lot of things are going on with my tl's and CRA...

to sum up

We bought a car on 7/28

App'ed and got the BCE and CSP first week of September

In November my last derog is supposed to fall off all 3B, EQ still has an old CO for $77, so there are two baddies on EQ.

Scores on 9/10 Fico 8 EQ 652.... TU 667.... EX 675

As INQ's and TL's start reporting the scores started going everywhere...mostly down.

On 10/19, the one derog on my EX fell off, and my score went to 739

On 11/1, my EX jumped again to 747 (not sure why) I think it was my brand new accounts aging

Called EQ today to dispute the $77 CO since I had the deletion letter....it's from 2010, so its a no brainer, just have to fax them the letter and she said they would process within 48 hours. While I was on the phone with her, I had her chack the derog and she couldn't find it under the name I was giving her...I gave her a few differnt names and she couldn't find it..... It finally dawned on me...it was gone!!!! SaWeeeet! Once the CO gets cleared, My EQ will be clean!

Scores today Fico 8 EQ 696.....TU 702...EX747

So I am down to the one CO on EQ and the one derog on TU...I could maybe be completly clean on all 3B's by next week...I am hoping for 40 pts on EQ and TU ...we'll have to see! I a smartwatch and I jump everytime a notification comes through on it!

Oh, and also...my 3x is coming up Friday! (I am loving November!) I pif'ed it earlier today and they check EX., which is up 67pts since I got the card... I want to upgrade to the BCE Preferred...do you think they will do it at the same time? Or how does that work?

I am sorry to keep babbling about all this, but this is very exciting to us!

Re: Score updates coming quick

805orbust — Fri, 04 Nov 2016 12:02:19 GMT

With Amex the score update happens monthly. Make sure to log in and check to ensure they've got the updated score. So excited for you. Good job, and great cards of course. CSP is on my radar but I need some more gardening time first.

Re: Score updates coming quick

Stryder — Fri, 04 Nov 2016 21:55:55 GMT

@805orbust wrote:
With Amex the score update happens monthly. Make sure to log in and check to ensure they've got the updated score. So excited for you. Good job, and great cards of course. CSP is on my radar but I need some more gardening time first.

Morning 805 and thank you! I've technically had 2 statments from them...first was a partial, the second was the 16th last month. AMEX shows on EQ and TU, but not EX yet?

I am almost like in a dream state with what is going on. I was on a thread last night chatting about card offer mailings and I am not getting the Cap one offers for $750 anymore...I'm getting the good stuff..I have a large marroon envelope sitting next to me for an AMEX PRG for 50,000 miles with a 2k spend...(It has RSVP codes and all which I guess means I have a pretty good shot at it). That would be no problem to do the 2k spend, I hate to pass up free $500, but I don't really need that card. I think this is where real patience comes is not going crazy with the new abilities. I am still focusing on the SDFCU card with their low apr for BT's. I recon'ed this week so I am anxiously waiting.

Question...Do charges cards have a CL that adds to utilization?

I did check my score and it updated to show the 739, but not the current 747. Today is my 61rst day!!! I will strike up a chat after I see what happens with SDFCU.

I would like to do a PC up the Preffered and see if I could get 10k cl, but others have said you cant pc for 12 mo's to an AF. I will just play stupid and ask them questions! haha

The CSP is my favorite card..I dont know what made me App for it. I was approved for the BCE on 9/4 and was shocked I was instantly approved (EX 681) for 2k. 3 days later and read about the pre-qual for Chase... no HP...I fill out the first page and the next said which card do you want...FU, Slate, or the CSP...I clicked the CSP, next page was to fill out more detailed info, a couple of more pages and the next thing I know I was approved!! My DW and I couldn't believe! I've been reading about CSP approvals and some of the horror stories makes me realize HOW lucky I am. YMMV could never be more true than with this business!

Re: Score updates coming quick

Stryder — Sat, 05 Nov 2016 10:48:08 GMT

UPDATE: My TU last baddie fell off yesterday and my score this morning went up 71 pts to...773 !! I couldn't believe it! Holy Cow! I was hoping it would go up to 740 - 750 maybe... I think it is bigger than my EX because TU still has a 12 yr old account which raises my AAoA....it fell off of EQ and EX so the oldest there is 10 yrs,,,which I don't understand why closed accounts fall off and then CR's tell me my accounts are not that old.

