topic Re: Authorized User does NOT affect ANY of the FICO scores PROOF in Understanding FICO® Scoring

Authorized User does NOT affect ANY of the FICO scores?

moonkey1234 — Thu, 31 May 2018 22:26:01 GMT

Hi I added myself as an athorized user on a 13 year old credit card (under same last name and address) thinking it would boost my fico by boosting my aaoa which is currently only 8 months. Turns out my score didn't even change one bit, not even from the balance on it (which is 50%) ! It did affect my vantage score however. Here's some pictures from Experian.com.

3 Pictures

Re: Authorized User does NOT affect ANY of the FICO scores PROOF

Anonymous — Thu, 31 May 2018 17:20:10 GMT

Looks to me like although you raised your AAoA and AoOA by adding this AU card, you also raised your UTI to 51%, the 2 probably ended up offsetting each other.

Re: Authorized User does NOT affect ANY of the FICO scores PROOF

Anonymous — Thu, 31 May 2018 17:23:34 GMT

What you are using (on Experian) is one example of a credit monitoring system or CMS. Every CMS has a front end dashboard that summarizes what is on your report. These front-end dashboards are created by programmers who have nothing to do with the team of people at FICO who designed the actual scoring model on the back end. The creators of the CMS dashboard are programmers who work for that particular CMS (Credit Karma, Credit Check Total, myFICO Ultimate, etc.).

Therefore a CMS dashboard may say that your utilization is 0% (because it is actually 0.1%) when the back-end FICO algorithm views it as 1% -- a crucial difference since you had a true 0.000% utilization FICO would impose a substantial penalty. The dashboard says one thing but the algorithm sees something else. Likewise there can be gaps between the algorithm and a dashboard on many things: history of derogs, AAoA, Age of Oldest Account, etc.

AU accounts are a common source of disconnect between what a dashboard sees and what the FICO algorithm sees.

Now it is indeed possible that FICO 8's secret anti-abuse algorithm has flagged your AU account as one that should not be considered. But the only way to know that is for you to have scores pulled before the AU account was added and then pull fresh scores again after it.

Re: Authorized User does NOT affect ANY of the FICO scores PROOF

Anonymous — Thu, 31 May 2018 17:27:10 GMT

And as Oldman observes, if your utilization is going up between the before and after comparison of scores, then even the score comparisson won't tell you anything, since you have good things happening (much older Age of Oldest Account) and bad things happening (increased utilization) at the same time.

Re: Authorized User does NOT affect ANY of the FICO scores PROOF

moonkey1234 — Thu, 31 May 2018 17:40:16 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
Looks to me like although you raised your AAoA and AoOA by adding this AU card, you also raised your UTI to 51%, the 2 probably ended up offsetting each other.

Not sure what your'e seeing. In the pictures I show that in one place it says aaoa is 11 months but in another it says 3 years and one month but my score didn't change. These pictures are all from the same report on the same day.

Re: Authorized User does NOT affect ANY of the FICO scores PROOF

moonkey1234 — Thu, 31 May 2018 17:44:43 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
What you are using (on Experian) is one example of a credit monitoring system or CMS. Every CMS has a front end dashboard that summarizes what is on your report. These front-end dashboards are created by programmers who have nothing to do with the team of people at FICO who designed the actual scoring model on the back end. The creators of the CMS dashboard are programmers who work for that particular CMS (Credit Karma, Credit Check Total, myFICO Ultimate, etc.).

Therefore a CMS dashboard may say that your utilization is 0% (because it is actually 0.1%) when the back-end FICO algorithm views it as 1% -- a crucial difference since you had a true 0.000% utilization FICO would impose a substantial penalty. The dashboard says one thing but the algorithm sees something else. Likewise there can be gaps between the algorithm and a dashboard on many things: history of derogs, AAoA, Age of Oldest Account, etc.

AU accounts are a common source of disconnect between what a dashboard sees and what the FICO algorithm sees.

