topic Re: AU question in Understanding FICO® Scoring

AU question

Anonymous — Thu, 03 Oct 2019 06:07:10 GMT

So I had a friend add me as an AU. Prior I only had 1 cc that was 2 years old. His card was opened 5 years ago. It helped me out and now I have been able to get my own cards with decent limits.

my question is if I now have it removed from my Cr's will it hurt my scores by a lot?

Re: AU question

AllZero — Thu, 03 Oct 2019 06:52:58 GMT

It depends. Did you notice a score improvement when you were added as an AU?

I don't think you will see a dramatic point loss if you were to remove the AU.

What is your AAoA with and without the AU?

What is your current AoOA without AU?

ETA, not knowing your credit card portfolio, if you have at least 3 cards of your own, then it's enough to strengthen your own scores without AU. That's considering if you were optimizing your utilization.

Re: AU question

Anonymous — Thu, 03 Oct 2019 07:11:24 GMT

When I was added I hate my 90 day late so honestly I only went up like 12-13 points. Then after I successfully got the late removed my scores jumped up about 150-180 points or take.

not sure if I didn't get a big jump because I had the derog.

This is my current without AU.

oldest account 2 years 8 months.

average 1 year 1 months.

with AU

average 1.6 years

oldest. 5.4

and right now I have 8 accounts of my own and at 1% utilization. I PIF normally. But when I got my disco card I made a purchase and right after it reported. I didn't know it was going to report that fast. Right now it's at a $0 balance so will be 0%.

If I just lose say 15 points I'm fine with that. I just didn't know if I would drop say 50 points or more.

Re: AU question

Anonymous — Thu, 03 Oct 2019 07:14:39 GMT

Forgot to add also utilization will change just not sure to what.

made a $2500 purchase on a card with a $30k cl. That will be the only one with a balance that I will be making payments on and not PIF since its 0% for 12 months

Re: AU question

AllZero — Thu, 03 Oct 2019 10:06:43 GMT

I don't recall exactly but I think there is a 2 year threshold for AAoA and 7, 7.5 AoOA threshold.

With AAoA similar, I don't think there is a score impact.

I'll have to dig and search the details for AoOA.

I think its safe to say you won't drop 50 points.

Re: AU question

AllZero — Thu, 03 Oct 2019 07:56:19 GMT

Found a post by Thomas_Thumb:

AoOA is not a Fico scoring factor. It is a scorecard assignment segmenter. If an increase moves you to a different scorecard your score may change is due to a shift in weighting of the factors used in scoring and the assigned min/max scores associated with the scorecard.

It is hard to confirm where Fico draws the line on age of file (AoOA) for segmentation but, it is likely higher than 5 years - perhaps 10 years.

https://ficoforums.myfico.com/t5/Understanding-FICO-Scoring/Seeking-AoOA-Threshold-Data-Points-Anecdotal-or-Otherwise/m-p/5144923

Re: AU question

Anonymous — Thu, 03 Oct 2019 08:21:32 GMT

Thank you very much. Was hoping this was the case.

Re: AU question

Anonymous — Fri, 04 Oct 2019 07:28:35 GMT

You realize being a segmentation factor means it has more effect than if it were a scoring factor? If one is re-bucketed, the effect can be larger than with a scoring factor.

Yes, you failed to see the jump due to the dirty file. Once you're segmented into a dirty file, there is no segmentation based on AoOA.

When you became clean and saw that huge jump? Guess what that came from? Re-bucketing, scorecard change; change of a segmentation factor, in other words, NOT change of a scoring factor.

When you are segmented clean, then you are segmented into thick/thin, aged/nonaged, new accounts/no new accounts.

So, segmentation affects score dramatically, as you've seen. You have a thick file, which is preferable, as its more stable.

Are you aged/nonaged? No one knows the demarcation point exactly. Has been theorized as low as 6 years and some think as high as 15-17 years. Its your AoOA that determines this. Personally, I think its at the lower end, but we don't know for sure. Some data points point to 6 years. Who knows? Either way, you can have a great score as nonaged, as long as you are clean with low utilization.

Last is whether you have any new revolvers under 12 months of age, at least for Version 8. (Who knows the threshold(s) for the older models.) That's why you gain points when your youngest revolver turns 12 months old, you're being re-bucketed due to a change in scorecard segmenters.