My EQ is still at 696, that derog is gone too, but it still has a $77 collection that I filed a dispute on and sent them the Deletion Letter they gave me when I paid it off... so it should be gone pretty quick and then all 3B's will be squeaky clean.

Boy, its going to be hard to go the Garden with a tasty TU 773 and NFCU just sitting there looking pretty..

Re: Score updates coming quick

805orbust — Sat, 05 Nov 2016 12:30:44 GMT

SCHWEEEEEEEEET!!! That is unbelievably excellent to coin a phrase. Yeah, for sure your biggest challenge is going to be calming down and tending to your garden. But definitely TRY to calm down at some point lol. As for NFCU you need to just go for that now. Unless for the principle you wanna wait till that $73 pain in the rear is gone. It looks like it's a crapshoot as to who they pull, however there are more TU pulls than any in the credit pulls database. With scores like that your starting limit will be hovering around 20k for sure. So happy for you guys. LOVE this stuff!!

But calm down ok? LOL!!!

Re: Score updates coming quick

805orbust — Sat, 05 Nov 2016 12:37:50 GMT

Oh, and with charge cards there is no utilization, just your balance. There is some funky formula I read about here where your high balance is compared to your reported balance and made into a utilization component. Haven't verified, HOWEVER, just in case I let $3,000 report one month and then that was it. It'll never see more than20% even if I goof off one month. Awesome job dude, awesome.

Re: Score updates coming quick

Stryder — Sat, 05 Nov 2016 13:14:10 GMT

@805orbust wrote:
SCHWEEEEEEEEET!!! That is unbelievably excellent to coin a phrase. Yeah, for sure your biggest challenge is going to be calming down and tending to your garden. But definitely TRY to calm down at some point lol. As for NFCU you need to just go for that now. Unless for the principle you wanna wait till that $73 pain in the rear is gone. It looks like it's a crapshoot as to who they pull, however there are more TU pulls than any in the credit pulls database. With scores like that your starting limit will be hovering around 20k for sure. So happy for you guys. LOVE this stuff!!

But calm down ok? LOL!!!

Haha...I'm trying to calm down, but jeeze.... I fight and fight to get things fixed and now I cant use it? Here's your new Lamborgini, but you cant drive it?

I am just shocked at how big the jumps are...I was hoping to be in 720 - 730 avg overall. My goal was 740's by spring.

I am looking for a bigger Total Util...I am only at 16k with all I have now. I still haven't done my 3x ... I chatted with them and ask if it was a HP or SP and he said it could be either, so I am going to wait until I see what I want to do. I dont want to waste an hp for 4k. I really want a low apr BT card and as TCL as I can get. That way I can roll a 4k bl and still only be around 10%.

I am going to go a head and start the process to join the Navy League because it will take a week or so, that will give time for the $77 deal to be gone off of Equisux (currently 696 Fico 8). From what I've read on the new NFCU thread, they are pulling TU for CC and EQ for membership and LOC's.

I just pulled my 1B on TU and was surprised my Fico 8's are better than the older Ficos...accross the board.

Bankcard 8 - 792

Bankcard 4 - 752

Fico 4 may still be good enough for a chance at 20k? My income is only 60k, so I don't know if that will hold me back

We'll see! I really appreciate your support...this is life changing for us. This also shows that if you have bad stuff on your CR's (I had 5 in Jan16, 1 repo, 1 collection, 3 co's) as long as you keep making no mistakes on payments and pif you cards, when the baddies are gone, your accounts will shine!

Re: Score updates coming quick

Anonymous — Sat, 05 Nov 2016 15:35:12 GMT

Congrats, Stryder. Very happy for you.

The most encouraging thing I read is to watch you feel tempted (based on feelings, emotions, impulses) to do a certain thing (e.g. apply for an Amex PRG) but then (with some difficulty) rein yourself in and remind yourself to stick to your plan (whatever the plan might be).

This habit of mind is incredibly important -- a million times more important than the specific cards you have, bonuses you get, the speed at which your scores are going up, etc. To reemphasize that habit is this:

(1) Calmly, coldly, and methodically make a plan for your finances. (This applies to credit building or retirement or whatever.)