Now it is indeed possible that FICO 8's secret anti-abuse algorithm has flagged your AU account as one that should not be considered. But the only way to know that is for you to have scores pulled before the AU account was added and then pull fresh scores again after it.

This is exactly what I showed that in one place it says aaoa 11 months and in another it says 3 years and one month. Also in one place it shows a balance of $15,741 with 51% utilization and in another it shows a balance of $1,806 with a 27% utilization which is correct without the AU. And my score didn't change. These pictures are all from one report. Not a comparison.

Re: Authorized User does NOT affect ANY of the FICO scores PROOF

moonkey1234 — Thu, 31 May 2018 17:46:22 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
And as Oldman observes, if your utilization is going up between the before and after comparison of scores, then even the score comparisson won't tell you anything, since you have good things happening (much older Age of Oldest Account) and bad things happening (increased utilization) at the same time.

This is my exact point it's not a comparison it's the same report. Just one's the dash and ones the actual report.

Re: Authorized User does NOT affect ANY of the FICO scores PROOF

Anonymous — Thu, 31 May 2018 18:04:58 GMT

Yep. So since there is no comparison between scores in time (drawn before the AU account appeared and after) there is no way to draw conclusions about whether FICO 8 (the back end algorithm) is considering the AU account.

The dashboard was likely just programmed to ignore all AU accounts.

Re: Authorized User does NOT affect ANY of the FICO scores PROOF

Anonymous — Thu, 31 May 2018 18:28:17 GMT

@moonkey1234 wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
Looks to me like although you raised your AAoA and AoOA by adding this AU card, you also raised your UTI to 51%, the 2 probably ended up offsetting each other.
Not sure what your'e seeing. In the pictures I show that in one place it says aaoa is 11 months but in another it says 3 years and one month but my score didn't change. These pictures are all from the same report on the same day.

Forget about what the software is telling you for a second (as there are obvious discrepancies between page 1 and 2 explained by CGID) and stick to raw data and its effects on your score.

Before adding AU :

AAoA = 8 months

AoOA = 11 months

UTI = $1,806/$6,600 = 27%

After adding AU :

AAoA = 3 year 1 month

AoOA = 13 years

UTI = $15,741/$30,600 = 51%

Is this not correct?

Re: Authorized User does NOT affect ANY of the FICO scores PROOF

moonkey1234 — Thu, 31 May 2018 18:28:34 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
@moonkey1234 wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
Looks to me like although you raised your AAoA and AoOA by adding this AU card, you also raised your UTI to 51%, the 2 probably ended up offsetting each other.
Not sure what your'e seeing. In the pictures I show that in one place it says aaoa is 11 months but in another it says 3 years and one month but my score didn't change. These pictures are all from the same report on the same day.
Forget about what the software is telling you for a second (as there are obvious discrepancies between page 1 and 2) and stick to raw data and its effects on your score.

Before adding AU :
AAoA = 8 months
AoOA = 11 months
UTI = $1,806/$6,600 = 27%

After adding AU :
AAoA = 3 year 1 month
AoOA = 13 years
UTI = $15,741/$30,600 = 51%

Is this not correct?

No because even after I added it still shows the old aaoa on the dashboard. All the pictures are AFTER adding it

Re: Authorized User does NOT affect ANY of the FICO scores PROOF

moonkey1234 — Thu, 31 May 2018 18:39:06 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
Yep. So since there is no comparison between scores in time (drawn before the AU account appeared and after) there is no way to draw conclusions about whether FICO 8 (the back end algorithm) is considering the AU account.

The dashboard was likely just programmed to ignore all AU accounts.

Nevermind. Your'e right. My score on May 28th was 691 and on May 29th it was 697 with no changes other then the AU being added. The problem is I was expecting a way bigger gain but the utilization messed it up. Thanks for your input everyone! This forum really helped me alot. After I remove myself it'll show up as closed with no balance and that'll boost my aaoa. At least that's what i'm hoping.