Hope this provides some elucidation.

Re: AU question

Anonymous — Fri, 04 Oct 2019 20:04:44 GMT

In other words, it probably wont affect you by AoOA much becuz you wont cross a threshold. However, if you leave it, you can get to that line more quickly.

Re: AU question

Anonymous — Sat, 05 Oct 2019 04:51:01 GMT

Thank you @birdman7

I contacted them today to have it removed.

I will update with what happens to scores after it updates in case anyone has this question in the future

Re: AU question

Anonymous — Sat, 05 Oct 2019 05:37:36 GMT

Any score change you see should be due to AAoA and as @AllZero said, shouldn’t be very large because you’re not crossing an AoOA threshold.. Utilization will not be a concern in your case because you’re so low and PIF.

Look forward to your results.

Re: AU question

Anonymous — Sat, 05 Oct 2019 19:27:33 GMT

Edit: entered the wrong score.

TU updated. Went from 729 to a 713. Not bad at all

Re: AU question

AllZero — Sat, 05 Oct 2019 17:58:44 GMT

Thank you for sharing the data point. Not too bad of a drop. You got a good base of cards in your arsenal.

Re: AU question

Anonymous — Sat, 05 Oct 2019 19:14:46 GMT

no problem. Hopefully it helps someone down the road.

wasnt too bad of a drop. I think I should be able to make it up with a little time.

Re: AU question

AllZero — Sat, 05 Oct 2019 21:31:21 GMT

Data points are very useful. I periodically go back and read all I can to learn more.

As mentioned by Birdman7, clean segmentation is good. You have the thick portion. You're working on the aged portion.

If you can reach the >12 month mark of no new account portion, you'll get +- 10-15 possibly 15-20 points.

Re: AU question

Anonymous — Sat, 05 Oct 2019 21:16:14 GMT

i have been trying to read everything on here to understand more. So totally know what you mean.

I appreciate all your help. I got the cards I have and since have not been applying. I'm trying to stay strong and garden for a full 2 years. Will just be working on getting cli's. Also ended up closing my Uber card. It had a $500 sl and honestly that was the card I regret getting. Both times I talked to a csr from there they were the rudest people ever. Got it during my app spree with the rest of my recent cards so don't really care.

so right now I have 7 accounts.

cap 1 qs

cap 1 qs1

disco it

amex gold delta

Lowe's

Apple Card

us bank cash +

im good with these for a while. Only thing I really want to add in the future is a few more Amex cards.

Re: AU question

Anonymous — Sun, 06 Oct 2019 03:03:01 GMT

Yeah I think you’re in a good place cardwise you just need to let it age as @AllZero said.

Keep in mind that broad range of points that can be awarded is to a large degree dictated by whether it’s a thick or thin file. Age/non-aged may play a part as well, though I don’t think as significant in my opinion. A thin file would get more points than a thick file for AOYA awards/penalties.

HulkCreditSmash can you give us your before and after AAOA? For the record? Or maybe you have already and I just don’t remember..lol.

Re: AU question

Anonymous — Sun, 06 Oct 2019 03:22:46 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
Yeah I think you’re in a good place cardwise you just need to let it age as @AllZero said.

Keep in mind that broad range of points that can be awarded is to a large degree dictated by whether it’s a thick or thin file. Age/non-aged may play a part as well, though I don’t think as significant in my opinion. A thin file would get more points than a thick file for AOYA awards/penalties.

HulkCreditSmash can you give us your before and after AAOA? For the record? Or maybe you have already and I just don’t remember..lol.

This is my current without AU.

oldest account 2 years 8 months.

average 1 year 1 months.

with AU it was

average 1.6 years

oldest. 5.4

when I look at my summary on EX everything ranges from very good to exceptional. Except credit length history is rated fair and amount of new credit is poor. with time I should have those rating better also.

Re: AU question

Anonymous — Sun, 06 Oct 2019 17:10:40 GMT

Not sure if this is correct or fully hasn't updated but this fell off of EQ. Score went from 716 to 711. I even updated my credit report and that's what it shows. Not sure if the score is delayed or that's really all it dropped.

I will keep an eye on it and update if needed. Hopefully that's what the drop only is

Re: AU question

Anonymous — Mon, 07 Oct 2019 05:33:31 GMT

Sounds about right.