(2) Stick with the plan and do not let feelings/impulses of the moment cause you deviate from it. In your case this may take the form of credit card offers, but it applies to people with investments too (greed for a new stock, fear that you are missing out on X or Y, fear that the market will tank, etc.).

(3) Reevaluate and update the plan once or twice a year at fixed intrevals -- but not when you are in the throes of any kind of excitement (worry, fear, elation, greed, etc.).

Again, best wishes for a great future.

Re: Score updates coming quick

Anonymous — Sat, 05 Nov 2016 15:47:36 GMT

PS. I saw that part of your plan is to try to increase your total credit limit. You mention that it is 16k now but you want it to be higher.

That's a fine goal. Personally my advice is to make it a very secondary goal. I am sure you have heard that over time you can periodically solicit soft-pull based CLIs. And you have several cards so it will certainly go up over time.

But I'd also mislead you if I told you that the bigger CL would help your score. If it does help a person's score, that necessarily means that he is unable to pay off his cards. And if that's so, then that becomes the (very serious) problem to work on, not one's CL. Yours is fine right now and you should be able to easily have a total utilization of < 29 % without even trying, and of course if you need a top score you can get it in a heartbeat by paying all cards to $0 except one.

PPS. If you ever do get a charge card, make sure that you do not use it (or an AU card) as the "one" card that reports a balance (if you are straining for a top score). FICO may ignore it and then it would look like all your cards are at $0.

Re: Score updates coming quick

Stryder — Sat, 05 Nov 2016 15:59:55 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
Congrats, Stryder. Very happy for you.

The most encouraging thing I read is to watch you feel tempted (based on feelings, emotions, impulses) to do a certain thing (e.g. apply for an Amex PRG) but then (with some difficulty) rein yourself in and remind yourself to stick to your plan (whatever the plan might be).

This habit of mind is incredibly important -- a million times more important than the specific cards you have, bonuses you get, the speed at which your scores are going up, etc. To reemphasize that habit is this:

(1) Calmly, coldly, and methodically make a plan for your finances. (This applies to credit building or retirement or whatever.)

(2) Stick with the plan and do not let feelings/impulses of the moment cause you deviate from it. In your case this may take the form of credit card offers, but it applies to people with investments too (greed for a new stock, fear that you are missing out on X or Y, fear that the market will tank, etc.).

(3) Reevaluate and update the plan once or twice a year at fixed intrevals -- but not when you are in the throes of any kind of excitement (worry, fear, elation, greed, etc.).

Again, best wishes for a great future.

Thank You VERY much CGiD. You (and many others) have given me great advice along the way and it helps having the knowledge shares, and just the comfort of a place to run to and sort through the trauma and confusion in dealing with such an important issue that is in our lives.

I've said it once and I'll say it again, this is a life changing event that is happening to us right now. Those of you that are younger on here complaining about having bad credit for 3 or 4 years....try 30 or 40 years. I don't know exactly what my scores were (because I never checked, probably high 600's) ...after 2009, we've had nothing for 7 years...2 cars with over 100,000 miles apiece, one $500 credit card. I lived in mortal fear that a transmission or something would go out and we would be sunk. I fixed the cars myself, made perfect payments, and worked at getting credit and paying back with out any mistakes...and now its paid off.

My wife and I just hugged for an hour with tears in our eyes this morning realizing this is reality. I will never ever let us get back in the situation we were in before. And I believe I can make that statement now because I am educated in credit!

Re: Score updates coming quick

Stryder — Sat, 05 Nov 2016 16:21:00 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
PS. I saw that part of your plan is to try to increase your total credit limit. You mention that it is 16k now but you want it to be higher.

That's a fine goal. Personally my advice is to make it a very secondary goal. I am sure you have heard that over time you can periodically solicit soft-pull based CLIs. And you have several cards so it will certainly go up over time.

But I'd also mislead you if I told you that the bigger CL would help your score. If it does help a person's score, that necessarily means that he is unable to pay off his cards. And if that's so, then that becomes the (very serious) problem to work on, not one's CL. Yours is fine right now and you should be able to easily have a total utilization of < 29 % without even trying, and of course if you need a top score you can get it in a heartbeat by paying all cards to $0 except one.

PPS. If you ever do get a charge card, make sure that you do not use it (or an AU card) as the "one" card that reports a balance (if you are straining for a top score). FICO may ignore it and then it would look like all your cards are at $0.