Re: Authorized User does NOT affect ANY of the FICO scores PROOF

Anonymous — Thu, 31 May 2018 18:42:13 GMT

@moonkey1234 wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
@moonkey1234 wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
Looks to me like although you raised your AAoA and AoOA by adding this AU card, you also raised your UTI to 51%, the 2 probably ended up offsetting each other.
Not sure what your'e seeing. In the pictures I show that in one place it says aaoa is 11 months but in another it says 3 years and one month but my score didn't change. These pictures are all from the same report on the same day.
Forget about what the software is telling you for a second (as there are obvious discrepancies between page 1 and 2) and stick to raw data and its effects on your score.

Before adding AU :
AAoA = 8 months
AoOA = 11 months
UTI = $1,806/$6,600 = 27%

After adding AU :
AAoA = 3 year 1 month
AoOA = 13 years
UTI = $15,741/$30,600 = 51%

Is this not correct?
No because even after I added it still shows the old aaoa on the dashboard. All the pictures are AFTER adding it

If those are not the correct raw data, what are the correct ones? Again, ignore what the dashboard/software is showing you, what are the AAoA, AoOA and UTI before and after calculated based on data on your report?

Re: Authorized User does NOT affect ANY of the FICO scores PROOF

moonkey1234 — Thu, 31 May 2018 18:46:49 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
@moonkey1234 wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
@moonkey1234 wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
Looks to me like although you raised your AAoA and AoOA by adding this AU card, you also raised your UTI to 51%, the 2 probably ended up offsetting each other.
Not sure what your'e seeing. In the pictures I show that in one place it says aaoa is 11 months but in another it says 3 years and one month but my score didn't change. These pictures are all from the same report on the same day.
Forget about what the software is telling you for a second (as there are obvious discrepancies between page 1 and 2) and stick to raw data and its effects on your score.

Before adding AU :
AAoA = 8 months
AoOA = 11 months
UTI = $1,806/$6,600 = 27%

After adding AU :
AAoA = 3 year 1 month
AoOA = 13 years
UTI = $15,741/$30,600 = 51%

Is this not correct?
No because even after I added it still shows the old aaoa on the dashboard. All the pictures are AFTER adding it
If those are not the correct raw data, what are the correct ones? Again, ignore what the dashboard/software is showing you, what are the AAoA, AoOA and UTI before and after calculated based on data on your report?

Yes this is the correct data bet may 28th and 29th if you ignore the dash. My score actually changed from 691 to 697 also but I didn't realize the utilization would make it such a small difference. Cool how you figured out $6600 .

Re: Authorized User does NOT affect ANY of the FICO scores PROOF

Anonymous — Thu, 31 May 2018 19:27:51 GMT

UTI accounts for 30% of the score, adding a 58% card with a large limit taking you across 2 known UTI scoring thresholds would result in a pretty big hit, at least it was a small net positive.

Re: Authorized User does NOT affect ANY of the FICO scores PROOF

Anonymous — Thu, 31 May 2018 19:39:57 GMT

To summarize, here are two helpful lessons learned:

(1) Difference between what a front-end dashboard says and what the back-end scoring algorithm does.

(2) The importance of holding all other scoring factors constant if you are trying to isolate one factor in particular and draw conclusions about it.

Best wishes....

Re: Authorized User does NOT affect ANY of the FICO scores PROOF

Anonymous — Fri, 01 Jun 2018 08:02:35 GMT

@Anonymous
UTI accounts for 30% of the score, adding a 58% card with a large limit taking you across 2 known UTI scoring thresholds would result in a pretty big hit, at least it was a small net positive.

Correct. I'd say that the loss from crossing 2 aggregate utilization thresholds (28.9%, 48.9%) as well as going to a single trade line at > 50% utilization may have harmed the OPs scores to the tune of 60 points. If he ended up seeing a small net gain of 5-10 points, perhaps the "age of accounts" factors that were positively impacted raised his scores 65-70 points.

OP, if the person that added you as an AU is able to take their utilization down to a small amount, I'd estimate you could stand to see around a 60 point gain to your scores based on the improved utilization.