Here is where I am at on my plan... I am happy with my rewards cards and the mix/diversity. I do not need any more rewards because I don't see any use for having cards in the sockdrdrawer, i have all that I can feed now. I do however want a good BT card or two ...I have mentioned SDFCU because of their 7.24% rate, but I don't know how much of a cl I can get with them. I am also interested in this NFCU Platinum because it also has a good rate at 8.24% and could be an awesome SL.

With this setup I can buy with my reward cards and if I want to carry a balance, I can bt to these cards...I may get both and then I will be set and go the garden for a year or two and let things grow. The PRG card was exciting but it doesn't fit in with me...I have the CSP for mileage, the Amex and QS for rotation, and the Sync card for refridgerators and furniture where I can carry with zero for for 36mo. I also believe I can get very good car rates between these two CU's

Let me know if this is a decent plan or if there are different ways to approach what I am doing...

Thanks again for your advice CGiD!

Re: Score updates coming quick

805orbust — Sat, 05 Nov 2016 16:45:05 GMT

Good advice Credit Guy. It's a great story Stryker. Nice to read this kind of thing.

Re: Score updates coming quick

Anonymous — Sat, 05 Nov 2016 18:17:04 GMT

Your plans sound fine. What I think is most important is that they are your plans -- you are carefully thinking things through and making a plan. That's better than most of us do (me included).

I don't know much about BT cards. I seem to get 0% offers (unsure whether there are BT fees) about half of the time I get a card. I never use them, since I have a lot of cash in the bank. I wonder whether it makes sense to wait on the BT issue until you actually need it -- and then when you do, apply for whatever cards are out there that are currently running a 12 or 18 month 0% promotion. (As I say, I seem to get these even if I am solely looking for a huge signup bonus.)

Other folks can guide you better through the whole BT and carrying a balance issue, since as I say I never use that aspect of CCs. A very quick question, however: do you plan to buy a house or refinance an existing mortgage in the next few years?

Re: Score updates coming quick

Stryder — Sat, 05 Nov 2016 18:19:27 GMT

however: do you plan to buy a house or refinance an existing mortgage in the next few years?

Yes....

ayRe: Score updates coming quick

Anonymous — Sat, 05 Nov 2016 20:08:53 GMT

In that event, you may wish to move away from the pattern of occasionally carrying balances, and moving instead toward always paying your cards in full.

For many many years there was never any downside to carrying balances (aside from the interest you might have to pay) since creditors and future lenders had no way to see if you did that. A person preparing for any important credit pull (like a mortgage) could simply pay off his credit cards a month before and it would look like you had always had mostly zero balances and maybe one small balance.

Until, that is, a fairly new development, where potential lenders began to be able to see if you have carried balances in the last 24 months and if so how much and how often and whether you only paid the minimum payment. Furthermore (and this started only a month or two ago) Fannie Mae has required lenders to incorporate this into their decision making. People who occasionally carry balances are called revolvers and are (as a group of people) far riskier than those who always pay their cards in full.

Here's a recent thread where this was discussed:

http://ficoforums.myfico.com/t5/Credit-in-the-News/Equifax-going-to-report-balance-payment-amount-history-Is-this/td-p/4758761

Score updates coming quick

Stryder — Sat, 05 Nov 2016 22:25:45 GMT

That is good to know, but I don't plan on carrying a balance, the BT cards are for after we get a mortgage and for doing upgrades and such..also emergencies. The only balance I am carrying now is what's left on my SYNC card ($850), once that is paid off, I will have zero balance on all cards...I pif them all and i will rotate around each to leave the one balance on.

That is great info in the link, and on the links in the thread. I think it will encourage people to have better credit card habits.

My first card after my troubles in 2009 was my BoA. It started out as a secured card for $500. I ask the Gentleman helping me set the card up, how I should pay on it. I had always bought clothes, fishing rods, whatever and then paid minimum Payments. He said, no, they don't like that, they like for you to keep it around 50% paid off. I asked if it wouldn't be better to pay it way down, he told me they didn't like that either. I know now that answer is so they get the interest. He could care less about whats best for me. I paid it like that up until the year thinking I was doing the right thing

Score updates coming quick

Stryder — Sat, 05 Nov 2016 22:26:14 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
In that event, you may wish to move away from the pattern of occasionally carrying balances, and moving instead toward always paying your cards in full.

For many many years there was never any downside to carrying balances (aside from the interest you might have to pay) since creditors and future lenders had no way to see if you did that. A person preparing for any important credit pull (like a mortgage) could simply pay off his credit cards a month before and it would look like you had always had mostly zero balances and maybe one small balance.

Until, that is, a fairly new development, where potential lenders began to be able to see if you have carried balances in the last 24 months and if so how much and how often and whether you only paid the minimum payment. Furthermore (and this started only a month or two ago) Fannie Mae has required lenders to incorporate this into their decision making. People who occasionally carry balances are called revolvers and are (as a group of people) far riskier than those who always pay their cards in full.

Here's a recent thread where this was discussed:
http://ficoforums.myfico.com/t5/Credit-in-the-News/Equifax-going-to-report-balance-payment-amount-history-Is-this/td-p/4758761

OK, I have read most everything on your link and I am confused on the actions of a Transactor. You recommend to leave a balance to got to statement, then pif a week later. I would think it would be what we do now, by not letting anything report. EQ records would show transctions were made on the account and then could see that it was pif'ed for statement, which seems like good behavior. What am I missing? How is your recomendation good behavior?

Re: Score updates coming quick

Anonymous — Sun, 06 Nov 2016 00:20:44 GMT

@Stryder wrote:
OK, I have read most everything on your link and I am confused on the actions of a Transactor. You recommend to leave a balance to got to statement, then pif a week later. I would think it would be what we do now, by not letting anything report. EQ records would show transctions were made on the account and then could see that it was pif'ed for statement, which seems like good behavior. What am I missing? How is your recomendation good behavior?

I have read the section I have highlighted in blue a few times, but I just can't make out what you are trying to say. Would you mind giving it another shot?

Re: Score updates coming quick

Stryder — Sun, 06 Nov 2016 00:33:44 GMT

I'm sorry...I was leaving work and I was trying to post in a hurry. My confusion lies in the fact the if you don't pif, and let a balance roll...how does that make it look like you aren't a revolver that leaves balances? When you are leaving balances. Experian is saying they can tell the transactions in your account, and how you pay, then what is the purpose of leaving a balance?

I am just trying to understand, everyone agrees with you, so I know it is my confusion, but I think it's an important detail I want to understand.

Thanks Credit Guy...

Re: Score updates coming quick

Anonymous — Sun, 06 Nov 2016 01:02:31 GMT

I am delighted to report that the world does not agree with me about everything. Thank God! :-)

It sounds like there are some concepts and terminology we should get cleared up, and that may solve some of your confusion. In your last post you wrote:

"My confusion lies in the fact the if you don't pif, and let a balance roll...how does that make it look like you aren't a revolver that leaves balances?"

It sounds like you think that PIF (Pay In Full) means the same thing as PTZ (Pay To Zero). The latter is where a person makes sure that a zero balance reports for that month by paying the card down to $0 before the statement is generated.

PIF stands for Pay In Full, which is itself shorthand for Pay [the "amount owed" that you see at the top of your statement] In Full. To PIF is to pay that amount in full -- which you do not of course have to do with a credit card. You could pay less than the full amount, and carry the remainder onto the next statement.

The key idea is that PIF-ing vs. Carrying A Balance are two contrasting ways of dealing with the statement after it has printed with a positive balance. If the statement has a $0 balance then there is no amount to pay, either in full or in part.

So when I suggest that a simple thing to do is to use your cards as naturally feels right (e.g. use your Amex Blue Cash for groceries, etc.), allow them to produce statements with an Amount Owed, and then pay that amount in full in the couple weeks following the statement date -- that's actually what PIF means. That's acturally the normal, straightforward way to use your cards. It's actually PTZ that requires a lot more work and attention.

As you saw, I think PTZ has an important place in the current scheme of things as well. It's just that you don't need to be constantly paying all your cards down to zero except one every single month. It's a lot easier (in my view and in the view of some other people) to just use them and PIF, not worrying most months how many zero balances you have. Then, right before some major huge FICO event (like getting mortgage pre-approval, or whatever) you can do the PTZ to squeeze out some extra FICO scoring points.